Thanks all and a very Merry Christmas from the Rushes. Hope you find that much wanted Fairlane part under your tree. Jay
On Fri, Dec 25, 2020, 8:25 AM Dave Buchanan via <nytrkrdave= [email protected]> wrote: Merry Christmas to everyone. And stay safe! Dave Buchanan
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Merry Christmas to everyone. And stay safe! Dave Buchanan
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Thanks Dave,
Right back at ya and everyone else out there. --
============================================================
I am Linc..... What more could you possibly need to know?
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toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
On Fri, 2020-12-25 at 09:52 +0000, D. Hadley via groups.io wrote: Wishing you all a Very Merry Christmas & a Happy New Year.
David from WNY
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Wishing you all a Very Merry Christmas & a Happy New Year.
David from WNY
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Re: Midland & Bendix Brake Booster Check Valves pics & size.
Those #s look decent enough to give you adequate braking added to your new check valve that isn't leaking down.
I will caution you that IF that master cylinder rod is too long it will cause the brakes to apply & stay applied.
How is it operating now after the rod adjustment & final bleed of the system?
David from WNY
On Sunday, December 20, 2020, 11:33:34 PM EST, LLLLllllloooyyydd via groups.io <heintz58@...> wrote:
Gary, ? Based on the information I have gathered through the years, and the specs David provided for your cam, the vacuum readings you provided indicate you have a very healthy (physically tightly sealed) engine..? It suggests that there are only minute, if any leaks in the rings, valve guides, valve seats, intake and head gaskets, vacuum fittings and vacuum lines.? It also indicates the cam was installed properly for your components and does not have excessive overlap and that you are most likely somewhere below 800 feet in elevation. ? I believe I read that a fresh engine with a very mild?cam?(like grandma's car) might see vacuum at the manifold in park in the 20 to 22 inches of vacuum range.? It is most important to know what your vacuum numbers are when tuning the carburetor as the power valve that controls addition fuel when you step on it opens when the vacuum drops below a certain level.? I believe the factory Holley carbs came with a 6.5 inch power valve which Holley recommends being at just under half of your idle vacuum in gear.? If this reading would be, for example, at or below 6.5 inches the power valve would activate causing a rich idle.? ? The good response in vacuum readings you get when stepping on it then letting off indicates a good, quick recovery of vacuum and supports the overall indication that the engine is sealed nicely.? The sudden and complete drop in vacuum when you floor it is perfectly normal as you just opened up two (or four) large holes in the vacuum system. ? I had a 222/228 hydraulic roller cam with 110 LSA in my engine on its first rebuild since I bought they car and after breaking it in on the dyno I could get only 10 inches of vacuum at idle in park and it dropped to 5.5 inches at idle in gear.? The increased overlap being ground with a 110 LSA contributed to a slightly lower vacuum reading than you have as well as being in the Mile High City but the result was poor idle and a carb that barely responded to mixture screw adjustments because the vacuum signal it needs to function properly and atomize the fuel was so poor.? Several tests and a complete tear down showed leaking rings, leaking valve seats, and black soot on several spark plugs indicating poorly sealing valve guides and possibly an intake gasket leak.? ? If not for the poor vacuum readings I may not have pursued deeper inspection and possibly catastrophic engine failure on a fresh rebuild.? Ironically the engine made 420 Hp and 480 ft lbs torque on the dyno with factory CJ heads, factory Holley carb and factory CJ exhaust manifolds so the numbers did not reflect the issues hiding inside. ? I am thrilled to hear you getting such good vacuum with that cam.? It gives me a good reference for the next round with my build. ? Did you install this cam in your engine since you bought the car? ? LLlllllllllllooooyyyddd?? ? In a message dated 12/18/2020 2:43:16 PM Central Standard Time, gary.wittman@... writes: ?
David,
After I got the new master cylinder bench bled and back on the car, I heeded your advice and hooked up a vacuum gauge to the ram air vacuum line. I don't know what the numbers mean but they seem to be pretty good except at idle in gear. At idle in neutral it shows 17-18 depending on the idle speed. When I put it in gear, it drops to 11-12. Cruising at around 45 mph it is about 18. When I stomp on it, it pretty much goes to zero. It is below any numbers on the gauge anyway. When I let up on it from 45 mph, it goes up to 20. I didn't go any faster because I had not done a final brake system bleed yet. The brakes were working fine put I didn't want to push it too hard,
When parked and quickly revved up and down, it drops to zero and jumps to around 25 or higher when I let off.
I checked the push rod adjustment between the power booster and master cylinder because sometime it felt like the brake pedal was bottoming out and not working any better when I stepped on it harder. I discovered the push rod was too short by about 0.060-0.070". I adjusted it to spec and applied a little Loctite. I hope it improves that issue.
Gary in SoCal On Tuesday, December 15, 2020, 04:09:21 PM PST, D. Hadley via groups.io <dhadley390@...> wrote: ? ? No problem Gary. The way I was seeing it is the way each motor sees their respective cams in respect to size & how radical they are would sort of cancel out & be abt the same in respect of vacuum brake operation & wouldn't think you would have much if any issues with your brakes from a vacuum standpoint.
Power wise is another matter as you have abt a 38 CID advantage (give or take a little depending on how much overbore each is vs the other), let alone not knowing what go fast goodies you have your motor topped with or compression.
By chance have you tried putting a vacuum gauge on your motor to see how much vacuum it is pulling at idle, under normal driving & when you mash the go petal? IF not, you might want to, then post the #s here & save the #s info you read/get under each condition in your engine build folder (and for future reference if you run into a problem down the road so to speak you then have something to base it on).
