On 5/11/20 3:14 PM, David Eckhardt wrote: The MFJ's
1) do not cover the frequency range of the NANO's
2) do not offer the measurement accuracy of the NANO's
3) do not have the frequency accuracy of the NANO's
4) do not have the diversified plotting capabilities of the NANO's
5) do not make an ACCURATE measurement of either the real or complex
portion of an impedance
6) are not true vector network analyzers
7) are far more expensive than the NANO's (MFJ charges roughly $380 for
their closest competition to the NANO's and it
covers to only 260 MHz)
8) either end of their frequency coverages suffer from extreme errors in
measurements
9) others can add to this list...................
SMITH CHARTS !!!! Bill
|
I concur with what Dave sez, plus the freq range is seamless & you can connect it to a droid and/or windblows PC.
I do suggest using a pair of SMA connector savers. I have some that are push-on, pretty sweet.
I also have an Anritsu Site Master, which is really only good for a couple of chores.
I have a MFJ-249 for sale if anyone is interested.
?___
Sent from my two way wrist watch
73 de W3AB/GEO?
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On May 11, 2020, 13:15, at 13:15, David Eckhardt <davearea51a@...> wrote: The MFJ's
1) do not cover the frequency range of the NANO's
2) do not offer the measurement accuracy of the NANO's
3) do not have the frequency accuracy of the NANO's
4) do not have the diversified plotting capabilities of the NANO's
5) do not make an ACCURATE measurement of either the real or complex
portion of an impedance
6) are not true vector network analyzers
7) are far more expensive than the NANO's (MFJ charges roughly $380
for
their closest competition to the NANO's and it
covers to only 260 MHz)
8) either end of their frequency coverages suffer from extreme errors
in
measurements
9) others can add to this list...................
Personally, I would not even consider MFJ, given the full capabilities
and
price (and marginal reputation of MFJ) of the NANO's. They are a game
changer!!!!
One last comment: I've many times compared the NANO's to the HP 8753C
vector network analyzer in many different setups and different tasks.
Guess what? The NANO's compare extremely favorably with the
(expensive) HP
8753C! The MFJ units do not, in most cases!!!!!
Dave - W?LEV
On Mon, May 11, 2020 at 11:47 AM Dan Gilliam via groups.io <k5khz=
[email protected]> wrote:
I am preparing to purchase my first antenna analyzer product. I have an
old MFJ-209 which has neither meters nor frequency readout. I love to
build antennas, especially for my ham club.
Can any of you give a reason pro or con as to why nanovna vs MfJ 259
series. I presume many are nanovna users due to the lower cost. Is there
any tradeoff that would discourage either?
Thanks in advance from a new subscriber to [email protected]
Dan K5KHZ
--
*Dave - W?LEV*
*Just Let Darwin Work*
|
Re: Test fixture question
On Mon, May 11, 2020 at 09:07 PM, EB4APL wrote:
The resistive pad approach is easier, but it could attenuate too much, it is
something to be calculated and tested.
I calculated a minimum loss resistor network, reducing the 2 x 14.8 dB from the HP fixture to 2 x 11.4 dB. Please see at Attached are 2 photos of my test fixture. 73, Rudi DL5FA
|
On Mon, May 11, 2020 at 09:09 PM, GEO BADGER wrote:
Didn't see any for the H4 version.
?___
Sent from my two way wrist watch
73 de W3AB/GEO?
Why don't you pay half a beer to the OP of this topic?
|
On Mon, May 11, 2020 at 01:09 PM, GEO BADGER wrote:
Didn't see any for the H4 version.
You will see them. It's just a matter of time.
|
Thank you Dave.? I have gotten great answers and enough courage to decide.? Just clicked the purchase the NanoVna H4.? I am really looking forward to having it on this next antenna project.
Thanks everyone for your comments.
