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Hello, All, I finally got my new mill into my basement shop, reassembled and mounted. The subject came up of using coolant. When I use coolant on the milling machine, I usually have a spray bottle that I'll use to spray the tool where it's in contact with the work, but it's messy. On my lathe, I again don't use coolant too often, but when I do, I use a drip system that John Lindo had described to me some time ago. As I won't be standing there watching the entire job, I won't be there to spray the tool when running CNC. So I figured that I will apply the same drip coolant system. I thought it might be interesting for others so I will describe it here. To be clear, the idea was John's and I just stole his implementation. Basically, it uses intravenous tubing and the drip-speed regulator to control the flow of coolant. You can buy these on Amazon, though I got mine from several hospital stays. They were just going to throw them out anyway! The portion of the IV tubing that normally is pushed into the plastic IV bag is instead secured to a container. I used a one-liter water bottle, while John uses a 4-liter container. At the other end, a short length of copper tubing is used to deliver the coolant to the desired spot. You will need some way to hold the copper tube in place. I took an old LED gooseneck light and removed the gooseneck. This is mounted to a small block, and I attach the block to the cross-slide when coolant is required. Then just position the copper tubing, set the drip rate, and start machining. It's a simple concept, and I've included a few photos of mine (with the blue-colored coolant) and John's (with the yellowish-colored coolant) to clarify my description. So next time you're leaving the hospital, and they finally remove your IV, ask them for the tubing. I have never had a nurse refuse!  ??  ??  ??  ??  -- Regards, Charlie New Jersey, USA
SATTINGER’S LAW: It works better if you plug it in.
EDWARD'S LAW: It works even better if you turn it on.
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Charlie
Drip feed IV
Thanks for sharing with the forum members.
Coolant selection can be intmidating and of course availabilty around th world.
We are all mindful of the strict health standards which can also vary from country to country.
I use a type that is traditionally used for large commercial refridgerating units, similat to car radiator fluids.
Mixed at 1 part to 20 parts of water. It is not corrosive and seems to protect against rust of iron or steel parts.
Yellow in colour and it looks humanly disgusting and smells of Curry.?
But it does the job.
--
John
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Hey guys,
I once made a similarly working drip feed chain oiler for my dual-sport motorbike.
It took some fudging about until it started to work well enough.
I found the flow rate adjuster/regulator a bit fiddly, sometimes it would stop providing the oil, I'd have to open the regulator a bit, and then at other times it would start providing the oil too fast.
The IV bags in the hospital are made of flexible plastic so as the fluid goes out, the bag just collapses.
When using a plastic bottle, a vent has to be added at the top otherwise vacuum is formed and the feed rate reduces and possibly stops altogether eventually.
If I remember correctly, I had a vent at the top of the bottle, and another vent hose spliced to the drip hose with a Y-connector. The two vent hoses went up to the bike's airbox, joined there and were terminated with a tiny air filter.
I didn't want to have to add a shut-off valve to the system, or disturb the flow rate adjuster setting once I had it worked out, my solution was a chainsaw primer bulb between the oil bottle and the flow rate adjuster.
Some time during a ride, when I felt like it's time to re-lube the chain, I would reach down with my hand and squeeze the primer bulb, which would squirt a dose of oil into the tube, which would then slowly drip over the chain during a few minutes of riding (the oil hose was terminated with a syringe needle attached to the chain guide and aimed at the right spot, if I recall correctly).
I bought the IV set in a local pharmacy and various other parts for small money from China via eBay. I used ATF for chain oil, it worked very well and kept the chain quite clean even though I did a lot of dirt riding. The IV tubing seemed to not mind ATF in it.
Several pieces of advice for anyone who wants to duplicate the drip coolant system described above, based on my own experience:
- Test if the selected components (tubing) is compatible with the used coolant. Medical tubing is available in various materials (e.g. silicone, Tygon, Viton), which have different levels of compatibility with various oils, solvents etc.
- Pay attention to venting the coolant reservoir, otherwise the flow rate won't be stable
- Make sure you don't have leaks in the various parts of the system, or you may one day come to the workshop to find a huge mess on your machine/floor.
Best regards
Gene
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Thanks Gene.
Good use of the IV drip system priniple.
Yes a top vent in the cap if you are using a container, as it would be difficult to refill an IV plastic bag.
Not sure of the maximum viscosity and IV will accept, IE I don?t think lube oil for sprindle bearings would work, but
never tried it.
Thanks
--
John
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Hi, Gene, You made some excellent points. Thanks for raising them. I did not vent my bottle for a couple of reasons. First, I invert it to fill the bottle, and I didn't want to have to deal with blocking the vent during filling. Second, I have not, in the past, run the coolant for more than 5 minutes or so in one operation. As I turn it off at the end of each operation, I basically readjust the flow rate each time I start it. But if I will use it on a CNC mill, this could definitely be an issue, as it will run continually for much longer. The one-liter water bottle does start to collapse when the liquid level gets low, indicating that there is a substantial vacuum. So some kind of vent that can be closed for filling would make sense, and I will have to work that out. Thanks for pointing out the venting issue. -- Regards, Charlie New Jersey, USA
SATTINGER’S LAW: It works better if you plug it in.
