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Locked Signalling issue with my panel
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Hi,
I have built a panel in panelpro using layout editor, so far I am very pleased with the results. ?However I have just added signals to the panel and they do not operate quite as expected. ? I am using the BR.2003 system and have added a mixture of signals, several dual aspect, one three aspect with feather and several ground signals. I have set them all up in the signal heads and then signal mast as per the instructions. ?I can change the aspects from either table ok. I have then added the signal masts to the panel in the locations I want them to be and to some extent I am very happy with the result as I can control the aspect by clicking on the panel. My confusion comes as when I load the panel all the signals look like a red X. ?I had created a load of routes to set up routes but I also included a reset route which I use at loadup to reset all points closed and all signals red. The panel updates nicely showing the position of all the points/turnouts but the signals remain as a red X. How do I get the panel to refresh the signal condition other than me having to go round and click each one several times until showing red. Hope this makes sense, I cannot find anything in theorem to the help pages. regards Doug |
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Doug,
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When you added the signal masts to the panel, did you place them at block boundaries. Signal masts can be placed at end bumpers, anchor points, edge connectors and turnout connections. The right click context menu has an entry for setting signal masts. Once the masts are in the proper locations, you generate the signal mast logic using the signal mast logic table or for individual masts using the signal mast context menu. Dave Sand On Nov 29, 2018, at 3:22 PM, douglas.31johnson via Groups.Io <douglas.31johnson@...> wrote: |
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Doug,
The red X for the signals imply that you have sensors or turnouts that are not initialized. Until a sensor or turnout state becomes set that in turn triggers the signal logic, nothing sets the signal. So go through your sensor and turnout table, you will see what is still UNKNOWN. -Ken Cameron, Member JMRI Dev Team www.jmri.org www.fingerlakeslivesteamers.org www.cnymod.com www.syracusemodelrr.org |
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Thank you to both of you.? I have tried to look at your suggestions but it either does not work as you suggest or I cannot find the relevant options.
All I want is a very basic control system where the "head table", "mast table" and "signal icon" on the panel all agree with each other.? At the moment the tables reflect the changes but the panel does not.? If I click on the icon on the panel it changes the tables but not there other way around.? I have not bothered with logic as I do not need it for the very simple system I am running.? I have used routes to control some of the signals but again those changes are not reflected on the panel. I apologise if I am not making sense I am not a programmer and am not after a complex automatic system.? To be honest I am at the point of buying a simple mimic system to replace the JMRI. Regards Doug |
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Doug,
Here is an important point to keep in mind. The changes flow downhill so to speak. If you have a mast that is built from heads that is driven by turnouts, there is an order to how they work. If you change the mast, it tells the heads, the heads send the turnout (output) commands. But it is only one way, the heads can't update the mast, the outputs (turnouts) won't update the heads. So you need to make sure your panel has the mast on the pane. Then as you toggle it, the changes flow down the tree. If you used routes, they would have to be able to tell the mast what to do, I don't think they can. Routes talk to turnouts. -Ken Cameron, Member JMRI Dev Team www.jmri.org www.fingerlakeslivesteamers.org www.cnymod.com www.syracusemodelrr.org |
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Hi Ken,
Thats make a lot of sense to me thanks for the explantation. ?It fits with what I am seeing so I have decided to remove the signals from routes and go to a manual signalling system by clicking on the Icons to achieve the right aspect. This fits better as my ground signals will work as per the British Rail system and signal both ways on a turnout for a short move such as light engine or shunting. The only thing I would love to achieve is the mast icons on the panel being dynamic to the tables. ?(If that makes sense.) For now I will set all signals to danger from the panel and set them manually after the route is set. ?This way it is a simple route setting system as well as a signalling system.. Maybe as I get better at this I can automate some of the signals such as the entry point to the two fiddle yards which depend on a turnout being set correctly. ?am feeling a little ?better about things now many thanks Doug |
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I have been through all this too.? I don't find that the automation in JMRI meets what I require so I have written Logix to check routes clear, switch points (turnouts) and then signals (BR2003) in a timed sequence.? The automated stuff a) works too fast, b) my electronics overruns itself and sometimes loses commands, c) odd things happen with (e.g.) signalling within a station area.
I have built a One Button Route Setting panel with Tokenless Block built in between my station and my fiddle yard. Happy to share details if you wish? |
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Hi Iain,
Your system sounds interesting. ?I was using routes to set up the various routes and signals, my frustration is that the signal masts on the panel are just dumb. ?Would love to see what you have done. ?Was looking to see if I could figure out a script that would set all signals to danger and update the panel. ?Then I could just operate the signals manually whilst the points are set by routes. Would love to see what you have done. regards Doug |
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Doug,
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Your signal masts are ¡°dumb¡± because you have done nothing to make them smart. There are at least 3 approaches to making them smart. 1). Implement signal mast logic. It works fine regardless of the layout size or complexity and requires no programming skills. Earlier Ken mentioned that signals move ¡°DOWN" from the icon to the mast to the head, etc. SML provides the ¡°UP" using turnout position and block occupancy. 2). Use Logix to set the signal aspects based on layout conditions such as turnout position and block occupancy. This requires understanding logic and how it is implemented in Logix. This is Iain¡¯s approach. 3). Use Python instead of Logix. This requires programming skill and some knowledge of JMRI internals. Take a look at this image: /g/jmriusers/photo/79886/0?p=Name,,,20,1,0,0 Dave Sand On Dec 5, 2018, at 4:13 AM, douglas.31johnson via Groups.Io <douglas.31johnson@...> wrote: |
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Clay,
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I have added 3 SML screenshots to the album: /g/jmriusers/album?id=79886 I normally use the signal mast icon context menu to access the SML. The Signal Mast table "Edit Logic¡± buttons and Signal Mast Logic ¡°Edit¡± buttons provide the same information. Dave Sand On Dec 5, 2018, at 11:30 AM, Clay <claysmith44@...> wrote: |
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Hi Dave,
Will have a look at SML and see if I can make it work for the main signals but the ground signals or shunt signals need to be turned on and off despite the setting of the points. ?Well those that could route in more than one direction. ?So all I need to do is set them at the start and run them manually. regards Doug |
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Hi Dave and all,
After reading more on the main site and communicating with Iain over his panel I have spent a few hours using Logix to automate the main signals and apart from a few niggles I am very pleased with the results, the panel now updates very nicely. ? As for the ground signals I have used Logix to make a reset button to set them all on so the panel is updated at the start of operation. ?Also using Logix I am able to alter the main signals when the Ground signals are used for shunting movements. I need to run things and test them for a while then make alterations and additions to make the panel operate successfully but I am getting there. Thanks for the assistance. regards Doug |
Ken Cameron
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