Re: HP needed for heavy cutter?
I don't want to hijack the thread but. To David B, I sent you a PM, not sure if you got it or not but thank you for the videos to help me work out the issues with my saw. Too damn cold right now but I will give it my best when the shop is a bit warmer. On a side note, the weather event we are having now is remarkable. I have never seen this much snow here since I was a kid. Should be records amounts I assume off this storm front. Glen
Alpine Moulding and Millwork Inc.
Mail: ?? P.O. Box 257 ?????????? Avery, CA. 95224 Shop: 441 Pennsylvania Gulch Road ????????? Murphys, CA. 95247
????????? 650-678-3137 LIC # 707507
I ?hope you are getting well paid for this.? Sounds boring as hell to me.? David Best - Sent from my iPad ?Forgot to add some details. The spacing needs to be precise between the grooves, and we need to make 18,000 (thousand) of these, hence the dedicated machine.
|
Re: HP needed for heavy cutter?
I ?hope you are getting well paid for this. ?Sounds boring as hell to me.? David Best - Sent from my iPad
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
On Jan 28, 2021, at 6:16 PM, TMichael WARD via groups.io <tmikko@...> wrote:
?Forgot to add some details. The spacing needs to be precise between the grooves, and we need to make 18,000 (thousand) of these, hence the dedicated machine.
|
Re: HP needed for heavy cutter?
So how wide is this assembly going to be. 4 or 5 sets mean 4 to 5 feet mib width, if grooves are on the edges of the board.
Can you really do that w/o and support in the middle?
If you can live with less width a moulder like woodmaster (assuming material is not too tall) should work with self feeding. You can buy them used and resell them after you are done.
Bit safer with cutters enclosed. Dust collection is not great but that can be immensely improved for a dedicated setup.
Just a thought.
Imran?
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
On Jan 28, 2021, at 9:03 PM, TMichael WARD via groups.io <tmikko@...> wrote: ? Hi, I need to build a single purpose tool to cut two grooves about 3/32 deep, 2" wide, and 7-3/4" apart at the inside (for RR ties in a 2-1/2" scale model RR club). ?I'm thinking of using stacked dados on a long shaft with a 7-3/4" spacer. mount with pillow blocks?add pully and motor, ?Bolt to underside of a formica table with holes in it, then slide the plastic ties, say 20 in a frame or sled, over the two blades protruding through the table. ?Sorry, sounds complicated.
My question is, if I go with 8" dados, I need 4 or 5 sets at 5 lbs each maybe 21 lbs. ?What horsepower would it take to start that stack. Needs to go about 3450 RPM.
Or, I could use 6" dados at 5000 RPM, only about 6 lbs.
Thanks, Mike Ward
|
Re: HP needed for heavy cutter?
Mount urethane feeder wheels on spindles above the cutters to maintain down pressure as you cut. Rig up a sled with pneumatic cylinders to push the slats thru.?
You might want to find someone with a CNC router with a vacuum table, load the whole table and slot the slats with a 2” cutter to depth. You don’t say actual size of the slats, but you might be able to load 75 to 100 parts at a time on the full table.
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
On Jan 28, 2021, at 7:16 PM, TMichael WARD via < tmikko@...> wrote:
Forgot to add some details. The spacing needs to be precise between the grooves, and we need to make 18,000 (thousand) of these, hence the dedicated machine.
|
Re: HP needed for heavy cutter?
Can you use 50mm (1.968”) wide instead of 2”? If so, you could get two of the Hammer rebate cutters #500-04-003 and stick them on a 30mm shaft with spacers between. As for hp, they are aluminum, says they weigh 4.6lbs, I would suspect 3hp should handle it without much trouble, especially with the insert cutters that are staggered like these.
