Re: Machinery Max: 2019-FELDER-FORMAT-KAPPA-400 - Toronto Canada
That¡¯s a pretty broad statement James. ?Having consulted with Martin on the T60 design, and owning a Kappa 400, I can confirm there are differences in the build, but making an unqualified statement like ¡°way better than¡± is hyperbole. ?Each machine has plusses and minuses. ?
David Best
https://www.instagram.com/davidpbest/
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The bidding war is going strong, not a good deal at all. At US$ 22K, a Martin T-60 is way better than this Kappa 400.?
<Capture.JPG>
James
I can help people estimate those frustrations ?
? Plus the time to file the insurance claim when it arrives trashed . . .? :) ? -- Michael Garrison Stuber ?
On 1/6/2021 9:11 AM, David Kumm wrote:
plus the cost of a pallet.? Dave
I hr remaining - CAD$ 14K
?
45k CAD$ is 35K US$ based on the current exchange rate. I doubt Kappa 400 with the 12 foot sliding table would cost that much.
When I bought my KF700sp in 2016, I recall Kappa 400 was 30K+ CAD$ plus tax at that time.
?
On Wed, Dec 30, 2020 at 11:46 AM Rob H <rhorton@...> wrote:
That is a nice saw. in the ad it list the price new @?FELDER Model KAPPA 400 SLIDING SAW
ORIGINAL PURCHASE PRICE....APPROX $ 45,000 CDN
--
Michael Garrison Stuber
|
Re: Machinery Max: 2019-FELDER-FORMAT-KAPPA-400 - Toronto Canada
Sold at?$20,800.00 CAD? plus 15% premium plus 13% tax = $ 27029 CAD = $ 21327 US.
James
The bidding war is going strong, not a good deal at all. At US$ 22K, a Martin T-60 is way better than this Kappa 400.?
James
I can help people estimate those frustrations
?
?
Plus the time to file the insurance claim when it arrives trashed . . .?
:)
?
--
Michael Garrison Stuber
?
On 1/6/2021 9:11 AM, David Kumm wrote:
plus the cost of a pallet.? Dave
I hr remaining - CAD$ 14K
?
45k CAD$ is 35K US$ based on the current exchange rate. I doubt Kappa 400 with the 12 foot sliding table would cost that much.
When I bought my KF700sp in 2016, I recall Kappa 400 was 30K+ CAD$ plus tax at that time.
?
On Wed, Dec 30, 2020 at 11:46 AM Rob H <rhorton@...> wrote:
That is a nice saw. in the ad it list the price new @?FELDER Model KAPPA 400 SLIDING SAW
ORIGINAL PURCHASE PRICE....APPROX $ 45,000 CDN
--
Michael Garrison Stuber
|
Re: Mantle Build Question
Imran,
Here¡¯s the drawing. ?Don¡¯t underestimate the racking force here. ?The brackets ended up costing $150 and took 30 minutes to fabricate.
David Best
https://www.instagram.com/davidpbest/
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After reading, I realized it would be better to screw the mantle to the blocking from top vs bottom. Imran On Jan 6, 2021, at 1:00 AM, imranindiana via < imranindiana@...> wrote: ?So a friend wants a live edge mantle from an Ash log. He already has the log cut on the band mill. It is 11¡± deep (sticking out from wall) and 7.5¡± tall (vertical). The mantle will be 5¡¯ long. I can run the 11¡± wide top on the jointer and then make the back 90 deg to it. Finally run it thru planer to get the bottom parallel to the top. I need to return each end of the mantle so will need to cut 45s. I plan to do each 45 deg cut in two passes (due to 7¡±+ thickness) with material on one side of the xcut fence and then flipped and placed on the other side of the xcut fence. I have not done this so far. Finally i can plough a recess on the back side on all 3 pieces for mounting purpose and process a piece of wood that fits perfectly in the recess. With this piece mounted on the wall the mantle can be pushed on it and screwed from bottom. I can easily plough about 3¡± deep. Is that deep enough for a 11¡± deep mantle? I know there are many mounting options out there but would like to find out if what i described would work? Imran
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Re: Mantle Build Question
Tad,
Thanks, that is a nice option to consider. I had not seen this before. I do prefer to distribute the weight on all studs available but keep this option in mind.
