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I'm using 6 110 watt panels and 2 Victron charge controllers (3 panels wired in series on each) to charge my 3 48V Dakota Lithium batteries with no issues other than the amount of time required.? I think the bigger issue is where you're located.? I'm on Lake Ontario and I'm getting only around 10 - 15% efficiency even on the sunniest days in the summer due to cloud cover and our northern lattitude.
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Do solar panel charge controllers work well with lithium batterys?
Agree that lead acid is stone age…not sure if I agree about non-LiFePo lithium options---I’ve been powering my boat now for maybe 10 years with ex-THINK Enerdel lithium-ion batteries with absolutely no issues. Last purchase of used batteries saw me offering $1200 for 24kwh of lithium --- i.d. about 5cents/watt-hour. The batteries are probably good for 10 more years. Compare that to new lead-acid: Won’t last much more than 7 years and will cost about 15cents/watt-hour. And lead-acid requires maintenance, doesn’t like just sitting there floating for months and just never gives you confidence you’ll have the capacity for that trip you’re about to embark on…. ? ? ? LEAD IS DEAD! LiFePo is an acceptable chemistry for marine applications.? Stay away from anything with cobalt in it and you'll be fine.? I ran lead acid for over 10 years, went through three 48V banks of GC-2 6 Volt golf cart batteries which are some of the most robust lead acid batteries you can get. Recently made the switch to LiFePo and there is no comparison. Lead acid is in the Stone Age compared to lithium and yo can get top quality lithium batteries on Amazon for cheaper than some AGMs now.? On Friday, November 29, 2024 at 10:44:51 PM EST, Dale Shomette via <dashoway@...> wrote: Thanks Luke. I already have both generators and unfortunately bout the 100 watt PVs before I had researched it. I'm still concerned about lifepo battery's as lithium tends to blow up in a potential water environment and management is a bigger deal. I've been using Enersys Odyssey? 1800 PC AGM batteries and after 10 years they're still putting out 12.6 to 12.8 volts. They're less expensive than lifepo4s and easier (as I'm an old guy) to maintain. Your right though, I wish I had invested in eight 300watt PVs. Unfortunately,
I also only have room for 8 motor batteries and the house batteries. I've forgotten the size and pitch of my prop....gotta check that. Thanks
Dale ? On Fri, Nov 29, 2024, 8:03 PM Luke Johnson via <Jukelohnson=[email protected]> wrote: Im no expert but I have a comparable? setup with a catalina 30 with a 48v lifepo4 battery bank.? I get about 30 amps at 4 knots, 60 amps at 5, 90 amps at 6.? Prop is 12" diameter 6" pitch.? Hope that info helps. If it were me I'd get one generator and put the rest of the cash into higher output solar panels and one or more lifepo4 battery banks.? I don't know the size of your panels but 8 x 100 panels seems like low output for the footprint, isn't it? 8 400 watt panels would be nice, and make lots of power if you had a bank big enough to store it.
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Agree that lead acid is stone age…not sure if I agree about non-LiFePo lithium options---I’ve been powering my boat now for maybe 10 years with ex-THINK Enerdel lithium-ion batteries with absolutely no issues. Last purchase of used batteries saw me offering $1200 for 24kwh of lithium --- i.d. about 5cents/watt-hour. The batteries are probably good for 10 more years. Compare that to new lead-acid: Won’t last much more than 7 years and will cost about 15cents/watt-hour. And lead-acid requires maintenance, doesn’t like just sitting there floating for months and just never gives you confidence you’ll have the capacity for that trip you’re about to embark on…. ? ?
