Thanks, Sid!

How is openSUSE for technical stuff? - the things I do (dissertation/research-related) - GIS and spatial analysis, portable XRF calibration and analysis, and optical spectrometry, among others, works well with Ubuntu (with occasional minor glitches which I've fixed).? Other packages I use run in virtual machines (I usually have at least one open every day) - under W7. I don't have (and don't want) W10 - it makes me irritated every day I use it, but when you don't have a choice...

I may be eventually forced to use W10 in a virtual machine due to software upgrades (and companies only writing for W10).? I dread the day.? Anyway, I know Red Hat versions aren't that useful in my personal situation (the ones I've looked at/tried caused major headaches) and I've also (when Unity came out) considered Debian (upon suggestions by a Debian user).

(Laugh!) Some of my equipment still runs on Windows CE (like my mapping/survey GPS), and used to even require DOS in one case! (Part of the reason I have multiple virtual machines.)?? When modern replacements cost thousands or tens of thousands of dollars (and with the way the government is really trying to defund the social sciences), well, replacing equipment and/or software is... not that easily done.

I'd be willing to try a new distro if Ubuntu starts making ugly changes again - like they did with Unity.


On 2/9/20 9:31 PM, Sid Boyce via Groups.Io wrote:

Hi Bob,
Unfortunately - I have to run Ubuntu, first to help other people running it and also most SBC manufacturers only seem to know Ubuntu.
I have had problems? with Ubuntu where online updates end up with a non-booting system requiring a fresh install. No such problem with openSUSE which I have used since the mid 1980's.

Today's Tumbleweed update was 2239 packages on one PC and 2257 on another, they never miss a beat.

openSUSE only supports a few ARM SBC's. I have it running 64-bit Tumbleweed on my Pi 3B with? SDR apps ... quisk, pihpsdr, ghpsdr3-alex, QtRadio, gnuradio, LimeSDR apps and libraries, QtRadio, hamlib, etc. and they are more often than not later versions than available for Ubuntu.

For Hamradio apps you should look at what openSUSE provides, e.g


Quisk runs perfectly OK at 192K samplerate on a Pi 3B iwth openSUSE Tumbleweed aarch64 and so does pihpsdr and linhpsdr.

It's not always that developers get bored and move on to the next thing, some do of course, but some do so due to health reasons (CuSDR), some due to the flack they get from users and sometimes from companies wanting features they never intended to provide, case in point is the PiGPIO software and recently what some were doing incompatible? forking of the Hermes-Lite2 hardware/software which caused the developer to push back -- he has a day job and this is his hobby.
Similar sentiments were expressed by Jim a while back with regards to quisk.

One of the nice things about Linux is that you can get to the main developers which I have had to do over the years, asking for a fix, proposing/providing a fix. I have had? a number of issues, one, a coding error that had been in the kernel for years according to Linus and suddenly affected just me. The developer looked through his code and discovered the error. Where I can/could I submitted patches.

The only issuse I have are with Oracle VirtualBox,? they use kernel ABI's and are slow to follow kernel upgrades, also NVidia drivers --
When Christian Zander was at NVidia he used to provide me with swift driver patch updates to make public as he didn't want thousands of people bombarding him with their problems if they knew he was the guy.

The companies that provide Linux free to thee and me, they do provide paid support for their products to SME's and corporations and that's pays for our Linux use.

Where is Windows 7 now? Did not Apple change Mac hardware from PowerPC to x86?
I am sure there are lots of people and companies that had to upgrade and found key apps no longer would run.
The fate of Windows CE, Windows Phone --- on Wikipedia there is a surprisingly long list.

Good luck with your dissertation -- number one in terms of importance.
73 ... Sid.

On 09/02/2020 16:42, Robert D. Bowers wrote:

(Laugh)?? Yeah, there are sometimes upgrade headaches.?? When Ubuntu went with that horrid previous GUI (Unity), I did have some rather large issues because I've always preferred Gnome and despised the change (and the version of Red Hat I tried - an upgrade every six months did make for some real headaches as stuff did get broken every time). Even 18.04, which I really like - keeps trying to eliminate QGis, which I use all the time - and doesn't much like GRASS either (virtual machines have rarely been a problem...).?? (I've had people try to get me to change Distros to one more friendly to technical stuff, but I DO like amateur radio as well - and Ubuntu seems to fit the bill combining both, with a little additional work.)?? I could set up dual boot, but don't want to - I use multiple screens (3) and multiple workspaces to do everything - although I do run into problems when I try to run QUISK with other really technical stuff - too much demand on resources!?? (Quad 3.4ghz processors, 16gb memory, fast hard drive - and I DO overload it at times!)

