|
?I am working on a larger write up but thought I would share some results from my first run.
Main concern: it was too loud! I think the cutlass bearing was too worn when I started The project and there was too much motion up and down. I think that the shower is aligned with the motor well, but dad it’s at to much of an angle with respect to the Cutlass bearing. This is also putting pressure on the stuffing box.
So I need to adjust the angle.
But I was able to get some preliminary numbers
The boat is a 1979s 30 foot fiberglass hulled ketch (Rawson 30). Hull speed is 6.9ish
Power consumption is almost logarithmic, as expected ~20a @ 3.2kn, ~55a @ 4.5kn, 115a@ 5.5kn
Don’t yet know how much to trust that meter.
What do you guys use to monitor battery capacity? I have a little meter that I ordered from Amazon but it recorded 100% wow at the end of the run and when I plugged in the charger, it recorded between 50 and 75% unfortunately the charger doesn’t give me a better number than that.
|
Oi, hit send before fixing autocorrect typos. Edited below
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
On Aug 26, 2020, at 09:52, Ryan Sweet via groups.io <ryan@...> wrote:
?I am working on a larger write up but thought I would share some results from my first run.
Main concern: it was too loud! I think the cutlass bearing was too worn when I started The project and there was too much motion up and down. I think that the shaft is aligned with the motor well, but that it’s at to much of an angle with respect to the Cutlass bearing. This is also putting pressure on the stuffing box.
So I need to adjust the angle.
But I was able to get some preliminary numbers
The boat is a 1979s 30 foot fiberglass hulled ketch (Rawson 30). Hull speed is 6.9ish
Power consumption is almost logarithmic, as expected ~20a @ 3.2kn, ~55a @ 4.5kn, 115a@ 5.5kn
Don’t yet know how much to trust that meter. What do you guys use to monitor battery capacity? I have a little meter that I ordered from Amazon but it recorded 100% capacity at the end of the run and when I plugged in the charger, it recorded between 50 and 75%. unfortunately the charger doesn’t give me a better number than that.
|
Hi Ryan,?
We also just launched a couple weeks ago after our big conversion.? Right now, we are using the CAN translator and the Torque app on my android tablet which is supposed to show amps out, watts, and SOC% but none of those are working correctly.? When I get up to 16 amps, it resets to 0 and starts counting up again.? Since the watts are calculated from the amps, they also reset at about 1250 and start back at 0.? ?It is hard to trust the numbers when it's doing that.? I'm in touch with Thunderstruck to try and figure out the issue but nothing yet.? We use the Curtis battery monitor to show the SOC and it works pretty well.? Link .
We also are having a hard time getting the alignment just right.? Pretty much exactly as you said, the shafts look aligned but the prop shaft is not perfectly straight through the cutlass.? We get some vibration, especially at higher RPM.? What surprises us the most is the very high pitched whine that comes from the motor.? It's far from silent.? I don't know if it's normal or if maybe the belt is too tight.? Do you have a gear reduction???
Here are our very very preliminary numbers considering the watts I'm showing are slightly untrustworthy.? We are also in the puget sound where it's damn near impossible to get away from any currents and our speed log doesn't work, so we are relying on SOG.? Boat is a 39', 20k lb, sloop with the motenergy 1616 at 72V and 180ah (13kw) bank.? 17'' 2 blade maxprop.??
WATTS? ?RPMS? ? SOG(KTS)
1000? ? ? ?1500? ? ? ?3.1
2100? ? ? ?2000? ? ? ?3.7
3600? ? ? ?2500? ? ? ?4.5
6000? ? ? ?3000? ? ? ?5.6
Let us know how your shaft alignment goes.
|
Sounds like a data range/wraparound issue---could be a parameter isn’t configured right or perhaps the wrong shunt or ??? ?
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of MATT
Sent: Monday, August 31, 2020 10:11 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [electricboats] First run ? Hi Ryan,?
We also just launched a couple weeks ago after our big conversion.? Right now, we are using the CAN translator and the Torque app on my android tablet which is supposed to show amps out, watts, and SOC% but none of those are working correctly.? When I get up to 16 amps, it resets to 0 and starts counting up again.? Since the watts are calculated from the amps, they also reset at about 1250 and start back at 0.? ?It is hard to trust the numbers when it's doing that.? I'm in touch with Thunderstruck to try and figure out the issue but nothing yet.? We use the Curtis battery monitor to show the SOC and it works pretty well.? Link .
We also are having a hard time getting the alignment just right.? Pretty much exactly as you said, the shafts look aligned but the prop shaft is not perfectly straight through the cutlass.? We get some vibration, especially at higher RPM.? What surprises us the most is the very high pitched whine that comes from the motor.? It's far from silent.? I don't know if it's normal or if maybe the belt is too tight.? Do you have a gear reduction???
