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Locked Decoder Pro Manual ?
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Walter Thompson
JMRI changes and improves. The on-line help files try to keep up with those changes.
The manual was an attempt to create a printable PDF of the current online files. Because the PDF manual is a snapshot of the files at the time it was created, it does not reflect the current help files. The thread is the users group that start with message #70246 shows the confusion that the manual causes. Walt |
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Walter Thompson
What are the options to fix this?
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1. Change the manual so its links to the help pages " ? Then what is the use of the manual? 2. Delete the DP Manual and use the energy to update the Help pages? An example is the " needs updating. Other ideas? Walt --- In jmriusers@..., "Walter Thompson" <wsthompson@...> wrote:
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The 'operations manual' which I think was the start of the messages (see #70246) is not the same as the DecoderPro PDF manual.
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The 'Operations Manual' can be saved to the local computer as a 'web archive, single file' with a .mth extension Bob --- In jmriusers@..., "Walter Thompson" <wsthompson@...> wrote:
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Dale A Tripp
The manual update for 2.10 was nearing completion, but now must be updated to 2.12. The help files are good except that many things covered in the manual are not in the help files. Also the manual is generated in HTML then converted to pdf presently. auto generation of pdf from help files is not going to cover everything.
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Now if the help files were expanded into a hypertext document, it might work. One important piece of info in the help files is missing, the how to and the sequence of events to accomplish the task. Presently the help files only cover the specific page or window from which it is accessed. I am preparing to update to 2.12 shortly, now that I have my system up and running again. B0b Shank has been working with me on the updates. Dale Tripp On 8/3/2011 2:11 PM, John Plocher wrote:
On Wed, Aug 3, 2011 at 10:48 AM, Walter Thompson |
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On Aug 3, 2011, at 4:32 PM, Dale A Tripp <dat7719@...> wrote:
The manual update for 2.10 was nearing completion, but now must beThe help files ARE HTML documents. Paul |
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Walter Thompson
Dale:
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Wouldn't it be more helpful to get the Help pages updated? The current help for operations is something like 50 pages. It just doesn't seem practical to print every thing and then as soon as something is changed the whole document is out of date. Wouldn't there be a way to have the 'Manual' kept current by just using links to the Help files, which can be updated individually, rater than as one document like the manual appears to require? The help pages could be reformatted or a CCS could be used to print them, if somebody really wants to. Bottom line is that if its not up to date with the current releases, both test release and production release should we send users to it for help? I think not. IMHO Walt --- In jmriusers@..., Dale A Tripp <dat7719@...> wrote:
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On Aug 3, 2011, at 6:35 PM, Walter Thompson wrote:
Wouldn't there be a way to have the 'Manual' kept current by just using links to the Help files, which can be updated individually, rater than as one document like the manual appears to require?It would also be _very_ good to get things like the Manual in SVN so that many people can work on it, and so that incremental improvements and fixes can be made. The problem with having something as big as a Manual done by a separate, offline effort on a project like JMRI is that, despite hard work by dedicated people, it will almost always be significantly out of date. Bob -- Bob Jacobsen, UC Berkeley jacobsen@... +1-510-486-7355 fax +1-510-643-8497 AIM, Skype JacobsenRG |
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Walter Thompson
Bob B:
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There is not an 'Operations Manual" there is an Operations help page. It is at . If you want to help somebody with Operations that link is the place to start. Copying that shtml and putting into the files area of the Users group does not get it updated when the help file is changed. The current help files are what is current. Old copies of the help files are not! That is what happened with (see #70246) and the same bad info in the "current" DP Manual. Walt --- In jmriusers@..., "bob byck" <me_bob@...> wrote:
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Dale A Tripp
"operations manual" not sure what you mean. The Decoder Pro Manual has a section covering Operations.
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Dale Tripp On 8/3/2011 2:32 PM, bob byck wrote:
The 'operations manual' which I think was the start of the messages (see #70246) is not the same as the DecoderPro PDF manual. |
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Dale A Tripp
HTML files are not necessarily a hypertext document. In other words the help files normally have no links to other help files.
