|
Morning folks,
?
I have a KF700 and was trying to do some work today.? Now as soon as wood touches the blade the saw is instantly turning off.? This is the first time I have encountered this issue.? The manual doesn't address at all.
?
Any suggestions??
|
Need more info... what vintage? Single or three phase? VFD? Tripping the braker at your panel? Does it come back on without turning off the power to the machine?
Brian Lamb blamb11@... lambtoolworks.com
On Sunday, April 6, 2025 at 08:52:49 AM MST, Kyle Stiefel via groups.io <kstiefel@...> wrote:
Morning folks,
?
I have a KF700 and was trying to do some work today.? Now as soon as wood touches the blade the saw is instantly turning off.? This is the first time I have encountered this issue.? The manual doesn't address at all.
?
Any suggestions??
|
Took delivery 2021 Single phase Breaker not tripping Able to switch off and back on at machine so does not come back on without cycling power switch?
Sent from Verizon mobile
Need more info... what vintage? Single or three phase? VFD? Tripping the braker at your panel? Does it come back on without turning off the power to the machine?
On Sunday, April 6, 2025 at 08:52:49 AM MST, Kyle Stiefel via <kstiefel= [email protected]> wrote:
Morning folks,
?
I have a KF700 and was trying to do some work today.? Now as soon as wood touches the blade the saw is instantly turning off.? This is the first time I have encountered this issue.? The manual doesn't address at all.
?
Any suggestions??
|
Does the shaper spindle react the same way? They have amp draw settings in the electronics, that's beyond me, I would contact Felder on Monday.?
Brian Lamb blamb11@... lambtoolworks.com
On Sunday, April 6, 2025 at 09:00:57 AM MST, Kyle Stiefel via groups.io <kstiefel@...> wrote:
Took delivery 2021 Single phase Breaker not tripping Able to switch off and back on at machine so does not come back on without cycling power switch?
Sent from Verizon mobile
Need more info... what vintage? Single or three phase? VFD? Tripping the braker at your panel? Does it come back on without turning off the power to the machine?
On Sunday, April 6, 2025 at 08:52:49 AM MST, Kyle Stiefel via <kstiefel= [email protected]> wrote:
Morning folks,
?
I have a KF700 and was trying to do some work today.? Now as soon as wood touches the blade the saw is instantly turning off.? This is the first time I have encountered this issue.? The manual doesn't address at all.
?
Any suggestions??
|
I actually never have used the shaper on it, don't even have a head to toss on, ugh.
I will try to get them tomorrow unfortunately they run EST I think which makes it hard as I work the same.
Have a good weekend.
Sent from Verizon mobile
Does the shaper spindle react the same way? They have amp draw settings in the electronics, that's beyond me, I would contact Felder on Monday.?
On Sunday, April 6, 2025 at 09:00:57 AM MST, Kyle Stiefel via <kstiefel= [email protected]> wrote:
Took delivery 2021 Single phase Breaker not tripping Able to switch off and back on at machine so does not come back on without cycling power switch?
Sent from Verizon mobile Need more info... what vintage? Single or three phase? VFD? Tripping the braker at your panel? Does it come back on without turning off the power to the machine?
On Sunday, April 6, 2025 at 08:52:49 AM MST, Kyle Stiefel via <kstiefel= [email protected]> wrote:
Morning folks,
?
I have a KF700 and was trying to do some work today.? Now as soon as wood touches the blade the saw is instantly turning off.? This is the first time I have encountered this issue.? The manual doesn't address at all.
?
Any suggestions??
|
Does as soon as wood is touched mean you are unable to cut any amount of kerf in even thin soft wood?
|
Update:
?
So went through everything getting dust out of all the nooks and crannies as the day went on.?
?
Initially it let me then restart the saw from the wagon or frame without recycling the on/off but would still cut out when I tried to cut about 3/4."? I did not try thinner stuff.
?
I then kept messing around and cleaning as the no longer switching the main switch on/off was a change with the policing of dust around the unit.?
?
Finally got it to rip 2 sticks of 8/4 maple which is how I had started the day but then ran out of time for the day as the family calls.?
?