Here are our very very preliminary numbers considering the watts I'm showing are slightly untrustworthy.? We are also in the puget sound where it's damn near impossible to get away from any currents and our speed log doesn't work, so we are relying on SOG.? Boat is a 39', 20k lb, sloop with the motenergy 1616 at 72V and 180ah (13kw) bank.? 17'' 2 blade maxprop.??
WATTS? ?RPMS? ? SOG(KTS)
1000? ? ? ?1500? ? ? ?3.1
2100? ? ? ?2000? ? ? ?3.7
3600? ? ? ?2500? ? ? ?4.5
6000? ? ? ?3000? ? ? ?5.6
Let us know how your shaft alignment goes.
|
Well your basic power curve looks very similar to mine. I haven’t been able to make adjustments yet but will report when I do.?
I have the Thunderstruck gear reduction/engine mount and am using 2:1.?
I tensioned the belt to where it could just barely be deflected by hand.?
I was able to greatly reduce vibration by connecting the top nuts on the reduction frame with 1”x 1/4” steel plates at an angle to the other mount. (Pic below) They were thin enough to bend into place but vertically rigid. I put a rubber grommet in between the plate and the reduction. That stopped the top of the reduction frame from shaking back and forth.?
I think to fix my angle I am going to take out the lags that are going through the horizontal angle-iron and cut the wood away a bit, then install post bolts and lock nuts that I can use to adjust the angle up and down. my worry is that then more of the vibration will transfer through the bolt into the hull but if I can get the alignment right that seems preferable to destroying the cutlass bearing and stuffing box. ?I have a cover to fit over the exposed batteries and wiring in the pic below, but showing basically I built a platform for the batteries where the old engine was, keeping the weight as much in the same place (low and central) as possible. With the thunderstruck reduction the new engine sits entirely aft of where the old one was, but having removed all of the old exhaust system etc there is still tons of room.?
I haven’t noticed the motor whining but the shaft is pretty loud still. ?Equally irritating is that my Noco Genius 48v battery charger makes a very high pitches whine whenever it is running.?
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
On Aug 31, 2020, at 10:46, Myles Twete <matwete@...> wrote:
? Sounds like a data range/wraparound issue---could be a parameter isn’t configured right or perhaps the wrong shunt or ??? ? From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of MATT
Sent: Monday, August 31, 2020 10:11 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [electricboats] First run ? Hi Ryan,?
We also just launched a couple weeks ago after our big conversion.? Right now, we are using the CAN translator and the Torque app on my android tablet which is supposed to show amps out, watts, and SOC% but none of those are working correctly.? When I get up to 16 amps, it resets to 0 and starts counting up again.? Since the watts are calculated from the amps, they also reset at about 1250 and start back at 0.? ?It is hard to trust the numbers when it's doing that.? I'm in touch with Thunderstruck to try and figure out the issue but nothing yet.? We use the Curtis battery monitor to show the SOC and it works pretty well.? Link .
We also are having a hard time getting the alignment just right.? Pretty much exactly as you said, the shafts look aligned but the prop shaft is not perfectly straight through the cutlass.? We get some vibration, especially at higher RPM.? What surprises us the most is the very high pitched whine that comes from the motor.? It's far from silent.? I don't know if it's normal or if maybe the belt is too tight.? Do you have a gear reduction???
Here are our very very preliminary numbers considering the watts I'm showing are slightly untrustworthy.? We are also in the puget sound where it's damn near impossible to get away from any currents and our speed log doesn't work, so we are relying on SOG.? Boat is a 39', 20k lb, sloop with the motenergy 1616 at 72V and 180ah (13kw) bank.? 17'' 2 blade maxprop.??
WATTS? ?RPMS? ? SOG(KTS)
1000? ? ? ?1500? ? ? ?3.1
2100? ? ? ?2000? ? ? ?3.7
3600? ? ? ?2500? ? ? ?4.5
6000? ? ? ?3000? ? ? ?5.6
Let us know how your shaft alignment goes.
|
I purchased the Clearview display with my 10kw Thunderstruck kit. I keep it at the helm & it is very helpful keeping track of voltage & consumption. I also have a Victron 700 battery monitor down below. Between the two devices, I always know what's going on.
|
I like your stacking platform.? I have 2 of the four batteries in
front of the motor and the other two to the side where the gas
tank used to live but now I'm thinking I need to look at a
platform.? I will also look at mounting additional supports on the
top of the gear reduction mount.
As a side note I was disappointed with the performance of? my
10KW Thunderstruck system with a top speed of 4 knows drawing
100amps.? I had a diver go down and clean the prop and the speed
went up .3 knots but the current draw dropped from 104 amps to 51
full throttle.? I still think I need to change props but this was
a big improvement.