I did this years ago (duct taped a vacuum gauge to the windshield) & don't remember what mine did, but as I don't have any vacuum related issues (vacuum advance on dist, brakes, trany shifting {C6} or carb it isn't a big deal.
David from WNY
On Thursday, December 10, 2020, 06:15:48 PM EST, Gary Wittman via groups.io <gary.wittman@...> wrote: ? ? ? ? David,? Thanks for adding a little smile to my day.? ? ?Gary in SoCal ? ? On ?Thursday?, ?December? ?10?, ?2020? ?01?:?23?:?22? ?AM? ?PST, D. Hadley via groups.io <dhadley390@...> wrote: ? ? I am running a Comp Cams XE262H # 33-238-4 (Note: Comp's cam specs are based on 1.73 ratio rockers. I have the 1.76 ratio rockers so you need to recalculate to the larger #s by multiplying 1.76 by the cam lobe lift to get the correct valve lift #s) cam in my S code 390 (with 10.75:1 compression also a touch hotter than stock) that is also a step over the factory GT cam (same cam used in the 428CJ/SCJ) & is only a touch smaller than Gary's. BUT with my motor being smaller it makes the cam look bigger & his motor being bigger makes his cam look smaller so this I would figure just about equals them & I have NO issues with brakes & I wouldn't think he would have much issues if any with his.
The link to my cam specs
If I am correct, below is a link to the specs of Gary's cam
David from WNY On Wednesday, December 9, 2020, 11:49:01 AM EST, Gary Wittman via groups.io <gary.wittman@...> wrote: ? ? Linc, I would not say it has great brakes but they are pretty good.? The cam is decent one.? It is a Crower 280HDP which is slightly more cam than a stock 428CJ cam.? It is a very streetable cam and has a very slight lope at idle.? Once fully warmed up, the lope is only detectable when the C6 is in gear. ? I know your comment was tongue in cheek, I thought I would give you the specifics anyway.? ? Gary in SoCal ?
|
Re: Midland & Bendix Brake Booster Check Valves pics & size.
Lloyd, I live just under 800 ft above sea level. I live on a mesa which overlooks the ocean, which the city name Costa Mesa suggests. When I bought my Cobra in 2005, I removed the heads to make sure everything looked good in the top end. The valves looked good but I had a valve job done anyway. The guides did not require replacement. All top end gaskets were replaced of course.
I did not rebuild the bottom end because it sounded good and had very good oil pressure. The previous owner gave me the receipt for the rebuild with all the details of what was done. That is how I know what cam it has.
It had a Holley 650 double pumper on it when I bought it. I wanted to go back to the factory 735 Holley but they were not easy to find at a reasonable price. It ran okay with the double pumper but when I switched from 225x60-15 tires to 275x60-15 tires on the rear, the double pumper bogged down if I stomped on it too quick. Fortunately, I found a 735 Holley about that time at a reasonable price but was in serious need of a rebuild. It had the correct numbers for a 428 CJ Fairlane with C6, but the front bowl was not correct. I did a lot of research about rebuilding and put everything back to stock. I did bump up the jets a couple sizes at the advice of someone that knows these carburetors well. I understand the modern fuels are different than the fuels back then and I live a near sea level, so it needed more fuel. It worked out very well. The old double pumper was rich at idle and would burn my eyes. The correct 735 Holley is good at idle once warmed up but a little rich when cold.
I did use a 6.5 power valve which may contribute to the richness at idle when cold but the choke probably is the main culprit. That engine likes a lot of fuel when cold. Well, it likes a lot of fuel anytime, but more so when cold.
Thanks for the feedback on the vacuum readings. That helps me to understand more about vacuum diagnostics.
A lot of old timers that work with these engines like the Comp cams over the Crower cams. However, I have been happy with mine and have no complaints. It is not near an all out race cam but provides very good power and is very street friendly.
Gary in SoCal On Sunday, December 20, 2020, 08:33:34 PM PST, LLLLllllloooyyydd via groups.io <heintz58@...> wrote:
Gary, ? Based on the information I have gathered through the years, and the specs David provided for your cam, the vacuum readings you provided indicate you have a very healthy (physically tightly sealed) engine..? It suggests that there are only minute, if any leaks in the rings, valve guides, valve seats, intake and head gaskets, vacuum fittings and vacuum lines.? It also indicates the cam was installed properly for your components and does not have excessive overlap and that you are most likely somewhere below 800 feet in elevation. ? I believe I read that a fresh engine with a very mild?cam?(like grandma's car) might see vacuum at the manifold in park in the 20 to 22 inches of vacuum range.? It is most important to know what your vacuum numbers are when tuning the carburetor as the power valve that controls addition fuel when you step on it opens when the vacuum drops below a certain level.? I believe the factory Holley carbs came with a 6.5 inch power valve which Holley recommends being at just under half of your idle vacuum in gear.? If this reading would be, for example, at or below 6.5 inches the power valve would activate causing a rich idle.? ? The good response in vacuum readings you get when stepping on it then letting off indicates a good, quick recovery of vacuum and supports the overall indication that the engine is sealed nicely.? The sudden and complete drop in vacuum when you floor it is perfectly normal as you just opened up two (or four) large holes in the vacuum system. ? I had a 222/228 hydraulic roller cam with 110 LSA in my engine on its first rebuild since I bought they car and after breaking it in on the dyno I could get only 10 inches of vacuum at idle in park and it dropped to 5.5 inches at idle in gear.? The increased overlap being ground with a 110 LSA contributed to a slightly lower vacuum reading than you have as well as being in the Mile High City but the result was poor idle and a carb that barely responded to mixture screw adjustments because the vacuum signal it needs to function properly and atomize the fuel was so poor.? Several tests and a complete tear down showed leaking rings, leaking valve seats, and black soot on several spark plugs indicating poorly sealing valve guides and possibly an intake gasket leak.? ? If not for the poor vacuum readings I may not have pursued deeper inspection and possibly catastrophic engine failure on a fresh rebuild.? Ironically the engine made 420 Hp and 480 ft lbs torque on the dyno with factory CJ heads, factory Holley carb and factory CJ exhaust manifolds so the numbers did not reflect the issues hiding inside. ? I am thrilled to hear you getting such good vacuum with that cam.? It gives me a good reference for the next round with my build. ? Did you install this cam in your engine since you bought the car? ? LLlllllllllllooooyyyddd?? ? In a message dated 12/18/2020 2:43:16 PM Central Standard Time, gary.wittman@... writes: ?