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Dale Tripp On 8/3/2011 3:22 PM, Paul Bender wrote:
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Marshall
Walt,
I get the following error when I click on the link you provided to Operations help page An error has been encountered in accessing this page. 1. Server: jmri.org 2. URL path: /help/en/package/jmri/jmrit/operations/Operations.shtml. 3. Error notes: NONE 4. Error type: 404 5. Request method: GET 6. Request query string: NONE 7. Time: 2011-08-03 23:11:05 UTC (1312413065) Reporting this problem: The problem you have encountered is with a project web site hosted by SourceForge.net. This issue should be reported to the SourceForge.net-hosted project (not to SourceForge.net). If this is a severe or recurring/persistent problem, please do one of the following, and provide the error text (numbered 1 through 7, above): 1.. Contact the project via their designated support resources. 2.. Contact the project administrators of this project via email (see the upper right-hand corner of the Project Summary page for their usernames) at user-name@... If you are a maintainer of this web content, please refer to the Site Documentation regarding web services for further assistance. NOTE: As of 2008-10-23 directory index display has been disabled by default. This option may be re-enabled by the project by placing a file with the name ".htaccess" with this line: Options +Indexes Marshall Wales From: Walter Thompson Sent: Wednesday, August 03, 2011 4:01 PM To: jmriusers@... Subject: [jmriusers] Re: Decoder Pro Manual ? Bob B: There is not an 'Operations Manual" there is an Operations help page. It is at . If you want to help somebody with Operations that link is the place to start. Copying that shtml and putting into the files area of the Users group does not get it updated when the help file is changed. The current help files are what is current. Old copies of the help files are not! That is what happened with (see #70246) and the same bad info in the "current" DP Manual. Walt --- In mailto:jmriusers%40yahoogroups.com, "bob byck" <me_bob@...> wrote:
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed] |
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Walter Thompson
The period should not be on the end of it. try this:
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Walt --- In jmriusers@..., "Marshall" <fen7777@...> wrote:
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Walter Thompson
Dale:
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I don't understand why that is a problem. Walt --- In jmriusers@..., Dale A Tripp <dat7719@...> wrote:
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Dale A Tripp
The Help files should be updated by the developers as they make changes to the code, mainly, they are the person who know what the change is.
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Help files could be updated to a manual level by adding many new graphics of the current pages/windows/panes/dialogs with explanations. We are talking about several hundred files and more than a hundred graphics (png files). Currently, I believe that the current help files are HTML 4 or older and a weak CSS 1. To make a good document, these need to be updated XHTML with CSS 3 and shortly to HTML 5.0. Also help files only are available after a good install. The manual addresses Pre install scenario and hardware requirements. The manual now covers procedural use, whereas, the help files address only the purpose of an item in the program. BTW the help files are used to update the manual, but in many cases do not have enough information to write the manual. When writing the manual, the program is run, each Window, pane, dialog is noted (copied) and run using actual operating interface and command station with locomotive. Example: When programming a decoder: The manual goes thru each pane in sequence and explains what they do and the optimum sequence. The help file for each pane gives and explanation for each item on the pane, but does not relate that pane to the process. The manual could be kept current with a working copy in HTML as each development release is processed, the updated to a printable manual for each production release. Dale Tripp On 8/3/2011 3:35 PM, Walter Thompson wrote:
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Dale A Tripp
Bob
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That would be a great idea, Can SVN handle XHTML with CSS 3? I remember CVS had a lot of limitations. I have the complete document in the latest HTML with images and xlsx file for status of each file. I have never used SVN and I do all the updates to the pages in Adobe Dreamweaver CS4. What do we need to do to put the manual in SVN? Are there any tutorials on using SVN ? Dale Tripp On 8/3/2011 3:41 PM, Bob Jacobsen wrote:
On Aug 3, 2011, at 6:35 PM, Walter Thompson wrote:Wouldn't there be a way to have the 'Manual' kept current by just using links to the Help files, which can be updated individually, rater than as one document like the manual appears to require?It would also be _very_ good to get things like the Manual in SVN so that many people can work on it, and so that incremental improvements and fixes can be made. |
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Dale A Tripp
The referenced Operations Manual is good but is not hyper-linked with a table of contents.
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Dale Tripp On 8/3/2011 4:19 PM, Walter Thompson wrote:
The period should not be on the end of it. try this: |
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Dale A Tripp
The problem is that you can not link to a more detailed explanation. Example: The "operations manual" is linear top to bottom. It could be improved by making each of the major processes a separate page and linked, allowing the user to access the processes in a non-linear manner.
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Dale Tripp On 8/3/2011 4:23 PM, Walter Thompson wrote:
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Sorry if we have different opinions of the document at:
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(SVN)/ws/jmri/help/en/package/jmri/jmrit/operations/Operations.shtml Sure looks and reads like a manual to me... Bob --- In jmriusers@..., "Walter Thompson" <wsthompson@...> wrote:
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A user guide or user's guide, also commonly known as a manual, is a technical communication document intended to give assistance to people using a particular system. It is usually written by a technical writer, although user guides are written by programmers, product or project managers, or other technical staff, particularly in smaller companies.
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User guides are most commonly associated with electronic goods, computer hardware and software. Most user guides contain both a written guide and the associated images. In the case of computer applications, it is usual to include screenshots of how the program should look, and hardware manuals often include clear, simplified diagrams. The language used is matched to the intended audience, with jargon kept to a minimum or explained thoroughly --- In jmriusers@..., "bob byck" <me_bob@...> wrote:
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Bob Jacobsen
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