John
On 8/31/2020 3:08 PM, Ryan Sweet wrote:
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
Well your basic power curve looks very similar to
mine. I haven’t been able to make adjustments yet but will
report when I do.?
I have the Thunderstruck gear reduction/engine
mount and am using 2:1.?
I tensioned the belt to where it could just barely
be deflected by hand.?
I was able to greatly reduce vibration by
connecting the top nuts on the reduction frame with 1”x 1/4”
steel plates at an angle to the other mount. (Pic below) They
were thin enough to bend into place but vertically rigid. I put
a rubber grommet in between the plate and the reduction. That
stopped the top of the reduction frame from shaking back and
forth.?
I think to fix my angle I am going to take out the
lags that are going through the horizontal angle-iron and cut
the wood away a bit, then install post bolts and lock nuts that
I can use to adjust the angle up and down. my worry is that then
more of the vibration will transfer through the bolt into the
hull but if I can get the alignment right that seems preferable
to destroying the cutlass bearing and stuffing box. ?I have a
cover to fit over the exposed batteries and wiring in the pic
below, but showing basically I built a platform for the
batteries where the old engine was, keeping the weight as much
in the same place (low and central) as possible. With the
thunderstruck reduction the new engine sits entirely aft of
where the old one was, but having removed all of the old exhaust
system etc there is still tons of room.?
I haven’t noticed the motor whining but the shaft
is pretty loud still. ?Equally irritating is that my Noco Genius
48v battery charger makes a very high pitches whine whenever it
is running.?
?
Sounds
like a data range/wraparound issue---could be a
parameter isn’t configured right or perhaps the wrong
shunt or ???
?
From:
[email protected] [mailto:[email protected]]
On Behalf Of MATT
Sent: Monday, August 31, 2020 10:11 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [electricboats] First run
?
Hi Ryan,?
We also just launched a couple weeks ago after our big
conversion.? Right now, we are using the CAN translator
and the Torque app on my android tablet which is supposed
to show amps out, watts, and SOC% but none of those are
working correctly.? When I get up to 16 amps, it resets to
0 and starts counting up again.? Since the watts are
calculated from the amps, they also reset at about 1250
and start back at 0.? ?It is hard to trust the numbers
when it's doing that.? I'm in touch with Thunderstruck to
try and figure out the issue but nothing yet.? We use the
Curtis battery monitor to show the SOC and it works pretty
well.? Link .
We also are having a hard time getting the alignment just
right.? Pretty much exactly as you said, the shafts look
aligned but the prop shaft is not perfectly straight
through the cutlass.? We get some vibration, especially at
higher RPM.? What surprises us the most is the very high
pitched whine that comes from the motor.? It's far from
silent.? I don't know if it's normal or if maybe the belt
is too tight.? Do you have a gear reduction???
Here are our very very preliminary numbers considering the
watts I'm showing are slightly untrustworthy.? We are also
in the puget sound where it's damn near impossible to get
away from any currents and our speed log doesn't work, so
we are relying on SOG.? Boat is a 39', 20k lb, sloop with
the motenergy 1616 at 72V and 180ah (13kw) bank.? 17'' 2
blade maxprop.??
WATTS? ?RPMS? ? SOG(KTS)
1000? ? ? ?1500? ? ? ?3.1
2100? ? ? ?2000? ? ? ?3.7
3600? ? ? ?2500? ? ? ?4.5
6000? ? ? ?3000? ? ? ?5.6
Let us know how your shaft alignment goes.
|
Sounds like Matt and I may find better numbers once our shafts are better aligned then!?
With the batteries my primary worry is about them sliding around. The AGM are so heavy that they *appear* as if they would stay put, but I would hate to find out the hard way that they won’t, so in addition to the ventilated box they are shown in there is an additional cover that latches down in between the batteries and the engine. ?
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
On Aug 31, 2020, at 14:17, John Theune <jatheune@...> wrote:
?
I like your stacking platform.? I have 2 of the four batteries in
front of the motor and the other two to the side where the gas
tank used to live but now I'm thinking I need to look at a
platform.? I will also look at mounting additional supports on the
top of the gear reduction mount.
As a side note I was disappointed with the performance of? my
10KW Thunderstruck system with a top speed of 4 knows drawing
100amps.? I had a diver go down and clean the prop and the speed
went up .3 knots but the current draw dropped from 104 amps to 51
full throttle.? I still think I need to change props but this was
a big improvement.
John
On 8/31/2020 3:08 PM, Ryan Sweet wrote:
Well your basic power curve looks very similar to
mine. I haven’t been able to make adjustments yet but will
report when I do.?
I have the Thunderstruck gear reduction/engine
mount and am using 2:1.?
I tensioned the belt to where it could just barely
be deflected by hand.?