EDWARD'S LAW: It works even better if you turn it on.
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We had a stock water tank heater that dripped diesel fuel into a combustion chamber. ?The drip was controlled by a small valve at the bottom of the fuel tank. ?As the tank emptied or the diesel thickened at low temperatures the flow would decrease. ?Sometimes so slow that the flame went out. ?It was a real PITA. ?our solution was to raise the fuel tank a few feet and run a line down with the valve on the bottom end. ?This maintained a more even pressure at the valve and a more even flow of fuel.
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Charlie,
I like the simplicity and low price of the gravity-powered system, but personally I would like to use something more predictable for unattended operation.
I am yet to build something for my recently acquired Paulimot F205-V milling machine, but I am planning this project.
In my tiny cellar workshop I don't want to consider a flood coolant system, I've read about mist coolant systems, but apparently these can make quite a mess too, with the coolant aerosol filling the whole shop - unhealthy, too.
Then I learned about a "FogBuster" system, which looks similar to a mist system, but the cutting fluid droplets are bigger in size, they are not really atomized into an aerosol, and so it's not messy and much better for one's lungs.
A quick search on the internet revealed a few DIY FogBuster builds, which are quite simple and inexpensive to implement as long as the shop has compressed air.
The general idea is that cutting fluid and air are mixed together in a mixing block, and a nozzle directs the stream to the workpiece. The cutting fluid is stored in a residential water filter housing (without a filter inside), which is inexpensive, easy to find, and easy to plumb into. Compressed air is supplied to the housing, so that oil is forced through a tube towards the mixing block. Just before the mixing block, there's a flow control valve. The additional air line also has a flow control valve near the mixing block. The two valves allow good adjustment for the amount of oil and air delivered. It's also possible to use just air to provide some cooling and blow away the chips. Both air lines (one to the filter housing, the other to the mixing block) have their own pressure regulators, which are adjusted once and then left alone.
I read about another similar system where the oil is metered and delivered by an automotive windshield washer pump.
Yet another system uses a peristaltic pump, suitable small ones are available for little money from China.
My own plan is to use a peristaltic pump to deliver the oil, and mix it with compressed air in a mixing block. Got a used medical pump on eBay for little money, called Gilson Minipuls 2.
But, for sure, the drip system you described is cheaper and quicker to rig, and doesn't require compressed air or electricity.
Maybe someone will find the info I posted useful, though.
Cheers
Gene
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Gene Keep us informed, but I avoid?air feeds like the plague. I came up with my IV drip feed I think 12 years?ago, and with the workshop that is so small that you cannot even spin a mouse around let alone a cat, this system has done me well, and thank god I hang things from the roof. I am old fashioned but with my wifes current cancer problems, we try to avoid any chemicals lurking around us. I think with the current world climatic?changes, do we really need to blast more crap into the air? Yes I have a small air compressor, but rarely use it, maybe blowing swarf out of blind holes, but never? blast the machines with air as a way to clean them. Old fashioned as I am, but no way do I blow? chips etc with air, as they will eventually find ther way under the machine beds. A good old fashioned paintbrush?and a shop vac does me. But we can all move forward and learn, innovation is the KEY to this forum's success , as we are not a group of monkeys see, monkeys do. Many thanks for your continued posts and of course your enthusiasm. Love it. Stay well . John?
Charlie,
I like the simplicity and low price of the gravity-powered system, but personally I would like to use something more predictable for unattended operation.
I am yet to build something for my recently acquired Paulimot F205-V milling machine, but I am planning this project.
In my tiny cellar workshop I don't want to consider a flood coolant system, I've read about mist coolant systems, but apparently these can make quite a mess too, with the coolant aerosol filling the whole shop - unhealthy, too.
Then I learned about a "FogBuster" system, which looks similar to a mist system, but the cutting fluid droplets are bigger in size, they are not really atomized into an aerosol, and so it's not messy and much better for one's lungs.
A quick search on the internet revealed a few DIY FogBuster builds, which are quite simple and inexpensive to implement as long as the shop has compressed air.
The general idea is that cutting fluid and air are mixed together in a mixing block, and a nozzle directs the stream to the workpiece. The cutting fluid is stored in a residential water filter housing (without a filter inside), which is inexpensive, easy to find, and easy to plumb into. Compressed air is supplied to the housing, so that oil is forced through a tube towards the mixing block. Just before the mixing block, there's a flow control valve. The additional air line also has a flow control valve near the mixing block. The two valves allow good adjustment for the amount of oil and air delivered. It's also possible to use just air to provide some cooling and blow away the chips. Both air lines (one to the filter housing, the other to the mixing block) have their own pressure regulators, which are adjusted once and then left alone.
I read about another similar system where the oil is metered and delivered by an automotive windshield washer pump.
Yet another system uses a peristaltic pump, suitable small ones are available for little money from China.
My own plan is to use a peristaltic pump to deliver the oil, and mix it with compressed air in a mixing block. Got a used medical pump on eBay for little money, called Gilson Minipuls 2.