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From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of twowheelinguy via groups.io
Sent: Sunday, December 1, 2024 5:25 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [electricboats] Complex design issues? LEAD IS DEAD! LiFePo is an acceptable chemistry for marine applications.? Stay away from anything with cobalt in it and you'll be fine.? I ran lead acid for over 10 years, went through three 48V banks of GC-2 6 Volt golf cart batteries which are some of the most robust lead acid batteries you can get. Recently made the switch to LiFePo and there is no comparison. Lead acid is in the Stone Age compared to lithium and yo can get top quality lithium batteries on Amazon for cheaper than some AGMs now.? On Friday, November 29, 2024 at 10:44:51 PM EST, Dale Shomette via groups.io <dashoway@...> wrote: Thanks Luke. I already have both generators and unfortunately bout the 100 watt PVs before I had researched it. I'm still concerned about lifepo battery's as lithium tends to blow up in a potential water environment and management is a bigger deal. I've been using Enersys Odyssey? 1800 PC AGM batteries and after 10 years they're still putting out 12.6 to 12.8 volts. They're less expensive than lifepo4s and easier (as I'm an old guy) to maintain. Your right though, I wish I had invested in eight 300watt PVs. Unfortunately,
I also only have room for 8 motor batteries and the house batteries. I've forgotten the size and pitch of my prop....gotta check that. Thanks
Dale ? On Fri, Nov 29, 2024, 8:03 PM Luke Johnson via <Jukelohnson=[email protected]> wrote: Im no expert but I have a comparable? setup with a catalina 30 with a 48v lifepo4 battery bank.? I get about 30 amps at 4 knots, 60 amps at 5, 90 amps at 6.? Prop is 12" diameter 6" pitch.? Hope that info helps. If it were me I'd get one generator and put the rest of the cash into higher output solar panels and one or more lifepo4 battery banks.? I don't know the size of your panels but 8 x 100 panels seems like low output for the footprint, isn't it? 8 400 watt panels would be nice, and make lots of power if you had a bank big enough to store it.
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LEAD IS DEAD! LiFePo is an acceptable chemistry for marine applications.? Stay away from anything with cobalt in it and you'll be fine.?
I ran lead acid for over 10 years, went through three 48V banks of GC-2 6 Volt golf cart batteries which are some of the most robust lead acid batteries you can get. Recently made the switch to LiFePo and there is no comparison. Lead acid is in the Stone Age compared to lithium and yo can get top quality lithium batteries on Amazon for cheaper than some AGMs now.?
Capt. Carter www.shipofimagination.com?
On Friday, November 29, 2024 at 10:44:51 PM EST, Dale Shomette via groups.io <dashoway@...> wrote:
Thanks Luke. I already have both generators and unfortunately bout the 100 watt PVs before I had researched it. I'm still concerned about lifepo battery's as lithium tends to blow up in a potential water environment and management is a bigger deal. I've been using Enersys Odyssey? 1800 PC AGM batteries and after 10 years they're still putting out 12.6 to 12.8 volts. They're less expensive than lifepo4s and easier (as I'm an old guy) to maintain. Your right though, I wish I had invested in eight 300watt PVs. Unfortunately,
I also only have room for 8 motor batteries and the house batteries. I've forgotten the size and pitch of my prop....gotta check that. Thanks
Dale
On Fri, Nov 29, 2024, 8:03 PM Luke Johnson via <Jukelohnson= [email protected]> wrote: Im no expert but I have a comparable? setup with a catalina 30 with a 48v lifepo4 battery bank.? I get about 30 amps at 4 knots, 60 amps at 5, 90 amps at 6.? Prop is 12" diameter 6" pitch.? Hope that info helps.
If it were me I'd get one generator and put the rest of the cash into higher output solar panels and one or more lifepo4 battery banks.? I don't know the size of your panels but 8 x 100 panels seems like low output for the footprint, isn't it?
8 400 watt panels would be nice, and make lots of power if you had a bank big enough to store it.
Just some thoughts -
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Thanks Luke. I already have both generators and unfortunately bout the 100 watt PVs before I had researched it. I'm still concerned about lifepo battery's as lithium tends to blow up in a potential water environment and management is a bigger deal. I've been using Enersys Odyssey? 1800 PC AGM batteries and after 10 years they're still putting out 12.6 to 12.8 volts. They're less expensive than lifepo4s and easier (as I'm an old guy) to maintain. Your right though, I wish I had invested in eight 300watt PVs. Unfortunately,
I also only have room for 8 motor batteries and the house batteries. I've forgotten the size and pitch of my prop....gotta check that. Thanks
Dale
On Fri, Nov 29, 2024, 8:03 PM Luke Johnson via <Jukelohnson= [email protected]> wrote: Im no expert but I have a comparable? setup with a catalina 30 with a 48v lifepo4 battery bank.? I get about 30 amps at 4 knots, 60 amps at 5, 90 amps at 6.? Prop is 12" diameter 6" pitch.? Hope that info helps.
If it were me I'd get one generator and put the rest of the cash into higher output solar panels and one or more lifepo4 battery banks.? I don't know the size of your panels but 8 x 100 panels seems like low output for the footprint, isn't it?
8 400 watt panels would be nice, and make lots of power if you had a bank big enough to store it.