David,
After I got the new master cylinder bench bled and back on the car, I heeded your advice and hooked up a vacuum gauge to the ram air vacuum line. I don't know what the numbers mean but they seem to be pretty good except at idle in gear. At idle in neutral it shows 17-18 depending on the idle speed. When I put it in gear, it drops to 11-12. Cruising at around 45 mph it is about 18. When I stomp on it, it pretty much goes to zero. It is below any numbers on the gauge anyway. When I let up on it from 45 mph, it goes up to 20. I didn't go any faster because I had not done a final brake system bleed yet. The brakes were working fine put I didn't want to push it too hard,
When parked and quickly revved up and down, it drops to zero and jumps to around 25 or higher when I let off.
I checked the push rod adjustment between the power booster and master cylinder because sometime it felt like the brake pedal was bottoming out and not working any better when I stepped on it harder. I discovered the push rod was too short by about 0.060-0.070". I adjusted it to spec and applied a little Loctite. I hope it improves that issue.
Gary in SoCal On Tuesday, December 15, 2020, 04:09:21 PM PST, D. Hadley via groups.io <dhadley390@...> wrote: ? ? No problem Gary. The way I was seeing it is the way each motor sees their respective cams in respect to size & how radical they are would sort of cancel out & be abt the same in respect of vacuum brake operation & wouldn't think you would have much if any issues with your brakes from a vacuum standpoint.
Power wise is another matter as you have abt a 38 CID advantage (give or take a little depending on how much overbore each is vs the other), let alone not knowing what go fast goodies you have your motor topped with or compression.
By chance have you tried putting a vacuum gauge on your motor to see how much vacuum it is pulling at idle, under normal driving & when you mash the go petal? IF not, you might want to, then post the #s here & save the #s info you read/get under each condition in your engine build folder (and for future reference if you run into a problem down the road so to speak you then have something to base it on).
I did this years ago (duct taped a vacuum gauge to the windshield) & don't remember what mine did, but as I don't have any vacuum related issues (vacuum advance on dist, brakes, trany shifting {C6} or carb it isn't a big deal.
David from WNY
On Thursday, December 10, 2020, 06:15:48 PM EST, Gary Wittman via groups.io <gary.wittman@...> wrote: ? ? ? ? David,? Thanks for adding a little smile to my day.? ? ?Gary in SoCal ? ? On ?Thursday?, ?December? ?10?, ?2020? ?01?:?23?:?22? ?AM? ?PST, D. Hadley via groups.io <dhadley390@...> wrote: ? ? I am running a Comp Cams XE262H # 33-238-4 (Note: Comp's cam specs are based on 1.73 ratio rockers. I have the 1.76 ratio rockers so you need to recalculate to the larger #s by multiplying 1.76 by the cam lobe lift to get the correct valve lift #s) cam in my S code 390 (with 10.75:1 compression also a touch hotter than stock) that is also a step over the factory GT cam (same cam used in the 428CJ/SCJ) & is only a touch smaller than Gary's. BUT with my motor being smaller it makes the cam look bigger & his motor being bigger makes his cam look smaller so this I would figure just about equals them & I have NO issues with brakes & I wouldn't think he would have much issues if any with his.
The link to my cam specs
If I am correct, below is a link to the specs of Gary's cam
David from WNY On Wednesday, December 9, 2020, 11:49:01 AM EST, Gary Wittman via groups.io <gary.wittman@...> wrote: ? ? Linc, I would not say it has great brakes but they are pretty good.? The cam is decent one.? It is a Crower 280HDP which is slightly more cam than a stock 428CJ cam.? It is a very streetable cam and has a very slight lope at idle.? Once fully warmed up, the lope is only detectable when the C6 is in gear. ? I know your comment was tongue in cheek, I thought I would give you the specifics anyway.? ? Gary in SoCal ?
|
Re: Midland & Bendix Brake Booster Check Valves pics & size.
Gary,
?
Based on the information I have gathered through the years, and the specs David provided for your cam, the vacuum readings you provided indicate you have a very healthy (physically tightly sealed) engine..? It suggests that there are only minute, if any leaks in the rings, valve guides, valve seats, intake and head gaskets, vacuum fittings and vacuum lines.? It also indicates the cam was installed properly for your components and does not have excessive overlap and that you are most likely somewhere below 800 feet in elevation.
?
I believe I read that a fresh engine with a very mild?cam?(like grandma's car) might see vacuum at the manifold in park in the 20 to 22 inches of vacuum range.? It is most important to know what your vacuum numbers are when tuning the carburetor as the power valve that controls addition fuel when you step on it opens when the vacuum drops below a certain level.? I believe the factory Holley carbs came with a 6.5 inch power valve which Holley recommends being at just under half of your idle vacuum in gear.? If this reading would be, for example, at or below 6.5 inches the power valve would activate causing a rich idle.?