Dan
Dr. Dan S. Gilliam, Sr.Ham Call: K5KHZDMR ID: 1151012k5khz@yahoo434-210-8380434-210-8383 Cell
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On Monday, May 11, 2020, 04:15:16 PM EDT, David Eckhardt <davearea51a@...> wrote: The MFJ's 1)? do not cover the frequency range of the NANO's 2)? do not offer the measurement accuracy of the NANO's 3)? do not have the frequency accuracy of the NANO's 4)? do not have the diversified plotting capabilities of the NANO's 5)? do not make an ACCURATE measurement of either the real or complex portion of an impedance 6)? are not true vector network analyzers 7)? are far more expensive than the NANO's? (MFJ charges roughly $380 for their closest competition to the NANO's and it ? ? covers to only 260 MHz) 8)? either end of their frequency coverages suffer from extreme errors in measurements 9)? others can add to this list................... Personally, I would not even consider MFJ, given the full capabilities and price (and marginal reputation of MFJ) of the NANO's.? They are a game changer!!!! One last comment:? I've many times compared the NANO's to the HP 8753C vector network analyzer in many different setups and different tasks. Guess what?? The NANO's compare extremely favorably with the (expensive) HP 8753C!? The MFJ units do not, in most cases!!!!! Dave - W?LEV On Mon, May 11, 2020 at 11:47 AM Dan Gilliam via groups.io <k5khz= [email protected]> wrote: I am preparing to purchase my first antenna analyzer product.? I have an
old MFJ-209 which has neither meters nor frequency readout.? I love to
build antennas, especially for my ham club.
Can any of you give a reason pro or con as to why nanovna vs MfJ 259
series.? I presume many are nanovna users due to the lower cost.? Is there
any tradeoff that would discourage either?
Thanks in advance from a new subscriber to [email protected]
Dan? K5KHZ
-- *Dave - W?LEV* *Just Let Darwin Work*
|
The MFJ's 1) do not cover the frequency range of the NANO's 2) do not offer the measurement accuracy of the NANO's 3) do not have the frequency accuracy of the NANO's 4) do not have the diversified plotting capabilities of the NANO's 5) do not make an ACCURATE measurement of either the real or complex portion of an impedance 6) are not true vector network analyzers 7) are far more expensive than the NANO's (MFJ charges roughly $380 for their closest competition to the NANO's and it covers to only 260 MHz) 8) either end of their frequency coverages suffer from extreme errors in measurements 9) others can add to this list................... Personally, I would not even consider MFJ, given the full capabilities and price (and marginal reputation of MFJ) of the NANO's. They are a game changer!!!! One last comment: I've many times compared the NANO's to the HP 8753C vector network analyzer in many different setups and different tasks. Guess what? The NANO's compare extremely favorably with the (expensive) HP 8753C! The MFJ units do not, in most cases!!!!! Dave - W?LEV On Mon, May 11, 2020 at 11:47 AM Dan Gilliam via groups.io <k5khz= [email protected]> wrote: I am preparing to purchase my first antenna analyzer product. I have an
old MFJ-209 which has neither meters nor frequency readout. I love to
build antennas, especially for my ham club.
Can any of you give a reason pro or con as to why nanovna vs MfJ 259
series. I presume many are nanovna users due to the lower cost. Is there
any tradeoff that would discourage either?
Thanks in advance from a new subscriber to [email protected]
Dan K5KHZ
-- *Dave - W?LEV* *Just Let Darwin Work*
|
Didn't see any for the H4 version.
?___
Sent from my two way wrist watch
73 de W3AB/GEO?
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On May 11, 2020, 12:44, at 12:44, Larry Rothman <nlroth@...> wrote: Thingverse has a few
On Monday, May 11, 2020, 3:34:05 p.m. GMT-4, GEO BADGER via groups.io
<w3ab@...> wrote:
I guess I missed this thread. Who/where can the case for the h4 be
purchased or the 3d STL files downloaded.?
---?
Ciao baby, catch you on the flip side??
73 de W3AB/GEO ???
You can say "over", you can say "out", you just can't say "over and
out".
? ? On Monday, May 11, 2020, 11:32:36 AM PDT, CT2FZI <ct2fzi@...>
wrote:
Hello,
I purchased your case design to encorage you for the future :)
I also designed an addon if you want to use your unit just as an
antenna/cable analyzer, while still using your cover. Or remove when
not needed.
Next step is to print the nano H4 case in TPE, now I have it in PETG.