Just some thoughts -
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Im no expert but I have a comparable? setup with a catalina 30 with a 48v lifepo4 battery bank.? I get about 30 amps at 4 knots, 60 amps at 5, 90 amps at 6.? Prop is 12" diameter 6" pitch.? Hope that info helps.
If it were me I'd get one generator and put the rest of the cash into higher output solar panels and one or more lifepo4 battery banks.? I don't know the size of your panels but 8 x 100 panels seems like low output for the footprint, isn't it?
8 400 watt panels would be nice, and make lots of power if you had a bank big enough to store it.
Just some thoughts -
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The two Fischer-Pandas are three cylinder diesels, EXTREMELY quiet at 60 decibels (conversation level noise), water cooled of course, and weigh a little over 100+ lbs. I don't have the exact weights with me (away for Thanksgiving). However, they ain't cheap! (Not than anything is these days). Oh, they are both in insulated quiet shells that measure close to 2'x2'x2'. Thanks, Dale
Ok, ball park...? How much is one of these things?? ? 200 pounds doesn't sound bad for a diesel gen.
On Friday, November 29, 2024 at 10:52:46 AM CST, Dan Pfeiffer < dan@...> wrote:
Is this a Buccaneer 32?
Have you confirmed is actual service the 60 amps at 3.5 to 4 knots?? If you get the reduction and prop sizing right you might do better than that.? I have a similar sized boat (33ft, 12,500 lbs, 28.33 LWL) and at 4 knots I use about 30 amps.
7 to 7.5 kts may not be reachable though.? Not in a practical way.? But I do get to 85% hull speed (apr. 6 kts ) at 100 amps. ?
I was planning for a 12kW generator (using same ME1616 motor as generator) but after running for several seasons I think that's overkill.? 6 to 8 kW would do what I need.
I would look at a DC generator.? I saw these guys at Annapolis Baot Show.? Very interesting and maybe ahead of the curve in offerings?
Details on my installation here (with data):
Dan Pfeiffer
?
On 2024-11-29 11:12 am, Dale Shomette via wrote:
I have a 32' Bayliner sailboat (now dismasted) that I've gutted and am turning it into an electric hybrid. It has an 8 battery (185 a/h 12 volt each) battery bank of AGM Oddysey batteries to power a (to be purchased) ElectricYacht 2.0, 48 volt motor drive system. I have 8 solar panels, 100watts each to augment the two Fischer Panda 48 volt 10kw diesel gen. sets. I've taken the 13' mainmast spar and am stepping it where the main master was, with a 500watt wind generator mounted on top. To flesh it out a bit more, I've installed a separate 4 battery bank forward as the house batteries, with a 200watt PV on the forward cabin top to keep them topped up.
? Having said all that, I'd like to configure the 800 watt set of PVs to meet the 48 (actually need 54-6) volt requirement to charge the 8 battery bank but also maximize amperage. 10-11amps/hrs isn't much to plug into a 370amp bank.
The ElectricYacht will need roughly 60 amp/hr for a 3.5-4knot speed, up to 270 amps/hrs to reach a 7- 7.5 knot hll speed. The gen sets can run the motors by themselves and/or charge the batteries but I would like to get as much quiet time propulsion as possible. The gen. sets only put out 60 decibels of noise but would like to keep their use to a minimum. How would you do the overall PV / wind turbine configuration, and voltage and amperage to the battery bank? Should I utilize one 4? 185amp 48 volt bank at a time or use and charge both at the same time? Other insight would be appreciated. Thanks so much.
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Thanks Dan. I don't have the figures with me right now and you may be right about the 30 amps @ 4 knots as well as the practicality of hull speed. The Fischer-Pandas ARE Direct Current / 48 volt, 10kw gen sets. Generally, all I need is one gen to give up to a max of about 200 amps@48 volts. The ElectricYacht? 2.0 system is two motors in tandem. Like the two gen sets, It's redundant power and energy and cruising on one generator is easy but if you're in a storm, heavy sea or serious currant, #2 gen with #1coming on will kick in the second motor, and hopefully, get you outta there. The problem, is I don't want to be a total slave to the generators. I'd like to be as efficient as possible, by charging the bat.bank(s) with enough volts and enough amps to travel 4 or 5 hours on batteries alone. Getting that configuration as efficient as possible is what I need help with. I can't put on any more than the 8 100watt PVs (it's what I have) and the one 200 watt for maintaining the house batteries. I haven't installed the inverter yet and charging by shore power is still to be worked out. Anyway, thank you for your input! Dale
Ok, ball park...? How much is one of these things?? ? 200 pounds doesn't sound bad for a diesel gen.
