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Difference Between Compare and Reset #decoderpro

 

Don, if I have understood your problem correctly, then your locomotive runs after a decoder reset, but if you write your previously used CVs saved in DecoderPro back into the reset decoder, the locomotive no longer runs?

Yes, there may be CVs in the decoder that cannot be displayed with DecoderPro and therefore cannot be read or written. The CVs used are defined in the corresponding decoder template.

To analyze your problem above, perform a decoder reset and then compare your saved CVs with the values in the decoder. You must check all the different CV values and evaluate them using the decoder documentation. Then you should be able to find the cause.

Uli

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All,
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CVs 2, 6, and 5 are 1, 50, and 140.
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Econamis have an engine interlock, bit 4 of CV 114, but I've never used that setting or set that bit.
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Regards
 


Its a long shot, but is CV5 set too low or even zero. ( for loksound the motor is disabled by setiing cv5 = zero.)
Steve G.
 

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OK

Another small step. Some decoders have a “disconnect” mode where you can power the prime mover WITHOUT engaging “drive”. If this is selected (or not actively unselected), you will experience the same symptoms

Do you have the original doc for the sound project??

Phil G?

On 5 Apr 2025, at 10:21, Don Shroyer via groups.io <Donshroyer@...> wrote:

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Phil G,
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Changing CV 29 to 7 results in the loco responding to the short address in the same way as previously reported. Meaning sounds are fine, but no loco movement.
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Regards
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Phil G,
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Changing CV 29 to 7 results in the loco responding to the short address in the same way as previously reported. Meaning sounds are fine, but no loco movement.
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Regards
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Peter,
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I had changed the Brake Key to FKey 7, but I always check to confirm that all FKeys are Off.
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Phil G,
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Let me try that and report back.
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Regards
 

Testing the brake is simple. F11 is the default for these decoders. Make sure F11 is off.

--
Peter Ulvestad
Linux Mint 22.1, JMRI 5.11.4plus, Java 21.0.6
JMRI Users Group Moderator ( /g/jmriusers )
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Just for a sanity check, if you change cv29 to 7 does it respond to the short address??

Phil G

On 4 Apr 2025, at 11:46, Don Shroyer via groups.io <Donshroyer@...> wrote:

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Phil G,
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CV 1: 9, CV 17: 213, CV 18: 96, CV 29: 39, CV 19: 0. While there is a Primary Address of 9, I use the Long Address 5472. I ran the loco reversed.
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And Acceleration and Deceleration are 25 and 15.
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Regards
 

Phil G,
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CV 1: 9, CV 17: 213, CV 18: 96, CV 29: 39, CV 19: 0. While there is a Primary Address of 9, I use the Long Address 5472. I ran the loco reversed.
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And Acceleration and Deceleration are 25 and 15.
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Regards
 

All,
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The point about braking is certainly a good one. I've just never used anything more than braking sound effects, no actual slowing of the loco.
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Regards
 

Bob,
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It's in my OP.
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Regards
 

I was suggesting one step at a time. Small ones

Phil G

On 4 Apr 2025, at 07:44, Mick Moignard via groups.io <mick@...> wrote:

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Writing CVs back to a decoder will not magically turn a function, like
brakes, back on.

I’d look at speed tables, inertia, stuff like that next if the OP is sure
his addressing is correct.

Mick

Mick
______________________________________
Mick Moignard
mick@...
p:+44 7774 652504

The week may start M, T, but it always ends WTF!
 

Writing CVs back to a decoder will not magically turn a function, like
brakes, back on.

I’d look at speed tables, inertia, stuff like that next if the OP is sure
his addressing is correct.

Mick

Mick
______________________________________
Mick Moignard
mick@...
p:+44 7774 652504

The week may start M, T, but it always ends WTF!
 

Which decoder definition is this, exactly?

Bob

—
Bob Jacobsen
rgj1927@...
 

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Wouter comments:

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“The question should really be asked as:

- what does jmri write to these cvs?

- what is read back on the programming track?

That would rule out another type of error.”

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JMRI _should_ be writing that which is displayed on the screen when whatever command to write to the decoders is executed.? Hopefully it is either “Write all . . . “.

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Reading back the values of the CVs _after_ the “Write .? . “ to the decoder would be a good idea, but I suspect the OP has done the equivalent by using the compare process on the CV’s tab.

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Anything that sheds further light on what is occurring is a good idea.

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Best regards,

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Steve

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Steve Haas

Snoqualmie, WA
 

The question should really be asked as:
- what does jmri write to these cvs?
- what is read back on the programming track?
That would rule out another type of error.

Wouter

On Thu, 3 Apr 2025, 21:45 Phil G via , <phil=[email protected]> wrote:
After writing back to the decoder, what’s in cvs 1, 17, 18, 29 and 19??

Phil G

On 3 Apr 2025, at 21:18, Steve Haas via <Goatfisher2=[email protected]> wrote:

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Continuing the conversation, Don responds:

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      “Are you saying that CV 19 would somehow elude the Compare?”

Not likely – CV19 is just another location in the decoder to be compared to the data stored in the record in the Decoder Pro Decoder index.

This could be tested by changing CV19 in either the decoder itself or in the record in Decoder Pro, then running the compare function on the CV page.


      “You read the part where I say the settings had been working... for years in fact, right? No mysterious brake, BEMF, consist, or the like. And Economies don't, to my knowledge, have Drive Hold, Reverser Centered, or such features that could even accidentally be activated.”

Yes, I did.

The symptoms are identical to those reported previously by others where the braking functionality _has_ been revealed to be the cause.? While you are adamant this is not the case (no reason to doubt you), the symptoms _do_ seem to match that possibility.