I was able to greatly reduce vibration by
connecting the top nuts on the reduction frame with 1”x 1/4”
steel plates at an angle to the other mount. (Pic below) They
were thin enough to bend into place but vertically rigid. I put
a rubber grommet in between the plate and the reduction. That
stopped the top of the reduction frame from shaking back and
forth.?
I think to fix my angle I am going to take out the
lags that are going through the horizontal angle-iron and cut
the wood away a bit, then install post bolts and lock nuts that
I can use to adjust the angle up and down. my worry is that then
more of the vibration will transfer through the bolt into the
hull but if I can get the alignment right that seems preferable
to destroying the cutlass bearing and stuffing box. ?I have a
cover to fit over the exposed batteries and wiring in the pic
below, but showing basically I built a platform for the
batteries where the old engine was, keeping the weight as much
in the same place (low and central) as possible. With the
thunderstruck reduction the new engine sits entirely aft of
where the old one was, but having removed all of the old exhaust
system etc there is still tons of room.?
I haven’t noticed the motor whining but the shaft
is pretty loud still. ?Equally irritating is that my Noco Genius
48v battery charger makes a very high pitches whine whenever it
is running.?
<image0.jpeg>
On Aug 31, 2020, at 10:46, Myles Twete
<matwete@...> wrote:
?
Sounds
like a data range/wraparound issue---could be a
parameter isn’t configured right or perhaps the wrong
shunt or ???
?
From:
[email protected] [mailto:[email protected]]
On Behalf Of MATT
Sent: Monday, August 31, 2020 10:11 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [electricboats] First run
?
Hi Ryan,?
We also just launched a couple weeks ago after our big
conversion.? Right now, we are using the CAN translator
and the Torque app on my android tablet which is supposed
to show amps out, watts, and SOC% but none of those are
working correctly.? When I get up to 16 amps, it resets to
0 and starts counting up again.? Since the watts are
calculated from the amps, they also reset at about 1250
and start back at 0.? ?It is hard to trust the numbers
when it's doing that.? I'm in touch with Thunderstruck to
try and figure out the issue but nothing yet.? We use the
Curtis battery monitor to show the SOC and it works pretty
well.? Link .
We also are having a hard time getting the alignment just
right.? Pretty much exactly as you said, the shafts look
aligned but the prop shaft is not perfectly straight
through the cutlass.? We get some vibration, especially at
higher RPM.? What surprises us the most is the very high
pitched whine that comes from the motor.? It's far from
silent.? I don't know if it's normal or if maybe the belt
is too tight.? Do you have a gear reduction???
Here are our very very preliminary numbers considering the
watts I'm showing are slightly untrustworthy.? We are also
in the puget sound where it's damn near impossible to get
away from any currents and our speed log doesn't work, so
we are relying on SOG.? Boat is a 39', 20k lb, sloop with
the motenergy 1616 at 72V and 180ah (13kw) bank.? 17'' 2
blade maxprop.??
WATTS? ?RPMS? ? SOG(KTS)
1000? ? ? ?1500? ? ? ?3.1
2100? ? ? ?2000? ? ? ?3.7
3600? ? ? ?2500? ? ? ?4.5
6000? ? ? ?3000? ? ? ?5.6
Let us know how your shaft alignment goes.
|
Hi, Nothing stays put at sea! Batteries need to be tied down also, not just in a box just for everyday getting around. Now imagine a knockdown or god forbid a rollover. The best way to get it safe is to go below sit down grab a beer and imagine all the items that would not be good to have landing in your bunk or on your head then fix it. It Doesn’t take much to cause a serious injury if hit in the face by say a cordless drill. Or even a handheld radio or pots and pans. At least we wont have so many fuel cans flying about with our electric drives. LOL Best regards. Lee Chrystal Marsh Specialty HVAC LTD Box 5061 STN Main Leduc Alberta T9E-6L5 Cell: (780) 975-6801 ?
? ? ?
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
From: [email protected] <[email protected]> On Behalf Of Ryan Sweet
Sent: August 31, 2020 3:35 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [electricboats] First run? Sounds like Matt and I may find better numbers once our shafts are better aligned then!? With the batteries my primary worry is about them sliding around. The AGM are so heavy that they *appear* as if they would stay put, but I would hate to find out the hard way that they won’t, so in addition to the ventilated box they are shown in there is an additional cover that latches down in between the batteries and the engine. ?
