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Re: How to learn good design using TDD ?


 

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I have started coding back in September 1994, at that time we had no Internet connection in my home country so we could not download and install anything via internet as it is nowadays. So, I have started coding with QBasic, at that time there was no TDD, BDD anything else. So, far I have worked only with JUnit especially with Spring Framework, Spring Boot Applications.

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Mit freundlichen Gr¨¹?e / Kind regards

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Ahmet Murati

Email/Skype: ahmet.murati@...; amurati

E-Mail/Hangouts?: ahmetmurati@...

De-Email?: ahmet.murati.1@...

Cellphone/Handy: +49 1512 3015776

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From: [email protected] <[email protected]> On Behalf Of Avi Kessner
Sent: Friday, 31 July 2020 12:22
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [testdrivendevelopment] How to learn good design using TDD ?

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It's really going to depend on what ecosystem you are working in and what tools you'll have available.

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I worked for one year in C# on the windows phone. The only thing I was able to take from that year was some lessons in Microsoft sponsorships and a huge leap in what I expect tools to be able to do. I used resharper and typemocks and it allowed me to practice TDD. I was also learning the language, so the psychological barriers were lower.??

After having that experience I was in a better place to judge and improve the tools I use in other ecosystems.

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So yes, there is hope, but it's going to take more than just awareness and self study.?

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Before working on the windows phone I was working with ActionScript and Flash, and while the culture was supportive, and there were even some tools trying to help, it just wasn't a very good TDD experience. After the windows phone I did work in Unity, and despite being C#, the tools weren't available.

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And sometimes, even if the ecosystem exists, it's locked behind a relatively high paywall.

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On Fri, 31 Jul 2020, 11:39 Matteo Regazzi, <mregazzi@...> wrote:

This week there have been two interesting TDD webinars about why after 20 years it doesn't dominate the software development scene. To tell the truth, in some situations, it is even an unknown technique and therefore not adopted not by choice but out of ignorance.

My personal feeling (I have been in the software development field since 1995 and met extreme programming in 2001) is that in the last 20 years, starting from the rise of agile methodologies, there has been a clear bifurcation: on the one hand, craftmanship, extreme programming, people who apply to their profession that continuous improvement we preach. On the other hand, people who have learned from their predecessors (someone like me, possible), perhaps losing something, as if the transition between anticipatory and evolutionary design had been missing. We missed the design at all. Now my question is: how can we recover? It looks like a chicken egg problem. In the past a programmer learned design principles and techniques and then applied them (with all the disadvantages we know) but the process was clear and straightforward. Today if I started from scratch, under expert guidance, I would probably learn to program and design using TDD. But if I am already a programmer, maybe for 10 years (iterating the same bad year ten times), who knows almost nothing about good design (or at least is not aware of it), could I learn TDD and good design at the same time? Is it enough to repeat kata? The expert guide would always be desirable, but if it were not there?

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