So, if not braking related, what is left?

From your description, a reset decoder works fine until the values stored in Decoder Pro are written to the decoder, at which time the decoder ceases to respond.

I don’t recall the specifics;? Can you share the make and model of both your DCC system and the decoder again??

After you issue the decoder reset command, the loco/decoder responds at short address three, correct?

And after that you write the data stored in Decoder Pro back to the decoder, correct?

Does writing the settings from Decoder Pro back to the decoder itself result in the address being changed from short address 3 to some other address (short or long), and that is the address the decoder is not responding to?

I’m starting to suspect some type of potential disconnect between data loaded into the decoder via the reset, and data the command station has stored in regard to the address that doesn’t work after the decoder data is written to the decoder.

Various DCC systems store different pieces of data about a loco/decoder in their memory.

I’m not a specialist on the internal workings of various command stations, so folks with knowledge of your specific system’s internal workings would have to chime in here.

Hopefully this will give you some additional paths to explore.

Keep us posted.

Best regards,

Steve

Steve Haas

Snoqualmie, WA











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Regards
 

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After writing back to the decoder, what’s in cvs 1, 17, 18, 29 and 19??

Phil G

On 3 Apr 2025, at 21:18, Steve Haas via groups.io <Goatfisher2@...> wrote:

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Continuing the conversation, Don responds:

?

      “Are you saying that CV 19 would somehow elude the Compare?”

Not likely – CV19 is just another location in the decoder to be compared to the data stored in the record in the Decoder Pro Decoder index.

This could be tested by changing CV19 in either the decoder itself or in the record in Decoder Pro, then running the compare function on the CV page.


      “You read the part where I say the settings had been working... for years in fact, right? No mysterious brake, BEMF, consist, or the like. And Economies don't, to my knowledge, have Drive Hold, Reverser Centered, or such features that could even accidentally be activated.”

Yes, I did.

The symptoms are identical to those reported previously by others where the braking functionality _has_ been revealed to be the cause.? While you are adamant this is not the case (no reason to doubt you), the symptoms _do_ seem to match that possibility.

So, if not braking related, what is left?

From your description, a reset decoder works fine until the values stored in Decoder Pro are written to the decoder, at which time the decoder ceases to respond.

I don’t recall the specifics;? Can you share the make and model of both your DCC system and the decoder again??

After you issue the decoder reset command, the loco/decoder responds at short address three, correct?

And after that you write the data stored in Decoder Pro back to the decoder, correct?

Does writing the settings from Decoder Pro back to the decoder itself result in the address being changed from short address 3 to some other address (short or long), and that is the address the decoder is not responding to?

I’m starting to suspect some type of potential disconnect between data loaded into the decoder via the reset, and data the command station has stored in regard to the address that doesn’t work after the decoder data is written to the decoder.

Various DCC systems store different pieces of data about a loco/decoder in their memory.

I’m not a specialist on the internal workings of various command stations, so folks with knowledge of your specific system’s internal workings would have to chime in here.

Hopefully this will give you some additional paths to explore.

Keep us posted.

Best regards,

Steve

Steve Haas

Snoqualmie, WA











?

Regards
 

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Continuing the conversation, Don responds:

?

      “Are you saying that CV 19 would somehow elude the Compare?”

Not likely – CV19 is just another location in the decoder to be compared to the data stored in the record in the Decoder Pro Decoder index.

This could be tested by changing CV19 in either the decoder itself or in the record in Decoder Pro, then running the compare function on the CV page.


      “You read the part where I say the settings had been working... for years in fact, right? No mysterious brake, BEMF, consist, or the like. And Economies don't, to my knowledge, have Drive Hold, Reverser Centered, or such features that could even accidentally be activated.”

Yes, I did.

The symptoms are identical to those reported previously by others where the braking functionality _has_ been revealed to be the cause.? While you are adamant this is not the case (no reason to doubt you), the symptoms _do_ seem to match that possibility.

So, if not braking related, what is left?

From your description, a reset decoder works fine until the values stored in Decoder Pro are written to the decoder, at which time the decoder ceases to respond.

I don’t recall the specifics;? Can you share the make and model of both your DCC system and the decoder again??

After you issue the decoder reset command, the loco/decoder responds at short address three, correct?

And after that you write the data stored in Decoder Pro back to the decoder, correct?

Does writing the settings from Decoder Pro back to the decoder itself result in the address being changed from short address 3 to some other address (short or long), and that is the address the decoder is not responding to?

I’m starting to suspect some type of potential disconnect between data loaded into the decoder via the reset, and data the command station has stored in regard to the address that doesn’t work after the decoder data is written to the decoder.

Various DCC systems store different pieces of data about a loco/decoder in their memory.

I’m not a specialist on the internal workings of various command stations, so folks with knowledge of your specific system’s internal workings would have to chime in here.

Hopefully this will give you some additional paths to explore.

Keep us posted.

Best regards,

Steve

Steve Haas

Snoqualmie, WA











?

Regards
 

But when you program the saved file into the decoder then it programs in CV19 as well, so the compare will show as all correctly programmed.



On Mon, 31 Mar 2025 at 15:55, Don Shroyer via <Donshroyer=[email protected]> wrote:
All,
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Good point about the command station. Something to check out.
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But about CV 19, would that not be caught in the CVs tab Compare??
?
Regards
 

On Mon, Mar 31, 2025 at 10:55 AM, Don Shroyer wrote:
But about CV 19, would that not be caught in the CVs tab Compare??
Certainly does catch it on a diitrax decoder, I wouldnt have thought any other decoder would be different.
Steve G

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