On Aug 31, 2020, at 14:17, John Theune <jatheune@...> wrote:
? I like your stacking platform.? I have 2 of the four batteries in front of the motor and the other two to the side where the gas tank used to live but now I'm thinking I need to look at a platform.? I will also look at mounting additional supports on the top of the gear reduction mount. ? As a side note I was disappointed with the performance of? my 10KW Thunderstruck system with a top speed of 4 knows drawing 100amps.? I had a diver go down and clean the prop and the speed went up .3 knots but the current draw dropped from 104 amps to 51 full throttle.? I still think I need to change props but this was a big improvement. John On 8/31/2020 3:08 PM, Ryan Sweet wrote: Well your basic power curve looks very similar to mine. I haven’t been able to make adjustments yet but will report when I do.? I have the Thunderstruck gear reduction/engine mount and am using 2:1.? I tensioned the belt to where it could just barely be deflected by hand.? I was able to greatly reduce vibration by connecting the top nuts on the reduction frame with 1”x 1/4” steel plates at an angle to the other mount. (Pic below) They were thin enough to bend into place but vertically rigid. I put a rubber grommet in between the plate and the reduction. That stopped the top of the reduction frame from shaking back and forth.? I think to fix my angle I am going to take out the lags that are going through the horizontal angle-iron and cut the wood away a bit, then install post bolts and lock nuts that I can use to adjust the angle up and down. my worry is that then more of the vibration will transfer through the bolt into the hull but if I can get the alignment right that seems preferable to destroying the cutlass bearing and stuffing box. ?I have a cover to fit over the exposed batteries and wiring in the pic below, but showing basically I built a platform for the batteries where the old engine was, keeping the weight as much in the same place (low and central) as possible. With the thunderstruck reduction the new engine sits entirely aft of where the old one was, but having removed all of the old exhaust system etc there is still tons of room.? I haven’t noticed the motor whining but the shaft is pretty loud still. ?Equally irritating is that my Noco Genius 48v battery charger makes a very high pitches whine whenever it is running.? ? Sounds like a data range/wraparound issue---could be a parameter isn’t configured right or perhaps the wrong shunt or ??? ? From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of MATT
Sent: Monday, August 31, 2020 10:11 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [electricboats] First run ? Hi Ryan,?
We also just launched a couple weeks ago after our big conversion.? Right now, we are using the CAN translator and the Torque app on my android tablet which is supposed to show amps out, watts, and SOC% but none of those are working correctly.? When I get up to 16 amps, it resets to 0 and starts counting up again.? Since the watts are calculated from the amps, they also reset at about 1250 and start back at 0.? ?It is hard to trust the numbers when it's doing that.? I'm in touch with Thunderstruck to try and figure out the issue but nothing yet.? We use the Curtis battery monitor to show the SOC and it works pretty well.? Link .
We also are having a hard time getting the alignment just right.? Pretty much exactly as you said, the shafts look aligned but the prop shaft is not perfectly straight through the cutlass.? We get some vibration, especially at higher RPM.? What surprises us the most is the very high pitched whine that comes from the motor.? It's far from silent.? I don't know if it's normal or if maybe the belt is too tight.? Do you have a gear reduction???
Here are our very very preliminary numbers considering the watts I'm showing are slightly untrustworthy.? We are also in the puget sound where it's damn near impossible to get away from any currents and our speed log doesn't work, so we are relying on SOG.? Boat is a 39', 20k lb, sloop with the motenergy 1616 at 72V and 180ah (13kw) bank.? 17'' 2 blade maxprop.??
WATTS? ?RPMS? ? SOG(KTS)
1000? ? ? ?1500? ? ? ?3.1
2100? ? ? ?2000? ? ? ?3.7
3600? ? ? ?2500? ? ? ?4.5
6000? ? ? ?3000? ? ? ?5.6
Let us know how your shaft alignment goes.
|
What I did was change the cutless bearing then the stuffing box packing then lined up the shafts and installed the chain coupler. Without the drive belt installed. Then I had something to line up with first. The angle could change with a new bearing or packing installed so I just did it first. After that I could give it a spin and it kept spinning a few revolutions so I think/know its good. I do know that before I changed the worn cutless bearing the shaft would not continue spinning at all and I feel/heard it would have vibrated with the worn parts… I will wait to get the batteries as the warranty starts when you buy them not when you start using them which will be next summer for me. Best regards all. Lee Chrystal Marsh Specialty HVAC LTD Box 5061 STN Main Leduc Alberta T9E-6L5 Cell: (780) 975-6801 ?
? ? ?
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
From: [email protected] <[email protected]> On Behalf Of Ryan Sweet
Sent: August 31, 2020 3:35 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [electricboats] First run? Sounds like Matt and I may find better numbers once our shafts are better aligned then!? With the batteries my primary worry is about them sliding around. The AGM are so heavy that they *appear* as if they would stay put, but I would hate to find out the hard way that they won’t, so in addition to the ventilated box they are shown in there is an additional cover that latches down in between the batteries and the engine. ?
