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SCM FS 41ES/52ES

 

Does anyone here has experience with the SCM J/P combo.

?

I did some research on the SCM vs Felder J/P and it looks to me like the SCM has some advantage as of:
1)It has parallelogram jointer

2)The surface is flat vs the sprint joint the Felder line has

And another question about the 41 vs 52 cm J/P.

Do you find a lot of useful of having a bigger planer? (Today I have the A3-31 which is too small and I find work around when I work with wider material/boards, but I wonder if I'll regret not going with the bigger machine in the future)
 

I have one that is supposed to be here this month! I came to the same conclusion that you did. Mine (will be)is an FS 41 ESX.?

Kind regards,

Brian D. Milidrag
Cell?248.765.8411?


On Wed, Apr 17, 2024 at 3:12?PM netanel.belgazal via <netanel.belgazal=[email protected]> wrote:

Does anyone here has experience with the SCM J/P combo.

?

I did some research on the SCM vs Felder J/P and it looks to me like the SCM has some advantage as of:
1)It has parallelogram jointer

2)The surface is flat vs the sprint joint the Felder line has

And another question about the 41 vs 52 cm J/P.

Do you find a lot of useful of having a bigger planer? (Today I have the A3-31 which is too small and I find work around when I work with wider material/boards, but I wonder if I'll regret not going with the bigger machine in the future)
 

Glad to hear we got to the same conclusion.

Few questions if that is ok

1)Which type of knifes did you go with?

2)Are you intend to keep using the pork chop? (I asked the representative and the euro guard isn't available as pre configured because of some regulation)
3)Did you bought it from a dealer or directly through SCM website?
4)Was the delivery fee reasonable? (for me the initial quote was ~$1300 for ~300 miles from their warehouse, they look for more cost effective way right now)
 

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IMO, the SCM J/P combo units are a far better choice than the equivalent Felder machines. ?Several here on FOG have taken my suggestion and gotten the SCM machines and been happy. ?You should check in with Tom Gensmer - he just recently switched from the Felder 951L to the?SCM FS-52es, primarily for shop size reasons. ?Email him at: ?tom@...

David Best
DBestWorkshop@...
https://www.flickr.com/photos/davidpbest/collections/
https://www.youtube.com/@David_Best



On Apr 17, 2024, at 12:12?PM, netanel.belgazal via groups.io <netanel.belgazal@...> wrote:

Does anyone here has experience with the SCM J/P combo.

?

I did some research on the SCM vs Felder J/P and it looks to me like the SCM has some advantage as of:
1)It has parallelogram jointer

2)The surface is flat vs the sprint joint the Felder line has

And another question about the 41 vs 52 cm J/P.

Do you find a lot of useful of having a bigger planer? (Today I have the A3-31 which is too small and I find work around when I work with wider material/boards, but I wonder if I'll regret not going with the bigger machine in the future)
 

Hi Netanel,

1.) The ES with the X designation connotes the segmented knives.?
2.) I am comfortable with the Pork Chop and don’t really see an advantage to the euro guard even after having one on my Felder BF631 for years.?
3.) I bought it from a dealer in Tennessee, 360 degree Machinery.he is excellent. Not only did he give me the best price but he also arranged shipping for another Felder machine I shipped from Texas at a substantial?discount to what I could get it shipped for. He did that at his cost and for no financial benefit to him.
His name is Bryan Freese and I would be delighted to use him again! His contact info is:

4.) As for the delivery fee, in every case I focused on the bottom line cost, all in.

Lastly, many thanks to David Best for his excellent help in analyzing the choices!

Kind regards,

Brian D. Milidrag


On Wed, Apr 17, 2024 at 3:29?PM netanel.belgazal via <netanel.belgazal=[email protected]> wrote:

Glad to hear we got to the same conclusion.

Few questions if that is ok

1)Which type of knifes did you go with?

2)Are you intend to keep using the pork chop? (I asked the representative and the euro guard isn't available as pre configured because of some regulation)
3)Did you bought it from a dealer or directly through SCM website?
4)Was the delivery fee reasonable? (for me the initial quote was ~$1300 for ~300 miles from their warehouse, they look for more cost effective way right now)
 

Adding to the sentiment that Bryan Freese at 360 Machinery is a great resource and very helpful. I tried to buy some things that fell through but he was a great facilitator and has earned future business because of it. Sorry to hijack the thread.


On Wed, Apr 17, 2024 at 3:25?PM Brian via <brian.milidrag=[email protected]> wrote:
Hi Netanel,

1.) The ES with the X designation connotes the segmented knives.?
2.) I am comfortable with the Pork Chop and don’t really see an advantage to the euro guard even after having one on my Felder BF631 for years.?
3.) I bought it from a dealer in Tennessee, 360 degree Machinery.he is excellent. Not only did he give me the best price but he also arranged shipping for another Felder machine I shipped from Texas at a substantial?discount to what I could get it shipped for. He did that at his cost and for no financial benefit to him.
His name is Bryan Freese and I would be delighted to use him again! His contact info is:

4.) As for the delivery fee, in every case I focused on the bottom line cost, all in.