Fingers crossed next weekend I can actually meet my goals from this weekend.
?
Who knows but the sawdust was likely causing an electronic gremlin somehow.??
|
There is not enough information here for us to really be helpful. ?Please reply with answers to Brian’s questions. ?Without hearing more, I’d be very suspicious that the issue is related to the stop circuit connected through the sliding table to the switches at “the end of the wagon.” ? That circuit runs through the bearings, and if that circuit is broken (for just a millisecond) because of poor contact induced by the vibration of the saw starting to cut, that would produce the behavior you observe. ?Try cleaning the bearing ways of the lower and upper sliding table extrusions. ?Douse it with a solvent like WD-40, run the slider back and forth several times, then clean the ways several times to remove the solvent. ?Of course there are a bunch of other possibilities, but I’d start with that.
David Best
DBestWorkshop@...
https://www.flickr.com/photos/davidpbest/collections/
https://www.youtube.com/@David_Best
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
On Apr 6, 2025, at 1:50?PM, Kyle Stiefel via groups.io <kstiefel@...> wrote:
Update:
?
So went through everything getting dust out of all the nooks and crannies as the day went on.?
?
Initially it let me then restart the saw from the wagon or frame without recycling the on/off but would still cut out when I tried to cut about 3/4."? I did not try thinner stuff.
?
I then kept messing around and cleaning as the no longer switching the main switch on/off was a change with the policing of dust around the unit.?
?
Finally got it to rip 2 sticks of 8/4 maple which is how I had started the day but then ran out of time for the day as the family calls.?
?
Fingers crossed next weekend I can actually meet my goals from this weekend.
?
Who knows but the sawdust was likely causing an electronic gremlin somehow.??
|
Hi David,
Not sure if you got all msgs but Kyle responded to most if not all questions. I have heard of this happening when xcutting on the slider, not necessarily with material hitting the blade though. However, depending upon where the outrigger is positioned on the slider, it may seem like the material contacting the blade is causing the shutdown but in reality it is just that the slider has travelled a certain amount causing a break in signal as you mentioned. Besides cleaning the ways it may also be prudent to check the wiring related to the slider switches as well.
Kyle mentioned he was ripping, so not sure if the slider was locked while he was doing the ripping. That would make a dirty micro switch a possible culprit.
Another possibility is the overload relay that senses current. Brian also mentioned this. This is usually labeled as 2K1 in the electrical cabinet.
Imran Malik
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
On Apr 6, 2025, at 6:18?PM, David P. Best via groups.io <dbestworkshop@...> wrote: ? There is not enough information here for us to really be helpful. ?Please reply with answers to Brian’s questions. ?Without hearing more, I’d be very suspicious that the issue is related to the stop circuit connected through the sliding table to the switches at “the end of the wagon.” ? That circuit runs through the bearings, and if that circuit is broken (for just a millisecond) because of poor contact induced by the vibration of the saw starting to cut, that would produce the behavior you observe. ?Try cleaning the bearing ways of the lower and upper sliding table extrusions. ?Douse it with a solvent like WD-40, run the slider back and forth several times, then clean the ways several times to remove the solvent. ?Of course there are a bunch of other possibilities, but I’d start with that.
David Best
DBestWorkshop@...
https://www.flickr.com/photos/davidpbest/collections/
https://www.youtube.com/@David_Best
On Apr 6, 2025, at 1:50?PM, Kyle Stiefel via groups.io <kstiefel@...> wrote:
Update:
?
So went through everything getting dust out of all the nooks and crannies as the day went on.?
?
Initially it let me then restart the saw from the wagon or frame without recycling the on/off but would still cut out when I tried to cut about 3/4."? I did not try thinner stuff.
?
I then kept messing around and cleaning as the no longer switching the main switch on/off was a change with the policing of dust around the unit.?
?
Finally got it to rip 2 sticks of 8/4 maple which is how I had started the day but then ran out of time for the day as the family calls.?
?
Fingers crossed next weekend I can actually meet my goals from this weekend.
?