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
On Jan 28, 2021, at 7:03 PM, TMichael WARD via < tmikko@...> wrote:
Hi, I need to build a single purpose tool to cut two grooves about 3/32 deep, 2" wide, and 7-3/4" apart at the inside (for RR ties in a 2-1/2" scale model RR club). ?I'm thinking of using stacked dados on a long shaft with a 7-3/4" spacer. mount with pillow blocks?add pully and motor, ?Bolt to underside of a formica table with holes in it, then slide the plastic ties, say 20 in a frame or sled, over the two blades protruding through the table. ?Sorry, sounds complicated.
My question is, if I go with 8" dados, I need 4 or 5 sets at 5 lbs each maybe 21 lbs. ?What horsepower would it take to start that stack. Needs to go about 3450 RPM.
Or, I could use 6" dados at 5000 RPM, only about 6 lbs. Thanks, Mike Ward
|
Re: HP needed for heavy cutter?
Forgot to add some details. The spacing needs to be precise between the grooves, and we need to make 18,000 (thousand) of these, hence the dedicated machine.
|
Jason with all this 3d printing talk I didn’t even thank about that. I am in the same camp as a former multi-router owner it is the only one I am considering, would love to get my hands on the pantorouter to be proved wrong. As far as 3d printed templates I don’t see why the tapered tenon 3d printed couldn’t be used on the multirouter router as well using their holder or making something?
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
On Jan 28, 2021, at 9:06 PM, Jason Holtz <jholtzy@...> wrote:
? I was talking with someone who has used the Multirouter, and now has the Pantorouter. He explained one feature that seems to be better. The tenon templates on the PR are tapered, so you can adjust where your stylus follows the pattern to fine tune the fit of the joint. He claims to have virtually eliminated the hand tweaking with a shoulder plane that I've just come to accept as a part of the process. I'm intrigued. Wondering about 3D printing some new patterns for the MR incorporating that feature. Truth be told, I only cut live tenons on chair rails with the MR, otherwise I'm just slot routing for floating tenons. Chair orders are few and far between, so I'm probably obsessing over nothing.
Jason Jason Holtz
J. Holtz Furniture
3307 Snelling Ave. South Minneapolis, MN 55406
612 432-2765 -- Jason J. Holtz Furniture 3307 Snelling Ave. South Minneapolis, MN 55406
|
Re: How to Remove Wire from Brake Board Connector
Imran,? Could be, I mostly only ever see/use the io slices seen in my pic and on circuit board soldered connectors I typically only have see screw terminal connectors.?
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
On Jan 28, 2021, at 8:51 PM, imranindiana via groups.io <imranindiana@...> wrote:
? Mark,
The other connector (smaller) worked with just pushing. This one appears to only work with pushing down, at least with a screwdriver. Maybe, with proper tool you can just push it. I was afraid to apply too much force.
Imran
On Jan 28, 2021, at 8:08 PM, Mark Kessler <mkessler10@...> wrote:
? Also know you can just push the driver in and it will wedge it open On Jan 28, 2021, at 5:55 PM, imranindiana via groups.io <imranindiana@...> wrote:
? Thanks Murray. I saw my earlier post with many typos, so it may not be clear that I got it done. Exactly like you explained. Thin shaft flat head worked better for me as the slightly thicker was difficult to engage. As you said the feeling of engagement is like it is going between two pressure loaded jaws. Once you have engagement lift handle away from the wire hole and the copper part (in my pic) goes down. Wire is held between silver upper and copper lower tabs.
Imran
On Jan 28, 2021, at 5:31 PM, murrayau1 <murraywp@...> wrote:
?Imran, I’ve just been through exactly this issue replacing the starting capacitors. I also didn’t want to force anything so I contacted the Felder Service tech who put me straight. You get a very small flat screwdriver poke it in the hole above to engage a lug ?which is in there, and lever it to loosen the wire then pull it out, I think the lever direction is up up. You’ll need to doublecheck that it is the hole above and not below (I’ve only done this once), the best advice the felder Tech gave me was to experiment with a vacant hole.
hope this helps, Murray
|
I was talking with someone who has used the Multirouter, and now has the Pantorouter. He explained one feature that seems to be better. The tenon templates on the PR are tapered, so you can adjust where your stylus follows the pattern to fine tune the fit of the joint. He claims to have virtually eliminated the hand tweaking with a shoulder plane that I've just come to accept as a part of the process. I'm intrigued. Wondering about 3D printing some new patterns for the MR incorporating that feature. Truth be told, I only cut live tenons on chair rails with the MR, otherwise I'm just slot routing for floating tenons. Chair orders are few and far between, so I'm probably obsessing over nothing.