About the only general Linux complaint I have is that some of the open source software - some really awesome stuff - people get bored and stop maintaining it.?? For instance, there is really potent citation software that I used to use all the time, which even had SQL for the database - but the author stopped maintaining it and doesn't respond to queries about it (he's moved on to other stuff).?? When people get bored and start making changes to stop being bored with the same old code - well, that's where it makes life more difficult for everyone.? (If it's not broken, don't fix it!!!)?? The needed updates to that software to work with the "improvements" by other programmers would have been a rather big chore from what I understand.

Quisk has given me a few headaches, but I've always been able to find help from more experienced people who use it (generally programmers), and I do know enough to "lift the lid" on Linux a bit and figure out some of the problems myself.?? The biggest issue I've encountered is that I use older hardware (which isn't working right at this time) - can't afford to buy the latest and greatest (and never could).?? LAUGH - my "good" HF rig is an old TS520, and my "good" 2m rig is 10-15 years old (good that I can repair stuff!).?? (I dream of being able to run 2m SSB - always wanted to.)

BTW - I've had the same experience as you - I learned C quite a few years ago (self-taught), but can puzzle out Python OK for doing troubleshooting and even some minor modding.?? I do hope to learn Python someday (and R), but right now am working on my dissertation research - and have enough on my plate for 10 people!!!?? (Simple projects only until I get some pans off the fire, so to speak!)

Bob


On 2/8/20 2:32 PM, Terry Fox wrote:

I absolutely agree that Jim has done a wonderful job with Quisk.?? Even though I am not a Python programmer (rather old school C), I enjoy reading through the Quisk Python code because to me it's very clean and easily understandable.

IN a separate thread, I poked at GNU Radio and GRC.?? I think it's good for learning and experimenting, but don't plan for long-term or "pretty" use.?? I did recently purchase the "MUD 2019 GNU Radio Workshop Notebook" from Lulu, which I recommend.?? While focused on microwave, it has some basic GNU information.

I also complained about Linux in a separate thread.?? The Linux "stable" releases tend to be just that, stable.?? Some of the problems come from upgrading between stable versions.? Even just doing "updates" can some time break things.?? Just beware of "The Wizards" randomly changing things, such as library locations, "deprecation", etc.? Stable can mean a couple different things.?? Linux does crash much less often than Windows, so it's more stable in that way.?? But Windows seems to support some older software better.?? When I complain to a friend about Linux-related problems with SDR and other software that I use, he says that's because I am on the "fringe" of Linux users, and most people don't suffer with similar problems because they just use simpler, common programs, such as Email, web browsers, and office apps.

Several years ago, I used SDR Shell, GNU Radio, GRC, Quisk, GQRX, and wrote my own SDR (SDR101) using QT.?? Quisk continues to be the cleanest, most reliable, and easiest to maintain.

In summary, I agree with items 1 & 2, but 3 may not be totally accurate, depending on circumstances and expectations.

Hi Bob,
Unfortunately - I have to run Ubuntu, first to help other people running it and also most SBC manufacturers only seem to know Ubuntu.
I have had problems? with Ubuntu where online updates end up with a non-booting system requiring a fresh install. No such problem with openSUSE which I have used since the mid 1980's.

Today's Tumbleweed update was 2239 packages on one PC and 2257 on another, they never miss a beat.

openSUSE only supports a few ARM SBC's. I have it running 64-bit Tumbleweed on my Pi 3B with? SDR apps ... quisk, pihpsdr, ghpsdr3-alex, QtRadio, gnuradio, LimeSDR apps and libraries, QtRadio, hamlib, etc. and they are more often than not later versions than available for Ubuntu.

For Hamradio apps you should look at what openSUSE provides, e.g


Quisk runs perfectly OK at 192K samplerate on a Pi 3B iwth openSUSE Tumbleweed aarch64 and so does pihpsdr and linhpsdr.

It's not always that developers get bored and move on to the next thing, some do of course, but some do so due to health reasons (CuSDR), some due to the flack they get from users and sometimes from companies wanting features they never intended to provide, case in point is the PiGPIO software and recently what some were doing incompatible? forking of the Hermes-Lite2 hardware/software which caused the developer to push back -- he has a day job and this is his hobby.
Similar sentiments were expressed by Jim a while back with regards to quisk.