?
The good response in vacuum readings you get when stepping on it then letting off indicates a good, quick recovery of vacuum and supports the overall indication that the engine is sealed nicely.? The sudden and complete drop in vacuum when you floor it is perfectly normal as you just opened up two (or four) large holes in the vacuum system.
?
I had a 222/228 hydraulic roller cam with 110 LSA in my engine on its first rebuild since I bought they car and after breaking it in on the dyno I could get only 10 inches of vacuum at idle in park and it dropped to 5.5 inches at idle in gear.? The increased overlap being ground with a 110 LSA contributed to a slightly lower vacuum reading than you have as well as being in the Mile High City but the result was poor idle and a carb that barely responded to mixture screw adjustments because the vacuum signal it needs to function properly and atomize the fuel was so poor.? Several tests and a complete tear down showed leaking rings, leaking valve seats, and black soot on several spark plugs indicating poorly sealing valve guides and possibly an intake gasket leak.?
?
If not for the poor vacuum readings I may not have pursued deeper inspection and possibly catastrophic engine failure on a fresh rebuild.? Ironically the engine made 420 Hp and 480 ft lbs torque on the dyno with factory CJ heads, factory Holley carb and factory CJ exhaust manifolds so the numbers did not reflect the issues hiding inside.
?
I am thrilled to hear you getting such good vacuum with that cam.? It gives me a good reference for the next round with my build.
?
Did you install this cam in your engine since you bought the car?
?
LLlllllllllllooooyyyddd??
?
In a message dated 12/18/2020 2:43:16 PM Central Standard Time, gary.wittman@... writes:
?
David,
After I got the new master cylinder bench bled and back on the car, I heeded your advice and hooked up a vacuum gauge to the ram air vacuum line. I don't know what the numbers mean but they seem to be pretty good except at idle in gear. At idle in neutral it shows 17-18 depending on the idle speed. When I put it in gear, it drops to 11-12. Cruising at around 45 mph it is about 18. When I stomp on it, it pretty much goes to zero. It is below any numbers on the gauge anyway. When I let up on it from 45 mph, it goes up to 20. I didn't go any faster because I had not done a final brake system bleed yet. The brakes were working fine put I didn't want to push it too hard,
When parked and quickly revved up and down, it drops to zero and jumps to around 25 or higher when I let off.
I checked the push rod adjustment between the power booster and master cylinder because sometime it felt like the brake pedal was bottoming out and not working any better when I stepped on it harder. I discovered the push rod was too short by about 0.060-0.070". I adjusted it to spec and applied a little Loctite. I hope it improves that issue.
Gary in SoCal
On Tuesday, December 15, 2020, 04:09:21 PM PST, D. Hadley via groups.io <dhadley390@...> wrote:
?
?
No problem Gary. The way I was seeing it is the way each motor sees their respective cams in respect to size & how radical they are would sort of cancel out & be abt the same in respect of vacuum brake operation & wouldn't think you would have much if any issues with your brakes from a vacuum standpoint.
Power wise is another matter as you have abt a 38 CID advantage (give or take a little depending on how much overbore each is vs the other), let alone not knowing what go fast goodies you have your motor topped with or compression.
By chance have you tried putting a vacuum gauge on your motor to see how much vacuum it is pulling at idle, under normal driving & when you mash the go petal? IF not, you might want to, then post the #s here & save the #s info you read/get under each condition in your engine build folder (and for future reference if you run into a problem down the road so to speak you then have something to base it on).
I did this years ago (duct taped a vacuum gauge to the windshield) & don't remember what mine did, but as I don't have any vacuum related issues (vacuum advance on dist, brakes, trany shifting {C6} or carb it isn't a big deal.
David from WNY
On Thursday, December 10, 2020, 06:15:48 PM EST, Gary Wittman via groups.io <gary.wittman@...> wrote:
?
?
?
?
David,? Thanks for adding a little smile to my day.?
?
?Gary in SoCal
?
?
On ?Thursday?, ?December? ?10?, ?2020? ?01?:?23?:?22? ?AM? ?PST, D. Hadley via groups.io <dhadley390@...> wrote:
?
?
I am running a Comp Cams XE262H # 33-238-4 (Note: Comp's cam specs are based on 1.73 ratio rockers. I have the 1.76 ratio rockers so you need to recalculate to the larger #s by multiplying 1.76 by the cam lobe lift to get the correct valve lift #s) cam in my S code 390 (with 10.75:1 compression also a touch hotter than stock) that is also a step over the factory GT cam (same cam used in the 428CJ/SCJ) & is only a touch smaller than Gary's. BUT with my motor being smaller it makes the cam look bigger & his motor being bigger makes his cam look smaller so this I would figure just about equals them & I have NO issues with brakes & I wouldn't think he would have much issues if any with his.
The link to my cam specs
If I am correct, below is a link to the specs of Gary's cam
David from WNY
On Wednesday, December 9, 2020, 11:49:01 AM EST, Gary Wittman via groups.io <gary.wittman@...> wrote:
?
?
Linc, I would not say it has great brakes but they are pretty good.? The cam is decent one.? It is a Crower 280HDP which is slightly more cam than a stock 428CJ cam.? It is a very streetable cam and has a very slight lope at idle.? Once fully warmed up, the lope is only detectable when the C6 is in gear.
?
I know your comment was tongue in cheek, I thought I would give you the specifics anyway.?
?
Gary in SoCal
?
|
Re: Midland & Bendix Brake Booster Check Valves pics & size.