On Aug 31, 2020, at 14:17, John Theune <jatheune@...> wrote:
? I like your stacking platform.? I have 2 of the four batteries in front of the motor and the other two to the side where the gas tank used to live but now I'm thinking I need to look at a platform.? I will also look at mounting additional supports on the top of the gear reduction mount. ? As a side note I was disappointed with the performance of? my 10KW Thunderstruck system with a top speed of 4 knows drawing 100amps.? I had a diver go down and clean the prop and the speed went up .3 knots but the current draw dropped from 104 amps to 51 full throttle.? I still think I need to change props but this was a big improvement. John On 8/31/2020 3:08 PM, Ryan Sweet wrote: Well your basic power curve looks very similar to mine. I haven’t been able to make adjustments yet but will report when I do.? I have the Thunderstruck gear reduction/engine mount and am using 2:1.? I tensioned the belt to where it could just barely be deflected by hand.? I was able to greatly reduce vibration by connecting the top nuts on the reduction frame with 1”x 1/4” steel plates at an angle to the other mount. (Pic below) They were thin enough to bend into place but vertically rigid. I put a rubber grommet in between the plate and the reduction. That stopped the top of the reduction frame from shaking back and forth.? I think to fix my angle I am going to take out the lags that are going through the horizontal angle-iron and cut the wood away a bit, then install post bolts and lock nuts that I can use to adjust the angle up and down. my worry is that then more of the vibration will transfer through the bolt into the hull but if I can get the alignment right that seems preferable to destroying the cutlass bearing and stuffing box. ?I have a cover to fit over the exposed batteries and wiring in the pic below, but showing basically I built a platform for the batteries where the old engine was, keeping the weight as much in the same place (low and central) as possible. With the thunderstruck reduction the new engine sits entirely aft of where the old one was, but having removed all of the old exhaust system etc there is still tons of room.? I haven’t noticed the motor whining but the shaft is pretty loud still. ?Equally irritating is that my Noco Genius 48v battery charger makes a very high pitches whine whenever it is running.? ? Sounds like a data range/wraparound issue---could be a parameter isn’t configured right or perhaps the wrong shunt or ??? ? From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of MATT
Sent: Monday, August 31, 2020 10:11 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [electricboats] First run ? Hi Ryan,?
We also just launched a couple weeks ago after our big conversion.? Right now, we are using the CAN translator and the Torque app on my android tablet which is supposed to show amps out, watts, and SOC% but none of those are working correctly.? When I get up to 16 amps, it resets to 0 and starts counting up again.? Since the watts are calculated from the amps, they also reset at about 1250 and start back at 0.? ?It is hard to trust the numbers when it's doing that.? I'm in touch with Thunderstruck to try and figure out the issue but nothing yet.? We use the Curtis battery monitor to show the SOC and it works pretty well.? Link .
We also are having a hard time getting the alignment just right.? Pretty much exactly as you said, the shafts look aligned but the prop shaft is not perfectly straight through the cutlass.? We get some vibration, especially at higher RPM.? What surprises us the most is the very high pitched whine that comes from the motor.? It's far from silent.? I don't know if it's normal or if maybe the belt is too tight.? Do you have a gear reduction???
Here are our very very preliminary numbers considering the watts I'm showing are slightly untrustworthy.? We are also in the puget sound where it's damn near impossible to get away from any currents and our speed log doesn't work, so we are relying on SOG.? Boat is a 39', 20k lb, sloop with the motenergy 1616 at 72V and 180ah (13kw) bank.? 17'' 2 blade maxprop.??
WATTS? ?RPMS? ? SOG(KTS)
1000? ? ? ?1500? ? ? ?3.1
2100? ? ? ?2000? ? ? ?3.7
3600? ? ? ?2500? ? ? ?4.5
6000? ? ? ?3000? ? ? ?5.6
Let us know how your shaft alignment goes.
|
On 1/9/20 3:11 am, MATT wrote: What surprises us the most is the very high pitched whine that comes from the motor.? It's far from silent.? I don't know if it's normal or if maybe the belt is too tight. Some people are more sensitive to the high frequency switching noise than others. I can hear the switching noise on my boat (DC perm mag motor, direct drive). Actually it must be a harmonic I hear as there is no way I could hear the fundamental switching frequency from the transistor drive, that frequency is way to high for human ears. I can pretty well tell who manufactured the traction package of electric trains I board (if on the motor coach) by the changes in pitch from the traction package as the train accelerates. Each manufacture has a distinctive sound.
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>> What surprises us the most is the very high pitched whine that comes
from the motor.? It's far from silent.? I don't know if it's normal or
if maybe the belt is too tight.
I heard a big difference in the sound from the permanent magnet motor I used to use (very quiet) and the AC motor I use now (sounds like a kitchen appliance). Both are still much quieter than the gas outboard. I find it interesting that when using any motor (gas or electric), seals will pop up ahead of the boat and keeps their heads out of the water until I'm past. If I'm rowing, they don't pop up until after I've passed them. I wonder if the underwater noise of motors bothers them.
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Hi Ryan
Those are very good numbers.