One of the nice things about Linux is that you can get to the main developers which I have had to do over the years, asking for a fix, proposing/providing a fix. I have had? a number of issues, one, a coding error that had been in the kernel for years according to Linus and suddenly affected just me. The developer looked through his code and discovered the error. Where I can/could I submitted patches.

The only issuse I have are with Oracle VirtualBox,? they use kernel ABI's and are slow to follow kernel upgrades, also NVidia drivers --
When Christian Zander was at NVidia he used to provide me with swift driver patch updates to make public as he didn't want thousands of people bombarding him with their problems if they knew he was the guy.

The companies that provide Linux free to thee and me, they do provide paid support for their products to SME's and corporations and that's pays for our Linux use.

Where is Windows 7 now? Did not Apple change Mac hardware from PowerPC to x86?
I am sure there are lots of people and companies that had to upgrade and found key apps no longer would run.
The fate of Windows CE, Windows Phone --- on Wikipedia there is a surprisingly long list.

Good luck with your dissertation -- number one in terms of importance.
73 ... Sid.

On 09/02/2020 16:42, Robert D. Bowers wrote:

(Laugh)?? Yeah, there are sometimes upgrade headaches.?? When Ubuntu went with that horrid previous GUI (Unity), I did have some rather large issues because I've always preferred Gnome and despised the change (and the version of Red Hat I tried - an upgrade every six months did make for some real headaches as stuff did get broken every time). Even 18.04, which I really like - keeps trying to eliminate QGis, which I use all the time - and doesn't much like GRASS either (virtual machines have rarely been a problem...).?? (I've had people try to get me to change Distros to one more friendly to technical stuff, but I DO like amateur radio as well - and Ubuntu seems to fit the bill combining both, with a little additional work.)?? I could set up dual boot, but don't want to - I use multiple screens (3) and multiple workspaces to do everything - although I do run into problems when I try to run QUISK with other really technical stuff - too much demand on resources!?? (Quad 3.4ghz processors, 16gb memory, fast hard drive - and I DO overload it at times!)

About the only general Linux complaint I have is that some of the open source software - some really awesome stuff - people get bored and stop maintaining it.?? For instance, there is really potent citation software that I used to use all the time, which even had SQL for the database - but the author stopped maintaining it and doesn't respond to queries about it (he's moved on to other stuff).?? When people get bored and start making changes to stop being bored with the same old code - well, that's where it makes life more difficult for everyone.? (If it's not broken, don't fix it!!!)?? The needed updates to that software to work with the "improvements" by other programmers would have been a rather big chore from what I understand.

Quisk has given me a few headaches, but I've always been able to find help from more experienced people who use it (generally programmers), and I do know enough to "lift the lid" on Linux a bit and figure out some of the problems myself.?? The biggest issue I've encountered is that I use older hardware (which isn't working right at this time) - can't afford to buy the latest and greatest (and never could).?? LAUGH - my "good" HF rig is an old TS520, and my "good" 2m rig is 10-15 years old (good that I can repair stuff!).?? (I dream of being able to run 2m SSB - always wanted to.)

BTW - I've had the same experience as you - I learned C quite a few years ago (self-taught), but can puzzle out Python OK for doing troubleshooting and even some minor modding.?? I do hope to learn Python someday (and R), but right now am working on my dissertation research - and have enough on my plate for 10 people!!!?? (Simple projects only until I get some pans off the fire, so to speak!)

Bob


On 2/8/20 2:32 PM, Terry Fox wrote:

I absolutely agree that Jim has done a wonderful job with Quisk.?? Even though I am not a Python programmer (rather old school C), I enjoy reading through the Quisk Python code because to me it's very clean and easily understandable.

IN a separate thread, I poked at GNU Radio and GRC.?? I think it's good for learning and experimenting, but don't plan for long-term or "pretty" use.?? I did recently purchase the "MUD 2019 GNU Radio Workshop Notebook" from Lulu, which I recommend.?? While focused on microwave, it has some basic GNU information.

I also complained about Linux in a separate thread.?? The Linux "stable" releases tend to be just that, stable.?? Some of the problems come from upgrading between stable versions.? Even just doing "updates" can some time break things.?? Just beware of "The Wizards" randomly changing things, such as library locations, "deprecation", etc.?? Stable can mean a couple different things.?? Linux does crash much less often than Windows, so it's more stable in that way.?? But Windows seems to support some older software better.?? When I complain to a friend about Linux-related problems with SDR and other software that I use, he says that's because I am on the "fringe" of Linux users, and most people don't suffer with similar problems because they just use simpler, common programs, such as Email, web browsers, and office apps.