David,
After I got the new master cylinder bench bled and back on the car, I heeded your advice and hooked up a vacuum gauge to the ram air vacuum line. I don't know what the numbers mean but they seem to be pretty good except at idle in gear. At idle in neutral it shows 17-18 depending on the idle speed. When I put it in gear, it drops to 11-12. Cruising at around 45 mph it is about 18. When I stomp on it, it pretty much goes to zero. It is below any numbers on the gauge anyway. When I let up on it from 45 mph, it goes up to 20. I didn't go any faster because I had not done a final brake system bleed yet. The brakes were working fine put I didn't want to push it too hard,
When parked and quickly revved up and down, it drops to zero and jumps to around 25 or higher when I let off.
I checked the push rod adjustment between the power booster and master cylinder because sometime it felt like the brake pedal was bottoming out and not working any better when I stepped on it harder. I discovered the push rod was too short by about 0.060-0.070". I adjusted it to spec and applied a little Loctite. I hope it improves that issue.
Gary in SoCal On Tuesday, December 15, 2020, 04:09:21 PM PST, D. Hadley via groups.io <dhadley390@...> wrote:
No problem Gary. The way I was seeing it is the way each motor sees their respective cams in respect to size & how radical they are would sort of cancel out & be abt the same in respect of vacuum brake operation & wouldn't think you would have much if any issues with your brakes from a vacuum standpoint.
Power wise is another matter as you have abt a 38 CID advantage (give or take a little depending on how much overbore each is vs the other), let alone not knowing what go fast goodies you have your motor topped with or compression.
By chance have you tried putting a vacuum gauge on your motor to see how much vacuum it is pulling at idle, under normal driving & when you mash the go petal? IF not, you might want to, then post the #s here & save the #s info you read/get under each condition in your engine build folder (and for future reference if you run into a problem down the road so to speak you then have something to base it on).
I did this years ago (duct taped a vacuum gauge to the windshield) & don't remember what mine did, but as I don't have any vacuum related issues (vacuum advance on dist, brakes, trany shifting {C6} or carb it isn't a big deal.
David from WNY
On Thursday, December 10, 2020, 06:15:48 PM EST, Gary Wittman via groups.io <gary.wittman@...> wrote:
David,? Thanks for adding a little smile to my day.?
?Gary in SoCal
On ?Thursday?, ?December? ?10?, ?2020? ?01?:?23?:?22? ?AM? ?PST, D. Hadley via groups.io <dhadley390@...> wrote:
I am running a Comp Cams XE262H # 33-238-4 (Note: Comp's cam specs are based on 1.73 ratio rockers. I have the 1.76 ratio rockers so you need to recalculate to the larger #s by multiplying 1.76 by the cam lobe lift to get the correct valve lift #s) cam in my S code 390 (with 10.75:1 compression also a touch hotter than stock) that is also a step over the factory GT cam (same cam used in the 428CJ/SCJ) & is only a touch smaller than Gary's. BUT with my motor being smaller it makes the cam look bigger & his motor being bigger makes his cam look smaller so this I would figure just about equals them & I have NO issues with brakes & I wouldn't think he would have much issues if any with his.
The link to my cam specs
https://www.compcams.com/xtreme-energy-218-224-hydraulic-flat-cam-for-ford-352-428.html
If I am correct, below is a link to the specs of Gary's cam
https://www.crower.com/camshafts/ford-332-428-compu-pro-hydraulic-cam-280-hdp.html
David from WNY
On Wednesday, December 9, 2020, 11:49:01 AM EST, Gary Wittman via groups.io <gary.wittman@...> wrote:
Linc, I would not say it has great brakes but they are pretty good.? The cam is decent one.? It is a Crower 280HDP which is slightly more cam than a stock 428CJ cam.? It is a very streetable cam and has a very slight lope at idle.? Once fully warmed up, the lope is only detectable when the C6 is in gear.
I know your comment was tongue in cheek, I thought I would give you the specifics anyway.?
Gary in SoCal
|
Re: Happy Thanksgiving and one quick question (Turn Signal Cancle Cam)
Bob
Thanks for the update.
Would you please email pics of it all while you have it apart. Also please tell us what size & type the screws are so IF/When someone else runs into this issue they can maybe hit a hardware store to get correct size replacements. Thanks.
David from WNY
On Saturday, December 12, 2020, 10:22:32 AM EST, Bob Duncan via groups.io <breathe_ezr@...> wrote:
Hello,
Update for all. The screws seem to fit.? I also bought a new steering wheel, but the horn assembly is a bit sticky, so I have to take a file to the new wheel slots it before I button everything back up.? I might just unscrew the old base (where the contacts are) and re-use them in the new wheel, but I'm not sure how good they were.
Bob in PA.
On Monday, November 30, 2020, 10:31:44 PM EST, D. Hadley via groups.io <dhadley390@...> wrote:
Thanks for the update.
The cancel cam as far as I know is the same between the cars/trucks of that vintage so it would stand to reason the hardware would/could be the same. That thread looks to be sheet metal type & that funky shoulder on the screw head I am thinking is to center in the cam mounting holes.
When do you expect to have them?
Please keep us updated.
David from WNY
On Sunday, November 29, 2020, 09:39:48 PM EST, Bob Duncan via groups.io <breathe_ezr@...> wrote:
I checked using drill bits and the hole was between .141" and .156",which puts it at a #8 or #10.? I have an absolute ton of #8-32 screws, and I think the size is right.? but the thread pitch is off. I did find this which is an odd thread.? So, for the $10 bucks for the 3 I'll just buy them.? I'm sure Cougar and Fairlane are close enough. 
|
Re: This engine is on my 72 Ltd squire. It is an n code 429 car.