Rugged design... hihi
|
Bummer. Thanks.
?___
Sent from my two way wrist watch
73 de W3AB/GEO?
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On May 11, 2020, 13:01, at 13:01, CT2FZI <ct2fzi@...> wrote: Unfortunately not for the H4 version.
@GEO BADGER, check post 1 of this topic.
On Mon, May 11, 2020 at 08:44 PM, Larry Rothman wrote:
Thingverse has a few
On Monday, May 11, 2020, 3:34:05 p.m. GMT-4, GEO BADGER via
groups.io
<w3ab@...> wrote:
I guess I missed this thread. Who/where can the case for the h4 be purchased
or the 3d STL files downloaded.?
---?
Ciao baby, catch you on the flip side??
73 de W3AB/GEO ???
You can say "over", you can say "out", you just can't say "over and out".
? ? On Monday, May 11, 2020, 11:32:36 AM PDT, CT2FZI
<ct2fzi@...>
wrote:
Hello,
I purchased your case design to encorage you for the future :)
I also designed an addon if you want to use your unit just as an antenna/cable
analyzer, while still using your cover. Or remove when not needed.
Next step is to print the nano H4 case in TPE, now I have it in PETG.
Rugged design... hihi
|
Unfortunately not for the H4 version.
@GEO BADGER, check post 1 of this topic.
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On Mon, May 11, 2020 at 08:44 PM, Larry Rothman wrote:
Thingverse has a few
On Monday, May 11, 2020, 3:34:05 p.m. GMT-4, GEO BADGER via groups.io
<w3ab@...> wrote:
I guess I missed this thread. Who/where can the case for the h4 be purchased
or the 3d STL files downloaded.?
---?
Ciao baby, catch you on the flip side??
73 de W3AB/GEO ???
You can say "over", you can say "out", you just can't say "over and out".
? ? On Monday, May 11, 2020, 11:32:36 AM PDT, CT2FZI <ct2fzi@...>
wrote:
Hello,
I purchased your case design to encorage you for the future :)
I also designed an addon if you want to use your unit just as an antenna/cable
analyzer, while still using your cover. Or remove when not needed.
Next step is to print the nano H4 case in TPE, now I have it in PETG.
Rugged design... hihi
|
Dan, here's my 0.02 worth RE nanoVNA versus antenna analyzers:
One is an open source "vector network analyzer" that is continually open to updates and fixes and experimentation. It requires close attention to calibration, menu selection, cable choice and adapters to connect to your "device under test." Unless you connect it to an external computer (notebook or laptop usually), even the 4" version might be considered a little hard to read and you must pay attention to what values you are reading. If you can read small Smith Charts and they are what you need, then a VNA is your choice. The nanoVNA is essentially a hobbyist/experimenter device. More professional equipment in the same family costs more and offers more to professional users.
The other is an all-in-one box capable of high-levels of precision (still not "top-of-the-line, but up there). You connect your antenna and read the results with little difficulty or fiddling. They are antenna-centric, ready-to-go instruments.
Is the more expensive antenna analyzer worth so many $$ more than the nanoVNA? It is almost an apple-orange thing - you have to decide what you need and how you will be using it. Personally, a nanoVNA would not be my first purchase if measuring and adjusting antennas is what is needed. I have one 2.8" and one 4" nano, but when I'm going to an antenna site (at least for now) I'm taking my MFJ analyzer and (because I'm and belt and suspenders person) my Bird Wattmeter. (Or maybe just the Bird, because they are that good.)
If you are purchasing for the purpose of checking and adjusting/building antennas, you have your answer.
If you want to fool around with neat tech, by all means go small. :-)
Frankly, cost should be your last consideration.
Cheers, Ed H. KT4ED
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On 5/11/2020 1:06 PM, Dan Gilliam via groups.io wrote: I am preparing to purchase my first antenna analyzer product. I have an old MFJ-209 which has neither meters nor frequency readout. I love to build antennas, especially for my ham club.