We have a similar boat and a much higher consumption. We are running a 48 V system.
Do you use a higher voltage?
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On 27 Aug 2020, at 2:52 am, Ryan Sweet < ryan@...> wrote: I am working on a larger write up but thought I would share some results from my first run.
Main concern: it was too loud! I think the cutlass bearing was too worn when I started The project and there was too much motion up and down. I think that the shower is aligned with the motor well, but dad it’s at to much of an angle with respect to the Cutlass bearing. This is also putting pressure on the stuffing box.
So I need to adjust the angle.
But I was able to get some preliminary numbers
The boat is a 1979s 30 foot fiberglass hulled ketch (Rawson 30). ?Hull speed is 6.9ish
Power consumption is almost logarithmic, as expected ~20a @ 3.2kn, ~55a @ 4.5kn, 115a@ 5.5kn
Don’t yet know how much to trust that meter. ??
What do you guys use to monitor battery capacity? I have a little meter that I ordered from Amazon but it recorded 100% wow at the end of the run and when I plugged in the charger, it recorded between 50 and 75% unfortunately the charger doesn’t give me a better number than that.
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Hi Mitch,?
Mine is 48v. After adjustment of the prop angle ever so slightly the system is much quieter and now using a victron 712 meter we still have about the same numbers. Above 5kts it starts to ramp up the draw very quickly (I mean its still a logarithmic curve but that’s the dense area under the curve).?
Now I’m wiring up new powerwall style lifepo4 batteries and moving the AGM to be the house bank.?
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On Nov 1, 2020, at 10:27, Mich Pop <michpop@...> wrote:
? Hi Ryan
Those are very good numbers.
We have a similar boat and a much higher consumption. We are running a 48 V system.
Do you use a higher voltage?
On 27 Aug 2020, at 2:52 am, Ryan Sweet < ryan@...> wrote: I am working on a larger write up but thought I would share some results from my first run.
Main concern: it was too loud! I think the cutlass bearing was too worn when I started The project and there was too much motion up and down. I think that the shower is aligned with the motor well, but dad it’s at to much of an angle with respect to the Cutlass bearing. This is also putting pressure on the stuffing box.
So I need to adjust the angle.
But I was able to get some preliminary numbers
The boat is a 1979s 30 foot fiberglass hulled ketch (Rawson 30). ?Hull speed is 6.9ish
Power consumption is almost logarithmic, as expected ~20a @ 3.2kn, ~55a @ 4.5kn, 115a@ 5.5kn
Don’t yet know how much to trust that meter. ??
What do you guys use to monitor battery capacity? I have a little meter that I ordered from Amazon but it recorded 100% wow at the end of the run and when I plugged in the charger, it recorded between 50 and 75% unfortunately the charger doesn’t give me a better number than that.
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I am not sure but it almost seems like the meters need to have a few cycles of the battery to calculated the percentage charge . not sure just observation?
On Wed, Aug 26, 2020, 12:52 PM Ryan Sweet < ryan@...> wrote: I am working on a larger write up but thought I would share some results from my first run.
Main concern: it was too loud! I think the cutlass bearing was too worn when I started The project and there was too much motion up and down. I think that the shower is aligned with the motor well, but dad it’s at to much of an angle with respect to the Cutlass bearing. This is also putting pressure on the stuffing box.
So I need to adjust the angle.
But I was able to get some preliminary numbers
The boat is a 1979s 30 foot fiberglass hulled ketch (Rawson 30).? Hull speed is 6.9ish
Power consumption is almost logarithmic, as expected ~20a @ 3.2kn, ~55a @ 4.5kn, 115a@ 5.5kn
Don’t yet know how much to trust that meter.? ?
What do you guys use to monitor battery capacity? I have a little meter that I ordered from Amazon but it recorded 100% wow at the end of the run and when I plugged in the charger, it recorded between 50 and 75% unfortunately the charger doesn’t give me a better number than that.
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Is it a 48V system ? (Better to calc the consumption in Watt.)
On Friday, 13 November 2020, 09:43:27 GMT+8, Phil Costello <pcostelloaprn@...> wrote:
I am not sure but it almost seems like the meters need to have a few cycles of the battery to calculated the percentage charge . not sure just observation?
On Wed, Aug 26, 2020, 12:52 PM Ryan Sweet < ryan@...> wrote: I am working on a larger write up but thought I would share some results from my first run.
Main concern: it was too loud! I think the cutlass bearing was too worn when I started The project and there was too much motion up and down. I think that the shower is aligned with the motor well, but dad it’s at to much of an angle with respect to the Cutlass bearing. This is also putting pressure on the stuffing box.
So I need to adjust the angle.
But I was able to get some preliminary numbers
The boat is a 1979s 30 foot fiberglass hulled ketch (Rawson 30).? Hull speed is 6.9ish
Power consumption is almost logarithmic, as expected ~20a @ 3.2kn, ~55a @ 4.5kn, 115a@ 5.5kn
Don’t yet know how much to trust that meter.? ?