Imran
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On Jan 6, 2021, at 12:57 PM, Tad Gallistel <tadg@...> wrote: ? I just ran across these hangers, the smallest would work for you:
Just route a recess in the back of the mantle, screw these to the studs and drop it on.
Tad
After reading, I realized it would be better to screw the mantle to the blocking from top vs bottom. Imran On Jan 6, 2021, at 1:00 AM, imranindiana via < imranindiana@...> wrote: ?So a friend wants a live edge mantle from an Ash log. He already has the log cut on the band mill. It is 11¡± deep (sticking out from wall) and 7.5¡± tall (vertical). The mantle will be 5¡¯ long. I can run the 11¡± wide top on the jointer and then make the back 90 deg to it. Finally run it thru planer to get the bottom parallel to the top. I need to return each end of the mantle so will need to cut 45s. I plan to do each 45 deg cut in two passes (due to 7¡±+ thickness) with material on one side of the xcut fence and then flipped and placed on the other side of the xcut fence. I have not done this so far. Finally i can plough a recess on the back side on all 3 pieces for mounting purpose and process a piece of wood that fits perfectly in the recess. With this piece mounted on the wall the mantle can be pushed on it and screwed from bottom. I can easily plough about 3¡± deep. Is that deep enough for a 11¡± deep mantle? I know there are many mounting options out there but would like to find out if what i described would work? Imran
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Re: Machinery Max: 2019-FELDER-FORMAT-KAPPA-400 - Toronto Canada
The bidding war is going strong, not a good deal at all. At US$ 22K, a Martin T-60 is way better than this Kappa 400.?
James
I can help people estimate those frustrations
?
?
Plus the time to file the insurance claim when it arrives trashed . . .?
:)
?
--
Michael Garrison Stuber
?
On 1/6/2021 9:11 AM, David Kumm wrote:
plus the cost of a pallet.? Dave
I hr remaining - CAD$ 14K
?
45k CAD$ is 35K US$ based on the current exchange rate. I doubt Kappa 400 with the 12 foot sliding table would cost that much.
When I bought my KF700sp in 2016, I recall Kappa 400 was 30K+ CAD$ plus tax at that time.
?
On Wed, Dec 30, 2020 at 11:46 AM Rob H <rhorton@...> wrote:
That is a nice saw. in the ad it list the price new @?FELDER Model KAPPA 400 SLIDING SAW
ORIGINAL PURCHASE PRICE....APPROX $ 45,000 CDN
--
Michael Garrison Stuber
|
Re: Mantle Build Question
I just did this for a client in Bend OR - not live edge, but 8¡± thick with returns at the end in white rift-sawn Oak. ?We had a local fabricator make steel L-brackets that attached to the studs - 3 of them held together with flat bar in two places. ?The vertical members were 3/16" wall 1.5 x 1.5 square tube, mitered and projecting out from the wall. ?The verticals were drilled and through-bolted with carriage bolts to the studs about 2 feet long running upward from the CL of the mantle. ?This mantle projected 12¡± from the wall, and the L-brackets projected 10¡± total beyond the sheetrock. ?The GC used 2¡± augers to bore out for the L-brackets, and imbedded the entire mess in epoxy. ?It¡¯s never coming down.
David Best
https://www.instagram.com/davidpbest/
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So a friend wants a live edge mantle from an Ash log. He already has the log cut on the band mill. It is 11¡± deep (sticking out from wall) and 7.5¡± tall (vertical). The mantle will be 5¡¯ long.
I can run the 11¡± wide top on the jointer and then make the back 90 deg to it. Finally run it thru planer to get the bottom parallel to the top.
I need to return each end of the mantle so will need to cut 45s. I plan to do each 45 deg cut in two passes (due to 7¡±+ thickness) with material on one side of the xcut fence and then flipped and placed on the other side of the xcut fence. I have not done this so far.
Finally i can plough a recess on the back side on all 3 pieces for mounting purpose and process a piece of wood that fits perfectly in the recess. With this piece mounted on the wall the mantle can be pushed on it and screwed from bottom. I can easily plough about 3¡± deep. Is that deep enough for a 11¡± deep mantle?