Can any of you give a reason pro or con as to why nanovna vs MfJ 259 series. I presume many are nanovna users due to the lower cost. Is there any tradeoff that would discourage either?
|
Thingverse has a few
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On Monday, May 11, 2020, 3:34:05 p.m. GMT-4, GEO BADGER via groups.io <w3ab@...> wrote:
I guess I missed this thread. Who/where can the case for the h4 be purchased or the 3d STL files downloaded.?
---?
Ciao baby, catch you on the flip side??
73 de W3AB/GEO ???
You can say "over", you can say "out", you just can't say "over and out".
? ? On Monday, May 11, 2020, 11:32:36 AM PDT, CT2FZI <ct2fzi@...> wrote:
Hello,
I purchased your case design to encorage you for the future :)
I also designed an addon if you want to use your unit just as an antenna/cable analyzer, while still using your cover. Or remove when not needed.
Next step is to print the nano H4 case in TPE, now I have it in PETG.
Rugged design... hihi
|
I guess I missed this thread. Who/where can the case for the h4 be purchased or the 3d STL files downloaded.?
---?
Ciao baby, catch you on the flip side??
73 de W3AB/GEO ???
You can say "over", you can say "out", you just can't say "over and out".
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
On Monday, May 11, 2020, 11:32:36 AM PDT, CT2FZI <ct2fzi@...> wrote:
Hello,
I purchased your case design to encorage you for the future :)
I also designed an addon if you want to use your unit just as an antenna/cable analyzer, while still using your cover. Or remove when not needed.
Next step is to print the nano H4 case in TPE, now I have it in PETG.
Rugged design... hihi
|
It may assist in a high RF field environment.
?___
Sent from my two way wrist watch
73 de W3AB/GEO?
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On May 11, 2020, 11:11, at 11:11, aleks07111971@... wrote: Will a metal case affect measurement accuracy
|
Re: Test fixture question
Hola Jos¨¦, The crystal parameters can be calculated as explained in the PHSNA User's Guide Appendix I, by Nick Kennedy WA5BDU. All formulas are there. It can be downloaded from here: /g/PHSNA/files/Windows%20PHSNA/PHSNA%20User%27s%20Guide%201r42.pdfHere is an extract of a message that Nick sent to me when we were talking about crystal measurements with the nanoVNA: QUOTE I use this formula for the motional capacitance: Cm = (f1 - f2)/(2*PI*f1*f2*Rt) Where f1 and f2 are the upper and lower 3 dB points, so you could just say BW for f1 - f2. In the denominator, f1*f2 is not far from fc^2 where fc is the resonant frequency of the crystal so you can use fc^2 if you like. Rt is the total resistance of the circuit. So assuming you have a 50 ohm generator plus 50 ohm detector and you measured the loss resistance of the crystal at resonance at 55 ohms, your value is 155 ohms. Having found Cm, Lm is the value of inductance that has the same reactance as Cm at the resonant frequency. But a formula for that is: Lm = 1/(4 * PI^2 *f^2 * Cm) Where f is just the resonant frequency of the crystal. You'll probably wind up with Cm in femtofarads and Lm in millihenries. All of this depends of the resolution of the VNA. Being able to get down to 1 Hz resolution can help. I tried one crystal and didn't think I got good results. But in the nanoVNA notes by Wes Hayward linked here recently, he seemed to get some good crystal measurements. And Hayward is the guru of crystal measurements although he wasn't deriving motional parameters in his paper. In doing crystal measurements, people often use transformers or resistive pads to put the crystal in a 12.5 ohm environment, meaning the crystal sees 12.5 ohms looking in either direction. I'm not sure how advantageous this is, but it does lower the BW and so would seem to make fine resolution even more important. For parallel capacitance, generally using a low frequency capacitance meter like the AADE or eBay clones works. UNQUOTE The resistive pad approach is easier, but it could attenuate too much, it is something to be calculated and tested. Saludos, Ignacio, EB4APL
El 11/05/2020 a las 18:53, Jose Amador escribi¨®: Now I wonder: How do I extract the crystal equivalent model parameters
with this fixture? Does anyone have a link to the measurement method
explanation and perhaps associated software?
Jose, CO2JA
On 5/11/20, Aleksander Shalygin <shalygin@...> wrote:
The original circuit from the service manual of the HP device.