Several years ago, I used SDR Shell, GNU Radio, GRC, Quisk, GQRX, and wrote my own SDR (SDR101) using QT.?? Quisk continues to be the cleanest, most reliable, and easiest to maintain.

In summary, I agree with items 1 & 2, but 3 may not be totally accurate, depending on circumstances and expectations.

Michael,

Thank-you for the response.? I did try that with the same result.? There is a slight pause and then the cmd prompt comes back.? Nothing appears to start.? That is the same if I just type in quisk without python3, or for python quisk.? I do not have another python install other than 3.8.1.

At this point I am at a loss for what to do.? I do realize that the work is voluntary, as a hobby, so will just wait and see if someone else might have a suggestion.

73
Evan
AC9TU

(Laugh)?? Yeah, there are sometimes upgrade headaches.?? When Ubuntu went with that horrid previous GUI (Unity), I did have some rather large issues because I've always preferred Gnome and despised the change (and the version of Red Hat I tried - an upgrade every six months did make for some real headaches as stuff did get broken every time). Even 18.04, which I really like - keeps trying to eliminate QGis, which I use all the time - and doesn't much like GRASS either (virtual machines have rarely been a problem...).?? (I've had people try to get me to change Distros to one more friendly to technical stuff, but I DO like amateur radio as well - and Ubuntu seems to fit the bill combining both, with a little additional work.)?? I could set up dual boot, but don't want to - I use multiple screens (3) and multiple workspaces to do everything - although I do run into problems when I try to run QUISK with other really technical stuff - too much demand on resources!?? (Quad 3.4ghz processors, 16gb memory, fast hard drive - and I DO overload it at times!)

About the only general Linux complaint I have is that some of the open source software - some really awesome stuff - people get bored and stop maintaining it.?? For instance, there is really potent citation software that I used to use all the time, which even had SQL for the database - but the author stopped maintaining it and doesn't respond to queries about it (he's moved on to other stuff).?? When people get bored and start making changes to stop being bored with the same old code - well, that's where it makes life more difficult for everyone.?? (If it's not broken, don't fix it!!!)?? The needed updates to that software to work with the "improvements" by other programmers would have been a rather big chore from what I understand.

Quisk has given me a few headaches, but I've always been able to find help from more experienced people who use it (generally programmers), and I do know enough to "lift the lid" on Linux a bit and figure out some of the problems myself.?? The biggest issue I've encountered is that I use older hardware (which isn't working right at this time) - can't afford to buy the latest and greatest (and never could).?? LAUGH - my "good" HF rig is an old TS520, and my "good" 2m rig is 10-15 years old (good that I can repair stuff!).?? (I dream of being able to run 2m SSB - always wanted to.)

BTW - I've had the same experience as you - I learned C quite a few years ago (self-taught), but can puzzle out Python OK for doing troubleshooting and even some minor modding.?? I do hope to learn Python someday (and R), but right now am working on my dissertation research - and have enough on my plate for 10 people!!!?? (Simple projects only until I get some pans off the fire, so to speak!)

Bob


On 2/8/20 2:32 PM, Terry Fox wrote:

I absolutely agree that Jim has done a wonderful job with Quisk.?? Even though I am not a Python programmer (rather old school C), I enjoy reading through the Quisk Python code because to me it's very clean and easily understandable.

IN a separate thread, I poked at GNU Radio and GRC.?? I think it's good for learning and experimenting, but don't plan for long-term or "pretty" use.?? I did recently purchase the "MUD 2019 GNU Radio Workshop Notebook" from Lulu, which I recommend.?? While focused on microwave, it has some basic GNU information.

I also complained about Linux in a separate thread.?? The Linux "stable" releases tend to be just that, stable.?? Some of the problems come from upgrading between stable versions.?? Even just doing "updates" can some time break things.?? Just beware of "The Wizards" randomly changing things, such as library locations, "deprecation", etc.?? Stable can mean a couple different things.?? Linux does crash much less often than Windows, so it's more stable in that way.?? But Windows seems to support some older software better.?? When I complain to a friend about Linux-related problems with SDR and other software that I use, he says that's because I am on the "fringe" of Linux users, and most people don't suffer with similar problems because they just use simpler, common programs, such as Email, web browsers, and office apps.

Several years ago, I used SDR Shell, GNU Radio, GRC, Quisk, GQRX, and wrote my own SDR (SDR101) using QT.?? Quisk continues to be the cleanest, most reliable, and easiest to maintain.