Dave,
As Linc said. On the FE it is on a centered (on the cylinder bank) raised pad just below the drivers side deck surface on the back of the block (see attached pic of document I made & my pic 100_8393). I imagine it would be in a similar location on the 385 series engines.
On the C4 it is on top on a big side bosses on the left side of the case just in front of the tail shaft housing mounting bosses (see attach pic 100_4724 of the C4 out of my early build 68 Fairlane 500 4 door on the cleaned off boss).
On the C6 it is also on top, BUT it is on a centered pad just forward of where the tail shaft housing mounts. (see attached pic of document I made & the pic 100_8393 showing exact location of the partial vin on my '68 S code 390 from my Torino GT vert).
The '68 & up 289 & 302 are the easiest to read on the classic cars & at most just need a cloth/towel & maybe some cleaner to remove dirt/grease/grime, maybe a light & maybe removing the air cleaner assembly giving better access.
On the Big Blocks. I know the FE is a ROYAL PAIN to read it while the engine is still in the car (and I imagine it will be the same in your case with the 429/460). I took a rag with some cleaner on it & cleaned the back of the block surface & with a good flashlight & mirror while just about laying on top of the engine compartment at various angles I managed to find & read mine. It was & is NOT easy, but it is doable. Though it will be a touch easier when you know exactly where to look.
I don't know where others are stamped with partial vins.
Note: pics & doc can only be reused with & if/when my permission is given ONLY & used/uploaded here for reference only for this email question being answered only.
Hope this helps.
David from WNY
On Saturday, December 12, 2020, 10:18:41 AM EST, Linc <linc@...> wrote:
So when you are looking, you want to find a machined surface, that is where it will be. Example: on small blocks it is on top directly behind the intake. On the 429 it is usually on the back side of the block right below the head.
--
============================================================ I am Linc..... What more could you possibly need to know?============================================================
On Sat, 2020-12-12 at 14:27 +0000, Dave Buchanan via groups.io wrote: I looked everywhere that I could see. I heard that ots on the back of the block too but can't find it even with a mirror. But now that I'm changing the starter. I found this. It's not urgent, just curious in case I ever sell it.
On Sat, Dec 12, 2020 at 8:57 AM, Linc <linc@...> wrote: Find the partial VIN that WILL be stamped on the block. Then you will have your answer. --
============================================================ I am Linc..... What more could you possibly need to know?============================================================
On Sat, 2020-12-12 at 06:48 +0000, Dave Buchanan via groups.io wrote: Being a 72, It could be the original engine. When I bought the car the guy that I bought it from said he didn't know. But I am the third owner and the engine was definitely rebuilt at some time real recent to when I bought it. These numbers were behind the starter.
On Fri, Dec 11, 2020 at 9:58 PM, Peter Mahaits <Astro@...> wrote: Hard to tell but if the first two digits are D1, then it's a 71 part number. Pete from the Loops . On 2020-12-11 6:31 p.m., Dave Buchanan via groups.io wrote:
Can anyone verify it to be original? On Fri, Dec 11, 2020 at 8:30 PM, Dave Buchanan via groups.io
|
Re: One repair leads to another.
On mine after I got the car painted I ended up trying to find the build sheet which led me to pulling out the carpet & finding lots of pin holes in the floor which I decided to get the whole floor replaced. I then ended up pulling the motor, rebuilding that & doing a bunch of other things. It does have a tendency to snowball when you start to dig into some things. Just be warned, LOL.
As for the booster, that is the great thing about the banded Midland boosters, they are easily taken apart with basic tools.
As for your master cylinder. I suggest that IF you have to get a new one, DON'T give them your original (as there is a VERY good chance that the "replacement" WON'T MATCH/LOOK the same & a very good chance that it won't accept the proper Ford cap/cover & only be fitted with a GM cover). I saved my original & got lucky years ago when I bought a replacement from Car Quest that it 100% matched the original master cylinder and DIDN'T have a big brass line adapter on the bottom port. BUT eventually the Car Quest one started leaking & I went to get it replaced and found out it ONLY had a 1yr warranty & was much more expensive than the one I got form Auto Zone plus the Auto Zone one has a Lifetime Warranty. The down side to the Auto Zone one is though the main master cylinder matched the original it had that brass adapter on it (I suspect this adapter was needed due to repairs done to the casting or due to this same body booster was used in another application that used a larger line fitting originally vs what our cars used. Sooo what I did is I gutted the Auto Zone Lifetime Warranty one & put the NEW parts in the Car Quest master cylinder that DIDN'T have the adapter. I also did a quick hone on the Car Quest unit to give the new seals a good surface to seal against.
So IF you can't get a rebuild kit & feel you need to "replace" it, I suggest you keep your current one & go out & buy a New one from say Auto Zone that has a "Lifetime Warranty" & then IF it uses an adapter you could do what I did & rob the New parts/seals out of it & put them in the master cylinder that is a 100% match to the original & doesn't need/use that brass adapter. Then put the old parts back into the Lifetime Warranty master cylinder, When the one on your car fails again just return the Lifetime Warranty one that you had put the worn parts in & get it replaced & do the same thing. Just a side note make sure you Keep the better piston/plunger IF all else matches between the original & the new one when swapping parts/seals.
David from WNY.
On Friday, December 11, 2020, 03:50:31 PM EST, Dave Buchanan via groups.io <nytrkrdave@...> wrote:
Good luck with it. I started on mine wanting to fix a rusty floor and it turned into a major reconstruction deal.?
