David: How did you get into my shop and take the pictures of my mess? We don¡¯t even know each other. Gil Fuqua One of the advantages of being disorderly is that one is constantly making exciting discoveries. A.A. Milne ¨C Winnie the Pooh author From: felder-woodworking@... [mailto:felder-woodworking@...] Sent: Friday, January 12, 2018 2:44 AM To: rcorselli@... [felder-woodworking] <felder-woodworking@...> Subject: Re: [felder-woodworking] KF 700 SP options You guys are funny. OCD has it¡¯s advantages and disadvantages. And people vary a great deal in terms of their need for organization and keeping the shop clean and tidy. When I¡¯m busy with a project, my shop can look like a tornado ripped through it. But personally, I can¡¯t work in such an environment for long without starting to twitch. On a trip this past year, I visited a dear friend (who will remain nameless) who is distinctly in the opposite camp. He thrives when everything is out and he can hop from one thing to another. Here¡¯s a few photos: The friend who owns this shop does amazing work, is also a Felder owner, and is an engineering genius - not to mention one of the nicest guys you¡¯ll ever meet. But I was afraid I¡¯d run out of Xanax before I was scheduled to leave. One of the best tricks I¡¯ve learned to keep the shop clean is to have high pressure compressed air, a long coiled hose with high output spray nozzle and a floor sweep for my dust extractor. I first put on my gas mask, turn on the extractor and the floor sweep blast gate opens, then I make two big loops from the far end of the shop spraying down everything towards the floor sweep as I get closer and closer to it. Once I¡¯m finished, my housecleaner empties the extractor bin with her Dyson Animal vacuum cleaner so I can reuse the plastic bin liners - and restocks the shop refrigerator with Champaign, refills the humidor with fresh Chesterfield Kings and disinfects the hookah. LOL David Best On Jan 11, 2018, at 9:54 PM, GLEN chris3645@... <mailto:chris3645@...> [felder-woodworking] <felder-woodworking@... <mailto:felder-woodworking@...> > wrote: He must have a night shift that cleans the place. I hope when i get set up in my shop I can keep it as clean as his. -----Original Message----- From: mfsta2lt@... <mailto:mfsta2lt@...> [felder-woodworking] <felder-woodworking@... <mailto:felder-woodworking@...> > To: felder-woodworking <felder-woodworking@... <mailto: [email protected]> > Sent: Thu, Jan 11, 2018 9:09 pm Subject: Re: [felder-woodworking] KF 700 SP options Yea when I was there you could have eaten off the floor. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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Imran,
That is great. No problem, I can wait, it is not urgent. I can lift and lower the heavy F48 :)
Thanks, James
On Fri, Jan 12, 2018 at 12:29 PM, imranindiana@... [felder-woodworking] <felder-woodworking@...> wrote:
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James,
I do not have hammer but looking at the pics the tilt away mechanism is different for Felder vs Hammer. I have the gas spring attached to the bracket on my Felder. The bracket engineering print is in files under FOG made products.
I am out of the country until end of Jan. If you can wait, upon return, I can send the complete instructions I received from a FOG member regarding the Big Lift. Perhaps it was Brian, but I ma not sure.
Imran
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James,
I do not have hammer but looking at the pics the tilt away mechanism is different for Felder vs Hammer. I have the gas spring attached to the bracket on my Felder. The bracket engineering print is in files under FOG made products.
I am out of the country until end of Jan. If you can wait, upon return, I can send the complete instructions I received from a FOG member regarding the Big Lift. Perhaps it was Brian, but I ma not sure.
Imran
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If I remember from the original postings many years ago it was for leverage and mechanical advantage. Never done one as I have?really no need for one and?zero interest. I do remember the discussions though and while not as simple as bolting on a shock there maybe other issues with the Felders vs Hammers.
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John,
Just curious why the gas spring is not attached directly to the tilt bracket flat base like Andy did on his hammer bracket?
Thanks, James
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Option 11 is a switch that controls the rotational direction of the shaper spindle.
Option 91 is a support arm to hold the extraction hose to the saw guard when the Euro II style saw guard is used and mounted to the riving knife/splitter (instead of being mounted to an overhead guard bracket, which is option 81). ? You can see #91 it in the top photo on this web page: ?
You can see option 81 at this page:
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David Best
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What is "Option 11 - Switch for forward and reverse run"?? It is supposedly a standard equipment option, but I have no idea what it is for and where are the switches???
What about "Option 91-Extractor hose mounting for rip capacity 31¡±/49¡± (800/1250 mm)"?? What does it mean?? I really wish Felder would have more pictures/better explanation of all these options.
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John,
Just curious why the gas spring is not attached directly to the tilt bracket flat base like Andy did on his hammer bracket?
Thanks, James
On Fri, Jan 12, 2018 at 11:33 AM, John Kee jmkserv@... [felder-woodworking] <felder-woodworking@...> wrote:
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James here's some pics of Felder with the gas shock and mounting bracket, there is also plans somewhere. I don't need one so maybe one of others can show them to you. If not my friend Fred has the setup mounted on his K500. I believe he also has detailed plans.