Lastly, many thanks to David Best for his excellent help in analyzing the choices!

Kind regards,

Brian D. Milidrag


On Wed, Apr 17, 2024 at 3:29?PM netanel.belgazal via <netanel.belgazal=[email protected]> wrote:

Glad to hear we got to the same conclusion.

Few questions if that is ok

1)Which type of knifes did you go with?

2)Are you intend to keep using the pork chop? (I asked the representative and the euro guard isn't available as pre configured because of some regulation)
3)Did you bought it from a dealer or directly through SCM website?
4)Was the delivery fee reasonable? (for me the initial quote was ~$1300 for ~300 miles from their warehouse, they look for more cost effective way right now)



--
Brett Wissel
Saint Louis Restoration
1831 S Kingshighway Blvd (at Shaw Blvd)
St Louis, MO 63110

314.772.2167
brett@...
 

I also got a quote from OakTreeSupply that ship the machine for "free" to the nearest Fedex terminal (unless I have a forklift at site to unload the machine)

I'll contact Bryan for a quote.

?
 

Hi Netanel,?

Yes I have a FS-52es and I like it. The A 951 L is a parallelogram design and if I had room for separates I wouldn't hesitate to order one, I just don't have room for separates.?

For the FS-52es:
-- The castings on the jointer tables and planer bed are ground very flat
-- The jointer tables are a parallelogram design, and with some tweaking I've been able to dial them in so they're perfectly co-planar (no spring joint)
-- The four knife Tersa head is nice, and easy to swap knives. I timed a change, it takes me ~ 30 seconds to rotate/swap a knife, so in two minutes I can swap/rotate all of the knives
-- Changing between jointer- and planer- takes roughly one minute, which includes the time necessary to raise/lower the thicknesser table
-- The fence is a little fussy to adjust, but once properly dialed-in it slides very smoothly and is a pleasure to use
-- Four speeds on the thicknesser via a mechanical gearbox
-- Thicknesser table is controlled by simple up/down buttons
-- I didn't care for the pork chop guard. The return spring on the pork chop is hilariously undersized, and the guard will not close without help.?
-- I wound up ordering a Suvamatic guard from Scott & Sargent, and the mounting bracket from SCM. Very happy with it.?

The FS-52es is a relatively simple, straightforward machine, no bells/whistles, but that's why I selected it. If you want some more creature comforts I'd suggest you look at the FS-7, I know PK really likes his.?

--
Tom Gensmer
Heritage Home Renewals, LLC
Minneapolis, MN
 

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Sorry Tom, but I beg to differ. ?The A 951L is not a parallelogram design - at least not in the conventional sense. ? The infeed table employs a parallelogram system for height adjustment, but the outfeed table is not, and relies on the same cam-actuated system for height adjustment as the other machines in the Felder jointer lineup. ?I know Felder likes to describe it as a “parallelogram design” but that is a half-truth. ?

That said, since it does not have flip-up tables, The A951L and Plan 51L stand alone jointers should not suffer from the same design/alignment deficiencies as the other Felder J/P combos or the A941. ?For anyone interested, you can find a discussion of all this in the document here on pages 8-9: ??

David Best
DBestWorkshop@...
https://www.flickr.com/photos/davidpbest/collections/
https://www.youtube.com/@David_Best



On Apr 17, 2024, at 5:07?PM, Tom Gensmer via groups.io <tom@...> wrote:

Hi Netanel,?

Yes I have a FS-52es and I like it. The A 951 L is a parallelogram design and if I had room for separates I wouldn't hesitate to order one, I just don't have room for separates.?

For the FS-52es:
-- The castings on the jointer tables and planer bed are ground very flat
-- The jointer tables are a parallelogram design, and with some tweaking I've been able to dial them in so they're perfectly co-planar (no spring joint)
-- The four knife Tersa head is nice, and easy to swap knives. I timed a change, it takes me ~ 30 seconds to rotate/swap a knife, so in two minutes I can swap/rotate all of the knives
-- Changing between jointer- and planer- takes roughly one minute, which includes the time necessary to raise/lower the thicknesser table
-- The fence is a little fussy to adjust, but once properly dialed-in it slides very smoothly and is a pleasure to use
-- Four speeds on the thicknesser via a mechanical gearbox
-- Thicknesser table is controlled by simple up/down buttons
-- I didn't care for the pork chop guard. The return spring on the pork chop is hilariously undersized, and the guard will not close without help.?
-- I wound up ordering a Suvamatic guard from Scott & Sargent, and the mounting bracket from SCM. Very happy with it.?