Who knows but the sawdust was likely causing an electronic gremlin somehow.??
|
Yes - “most” but not “all”. ?Even though, as he says, "don't even have a head to toss on” the shaper, just turning on the shaper spindle and observe the yellow “reverse” light would tell a lot about the condition. ?I seriously doubt the outrigger position or contacting the blade would trigger the machine to shut down unless it’s triggering the stop circuit via vibration. ?The idea the outrigger position or blade contact would disrupt the 24V circuit is tin-foil-hat thinking IMO. ?Since his machine is single-phase, there could be an issue with he internal VFD, but his statement "Able to switch off and back on at machine so does not come back on without cycling power switch” suggests to me that it’s the stop-circuit as the culprit here. ?I would suggest the following. ?When the machine stops during a cut, cycle the reverse switch on the shaper and observe the yellow indicator light to see if it turns on. ?Report here. ?If that light does illuminate when the reverse switch is toggled, then it’s probably not the stop-circuit at fault here, and more likely a bad relay, or some other issue with the VFD. ? If that light does not illuminate, then it’s most likely the stop circuit, which could be one of the microswitches, bad connection to the “Stop” button switches, dirty slider bearing ways, or poor connection from the electronic panel to the stop switches.
David Best
DBestWorkshop@...
https://www.flickr.com/photos/davidpbest/collections/
https://www.youtube.com/@David_Best
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
On Apr 6, 2025, at 4:25?PM, imran via groups.io <imranwoodshop@...> wrote:
Hi David,
Not sure if you got all msgs but Kyle responded to most if not all questions. I have heard of this happening when xcutting on the slider, not necessarily with material hitting the blade though. However, depending upon where the outrigger is positioned on the slider, it may seem like the material contacting the blade is causing the shutdown but in reality it is just that the slider has travelled a certain amount causing a break in signal as you mentioned. Besides cleaning the ways it may also be prudent to check the wiring related to the slider switches as well.
Kyle mentioned he was ripping, so not sure if the slider was locked while he was doing the ripping. That would make a dirty micro switch a possible culprit.
Another possibility is the overload relay that senses current. Brian also mentioned this. This is usually labeled as 2K1 in the electrical cabinet.
Imran Malik
On Apr 6, 2025, at 6:18?PM, David P. Best via groups.io <dbestworkshop@...> wrote:
? There is not enough information here for us to really be helpful. ?Please reply with answers to Brian’s questions. ?Without hearing more, I’d be very suspicious that the issue is related to the stop circuit connected through the sliding table to the switches at “the end of the wagon.” ? That circuit runs through the bearings, and if that circuit is broken (for just a millisecond) because of poor contact induced by the vibration of the saw starting to cut, that would produce the behavior you observe. ?Try cleaning the bearing ways of the lower and upper sliding table extrusions. ?Douse it with a solvent like WD-40, run the slider back and forth several times, then clean the ways several times to remove the solvent. ?Of course there are a bunch of other possibilities, but I’d start with that.
David Best
DBestWorkshop@...
https://www.flickr.com/photos/davidpbest/collections/
https://www.youtube.com/@David_Best
On Apr 6, 2025, at 1:50?PM, Kyle Stiefel via groups.io <kstiefel@...> wrote:
Update:
?
So went through everything getting dust out of all the nooks and crannies as the day went on.?
?
Initially it let me then restart the saw from the wagon or frame without recycling the on/off but would still cut out when I tried to cut about 3/4."? I did not try thinner stuff.
?
I then kept messing around and cleaning as the no longer switching the main switch on/off was a change with the policing of dust around the unit.?
?
Finally got it to rip 2 sticks of 8/4 maple which is how I had started the day but then ran out of time for the day as the family calls.?
?
Fingers crossed next weekend I can actually meet my goals from this weekend.
?
Who knows but the sawdust was likely causing an electronic gremlin somehow.??
|
Hi David,
Just FYI, I have helped 2 members with Felder VFD setup where the reverse light is not an indicator of the status of the 24VAC string with all switches. It only is an indicator of 24VAC presence.
Also, Kyle should know that if it is the overload relay it will reset in 2 to 3 minutes and power cycling is not necessary.