On Friday, November 29, 2024 at 10:52:46 AM CST, Dan Pfeiffer < dan@...> wrote:
Is this a Buccaneer 32?
Have you confirmed is actual service the 60 amps at 3.5 to 4 knots?? If you get the reduction and prop sizing right you might do better than that.? I have a similar sized boat (33ft, 12,500 lbs, 28.33 LWL) and at 4 knots I use about 30 amps.
7 to 7.5 kts may not be reachable though.? Not in a practical way.? But I do get to 85% hull speed (apr. 6 kts ) at 100 amps. ?
I was planning for a 12kW generator (using same ME1616 motor as generator) but after running for several seasons I think that's overkill.? 6 to 8 kW would do what I need.
I would look at a DC generator.? I saw these guys at Annapolis Baot Show.? Very interesting and maybe ahead of the curve in offerings?
Details on my installation here (with data):
Dan Pfeiffer
?
On 2024-11-29 11:12 am, Dale Shomette via wrote:
I have a 32' Bayliner sailboat (now dismasted) that I've gutted and am turning it into an electric hybrid. It has an 8 battery (185 a/h 12 volt each) battery bank of AGM Oddysey batteries to power a (to be purchased) ElectricYacht 2.0, 48 volt motor drive system. I have 8 solar panels, 100watts each to augment the two Fischer Panda 48 volt 10kw diesel gen. sets. I've taken the 13' mainmast spar and am stepping it where the main master was, with a 500watt wind generator mounted on top. To flesh it out a bit more, I've installed a separate 4 battery bank forward as the house batteries, with a 200watt PV on the forward cabin top to keep them topped up.
? Having said all that, I'd like to configure the 800 watt set of PVs to meet the 48 (actually need 54-6) volt requirement to charge the 8 battery bank but also maximize amperage. 10-11amps/hrs isn't much to plug into a 370amp bank.
The ElectricYacht will need roughly 60 amp/hr for a 3.5-4knot speed, up to 270 amps/hrs to reach a 7- 7.5 knot hll speed. The gen sets can run the motors by themselves and/or charge the batteries but I would like to get as much quiet time propulsion as possible. The gen. sets only put out 60 decibels of noise but would like to keep their use to a minimum. How would you do the overall PV / wind turbine configuration, and voltage and amperage to the battery bank? Should I utilize one 4? 185amp 48 volt bank at a time or use and charge both at the same time? Other insight would be appreciated. Thanks so much.
|
Ok, ball park...? How much is one of these things?? ? 200 pounds doesn't sound bad for a diesel gen.
On Friday, November 29, 2024 at 10:52:46 AM CST, Dan Pfeiffer <dan@...> wrote:
Is this a Buccaneer 32?
Have you confirmed is actual service the 60 amps at 3.5 to 4 knots?? If you get the reduction and prop sizing right you might do better than that.? I have a similar sized boat (33ft, 12,500 lbs, 28.33 LWL) and at 4 knots I use about 30 amps.
7 to 7.5 kts may not be reachable though.? Not in a practical way.? But I do get to 85% hull speed (apr. 6 kts ) at 100 amps. ?
I was planning for a 12kW generator (using same ME1616 motor as generator) but after running for several seasons I think that's overkill.? 6 to 8 kW would do what I need.
I would look at a DC generator.? I saw these guys at Annapolis Baot Show.? Very interesting and maybe ahead of the curve in offerings?
Details on my installation here (with data):
Dan Pfeiffer
?
On 2024-11-29 11:12 am, Dale Shomette via groups.io wrote:
I have a 32' Bayliner sailboat (now dismasted) that I've gutted and am turning it into an electric hybrid. It has an 8 battery (185 a/h 12 volt each) battery bank of AGM Oddysey batteries to power a (to be purchased) ElectricYacht 2.0, 48 volt motor drive system. I have 8 solar panels, 100watts each to augment the two Fischer Panda 48 volt 10kw diesel gen. sets. I've taken the 13' mainmast spar and am stepping it where the main master was, with a 500watt wind generator mounted on top. To flesh it out a bit more, I've installed a separate 4 battery bank forward as the house batteries, with a 200watt PV on the forward cabin top to keep them topped up.
? Having said all that, I'd like to configure the 800 watt set of PVs to meet the 48 (actually need 54-6) volt requirement to charge the 8 battery bank but also maximize amperage. 10-11amps/hrs isn't much to plug into a 370amp bank.
