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I am impressed!<br>The prices of electric motors
are something else....<br>If I'm going to get one
(and I'd love to....) I'd expect it to at least be
competitive with a new diesel.<br>Not so!<br>Anybody have any
suggestions on sites/companies?<br>To me a price over
$8,000.- for just motor and controller is
rediculous.<br>Then comes batteries, charging,installation,
etc.etc.<br>hope to get some hints.......

Try EV america , talk to Bob.
EVAmerica@....<br><br>Yoe didn't say whom you got that price from, but i
would guess that it was Elco. They don't seem to think
that ther is any other compition out there. EV America
is primarily an electric car group but they also do
boats. Have you gotten a price from Solomon technolgies?
If their price seem high remember that this is brand
new technologies, and with the recharge capablities
extras such as generators are not needed at all or a
much smaller one can be used. This will save quite a
bit of money. Also, fuel is a constant expense. And
finally, I don't know why you what to go electic, but for
me it is a quality, reliblity, and packaging issue,
not a price one. Hey, all you lurkers out there what
do you all think?<br><br>Bill

I would add KTA Services to the list of places to
check: (909) 949-7914.<br><br>I recently purchased all
the propulsion system components, except batteries
and charger, for my 23' fantail from them. The cost
was just over $2200 and that included LOTS more than
just the motor and the controller--right down to the
cabling and crimping tools, and the connectors.<br><br>I
did find that the more power your application
requires, the more specialized (and the more expensive)
everything becomes. A 38' boat is BIG.<br><br>One other
general point--you have to keep in mind that once those
batteries are installed you not only have a major portion
of your propulsion system but a major portion of
your operating costs as well. You can recharge the
batteries at a fraction of the cost of pumping $1.50/gal
diesel into those tanks after each outing.

Kirsti, the prices of electric boat motors are
high because they are built to last longer than
diesels...20 year design life instead of 10 years.
Additionally, there aren't any diesels that recharge themselves
while undersail. And actually there many other reasons.

Thanks for replying. I have gotten some material
from Dan on s/v"Nameste" about "the Wheel", and it
looks very good. <br>Do you guys have a web-site? With
all the interest for your product it would be nice to
be able to read something about it on-line.<br>Would
like to write directly to you...can you reply to
kirsti_drewsen@... <br>Thanks.

You can write directly to Solomon Technologies,
PO Box 314, Benedict, MD. 20612. You can also call
me directly at 301-274-4479. I apologize for the
inconvenience but our web site is not up yet because someone
else had registered Solomontech.com. We were able to
get the name but are just waiting for the paperwork.
Meanwhile, if you call or write we can forward to you a
package that will explain most or all of your questions.
Again....if you have any other questions do not hesitate to
call the # above....&#92;<br>Dave Tether

I disagree with your thoughts that electric motor
drive system are more "expensive than deisel because
they are designed to last longer". I have been
involved in the sales and applications DC and AC motors
and controlers for variable speed systems in
industrial systems for 30 years. The quality has incresed
and the prices have decreased. The problem with
marine use is that there is a lack of competition and/
or a lack crossover from the industrial world to the
marine world. A DC Motor has brushes. Todays motors have
brushes which are desigend to run for 10000 hours when
properly applied. Both AC and DC Motors have bearing they
have a MTBF (mean time between failure)equal to or
beter than the brushes in DC Motors. The cost of
controls (amplifiers) in the industrial application has
gone down 10 fold in the last 20 years but these
controls have not been applied to marine applications for
whatever reason. The only other item in the system is
batteries and due to the push for electric cars there is a
lot of work being done to make them have better
capacity and lower the cost and weight at the same time. I
feel that it is feasable to put together an effecient
cost effective electric marine propulsion system with
todays componets that will be be every bit as good if
not better then the fossil fuel drive system that are
being used today at a price that is competive to fossil
fuel propulsion systems.

I agree that a cost effective system can be
developed for marine propulsion using off the shelf
technologies. I do not, however, agree that the disign life
will be acieved unless the motor has been reworked for
the marine industry. Salty air, electrolysis and
water will eventually have its way with brushes and the
other internal parts of the motor if it is not modified
for the marine environment. The additional
modifications will make the motor some what more expensive but
cost effective anyway. <br> It is for these reasons,
and to develop a motor designed for the right RPM's
to push props, that Solomon Technologies productized
the Solo 6HP and 10 HP Electric Wheel. They are water
proof down to 20 feet, designed for 1200 RPM's,
brushless, protected from electrolysis and can regenerate in
sailboats. These motors are a bit more expensive because of
low production quantities and these additional
benfits that have been designed in. Are they still cost
effective ? Yes. When you go to the out years (10 +) and
you have spent an additional $4,000 for maintenance
and you must rebuild that diesel, replace fuel
injectors, repair transmission...etc. then the electric
motor is not only cost effective but comes with much
less hastle and is quiet too. It is now only a matter
of time until folks like you all will be considered
visionaries because I truly believe that within 10 years all
new production boats will be electric or diesel
electric hybrids. There were limitations to older
electrics....those days have changed...the new electrics can produce
equal the power and better performance than any diesel
or gasoline engine. And even today and for the past
30 years the fastes ships in the Navy's inventory
(any Navy...US, Russian, British, French) are all
diesel electric or nuclear electric hybrids...It's about
time that the civilian sector is given the opportunity
to do the same.