On Fri, Dec 11, 2020 at 3:23 PM, Gary Wittman via groups.io <gary.wittman@...> wrote: Today is the day to replace the check valve for the master cylinder power booster.? The new part appears to be a perfect fit but is not 100% identical to the?old one overall,?however close.?
Removal of the old check valve did not go as planned.? When I glued the check valve back together so I could drive the car home safely, it bonded to the rubber grommet also.? I could not separate them so I had to remove the check valve and grommet together.??This broke the part of the check valve that goes inside the grommet.? I pretty much expected that.? Unfortunately, as I pulled them out some of the broken check valve fell into the booster.? That meant I had to remove the booster to get the pieces of plastic out.?
To get the booster out, I had to remove the master cylinder.? Once I did that, I discovered it had a small leak into the booster.? I have not taken the master cylinder apart yet to see if I can rebuild it or buy a new one.
I was able to get the plastic pieces out of the booster but realized I needed to open the booster to clean out the brake fluid that had built up in it.? I cleaned it up and it doesn't look like the brake fluid damaged anything.? It appears to have been rebuilt at some time because there was some pitting where brake fluid?had been sitting before?and caused some corrosion when it absorbed moisture from the air.? The was no rust and it appears to have some kind of corrosion resistant finish on it.? So, I know the pitting is not from the brake fluid leak this time.?
Once the booster was out I had good access to the shifter linkage.??The linkage?has always had a little play?in it but was not bad and I just lived with it.? Of course, could not help myself and had to take a closer look at the linkage.? I found one of the connections is worn and I will probably take that apart to see what I can do to repair that.?
I need to stop looking elsewhere or I might have the whole car apart.
Gary in SoCal
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Re: Midland & Bendix Brake Booster Check Valves pics & size.
No problem Gary. The way I was seeing it is the way each motor sees their respective cams in respect to size & how radical they are would sort of cancel out & be abt the same in respect of vacuum brake operation & wouldn't think you would have much if any issues with your brakes from a vacuum standpoint.
Power wise is another matter as you have abt a 38 CID advantage (give or take a little depending on how much overbore each is vs the other), let alone not knowing what go fast goodies you have your motor topped with or compression.
By chance have you tried putting a vacuum gauge on your motor to see how much vacuum it is pulling at idle, under normal driving & when you mash the go petal? IF not, you might want to, then post the #s here & save the #s info you read/get under each condition in your engine build folder (and for future reference if you run into a problem down the road so to speak you then have something to base it on).
I did this years ago (duct taped a vacuum gauge to the windshield) & don't remember what mine did, but as I don't have any vacuum related issues (vacuum advance on dist, brakes, trany shifting {C6} or carb it isn't a big deal.
David from WNY
On Thursday, December 10, 2020, 06:15:48 PM EST, Gary Wittman via groups.io <gary.wittman@...> wrote:
David,? Thanks for adding a little smile to my day.?
?Gary in SoCal
On ?Thursday?, ?December? ?10?, ?2020? ?01?:?23?:?22? ?AM? ?PST, D. Hadley via groups.io <dhadley390@...> wrote:
I am running a Comp Cams XE262H # 33-238-4 (Note: Comp's cam specs are based on 1.73 ratio rockers. I have the 1.76 ratio rockers so you need to recalculate to the larger #s by multiplying 1.76 by the cam lobe lift to get the correct valve lift #s) cam in my S code 390 (with 10.75:1 compression also a touch hotter than stock) that is also a step over the factory GT cam (same cam used in the 428CJ/SCJ) & is only a touch smaller than Gary's. BUT with my motor being smaller it makes the cam look bigger & his motor being bigger makes his cam look smaller so this I would figure just about equals them & I have NO issues with brakes & I wouldn't think he would have much issues if any with his.
The link to my cam specs
https://www.compcams.com/xtreme-energy-218-224-hydraulic-flat-cam-for-ford-352-428.html
If I am correct, below is a link to the specs of Gary's cam
https://www.crower.com/camshafts/ford-332-428-compu-pro-hydraulic-cam-280-hdp.html
David from WNY
On Wednesday, December 9, 2020, 11:49:01 AM EST, Gary Wittman via groups.io <gary.wittman@...> wrote:
Linc, I would not say it has great brakes but they are pretty good.? The cam is decent one.? It is a Crower 280HDP which is slightly more cam than a stock 428CJ cam.? It is a very streetable cam and has a very slight lope at idle.? Once fully warmed up, the lope is only detectable when the C6 is in gear.
I know your comment was tongue in cheek, I thought I would give you the specifics anyway.?
Gary in SoCal
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Re: Happy Thanksgiving and one quick question (Turn Signal Cancle Cam)
Hello,
Update for all. The screws seem to fit.? I also bought a new steering wheel, but the horn assembly is a bit sticky, so I have to take a file to the new wheel slots it before I button everything back up.? I might just unscrew the old base (where the contacts are) and re-use them in the new wheel, but I'm not sure how good they were.
Bob in PA.
On Monday, November 30, 2020, 10:31:44 PM EST, D. Hadley via groups.io <dhadley390@...> wrote:
Thanks for the update.
The cancel cam as far as I know is the same between the cars/trucks of that vintage so it would stand to reason the hardware would/could be the same. That thread looks to be sheet metal type & that funky shoulder on the screw head I am thinking is to center in the cam mounting holes.
When do you expect to have them?
Please keep us updated.