Jason Jason Holtz
J. Holtz Furniture
3307 Snelling Ave. South Minneapolis, MN 55406
612 432-2765 -- Jason J. Holtz Furniture 3307 Snelling Ave. South Minneapolis, MN 55406
|
HP needed for heavy cutter?
Hi, I need to build a single purpose tool to cut two grooves about 3/32 deep, 2" wide, and 7-3/4" apart at the inside (for RR ties in a 2-1/2" scale model RR club). ?I'm thinking of using stacked dados on a long shaft with a 7-3/4" spacer. mount with pillow blocks?add pully and motor, ?Bolt to underside of a formica table with holes in it, then slide the plastic ties, say 20 in a frame or sled, over the two blades protruding through the table. ?Sorry, sounds complicated.
My question is, if I go with 8" dados, I need 4 or 5 sets at 5 lbs each maybe 21 lbs. ?What horsepower would it take to start that stack. Needs to go about 3450 RPM.
Or, I could use 6" dados at 5000 RPM, only about 6 lbs.
Thanks, Mike Ward
|
Re: How to Remove Wire from Brake Board Connector
Mark,
The other connector (smaller) worked with just pushing. This one appears to only work with pushing down, at least with a screwdriver. Maybe, with proper tool you can just push it. I was afraid to apply too much force.
Imran
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
On Jan 28, 2021, at 8:08 PM, Mark Kessler <mkessler10@...> wrote: ? Also know you can just push the driver in and it will wedge it open On Jan 28, 2021, at 5:55 PM, imranindiana via groups.io <imranindiana@...> wrote:
? Thanks Murray. I saw my earlier post with many typos, so it may not be clear that I got it done. Exactly like you explained. Thin shaft flat head worked better for me as the slightly thicker was difficult to engage. As you said the feeling of engagement is like it is going between two pressure loaded jaws. Once you have engagement lift handle away from the wire hole and the copper part (in my pic) goes down. Wire is held between silver upper and copper lower tabs.
Imran
On Jan 28, 2021, at 5:31 PM, murrayau1 <murraywp@...> wrote:
?Imran, I’ve just been through exactly this issue replacing the starting capacitors. I also didn’t want to force anything so I contacted the Felder Service tech who put me straight. You get a very small flat screwdriver poke it in the hole above to engage a lug ?which is in there, and lever it to loosen the wire then pull it out, I think the lever direction is up up. You’ll need to doublecheck that it is the hole above and not below (I’ve only done this once), the best advice the felder Tech gave me was to experiment with a vacant hole.
hope this helps, Murray
|
Re: How to Remove Wire from Brake Board Connector
Also know you can just push the driver in and it will wedge it open
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
On Jan 28, 2021, at 5:55 PM, imranindiana via groups.io <imranindiana@...> wrote:
? Thanks Murray. I saw my earlier post with many typos, so it may not be clear that I got it done. Exactly like you explained. Thin shaft flat head worked better for me as the slightly thicker was difficult to engage. As you said the feeling of engagement is like it is going between two pressure loaded jaws. Once you have engagement lift handle away from the wire hole and the copper part (in my pic) goes down. Wire is held between silver upper and copper lower tabs.