The ElectricYacht will need roughly 60 amp/hr for a 3.5-4knot speed, up to 270 amps/hrs to reach a 7- 7.5 knot hll speed. The gen sets can run the motors by themselves and/or charge the batteries but I would like to get as much quiet time propulsion as possible. The gen. sets only put out 60 decibels of noise but would like to keep their use to a minimum. How would you do the overall PV / wind turbine configuration, and voltage and amperage to the battery bank? Should I utilize one 4? 185amp 48 volt bank at a time or use and charge both at the same time? Other insight would be appreciated. Thanks so much.
|
Is this a Buccaneer 32?
Have you confirmed is actual service the 60 amps at 3.5 to 4 knots?? If you get the reduction and prop sizing right you might do better than that.? I have a similar sized boat (33ft, 12,500 lbs, 28.33 LWL) and at 4 knots I use about 30 amps.
7 to 7.5 kts may not be reachable though.? Not in a practical way.? But I do get to 85% hull speed (apr. 6 kts ) at 100 amps. ?
I was planning for a 12kW generator (using same ME1616 motor as generator) but after running for several seasons I think that's overkill.? 6 to 8 kW would do what I need.
I would look at a DC generator.? I saw these guys at Annapolis Baot Show.? Very interesting and maybe ahead of the curve in offerings?
Details on my installation here (with data):
Dan Pfeiffer
?
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Show quoted text
On 2024-11-29 11:12 am, Dale Shomette via groups.io wrote:
I have a 32' Bayliner sailboat (now dismasted) that I've gutted and am turning it into an electric hybrid. It has an 8 battery (185 a/h 12 volt each) battery bank of AGM Oddysey batteries to power a (to be purchased) ElectricYacht 2.0, 48 volt motor drive system. I have 8 solar panels, 100watts each to augment the two Fischer Panda 48 volt 10kw diesel gen. sets. I've taken the 13' mainmast spar and am stepping it where the main master was, with a 500watt wind generator mounted on top. To flesh it out a bit more, I've installed a separate 4 battery bank forward as the house batteries, with a 200watt PV on the forward cabin top to keep them topped up.
? Having said all that, I'd like to configure the 800 watt set of PVs to meet the 48 (actually need 54-6) volt requirement to charge the 8 battery bank but also maximize amperage. 10-11amps/hrs isn't much to plug into a 370amp bank.
The ElectricYacht will need roughly 60 amp/hr for a 3.5-4knot speed, up to 270 amps/hrs to reach a 7- 7.5 knot hll speed. The gen sets can run the motors by themselves and/or charge the batteries but I would like to get as much quiet time propulsion as possible. The gen. sets only put out 60 decibels of noise but would like to keep their use to a minimum. How would you do the overall PV / wind turbine configuration, and voltage and amperage to the battery bank? Should I utilize one 4? 185amp 48 volt bank at a time or use and charge both at the same time? Other insight would be appreciated. Thanks so much.
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I have a 32' Bayliner sailboat (now dismasted) that I've gutted and am turning it into an electric hybrid. It has an 8 battery (185 a/h 12 volt each) battery bank of AGM Oddysey batteries to power a (to be purchased) ElectricYacht 2.0, 48 volt motor drive system. I have 8 solar panels, 100watts each to augment the two Fischer Panda 48 volt 10kw diesel gen. sets. I've taken the 13' mainmast spar and am stepping it where the main master was, with a 500watt wind generator mounted on top. To flesh it out a bit more, I've installed a separate 4 battery bank forward as the house batteries, with a 200watt PV on the forward cabin top to keep them topped up. ? Having said all that, I'd like to configure the 800 watt set of PVs to meet the 48 (actually need 54-6) volt requirement to charge the 8 battery bank but also maximize amperage. 10-11amps/hrs isn't much to plug into a 370amp bank. The ElectricYacht will need roughly 60 amp/hr for a 3.5-4knot speed, up to 270 amps/hrs to reach a 7- 7.5 knot hll speed. The gen sets can run the motors by themselves and/or charge the batteries but I would like to get as much quiet time propulsion as possible. The gen. sets only put out 60 decibels of noise but would like to keep their use to a minimum. How would you do the overall PV / wind turbine configuration, and voltage and amperage to the battery bank? Should I utilize one 4? 185amp 48 volt bank at a time or use and charge both at the same time? Other insight would be appreciated. Thanks so much.
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