You misunderstood me. I had a case where moving the slider cut the machine off but it was due to the slider switch circuit. I was merely saying that same could be happening here depending upon where his outrigger is and it may appear that touching the blade with material is the cause but infact it is just slider movement. Long shot and don’t even know if he is even using the slider.
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
On Apr 7, 2025, at 1:07?AM, David P. Best via groups.io <dbestworkshop@...> wrote: ? Yes - “most” but not “all”. ?Even though, as he says, "don't even have a head to toss on” the shaper, just turning on the shaper spindle and observe the yellow “reverse” light would tell a lot about the condition. ?I seriously doubt the outrigger position or contacting the blade would trigger the machine to shut down unless it’s triggering the stop circuit via vibration. ?The idea the outrigger position or blade contact would disrupt the 24V circuit is tin-foil-hat thinking IMO. ?Since his machine is single-phase, there could be an issue with he internal VFD, but his statement "Able to switch off and back on at machine so does not come back on without cycling power switch” suggests to me that it’s the stop-circuit as the culprit here. ?I would suggest the following. ?When the machine stops during a cut, cycle the reverse switch on the shaper and observe the yellow indicator light to see if it turns on. ?Report here. ?If that light does illuminate when the reverse switch is toggled, then it’s probably not the stop-circuit at fault here, and more likely a bad relay, or some other issue with the VFD. ? If that light does not illuminate, then it’s most likely the stop circuit, which could be one of the microswitches, bad connection to the “Stop” button switches, dirty slider bearing ways, or poor connection from the electronic panel to the stop switches.
David Best
DBestWorkshop@...
https://www.flickr.com/photos/davidpbest/collections/
https://www.youtube.com/@David_Best
On Apr 6, 2025, at 4:25?PM, imran via groups.io <imranwoodshop@...> wrote:
Hi David,
Not sure if you got all msgs but Kyle responded to most if not all questions. I have heard of this happening when xcutting on the slider, not necessarily with material hitting the blade though. However, depending upon where the outrigger is positioned on the slider, it may seem like the material contacting the blade is causing the shutdown but in reality it is just that the slider has travelled a certain amount causing a break in signal as you mentioned. Besides cleaning the ways it may also be prudent to check the wiring related to the slider switches as well.
Kyle mentioned he was ripping, so not sure if the slider was locked while he was doing the ripping. That would make a dirty micro switch a possible culprit.
Another possibility is the overload relay that senses current. Brian also mentioned this. This is usually labeled as 2K1 in the electrical cabinet.
Imran Malik
On Apr 6, 2025, at 6:18?PM, David P. Best via groups.io <dbestworkshop@...> wrote:
? There is not enough information here for us to really be helpful. ?Please reply with answers to Brian’s questions. ?Without hearing more, I’d be very suspicious that the issue is related to the stop circuit connected through the sliding table to the switches at “the end of the wagon.” ? That circuit runs through the bearings, and if that circuit is broken (for just a millisecond) because of poor contact induced by the vibration of the saw starting to cut, that would produce the behavior you observe. ?Try cleaning the bearing ways of the lower and upper sliding table extrusions. ?Douse it with a solvent like WD-40, run the slider back and forth several times, then clean the ways several times to remove the solvent. ?Of course there are a bunch of other possibilities, but I’d start with that.
David Best
DBestWorkshop@...
https://www.flickr.com/photos/davidpbest/collections/
https://www.youtube.com/@David_Best
On Apr 6, 2025, at 1:50?PM, Kyle Stiefel via groups.io <kstiefel@...> wrote:
Update:
?
So went through everything getting dust out of all the nooks and crannies as the day went on.?
?
Initially it let me then restart the saw from the wagon or frame without recycling the on/off but would still cut out when I tried to cut about 3/4."? I did not try thinner stuff.
?
I then kept messing around and cleaning as the no longer switching the main switch on/off was a change with the policing of dust around the unit.?
?
Finally got it to rip 2 sticks of 8/4 maple which is how I had started the day but then ran out of time for the day as the family calls.?
?
Fingers crossed next weekend I can actually meet my goals from this weekend.
?
Who knows but the sawdust was likely causing an electronic gremlin somehow.??
|
David P. Best
imran