Re: Which comes first: design skill or TDD?
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On Wed, Jul 5, 2023 at 6:57?AM Sleepyfox < sleepyfox@...> wrote: The original proposition, partly, as stated is:
> One can learn design skill by practising TDD, and I consider this a kind of pracitisng TDD "well"
That was JB's proposition. A good way to seed an active discussion is to throw in a red herring. :-)
If we wanted to be precise, I'd correct it to say "One can learn design skill _while_ practicing TDD." Alternatively, one might try to practice TDD and fail to learn design in the process.
I think we're approaching the "One True Scotsman" fallacy here. I'm tempted to say that anyone who doesn't practice improving design while doing TDD isn't "really" doing TDD. I'll resist that as being unhelpful. :-)
In fact, the folks who originated TDD pretty much universally situated it in the center of a set of practices - other practices - which supported it and were supported by it. XP is the classic example but not the only one. Being an old and continuing XP guy, I still use the XP terms. So... you can try to do Test Driven Development without
doing Simple Design, but you won't get nearly as far.
XP was a set of practices (originally 12) but IMO its real lesson is that you need _some_ set of practices, which work to support one another.
All of which is a long preamble to asking everyone this question: What __other__ practices do you find essential
when using TDD in your own work?
Charlie
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