Being the owner of the 38-footer,(and totally
ignorant about electric propulsion!) I'm very happy to see
qualified discussion about the subject.<br>1) As mentioned
by EWHEL, there have been boats utilizing electric
drives for many years. Why didn't it ever before filter
down to us little civilian guys?<br>2) As US
government (coast-guard) is so preoccupied with the
live-aboards letting out a bit of waste from the heads, foul
anti-fouling paint etc. why not take the big step and try to
help keep the bilges clean by subsidizing compagnies
who really could make a difference in the mess we
boaters leave in the water? Show me a boat that didn't at
one time overfill the dieseltank, or get oil in the
bilge. So the bilges get pumped during the night!
Doesn't really help, does it?<br>Wouldn't it help with a
bit of government incentive?<br>3) Yes, a new diesel
IS cheaper than changing the whole system over to
electric! Even figuring the years of use! My old diesel
gave up after 30 years (and 5 different owners) If I
count in the batteries needed (AND the replacement of
these once in a while) + the price for The Electric
Wheel, + whatever else might have to be included, it
will be a very expensive change. I would like for
somebody with the knowledge needed in this to set up the
pro's and con's here. We would all like the quiet, the
cleanliness and ease of electric propulsion, but not at
double the cost. <br>I'll cheer for anybody who has the
know-how and the energy to work on this matter - I forget
HOW many boats are roaming the waters in the US
alone, but it must be profitable to get a business going
pushing all of us around. <br>But as long as it's half
the price to buy a brand new YANMAR out of the box,
guess what???<br>I WANT electric propulsion, but I can
stay tied off in the marina for another year or two
for the extra I'll have to pay for it!<br>And that'll
give me enough time to save up for a
diesel....<br>What a choice!!!

There are many problems with the development of
effecient electric propulsion system for non military
applications may of which can be blamed on a lack of available
funds for this purpose. unfortunatly until private
industry can see the market the development of such will
be limited to a few visionaries who are willing to
spend the time and their own money to do this. We can
however benifit from other sources of of development.
private industry has had a need for years for corrosion
resistant motors. These are avaible off the shelf, as a
matter of fact I know of one company who is producing
all stainless motors as cheaply as other so callled
sever duty motors. Servo motors have been in sever duty
for over 20 years and some are avaible with effencies
in excess of 90%.

There are many problems with the development of
effecient electric propulsion system for non military
applications may of which can be blamed on a lack of available
funds for this purpose. unfortunatly until private
industry can see the market the development of such will
be limited to a few visionaries who are willing to
spend the time and their own money to do this. We can
however benifit from other sources of of development.
private industry has had a need for years for corrosion
resistant motors. These are avaible off the shelf, as a
matter of fact I know of one company who is producing
all stainless motors as cheaply as other so callled
sever duty motors. Servo motors have been in sever duty
for over 20 years and some are avaible with effencies
in excess of 90%. <br> In the late 60's and early 70
I served on board a nuclear submarine. We had an
emergency propulsion system that used a 150 HP motor to
drive an 8000 ton displacement submarine through the
water at a speed in excess of 4 knots, under battery
power. Now thats not a speed record but it is very
inpressive when you think about it. You have a 38ft
displacemtn hull. you water line length is prounbly around
32ft. That means your a max. effecient speed is around
8 knotts. I firmly believe that an electric
propulsion system could be put into you boat which could
propel you through the water at 8 knots for 6-8 hours at
a streatch and would not cost you much more than
the cost of replacing you diesel. The real problem is
in selecting the batteries to use. I could go into
more details on this matter however I shouldn't hog up
so much space. If you want more information as to my
thoughts please feel free to E mail me at my web address
donaldbaer@...

Amen Kirsti....and read "Polluting for Pleasure"
by Andre Mele..It will strenghten your resolve. The
Waste and Pollution associated with pleasure boating is
appauling. And the folks associated with this association
(Elco, Duffy, Donaldbaer, Solomon Technologies, Mr.
Morton Ray and even NASA) are living proof that there is
a market and it is growing. Its growing because
today the technology does exist to have "drop-in
replacements" for diesels and gasoline motors that not only
quiet and clean, but just as powerful with much longer
operational life. Batteries were a hurtle in the past but
today they are getting better every day and fossil fuel
generator technologies provide infinite range while using
fossil fuel sparingly and efficiently. You need only
define your cycle of use to determine average continuous
run time then select the hybrid combination to
achieve it. It is only a matter of time now.

AMEN to that. This is especialy true when one
considers that most boats spend most of their time going
through the water at speed less than 10 knots. the speed
limit for marinas, most harbors and many many lakes is
5 mph. Its only in the open water that boats go
faster or in specialy selected areas that boats go any
faster.