I know there are many mounting options out there but would like to find out if what i described would work?
Imran
|
Re: Mantle Build Question
Brett,
It seems that most brackets are meant for hollow shelfs/mantles where the size of the hollow can be controlled precisely.
I thought of similar approaches to your suggestion none as clever though ? The returns on each side would really make that really challenging. I am doing this as a favor and do need to limit my time as I have too many things that still need done.
I thought that we can saw off the live edge face followed by ripping thick boards from the top and bottom of the remaining log. Then recreate the log with hollow center. This likely will get rid of the most moist part of the log but there is no telling what would happen to the cut pieces once they are removed from the main log.
Imran
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On Jan 6, 2021, at 11:06 AM, Brett Wissel <Brettwissel@...> wrote: ?If the board is truly 7.5" thick/tall I'd suggest looking into special brackets like??.?
Otherwise, a clever method if the situation makes sense is to cut? the back of the board a good 1-1.5" from the back edge, and use it to mount directly to the wall with recessed anchors. Then use dominoes in an array to push the rest of the board against the mounting slice, and the piece will be impossible for the next guy to figure out how you did it once the adhesive sets and the dominoes swell. If you dry fit the dominoes beforehand like you are supposed to, you can tweak the joint line to make invisible, which shouldn't be too tough on ash given grain orientation. Fun project!
|
Re: Mantle Build Question
I just ran across these hangers, the smallest would work for you:
Just route a recess in the back of the mantle, screw these to the studs and drop it on.
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
After reading, I realized it would be better to screw the mantle to the blocking from top vs bottom. Imran On Jan 6, 2021, at 1:00 AM, imranindiana via < imranindiana@...> wrote: ?So a friend wants a live edge mantle from an Ash log. He already has the log cut on the band mill. It is 11¡± deep (sticking out from wall) and 7.5¡± tall (vertical). The mantle will be 5¡¯ long. I can run the 11¡± wide top on the jointer and then make the back 90 deg to it. Finally run it thru planer to get the bottom parallel to the top. I need to return each end of the mantle so will need to cut 45s. I plan to do each 45 deg cut in two passes (due to 7¡±+ thickness) with material on one side of the xcut fence and then flipped and placed on the other side of the xcut fence. I have not done this so far. Finally i can plough a recess on the back side on all 3 pieces for mounting purpose and process a piece of wood that fits perfectly in the recess. With this piece mounted on the wall the mantle can be pushed on it and screwed from bottom. I can easily plough about 3¡± deep. Is that deep enough for a 11¡± deep mantle? I know there are many mounting options out there but would like to find out if what i described would work? Imran
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Re: KF700sp and AD741 used pricing
For a lot of reasons and assistance from some amazing people on FOG, I have backed out of this deal. ?The accessories and tooling are great, but the high price, age and trunnion issues make this offering good from afar, but far from good. ?Unfortunately, the seller will not part out the tooling and/or accessories and prefers to sell as a package deal. ?
Back on the search and contemplating buying new.
Thanks to everyone for their thoughts!
--
Mike Barrow
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Re: Machinery Max: 2019-FELDER-FORMAT-KAPPA-400 - Toronto Canada
I can help people estimate those frustrations
?
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From: [email protected] < [email protected]>
On Behalf Of Michael Garrison Stuber
Sent: Wednesday, January 6, 2021 10:16 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [FOG] Machinery Max: 2019-FELDER-FORMAT-KAPPA-400 - Toronto Canada
?
Plus the time to file the insurance claim when it arrives trashed . . .?
:)
?
--
Michael Garrison Stuber
?
On 1/6/2021 9:11 AM, David Kumm wrote:
plus the cost of a pallet.? Dave
I hr remaining - CAD$ 14K
?
45k CAD$ is 35K US$ based on the current exchange rate. I doubt Kappa 400 with the 12 foot sliding table would cost that much.
When I bought my KF700sp in 2016, I recall Kappa 400 was 30K+ CAD$ plus tax at that time.
?