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It was their part number 9416K21 225lb rating. You need a gas spring rated higher than the combined weight of the stand/feeder due to leverage
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Re: Comatic DC40 on a Felder KF700SP
They show up as image holder tags ([image#.jpeg], not the actual image themselves.??
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Are there pictures of Felder's?? How is it compared to the above version?? Thanks for the URL.
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Re: Comatic DC40 on a Felder KF700SP
I am curious, does anyone see these images? They dont show up even on the Yahoo Group page.
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James here's some pics of Felder with the gas shock and mounting bracket, there is also plans somewhere. I don't need one so maybe one of others can show them to you. If not my friend Fred has the setup mounted on his K500. I believe he also has detailed plans.
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Andy,
Could you post a picture for your Hammer tilt bracket with the gas spring from McMaster? I want to see how you mount the gas spring on the bracket. I have Felder tilt bracket.
Thanks, James
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Comatic DC40 on a Felder KF700SP
Here are a few pics for the those who can see them. If you want me to email separately send me your email¡joe
Joe.jensen@...
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On Jan 12, 2018, at 8:18 AM, Vunghi Hoang <vnh84@...<mailto:vnh84@...>> wrote:
Hi Joe,
Thanks for your help with the KF 700 SP options. If you don't mind, I'd like to take you up on your offer of the photos of your customized power feeder stand/attachment with gas strut. I have the option quoted by Liz Rogers, but not 100% sure it is worth the money as the picture in Felder catalog is inadequate in showing off the item.
Regards,
Vunghi Hoang (aka SW)
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What is "Option 11 - Switch for forward and reverse run"?? It is supposedly a standard equipment option, but I have no idea what it is for and where are the switches???
What about "Option 91-Extractor hose mounting for rip capacity 31¡±/49¡± (800/1250 mm)"?? What does it mean?? I really wish Felder would have more pictures/better explanation of all these options.
?
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Before I upgraded to the Comatic, I had my PF Euro-plug mounted on the Profil, and the power came from the shaper main supply line and it was not a delayed circuit or tied to the motor running ?- it was active as long as the main power switch on the Profil was turned on. ? This may not be how Felder normally configures it if rigged by the factory, but I know it can be done easily inside the electrical box of the machine by moving a couple of wires. ??
Getting the e-stop to disable a normally-on PF voltage supply supply would require a normally closed DIN relay with some kind of triggering circuit tied into the e-stop circuit or button. ? Here is such a relay - how you¡¯d wire that to the e-stop requires some investigation, and the PF would need to be single-phase as that relay is single pole:
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David Best
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Here¡¯s my take on this. ?The Felder feeder has manual (not magnetic) on-off switch. ?If the switch is left on, the feeder comes on with the shaper motor. ?I believe the Comatic has a magnetic or similar on-off switch and ordinarily has to be powered up once the shaper is running. ?On either feeder, power is only supplied when the shaper is running. ?At least, that¡¯s the way mine is configured, I believe. ?I¡¯m not an electrical guru, so there are probably other options for powering up the feeder. Gary
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I did, and I don¡¯t believe it. ? His feeder may be tied into the main power switch on the Profil, but I don¡¯t see how the feeder can be configured to power on when the spindle motor is actuated. ? Maybe there¡¯s some hack to the Comatic feeder that allows it to start up in the RUN position, but I have my doubts.
David Best
David,
Did you read Lucky¡¯s post about his feeder starting and stopping with the spindle?
Joe in New Orleans
This is confusing to me. ? How do you get the Comatic feeder to automatically start running when power is applied to it? ? If I start my Comatic feeder, unplug it, then plug it back in, it powers back up on the OFF mode and I have to press the start switch on the feeder again to get it running - which is the way it should be for safety purposes.. ? So I seriously doubt John¡¯s feeder starts running by itself when the shaper spindle switch is depressed.
Having the power to the PF unavailable if the shaper motor is not running would drive me nuts - setting up the feeder to track accurately is trial and error and I usually test the feeder tracking setup without the spindle turning until I¡¯m certain it¡¯s aligned properly. ??
David Best
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Gary,
That is interesting.
There must be options that can be set.
I think John Ferandin¡¯s Profile 45z has a time delay then starts the feeder after the spindle is started and then the feeder stops when the spindle stops.?
I never hooked my feeder to the shaper plug because I did not want to the feeder to start and stop this way.
Joe in New Orleans
Gary Blasingame 195 Red Fox RunAthens, Georgia 30605706-353-8629706-540-2130 (Cell)garyblasingame@...
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Just uploaded into the Photos library under?Hammer C3 with Comatic DC40 installation
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Thanks Corey.? If I need to rip long (7 foot+) and narrow pieces, then I go to the band saw with infeed and outfeed supports.? Then the piece goes into the planner/drum sander to get to final dimensions.??
I hope that with the 3200mm slider, I can rip 8-foot+ pieces to the left of the blade with parallel guides.? This is a hobby, so I am not too worried about wear and tear.? My thinking is that I am going to use the heck out of a machine and enjoy it while I am still alive.? There is an old saying in our culture;? objects last 7 lifetimes, you only 1.? :)? Happy New Year!