In summary, I agree with items 1 & 2, but 3 may not be totally accurate, depending on circumstances and expectations.

I absolutely agree that Jim has done a wonderful job with Quisk.? Even though I am not a Python programmer (rather old school C), I enjoy reading through the Quisk Python code because to me it's very clean and easily understandable.

IN a separate thread, I poked at GNU Radio and GRC.? I think it's good for learning and experimenting, but don't plan for long-term or "pretty" use.? I did recently purchase the "MUD 2019 GNU Radio Workshop Notebook" from Lulu, which I recommend.? While focused on microwave, it has some basic GNU information.

I also complained about Linux in a separate thread.? The Linux "stable" releases tend to be just that, stable.? Some of the problems come from upgrading between stable versions.? Even just doing "updates" can some time break things.? Just beware of "The Wizards" randomly changing things, such as library locations, "deprecation", etc.? Stable can mean a couple different things.? Linux does crash much less often than Windows, so it's more stable in that way.? But Windows seems to support some older software better.? When I complain to a friend about Linux-related problems with SDR and other software that I use, he says that's because I am on the "fringe" of Linux users, and most people don't suffer with similar problems because they just use simpler, common programs, such as Email, web browsers, and office apps.

Several years ago, I used SDR Shell, GNU Radio, GRC, Quisk, GQRX, and wrote my own SDR (SDR101) using QT.? Quisk continues to be the cleanest, most reliable, and easiest to maintain.

In summary, I agree with items 1 & 2, but 3 may not be totally accurate, depending on circumstances and expectations.

Hi Bob,

We are in violent agreement ;-)?? "Uunstable" was sloppy? word choice on my part. Linux is in a state of constant development. Trying to keep up with that can wear out a person whose priority is the productive application of linux. The answer is, as you point out, to choose the appropriate linux distribution.

For several years I have relied on Ubuntu LTS versions for my gainful employment in R&D. Only rarely have I been bitten by regression failures and automatic updates and even those instances were recoverable with minor effort. For the last couple of years, I have been running the Lubuntu sub-set because I prefer a lightweight window manager and operating features more typical of unix workstations. Recently, I have been trying out Linux Mint in the context of hobby activity and basic email, word-processing, etc., curious to see whether its update policies and feature set offer benefits. After a few months, it's thumbs up for Linux Mint 19.2. I have had zero issues. Updates are not at all intrusive, but adequate for security, as near as I can tell. It runs nicely on old PC hardware. One family member, starting with only basic windows skills, was able to transition with zero effort, with no complaints, except that open-source Solitaire games are not as cool as windows' proprietary version.

I'd summarize your point as, Linux is what you make it. It can be simple, efficient, easy to use by anyone and solidly stable.

Incidentally, back when I first installed Patrick Volkerding's Slackware with the 1.09 kernel, I recall his cautionary advice to avoid trying to keep up with versioning. That's still pretty good advice. I also recall re-compiling the kernel with only the features I needed (long before it was modular), thereby enabling snappy performance on really limited hardware. There was also the manual dot-by-dot calculation and construction of video modelines that Sid referred to. I concocted a modeline to produce crt timing to exactly match windows' driver, so I could switch back and forth between OSes without adjusting crt controls. Ok, stopping there-- that's Linux nostalgia, which is off topic...

Bruce, ag5gt

After re-reading all of the comments, I don't see much to disagree with. Summary: (1) Quisk is well-optimized and remarkably adaptable, as is. (2) GRC has its uses, but would not be a framework within which Qusik could/should be replicated.? (3) Linux is inherently unstable, but users accept that as part of the deal.

Thanks to all.

Bruce, ag5gt

I hadn't updated Quisk in a while, so I did and now it doesn't work. Apparently the soappy support that is part of Debian (I run Debian GNU/Linux 64 bit) doesn't work with the version of soappy that i have.

You wouldn't happen to know how to verify that, would you?

On 2/5/2020 7:03 AM, R.J. Butcher wrote:

Should interface using Soapy - all set up using Quisk Radios screen.

Works fine with Lime board. TxRx also working but flaky. See Jim's notes. Lime also works with GNU

73 Bob g3udi




On Feb 5 2020, Jonathan Guthrie wrote:

I know it's a little late after sending a couple of emails to the group, but hello the group!

I'm interested in using Quisk with this HackRF One that I have. I'd like to eventually use it as an HF radio. I realize that Quisk may need some modifications for this to work, but I'm a reasonably capable programmer, so I'm expecting to have to help with that.