On Wed, Dec 30, 2020 at 11:46 AM Rob H <rhorton@...> wrote:
That is a nice saw. in the ad it list the price new @?FELDER Model KAPPA 400 SLIDING SAW
ORIGINAL PURCHASE PRICE....APPROX $ 45,000 CDN
--
Michael Garrison Stuber
|
Re: Machinery Max: 2019-FELDER-FORMAT-KAPPA-400 - Toronto Canada
Plus the time to file the insurance claim when it arrives trashed
. . .?
:)
--
Michael Garrison Stuber
On 1/6/2021 9:11 AM, David Kumm wrote:
plus the cost of a pallet.? Dave
I hr remaining - CAD$ 14K
Imran
?
45k CAD$ is 35K US$ based on the current
exchange rate. I doubt Kappa 400 with the 12 foot sliding
table would cost that much.
When I bought my KF700sp in 2016, I recall Kappa 400
was 30K+ CAD$ plus tax at that time.
James
On Wed, Dec 30, 2020
at 11:46 AM Rob H < rhorton@...>
wrote:
That is a nice saw. in the ad it list the price new @?FELDER
Model KAPPA 400 SLIDING SAW
ORIGINAL PURCHASE PRICE....APPROX $ 45,000 CDN
--
Michael Garrison Stuber
|
Re: Machinery Max: 2019-FELDER-FORMAT-KAPPA-400 - Toronto Canada
plus the cost of a pallet.? Dave
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I hr remaining - CAD$ 14K
Imran
On Dec 30, 2020, at 11:54 AM, James Zhu <james.zhu2@...> wrote:
?
45k CAD$ is 35K US$ based on the current exchange rate. I doubt Kappa 400 with the 12 foot sliding table would cost that much.
When I bought my KF700sp in 2016, I recall Kappa 400 was 30K+ CAD$ plus tax at that time.
James
On Wed, Dec 30, 2020 at 11:46 AM Rob H < rhorton@...> wrote:
That is a nice saw. in the ad it list the price new @?FELDER Model KAPPA 400 SLIDING SAW
ORIGINAL PURCHASE PRICE....APPROX $ 45,000 CDN
|
Re: Machinery Max: 2019-FELDER-FORMAT-KAPPA-400 - Toronto Canada
I hr remaining - CAD$ 14K
Imran
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On Dec 30, 2020, at 11:54 AM, James Zhu <james.zhu2@...> wrote: ? 45k CAD$ is 35K US$ based on the current exchange rate. I doubt Kappa 400 with the 12 foot sliding table would cost that much.
When I bought my KF700sp in 2016, I recall Kappa 400 was 30K+ CAD$ plus tax at that time.
James On Wed, Dec 30, 2020 at 11:46 AM Rob H < rhorton@...> wrote: That is a nice saw. in the ad it list the price new @?FELDER Model KAPPA 400 SLIDING SAW
ORIGINAL PURCHASE PRICE....APPROX $ 45,000 CDN
|
Re: Mantle Build Question
I did 3 mantels out of large white oak timbers for our new house.? On one I used a block as described by others and it sagged a bit.? I ended up redoing
that and for all three I did French cleats out of hardwood.? Once in place a thin trim screw keeps them there. I cut a recess in the back 1¡± deep and 3¡± wide for the cleat.
?
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From: [email protected] < [email protected]>
On Behalf Of Brett Wissel
Sent: Wednesday, January 6, 2021 9:06 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [FOG] Mantle Build Question
?
If the board is truly 7.5" thick/tall I'd suggest looking into special brackets like??.?
Otherwise, a clever method if the situation makes sense is to cut? the back of the board a good 1-1.5" from the back edge, and use it to mount directly to the wall with recessed anchors. Then use dominoes in an array to push the rest of the board against the
mounting slice, and the piece will be impossible for the next guy to figure out how you did it once the adhesive sets and the dominoes swell. If you dry fit the dominoes beforehand like you are supposed to, you can tweak the joint line to make invisible, which
shouldn't be too tough on ash given grain orientation. Fun project!
|
Re: Mantle Build Question
If the board is truly 7.5" thick/tall I'd suggest looking into special brackets like??.?