David from WNY
On Sunday, November 29, 2020, 09:39:48 PM EST, Bob Duncan via groups.io <breathe_ezr@...> wrote:
I checked using drill bits and the hole was between .141" and .156",which puts it at a #8 or #10.? I have an absolute ton of #8-32 screws, and I think the size is right.? but the thread pitch is off. I did find this which is an odd thread.? So, for the $10 bucks for the 3 I'll just buy them.? I'm sure Cougar and Fairlane are close enough. 
|
Re: This engine is on my 72 Ltd squire. It is an n code 429 car.
So when you are looking, you want to find a machined surface, that is where it will be. Example: on small blocks it is on top directly behind the intake. On the 429 it is usually on the back side of the block right below the head.
--
============================================================
I am Linc..... What more could you possibly need to know?
============================================================
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
On Sat, 2020-12-12 at 14:27 +0000, Dave Buchanan via groups.io wrote: I looked everywhere that I could see. I heard that ots on the back of the block too but can't find it even with a mirror. But now that I'm changing the starter. I found this. It's not urgent, just curious in case I ever sell it.
On Sat, Dec 12, 2020 at 8:57 AM, Linc <linc@...> wrote: Find the partial VIN that WILL be stamped on the block. Then you will have your answer. --
============================================================
I am Linc..... What more could you possibly need to know?
============================================================
On Sat, 2020-12-12 at 06:48 +0000, Dave Buchanan via groups.io wrote: Being a 72, It could be the original engine. When I bought the car the guy that I bought it from said he didn't know. But I am the third owner and the engine was definitely rebuilt at some time real recent to when I bought it. These numbers were behind the starter.
On Fri, Dec 11, 2020 at 9:58 PM, Peter Mahaits <Astro@...> wrote:
Hard to tell but if the first two digits are D1, then it's a 71 part
number.
Pete from the Loops
.
On 2020-12-11 6:31 p.m., Dave Buchanan
via groups.io wrote:
Can anyone verify it to be original?
On Fri, Dec 11, 2020 at 8:30 PM, Dave Buchanan via
groups.io
|
Re: This engine is on my 72 Ltd squire. It is an n code 429 car.
I looked everywhere that I could see. I heard that ots on the back of the block too but can't find it even with a mirror. But now that I'm changing the starter. I found this. It's not urgent, just curious in case I ever sell it.
On Sat, Dec 12, 2020 at 8:57 AM, Linc <linc@...> wrote: Find the partial VIN that WILL be stamped on the block. Then you will have your answer. --
============================================================
I am Linc..... What more could you possibly need to know?
============================================================
On Sat, 2020-12-12 at 06:48 +0000, Dave Buchanan via groups.io wrote: Being a 72, It could be the original engine. When I bought the car the guy that I bought it from said he didn't know. But I am the third owner and the engine was definitely rebuilt at some time real recent to when I bought it. These numbers were behind the starter.
On Fri, Dec 11, 2020 at 9:58 PM, Peter Mahaits <Astro@...> wrote:
Hard to tell but if the first two digits are D1, then it's a 71 part
number.
Pete from the Loops
.
On 2020-12-11 6:31 p.m., Dave Buchanan
via groups.io wrote:
Can anyone verify it to be original?
On Fri, Dec 11, 2020 at 8:30 PM, Dave Buchanan via
groups.io
|
Re: This engine is on my 72 Ltd squire. It is an n code 429 car.
Find the partial VIN that WILL be stamped on the block. Then you will have your answer. --
============================================================
I am Linc..... What more could you possibly need to know?
============================================================
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
On Sat, 2020-12-12 at 06:48 +0000, Dave Buchanan via groups.io wrote: Being a 72, It could be the original engine. When I bought the car the guy that I bought it from said he didn't know. But I am the third owner and the engine was definitely rebuilt at some time real recent to when I bought it. These numbers were behind the starter.
On Fri, Dec 11, 2020 at 9:58 PM, Peter Mahaits <Astro@...> wrote:
Hard to tell but if the first two digits are D1, then it's a 71 part
number.
Pete from the Loops
.
On 2020-12-11 6:31 p.m., Dave Buchanan
via groups.io wrote:
Can anyone verify it to be original?
On Fri, Dec 11, 2020 at 8:30 PM, Dave Buchanan via
groups.io
|
Re: This engine is on my 72 Ltd squire. It is an n code 429 car.
Being a 72, It could be the original engine. When I bought the car the guy that I bought it from said he didn't know. But I am the third owner and the engine was definitely rebuilt at some time real recent to when I bought it. These numbers were behind the starter.
On Fri, Dec 11, 2020 at 9:58 PM, Peter Mahaits <Astro@...> wrote:
Hard to tell but if the first two digits are D1, then it's a 71 part
number.
Pete from the Loops
.
On 2020-12-11 6:31 p.m., Dave Buchanan
via groups.io wrote:
Can anyone verify it to be original?
On Fri, Dec 11, 2020 at 8:30 PM, Dave Buchanan via
groups.io
|
Re: This engine is on my 72 Ltd squire. It is an n code 429 car.
Hard to tell but if the first two digits are D1, then it's a 71 part
number.
Pete from the Loops
.
On 2020-12-11 6:31 p.m., Dave Buchanan
via groups.io wrote:
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
Can anyone verify it to be original?
On Fri, Dec 11, 2020 at 8:30 PM, Dave Buchanan via
groups.io
|
Re: This engine is on my 72 Ltd squire. It is an n code 429 car.
Can anyone verify it to be original?
On Fri, Dec 11, 2020 at 8:30 PM, Dave Buchanan via groups.io <nytrkrdave@...> wrote:
|
This engine is on my 72 Ltd squire. It is an n code 429 car.
|
Linc
LLLLllllloooyyydd
