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Re: Am I in the right track ?


 

Putting your hand near the antenna (or, really, anything) will also "load" it with a lossy medium, improving the match.

As noted before, though, most people do this by using a tool to design it (e.g. HFSS), build it, check the performance in a "radiated field strength" way, and call it done.
If you need to verify the design - you simulate the entire thing (fixture, connector, etc.) and then compare.
Getting rid of the feedline effects is more art than science. Absorber around the feedline (be it ferrite beads, absorbing tape, or whatever) also is putting absorber in the near field of the antenna.
For what it's worth, there's some interesting tape from Laird that is basically a flexible sticky material loaded with ferrite of some kind or another. We use it for emi suppression at work on equipment that's sensitive.



-----Original Message-----
From: <[email protected]>
Sent: Feb 24, 2025 9:40 AM
To: <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: [nanovna-users] Am I in the right track ?

Yes, you're on the right track. However, I'd strongly recomment you place
several appropriate clamp-on ferrites on your feedline right where it exits
the assembly. Also place a few at the VNA, itself.

As a test, with the assembly laying on your wooden structure, run your hand
up and down your feedline between the assembly and the VNA. If you note
changes on the VNA while doing so, you require more decoupling - ferrites.

And while grabbing the assembly: when grabbed and the VNA traces change,
something requires decoupling. Certainly it's an indication your hand and
arm are becoming part of the radiating structure - not desirable. A
free-space full wavelength at 902 MHz is 13-inches (33-cm). That PCB is
nowhere near even a 1/4-wavelength. Therefore, a good portion of a "real
antenna" is missing with the assembly.

In your first and third photos, I note what appears to be a metalized
membrane laying below and to the right of your wooden structure. It has a
circle of what appears to be a conductive circle. When the assembly is put
completely together, that may serve as part of the radiating structure?

And remember, SWR isn't a sole indicator of a good antenna!!!. Rely on the
Smith Chart or the complex reflection coefficient, not just SWR. Those two
parameters will tell you a WHOLE BUNCH MORE than just SWR. Besides, we're
not attempting to protect any final amplifier that "requires" a low SWR to
survive. It's such low power that even an infinite SWR likely would not
damage anything.

Dave - W&Oslash;LEV


Virus-free.www.avg.com



On Mon, Feb 24, 2025 at 2:36?AM Nico via groups.io wrote:

Once again,

Thanks to all of you for your inputs. Poorly translated from french, I
would say that I did not know in what type of gearbox I was going to put my
finger in !

Well, I ran some other experiments tonight. Here is what I've found.

The antenna is an helical monopole where the pcb copper pour serves as the
antenna ground plane. I really made sure to follow the manufacturer's
layout recommendations. The feed line (as pictured in my original post)
shows the feedline also, designed as suggested by LINX. I've included the
PI matching network at the very end of the ground plane as also
recommended.

This is the datasheet link:

;DocNm=ant-916-hexx-ds&amp;DocType=Data+Sheet&amp;DocLang=English&amp;DocFormat=pdf&amp;PartCntxt=ANT-916-HETH

I did what you guys suggested. I've cut a 6in piece of RG-174 and the used
a 30cm RG316 extension I have. I did the SOL at the end of the extension
and added a delay of a few pico seconds for the remaining piece that attach
to the pcb.

@Roger Need: Thanks, Oh, I forgot to mention some board details. I
attached pictures of my pcb. My cable is attached where the LoRa radio
module will go, as seen on the bottom side. The feedline to the antenna
should be a 50 ohms impedance feedline, it goes to a matching network (as
recommended by the manufacturer) and then to the antenna. The ground plane
dimensions are specified and the distance of the antenna from the ground
plane border also, which I've respected. It is a 4 layer PCB. Layer #2 has
a ground strip line under the trace that goes along with it that should
form the 50 ohm line right down to the antenna itself.

@John, Thanks for your input. could you point me out to some ferrite cores
? I would not know what to look for exactly. If you know some specs and a
good source for it, that would be awesome.

Well, I get some interesting result but I'm not sure if I understand what
is happening. As you can see with the pictures, if I hold the board in my
hands, I get what I would call a "proper" response. But once I lay the boar
on the top of the pole, the signal looks like crap. Putting the pcb back
into its enclose does not make any significant differences, good or bad.

By holding it and then read something better, does that I mean that my
body becomes the ground plane it needs ? Would that mean then that the pcb
ground plane is not sufficient in size ? That would be weird as the pcb
ground plane is slightly larger than what is recommended by the
manufacturer.

Once again, thanks to all of you for lighting up lantern, I truly
appreciate your advices.

RF has a steep learning curve ;)

Nicolas





--

*Dave - W&Oslash;LEV*


--
Dave - W&Oslash;LEV

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