Otherwise, a clever method if the situation makes sense is to cut? the back of the board a good 1-1.5" from the back edge, and use it to mount directly to the wall with recessed anchors. Then use dominoes in an array to push the rest of the board against the mounting slice, and the piece will be impossible for the next guy to figure out how you did it once the adhesive sets and the dominoes swell. If you dry fit the dominoes beforehand like you are supposed to, you can tweak the joint line to make invisible, which shouldn't be too tough on ash given grain orientation. Fun project!
|
Re: Jointer giving a rough finish
Jeff,
For some reason the pic did not come thru last night for me. Cliff¡¯s response made me look again and it is there. Anyhow, you got plenty of responses but looking at the pic, are you sure the 2nd piece is cherry. Some woods cut fuzzy and your bad board reminds me of sycamore.
Imran
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On Jan 6, 2021, at 9:49 AM, Cliff Rohrabacher, Esq. <rohrabacher@...> wrote:
?That's a rather dramatic level of rough finish.
I almost never consider the direction of grain and I've never seen
anything like that.
Best I can offer in no particular order
Run some other wood across it and see what you get. Maybe the one
board is screwy
reevaluate your set up blades their orientation their height
Rip that glue joint apart and flip that board or toss it in the firewood bin
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Re: Jointer giving a rough finish
That's a rather dramatic? level of rough finish.
I almost never consider the direction of grain and I've never seen
anything like that.
Best I can offer? in no particular order
?Run some other wood across it and see what you get.? Maybe the one
board is? screwy
reevaluate your set up? blades? their orientation their height
Rip that glue joint apart and flip that board or toss it in the firewood bin
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Re: Jointer giving a rough finish
It used to be that the two sided blades had an insignia on one side on right or left. They are ground with all markings on right or left so you want bro install all right or left to be in same cutting circle. You were definitely going against the grain so you need to watch that.? Proper Edging ?And facing takes a degree of skill, if your new to it practice practice practice. Bow up facing , bow down edging. Light pressure does it you want to change the shape not smooth ?and end up with the same crocked shape. ?Keep you eye on the out feed table that¡¯s your guide to success . mac,,, Designing and building for 50 years
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On Jan 6, 2021, at 6:01 AM, Mark Kessler <mkessler10@...> wrote:
? Blades installed backwards? On Jan 6, 2021, at 12:33 AM, Jeff <jeff.lund.ca@...> wrote:
?I didn't feel and chatter. I was wondering about the feeding against the grain. I did a glue up of two boards and I didn't think about matching grain direction when I did them. Looking at them I may have glued one with the grain going one way and one the other so I may not have a "right direction" to joint that one. I have some other boards that need to be planed so I'll try that later this week and see what happens.?
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David B,?
I love your response! ? So much more elegant than my father and my expression, "why make something simple when you can make it complex?" The underlaying rationale are quite similar. ?We can all find someone else to make it cheap and of poor quality, but that is one of the reasons I love making as a hobbyist. ?If I¡¯m not learning and improving and pushing my skill set on each project then it is simply less rewarding in the near term and crippling to long term skill development. ?
Thanks for sharing your response.
Anthony?
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On Jan 5, 2021, at 11:36 PM, David Luckensmeyer < dhluckens@...> wrote:
Perfect.?
As well, we¡¯ll get you into the ¡°Cambridge Split Infinitives Club¡± before much longer!!? ? Hahaha. ?Yes, I went through a re-branding phase. ?Current calling card - now that I¡¯ve been inducted into the Oxford Comma Society, even this needs updating ? LOL.
On Jan 5, 2021, at 7:42 PM, David Luckensmeyer < dhluckens@...> wrote:
Nicely said David.
I prefer your later descriptive alias: ¡°bon vivant et raconteur¡±. Isn¡¯t that on your current business card?
I love it.? Cheers, ? I¡¯ve been called a lot of things in my life. ?Here is my calling card from high school to prove it. ?So if you want to call me David Worst to distinguish me from the other David B, I am already trained to respond accordingly. ?We had a similar problem here with so many named Joe at one point.