Imran
On Jan 28, 2021, at 5:31 PM, murrayau1 <murraywp@...> wrote:
?Imran, I’ve just been through exactly this issue replacing the starting capacitors. I also didn’t want to force anything so I contacted the Felder Service tech who put me straight. You get a very small flat screwdriver poke it in the hole above to engage a lug ?which is in there, and lever it to loosen the wire then pull it out, I think the lever direction is up up. You’ll need to doublecheck that it is the hole above and not below (I’ve only done this once), the best advice the felder Tech gave me was to experiment with a vacant hole.
hope this helps, Murray
|
Just to follow up, I'm not able to get the photos off that old computer (now I remember why I replaced it).
If you are serious about going the Ivac route and really need to have photos, let me know. John Kee was very generous helping me get this set up on my RL160, and I'd be happy to go the extra mile here. It's just a bit of a pain to get into that top panel...
|
I looked at the Woodpeckers Multirouter, a couple of weeks ago, but decided on the metal Pantorouter ($1800) and absolutely loving it.
It’s super easy to setup and repeatability an accuracy is great.
Chris Edwards (407) 902-1358 cell
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
On Jan 28, 2021, at 1:50 PM, Mike@... wrote:
David
I gave it a strong think but ended up preordering the multi router that woodpecker is going to sell. ?I use a dedicated floor hollow chisel unit (powermatic) for timber size jobs but wanted something capable for furniture. ?Btw, I currently have a 22” powermatic planer and 8” jointer separately but am likely to move to a combo unit both to save floor space but as well to avoid a 2k upgrade of my planer to a helical head (so it was a timely decision to consider felder’s option).
Mike
|
Re: Felder Panel tilting device for Fat 300S
Thanks a lot for your feedback and all the pictures, that is helpful,
Bill
|
Re: Felder Panel tilting device for Fat 300S
|
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
On Jan 28, 2021, at 6:05 PM, bacchus6015 via groups.io <joeinno@...> wrote: ? Imran,
Yes that is what I am talking about.
Joe
Hi Joe,
I will look for it but I am pretty happy with the way it works. Are we talking about drill bit being perpendicular to the front fence and the horizontal movement of bit to be level with table top?
Efficient indexing is all I need to be more productive and reduce fussing over mortice alignment.
Imran? On Jan 28, 2021, at 5:32 PM, bacchus6015 via ??< joeinno@...> wrote: ?Imran,
Mac has posted a good method for calibrating the work table of the FD250 to the trajectory of the cutting bit.
MY FD250 did not work well until I calibrated it. ?When out of calibration there is a lot of friction along the sides of the bit resulting in heat and probably deflection resulting in bad mortises that would not glue well. ?Too much heat contributes to burnishing of the wood which makes for a poor glue surface.
Joe
|
Imran,
Yes that is what I am talking about.
Joe
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
Hi Joe,
I will look for it but I am pretty happy with the way it works. Are we talking about drill bit being perpendicular to the front fence and the horizontal movement of bit to be level with table top?
Efficient indexing is all I need to be more productive and reduce fussing over mortice alignment.
Imran? On Jan 28, 2021, at 5:32 PM, bacchus6015 via ??< joeinno@...> wrote: ?Imran,
Mac has posted a good method for calibrating the work table of the FD250 to the trajectory of the cutting bit.
MY FD250 did not work well until I calibrated it. ?When out of calibration there is a lot of friction along the sides of the bit resulting in heat and probably deflection resulting in bad mortises that would not glue well. ?Too much heat contributes to burnishing of the wood which makes for a poor glue surface.
Joe
|
Hi Joe,
I will look for it but I am pretty happy with the way it works. Are we talking about drill bit being perpendicular to the front fence and the horizontal movement of bit to be level with table top?
Efficient indexing is all I need to be more productive and reduce fussing over mortice alignment.
Imran?
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
On Jan 28, 2021, at 5:32 PM, bacchus6015 via groups.io <joeinno@...> wrote: ? Imran,
Mac has posted a good method for calibrating the work table of the FD250 to the trajectory of the cutting bit.