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Hi Joe,
I was browsing through Rangate website.? I remembered videos of tilt-and-turn window installations, so I looked at the FLEXset cutters.? Keep in mind, I have not ever used a shaper; I only have experience with routers.? The used FLEXset set was almost 7K USD and the new window-only set was 12K+.? Fortunately, I don't have any window project in my near future.? The windows of my old house are intact still.? However, the French doors are rotting in certain places.? I have, in total, 8 doors up for repair/replacement in the next few years.??
So, this KF 700 SP will be put into service for bringing this house up to date.? I just hope I have time to spend in the shop!??
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I highly recommend the Alpine Workshop with Joe Calhoun, especially for anyone who is just starting with a shaper. ?It¡¯s four days in his shop. ?Joe has all the patience in the world and is very knowledgeable in every aspect. ?He has a general shaper course, and a window-door course. ?Rangate sponsors the course. Gary
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I highly recommend that you consider the Aigner fence. It allows you to easily cover most of the opening between fences when shaping. It's expensive but I consider it the best upgrade I made when ordering.
Thanks Joe, David, Lucky, Mark and Gary. Your replies have been tremendously helpful and informative.
Given testimonies from David and Lucky, I will just order the standard digital stops with one of the two stops on the telescoping arm. Adding it later is difficult it sounds; much easier to add the 604-118 digital stop in the future.
I will ask Liz to change the spindle moulder size to 30mm. From what I gather from exploring Rangate website, the money is in the tooling. The machine cost pales in comparison. A window tooling set costs 12K USD!!! I have not used a shaper ever. It is one of the few machines that I find intimidating and dangerous, yet so capable. So, I am educating myself about shaper, Aigner, tooling, etc.
I am waiting for Liz to quote me the cost to upgrade to the 10 HP motor. Given the advise here, I will probably stay with the 7.4 HP motor and will have some overhead room for the PP 330.
Given what David said about the dust extractor position for 49" clearance to the right of the blade, I might as well stay with the 49" rip capacity option. One of the pluses of this machine is the ability to process full-size sheet goods.
If anything I learn from the forum, it's the length of the slider. Get the longest! Fortunately, I have more than enough room for the 3200mm slider.
I looked at David's pictures. David, you have the mitre indexing system. Is that Option 170 or 173? Do you find it useful and simple to use? It looks complicated from the pictures and catalog. I cannot tell if it can be used accurately.
I recall reading that the KF 700 SP should be specified at time of order to configure it to be able to use a grooving/dado cutter without removal of the scoring blade. Can someone elaborate on this? This information is not in the catalog or at Felder website.
Once again, thanks for your guidance.
SW
Joe Jensen | VP Internet of Things Group | GM Retail Solutions Div.
480-554-8207-Office | 480-231-0669-Cell
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Gary Blasingame 195 Red Fox RunAthens, Georgia 30605706-353-8629706-540-2130 (Cell)garyblasingame@...
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Here¡¯s my take on this. ?The Felder feeder has manual (not magnetic) on-off switch. ?If the switch is left on, the feeder comes on with the shaper motor. ?I believe the Comatic has a magnetic or similar on-off switch and ordinarily has to be powered up once the shaper is running. ?On either feeder, power is only supplied when the shaper is running. ?At least, that¡¯s the way mine is configured, I believe. ?I¡¯m not an electrical guru, so there are probably other options for powering up the feeder. Gary
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I did, and I don¡¯t believe it. ? His feeder may be tied into the main power switch on the Profil, but I don¡¯t see how the feeder can be configured to power on when the spindle motor is actuated. ? Maybe there¡¯s some hack to the Comatic feeder that allows it to start up in the RUN position, but I have my doubts.
David Best
David,
Did you read Lucky¡¯s post about his feeder starting and stopping with the spindle?
Joe in New Orleans
This is confusing to me. ? How do you get the Comatic feeder to automatically start running when power is applied to it? ? If I start my Comatic feeder, unplug it, then plug it back in, it powers back up on the OFF mode and I have to press the start switch on the feeder again to get it running - which is the way it should be for safety purposes.. ? So I seriously doubt John¡¯s feeder starts running by itself when the shaper spindle switch is depressed.
Having the power to the PF unavailable if the shaper motor is not running would drive me nuts - setting up the feeder to track accurately is trial and error and I usually test the feeder tracking setup without the spindle turning until I¡¯m certain it¡¯s aligned properly. ??
David Best
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Gary,
That is interesting.
There must be options that can be set.
I think John Ferandin¡¯s Profile 45z has a time delay then starts the feeder after the spindle is started and then the feeder stops when the spindle stops.?
I never hooked my feeder to the shaper plug because I did not want to the feeder to start and stop this way.
Joe in New Orleans
Gary Blasingame 195 Red Fox RunAthens, Georgia 30605706-353-8629706-540-2130 (Cell)garyblasingame@...
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imran
David P. Best
Joe Jensen