The FS-52es is a relatively simple, straightforward machine, no bells/whistles, but that's why I selected it. If you want some more creature comforts I'd suggest you look at the FS-7, I know PK really likes his.?

--
Tom Gensmer
Heritage Home Renewals, LLC
Minneapolis, MN

 

Hi David,?

You are correct, I forgot that the out feed table on the A 951 L is not a parallelogram design. That being said, it should be easy to adjust and hold its settings.

--
Tom Gensmer
Heritage Home Renewals, LLC
Minneapolis, MN
 

I just had a conversation with Sam Blasco.

I think I'll go with the Tersa blades and not the Xylent cutter-head as I originally though.
 

I went with the Tersa blades and am totally pleased with them.
 

Netanel,

I know of the benefits and have experienced/used Tersa on my last planer.? I had the same conversation with Sam when I purchased.? I am wondering why you made the switch to Tersa?

I find the xylent cutterhead amazing.

PK??
 

I think the main reason is because I am not a production shop, and can easily swap the blades when they become dull (and don't mind the extra volume of chips)
I can keep two sets of blades, one for the rough milling and one for the final path and get slightly better finish compare to Xylent.


Another think made me change is the angle of attack. The Xylent cutter head are perpendicular to the wood, so knots in the wood still give some tearout (the Felder one comes at an angle, which can reduce the tearout)

?
 

For people who has Tersa knifes, What type of knifes do you usually keep in stock and where do you source them?

I can see different sites recommend different type of knifes for the same type of wood (for example some recommend M+ for Walnut and some Gold

I usually work with medium-hard woods:
Walnut, cherry and white oak
 

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I buy them from Tersa Knives

Here is their recommendation based upon wood species.

I got the machine with HSS and am currently using M+. I am happy with both. They do tend to nick easily. Have not figured out if it is epoxy/glue line or knots. After shifting does not work, I flip one knife to the other side.

I am wondering, if I should order another set just for the final pass of critical projects.

Imran Malik

On Jun 5, 2024, at 1:08?PM, netanel.belgazal via groups.io <netanel.belgazal@...> wrote:

?

For people who has Tersa knifes, What type of knifes do you usually keep in stock and where do you source them?

I can see different sites recommend different type of knifes for the same type of wood (for example some recommend M+ for Walnut and some Gold

I usually work with medium-hard woods:
Walnut, cherry and white oak

 

I receive my FS41ES just yesterday and went with SCM for all the reasons you?mentioned!

Kind regards,

Brian D. Milidrag
Cell?248.765.8411


On Wed, Apr 17, 2024 at 3:12?PM netanel.belgazal via <netanel.belgazal=[email protected]> wrote:

Does anyone here has experience with the SCM J/P combo.

?

I did some research on the SCM vs Felder J/P and it looks to me like the SCM has some advantage as of:
1)It has parallelogram jointer

2)The surface is flat vs the sprint joint the Felder line has

And another question about the 41 vs 52 cm J/P.

Do you find a lot of useful of having a bigger planer? (Today I have the A3-31 which is too small and I find work around when I work with wider material/boards, but I wonder if I'll regret not going with the bigger machine in the future)

 

Glad to hear you got your machine.?

Did you had to adjust the machine or it came calibrated?

 

Netanel,

Not far enough along yet. Just got it off the truck yesterday. Got a 26’ box truck with a lift gate and an 94” clear opening. Crate which was substantially damaged by the shipper, was 91” wide and it ?protected the machine as far as I can see so far. I had commitments all day today so hopefully tomorrow I’ll assemble the fence and mobility kit and get a power cord on it. Then I ?can check for calibration. It comes with a whole Lot of grease on it too!?

Kind regards,

Brian D. Milidrag
Cell?248.765.8411


On Wed, Jun 5, 2024 at 4:52?PM netanel.belgazal via <netanel.belgazal=[email protected]> wrote:

Glad to hear you got your machine.?

Did you had to adjust the machine or it came calibrated?

 

Netanel,?
So all set up and I’ve been running some stock through my SCM FS41ES. It is lovely! Everything works as it should and no evidence of any snipe in either jointing or planing, and a great finish is the result. I did get the Zylent head.?
There was no adjustment needed though I did have to open the control panel (with the guidance of SCM support, and reset the main because the cutter block would not initially start.
Again, I can’t say enough nice things about Bryan Feese from 360 Degree Machinery for his help and of course our own David Best for his sage advice! Also always helpful is Imran who actually sent his machine clips to Texas where the seller of my “new” K700S was located!

Kind regards,

Brian D. Milidrag
Cell?248.765.8411


On Wed, Jun 5, 2024 at 4:52?PM netanel.belgazal via <netanel.belgazal=[email protected]> wrote:

Glad to hear you got your machine.?

Did you had to adjust the machine or it came calibrated?

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