MY FD250 did not work well until I calibrated it. ?When out of calibration there is a lot of friction along the sides of the bit resulting in heat and probably deflection resulting in bad mortises that would not glue well. ?Too much heat contributes to burnishing of the wood which makes for a poor glue surface.
Joe
Joe,
Some good ideas on indexing. I have saved your post and will look at it after I get my brake working on K975.
Imran On Jan 28, 2021, at 4:35 PM, bacchus6015 via < joeinno@...> wrote: ? I had an FD250 and liked it and learned to use it for mortising and dowel boring to make doors and windows.
I planned to make videos to share what I learned but ran out of time when liquidating the shop last summer.
I modified it in a few ways. ?I added a bracket to shift the control handle so it would not hit the clamp riser on the right hand side of the work table. ?I added a DRO for height to make double rows of dowel repeatable for window and door sash.?
I also added pneumatic clamps that I copied from the clamps that Ultimate Joe had on his Koehle mortiser. ? The pneumatic clamps made everything easier and more precise. ?
I had the rack and pinion mortising feature and it made dowel boring possible and made side to side mortising with birds beak bits easier.
I also had the index bars and I figured out how to use them to index mirror image parts for doors and windows.?
The way I indexed mirror image pieces was to use the 90 degree fence a couple of stops on the back side of the work table and a scrap of wood that could be bored all the way through when indexed to the 90 degree stop and then move the 90 degree stop to the opposite side of the worktable and reference the flip side of the scrap to the cutting bit. ?This allows you to index dowel holes to the edge or end of a workpiece exactly the same distance from the fence. ?I may have some photos if anyone is interested.
Another way to index parts is to use a wooden fence in place of the small metal one on the front edge of the worktable. ?You can set the wooden fence just below the height of the cutter and mark locations on the top edge of the fence. ?The thumbscrews that held the metal fence on my FD250 were very long and easily accommodated 6mm plywood for a fence.
I found the FD250 to provide a lot of bang for the buck. ?The alternatives that were better cost between $14k and $30k depending on options. ?The Hoffmann (HR150?) like the one Ultimate Joe Calhoon has is one option and the Stegherr FD Junior is another.?
I also had custom boring bits made that were .1mm oversize for the dowels I was using. ?I bought them from Greg at Rangate, they had nice thick carbide and worked well in side grain and end grain. ?
Joe in New Orleans
Hi David,
I have a FD250. I bought it used and it did not have the morticing option. IMHO, this option is needed to make slotting an enjoyable experience. It adds a rack & pinion (terminology may be off but I hope it gets the idea across) and a separate lever. The joy stick is okay but with this lever fwd motion is essentially fixed while you sweep horizontally. With joystick, if used regularly, one may develop sufficient muscle memory but that is not the case with me. Mortising option also adds a bell on the business end so that a hollow chisel can be used. I do not have any chisels so no experience there.
This is not a production machine. The process is slow if you are slot mortising. The physical position to do the mortising can be difficult for some as you stand in the rear and lean a bit fwd to see what is going on. In reality, with stops, in both directions, one should not have to do so, but I think it is natural response.
Where the machine is lacking is a way to easily index work. Maybe someone has figured something out and we all can benefit from it.
I will use the example of building a door with floating tenons. You can certainly, repeat the setting for stiles on multiple pieces via the stop on the rod, unless you door is too tall ?. But now there is no easy way to register the mortice on the mating rails. An indicator for center line of mortice can help and I may add that to my machine. Not sure if this issue is same for multirouter.
Multirouter is much more liked by some very experienced folks here, so I will certainly check it out. I am not sure, if FD250 has any advantage over multirouter, other than perhaps it can do deeper mortice/boring. You can bore holes with constant distance via the doweling attachment as well.
Hope this helps.
Imran
|
Re: Felder Panel tilting device for Fat 300S
Rice,
Cannot offer an answer, but I have a question for you :). How do you like your fat300? Do you see it as a workbench with some vacuum clamps?
Bill
|
David P. Best
imran
TMichael WARD
Jason Holtz
JP Rice