--
El software de antivirus Avast ha analizado este correo electr¨®nico en busca de virus.
|
I am impressed.? I have never touched a 3D printer, or seen one in action.? Do you sell the cases?
Please share what printer you use.? I might consider getting one.? I am always monkeying around trying to modify something not at all suited for the task.
Dr. Dan S. Gilliam, Sr.Ham Call: K5KHZDMR ID: 1151012k5khz@yahoo434-210-8380434-210-8383 Cell
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On Monday, May 11, 2020, 02:32:36 PM EDT, CT2FZI <ct2fzi@...> wrote:
Hello,
I purchased your case design to encorage you for the future :)
I also designed an addon if you want to use your unit just as an antenna/cable analyzer, while still using your cover. Or remove when not needed.
Next step is to print the nano H4 case in TPE, now I have it in PETG.
Rugged design... hihi
|
Hello,
I purchased your case design to encorage you for the future :)
I also designed an addon if you want to use your unit just as an antenna/cable analyzer, while still using your cover. Or remove when not needed.
Next step is to print the nano H4 case in TPE, now I have it in PETG.
Rugged design... hihi
|
I agree with Marco on his analysis.
I do lots of outdoor work and wanted something with a more substantial case so I purchased a NanoVNA-F with the push button switches instead of the rocker switch. You can get this from Deepelec.
<>
It costs twice as much as a NanoVNA but has a 4 inch display with sharper resolution. The downside is that it does not have the firmware development support of the NanoVNA or NanaVNA-H4 but the features are eventually added.
Mike N2MS
|
Thanks Marco.? Great insight,
Dr. Dan S. Gilliam, Sr.Ham Call: K5KHZDMR ID: 1151012k5khz@yahoo434-210-8380434-210-8383 Cell
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On Monday, May 11, 2020, 02:12:23 PM EDT, M Garza <mgarza896@...> wrote: Hi Dan. This is just my opinion. I like the nanovna because I can give it a frequency range and see where the antenna is resonant at, instantly.? With the MFJ-2XX, i had to tune around to find that info.? I feel like I get a better picture as to what is happening.? I also feel like the nanovna provides more functionality. I have owned the MFJ-259x & the 269x.? They are great, IMO, but I also like that the nanovna is cheaper & has a higher frequency that it can be used for. If I break the nanovna, it doesn't hurt as much & I can get the latest model (actually, probably 3 nanovnas to 1 MFJ). Marco - KG5PRT. On Mon, May 11, 2020, 12:47 PM Dan Gilliam via groups.io <k5khz= [email protected]> wrote: I am preparing to purchase my first antenna analyzer product.? I have an
old MFJ-209 which has neither meters nor frequency readout.? I love to
build antennas, especially for my ham club.
Can any of you give a reason pro or con as to why nanovna vs MfJ 259
series.? I presume many are nanovna users due to the lower cost.? Is there
any tradeoff that would discourage either?
Thanks in advance from a new subscriber to [email protected]
Dan? K5KHZ
|
Hi Dan. This is just my opinion. I like the nanovna because I can give it a frequency range and see where the antenna is resonant at, instantly. With the MFJ-2XX, i had to tune around to find that info. I feel like I get a better picture as to what is happening. I also feel like the nanovna provides more functionality. I have owned the MFJ-259x & the 269x. They are great, IMO, but I also like that the nanovna is cheaper & has a higher frequency that it can be used for. If I break the nanovna, it doesn't hurt as much & I can get the latest model (actually, probably 3 nanovnas to 1 MFJ). Marco - KG5PRT. On Mon, May 11, 2020, 12:47 PM Dan Gilliam via groups.io <k5khz= [email protected]> wrote: I am preparing to purchase my first antenna analyzer product. I have an
old MFJ-209 which has neither meters nor frequency readout. I love to
build antennas, especially for my ham club.
Can any of you give a reason pro or con as to why nanovna vs MfJ 259
series. I presume many are nanovna users due to the lower cost. Is there
any tradeoff that would discourage either?
Thanks in advance from a new subscriber to [email protected]
Dan K5KHZ
|
GEO BADGER
CT2FZI
Jim Allyn - N7JA