<David Calling Card High School.jpeg>
Dave Davies, thanks for passing along your son¡¯s comment. ?Just last week I experienced a bunch of flack on one of the machinist forums for not taking quick and dirty approach to things just to ¡°get it done in the most expedient manner.¡± ?I felt compelled to respond - admittedly in a defensive tone, but I think it¡¯s worth repeating here since many of us in this group share a similar dedication to doing things to high standards. ?Here was my reply to the hacks:
"We each have our own orientation in pursuing a craft such as this. For
me, this is a journey of continuous learning, problem-solving, and
perfecting skills. Taking the KISS approach often does little to enhance
those aspects.?
I am often equally baffled why someone pursuing a hobby or craft would
consistently take the cheap and expedient path. In so doing, they miss
an opportunity to experiment, grow, learn, and be rewarded with the
immense gratification of tackling and succeeding at something previously
beyond their grasp. In my avocational pursuits, faced with something
easy and something challenging, I will consistently pick the latter. To
do otherwise is a shortcut with hollow reward and bypasses the chance to
do something exceptional.
Perhaps, as the acronym KISS suggests, that renders me ¡°stupid¡± in the
minds of others. So be it. I do as much as I can to live up to my
surname and rarely succeed. This path is not always easy or expedient,
but despite the hardships, frustrations, and occasional disparaging
remarks, I¡¯m better for it. Paraphrasing one individual with greater
determination than my own, ¡°We do it not because it is easy, but because
it is hard.¡± This, I believe, is the source of enhanced achievement.
As I said in an earlier post, to each their own.¡±
As we're gearing up to get our mill and lathe my son is becoming exposed to David Best and after going through his flickr albums he tells me he knows why he's not David "Good Enough". Dave Davies On Tue, Jan 5, 2021 at 8:43 PM David Luckensmeyer < dhluckens@...> wrote: Which David B. ?? There can only be one David B. on FOG I think, and that is surely David Best.? David Blehar, do you have a nickname?
I¡¯m David L., but I¡¯m glad I go by Lucky here. Too many David¡¯s!!?
Warm regards, Lucky (David Luckensmeyer) ? David B,
Thanks for sharing the roller height calibration #s.
Imran ?perhaps the feed rollers need an adjustment beyond just the spring tension? Most of you guys in this forum seem have this info already, but the specs I got from Felder when I tuned up my AD741 were as follows:
The infeed roller should be 0.020" below the bottom most rotation of the carbide insert.
The outfeed roller should be 0.028" below.
+/- 0.004
Maybe if the infeed and/or outfeed rollers are set too high they're not engaging the material properly to pull it through?
David
-- Dave & Marie Davies
318-219-7868
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Re: Mantle Build Question
I wouldn¡¯t bother going that deep for the mounting block - just enough to catch it with 2 screws from the top.
A 1¡± block standing proud of the wall mounted firmly would be plenty - the mantle is relying on the sheer strength/friction to the wall for the majority of its load in those dimensions.
Brian
Heisenberg Woodworking
Sent from a device with less than stellar autocorrect
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On Jan 6, 2021, at 12:16 AM, imranindiana via groups.io <imranindiana@...> wrote:
?After reading, I realized it would be better to screw the mantle to the blocking from top vs bottom.
Imran
On Jan 6, 2021, at 1:00 AM, imranindiana via groups.io <imranindiana@...> wrote:
?So a friend wants a live edge mantle from an Ash log. He already has the log cut on the band mill. It is 11¡± deep (sticking out from wall) and 7.5¡± tall (vertical). The mantle will be 5¡¯ long.
I can run the 11¡± wide top on the jointer and then make the back 90 deg to it. Finally run it thru planer to get the bottom parallel to the top.
I need to return each end of the mantle so will need to cut 45s. I plan to do each 45 deg cut in two passes (due to 7¡±+ thickness) with material on one side of the xcut fence and then flipped and placed on the other side of the xcut fence. I have not done this so far.
Finally i can plough a recess on the back side on all 3 pieces for mounting purpose and process a piece of wood that fits perfectly in the recess. With this piece mounted on the wall the mantle can be pushed on it and screwed from bottom. I can easily plough about 3¡± deep. Is that deep enough for a 11¡± deep mantle?
I know there are many mounting options out there but would like to find out if what i described would work?
Imran
|
David P. Best
imran
Tad Gallistel
Joe Jensen