What do you guys use to monitor battery capacity? I have a little meter that I ordered from Amazon but it recorded 100% wow at the end of the run and when I plugged in the charger, it recorded between 50 and 75% unfortunately the charger doesn’t give me a better number than that.
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Hi Ryan,
Can you let me know some details of your install?. I currently have a 10kw Thunderstruck powered by AGM's. I would like to go with Lifepo4 and from the sounds of it the powerwall is a great option. I have a 30ft boat so would like to put two to three powerbanks on. Let me know your thoughts.
Thanks
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On Dec 3, 2020, at 07:53, oreillygb@... wrote:
?Hi Ryan,
Can you let me know some details of your install?. I currently have a 10kw Thunderstruck powered by AGM's. I would like to go with Lifepo4 and from the sounds of it the powerwall is a great option. I have a 30ft boat so would like to put two to three powerbanks on. Let me know your thoughts.
Rawson 30 Ketch, hull speed ~6.9kt
With the old engine the prop rpm for hull speed was about 1800. ?I don’t know the prop details and this is my next area to learn about.?
I have the 10kw me1115 Thunderstruck kit (Sevcon controller and 2:1 reduction and frame). ?
I am using four 150ah lifepo4 48v powerwall style batteries, wired in 4p. They are from Felicity Solar (Alibaba). See my recent post for some caveats about buying from China wholesale. I verified that it was ok to install these horizontally rather than vertically. Warning: they are 150lbs each and not easy to safely move around. plan your installation carefully and think through any future scenarios where you might have to move or remove them before mounting them somewhere.?
I am using the noco genius 4820 charger, victron energy 135|50 solar mppt, and the victron energy 712 battery monitor, all recommended in this group (thanks!).?
Total runtime is dependent on conditions and how much one leverages the throttle. At higher amp draw obviously you will get less runtime. ?I have gotten around 6h a few times. My power curve still approximately matches the numbers I posted in this thread for first run. ?For those that are in the PNW: I was able to motor the length of the Swinomish Channel from south to north with the tidal current changing in the middle and still had more than 1/3 of the battery capacity left. ?600ah seems to be enough to be able to make planning easier but I would not plan a whole day’s journey under power alone. If I could do it again I would spend more for 1000ah. I expect by next summer 1000ah may be at about the same price point anyway.?
Backup power: house bank is 800ah 12v with an inverter, can add 1/3 capacity to the 48v bank in 6h. ?Generac quiet running portable gasoline 30a generator and 15g gasoline. ?Last resort: Goal Zero yeti 1000 with inverter can add about 30ah. In theory with the generac I could motor at 3kt for as long as I have gasoline but that sort of defeats the point. It’s there for emergencies or the occasional necessary long motoring. ?Keep in mind that backup power can only put capacity back as quickly as the charger you have and the inverter you have will allow. For me this means about 1/3 charge in ~6h. ?I am wondering about faster charging. ?I haven’t had enough time in good weather to see any real benefit from my solar yet for the 48v bank. I did wire in a four way shutoff switch so that I can potentially add another bank.?
Thanks
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Ryan, I will be interested too, in your total setup, as I have a 29' monohull sailboat, almost as O'Reilly.
Maybe you (and others describing their systems) could post more drawings of it ? It is hard to follow just a written description. "A picture says more than a thousand words" !
Cheers,
Carsten
On Thursday, 3 December 2020, 23:53:50 GMT+8, <oreillygb@...> wrote:
Hi Ryan,
Can you let me know some details of your install?. I currently have a 10kw Thunderstruck powered by AGM's. I would like to go with Lifepo4 and from the sounds of it the powerwall is a great option. I have a 30ft boat so would like to put two to three powerbanks on. Let me know your thoughts.
Thanks
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I’ll share a drawing and some pics soon. It’s all in a pretty small space so pics may not help too much.?
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On Dec 3, 2020, at 08:26, Carsten via groups.io <Carstensemail@...> wrote:
?
Ryan, I will be interested too, in your total setup, as I have a 29' monohull sailboat, almost as O'Reilly.
Maybe you (and others describing their systems) could post more drawings of it ? It is hard to follow just a written description. "A picture says more than a thousand words" !
Cheers,
Carsten
On Thursday, 3 December 2020, 23:53:50 GMT+8, <oreillygb@...> wrote:
Hi Ryan,
Can you let me know some details of your install?. I currently have a 10kw Thunderstruck powered by AGM's. I would like to go with Lifepo4 and from the sounds of it the powerwall is a great option. I have a 30ft boat so would like to put two to three powerbanks on. Let me know your thoughts.
Thanks
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Matthew Geier
cpcanoesailor