But, for sure, the drip system you described is cheaper and quicker to rig, and doesn't require compressed air or electricity.
Maybe someone will find the info I posted useful, though.
Cheers
Gene
--
John
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John, It never occurred to me to try that. It is a simple matter to slide the flow control device closer to the dispensing end. Thanks for suggesting it! -- Regards, Charlie New Jersey, USA
SATTINGER’S LAW: It works better if you plug it in.
EDWARD'S LAW: It works even better if you turn it on.
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On Tue, Aug 17, 2021 at 11:06 AM, Gene Pavlovsky wrote:
A quick search on the internet revealed a few DIY FogBuster builds, which are quite simple and inexpensive to implement as long as the shop has compressed air.
Gene, I have read a little about this in the past, but I have not really considered it because I am not enamored of having my basement air compressor running continually. (Although I suspect that the FogBuster requires very little air flow, so maybe it would not run much at all.) Thanks for sharing the info! ?-- Regards, Charlie New Jersey, USA
SATTINGER’S LAW: It works better if you plug it in.
EDWARD'S LAW: It works even better if you turn it on.
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My Fogbuster clone runs off an airbrush compressor. Not very noisy at all. 15psi is enough since the fluid is pressurized.
Gerrit
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Gene, you mention a system employing a peristaltic pump ... do you have any links to this?? Mark and I are working on a system to drip feed my lathe bearings using such a pump.
Julian.
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A full schematic and software are available here:?
Video(s) here:?
YouTube has an automatic subtitle and translate option for those who don't understand German. It works reasonably well.
Gerrit
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Vielen Dank, Gerrit! -- Regards, Charlie New Jersey, USA
SATTINGER’S LAW: It works better if you plug it in.
EDWARD'S LAW: It works even better if you turn it on.
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Thanks, nice pump.? Looks far more up-market than the ones I'm using, but considerably more expensive.
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I cut the page into smaller pieces and translated to English and added the links. ? ? Product information "Pump control 1.5" ? With this board it is possible to control the peristaltic pump, which is necessary to fully use the ColdEND. The board takes over the control of 2 valves (air and liquid) The stepper motor is also controlled. ? There are 3 inputs on the controller. ? ??? 1. For the coolant - If this input is activated, the valve for the coolant also switches automatically ??? 2. A fast feed - this means that the minimum quantity lubrication can be filled directly when the milling machine is switched on without having to adjust the settings again. ??? That was one point that always annoyed me the most about needle valves. Here you simply press the button and the pump pumps the hose for the MQL fully again. Because despite the non-return valve, some liquid keeps pulling back in the hose over the course of the day. ??? 3. The input for switching the compressed air valve - this input can optionally be used if you only want to cool with air. If this is not desired, the inlet for the cooling lubricant and the inlet for the air can simply be bridged. ? All 3 inputs work both with 24V control voltage from the CNC control (provided that GND is connected to one another) and with a switching contact. The pump output and the duration of the "spit mode" are determined via the potentiometer. If the potentiometer for the spit mode is turned all the way to the left, it is deactivated. The function of the spit mode enables the cooling lubricant to be delivered quickly every time the minimum quantity lubrication is switched on, e.g. by means of an M7 command. Thus becomes either the cooling nozzle is filled and cooling lubricant is immediately available again on the tool. Or if more time has been set using the potentiometer the tool is pre-lubricated before it is engaged. ? The pump control board is supplied without additional components. So further components and a little soldering experience are needed to finish assembling the board! ? All links marked with * are affiliate links, if you buy with them I get a small commission, nothing changes for you. The links lead to products that are examples of what you want to use in the end with your ColdEND. It is just a matter of a suggestion. No liability is assumed for the correct functioning of components from the links! ? !ATTENTION! Unfortunately, I made a labeling error on the board with Rev. 1.3! GND and 5V for the relay board are labeled incorrectly. Here 5V = GND and vice versa. As of Rev. 1.4, this error has already been resolved! ? I do not accept any liability for injuries and / or damage to people, animals or equipment caused by working with the soldering iron or improper handling of electricity! ? Boards on which soldering work has started cannot be exchanged! ? If you have no basic electronic knowledge or have never had a soldering iron in hand, please get help from friends, acquaintances or a qualified electrician! ? Subject to changes No liability is accepted for improper use. Boards that have been assembled (soldering, etc.) cannot be exchanged. ? Related links to "Pump control 1.5" ? ??? Questions about the article?
? ??? Arduino Nano Compatible Controller *
? ??? A4988 stepper motor driver *
??? The relay board *
? ??? pump
??? The firmware for the ColdEND (now also with display)
??? More products from END-CNC
? Available downloads: ? ???Download description and assembly instructions Rev 1.3 and 1.4
? ??? Download circuit diagram Rev. 1.3 and 1.4
? ??? Download the board as a .Step file
? ??? Download description and assembly instructions Rev 1.5
? ? ?
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Gerritv
Sent: August-21-21 4:04 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [digitalhobbyist] A Drip Coolant System #MISC? A full schematic and software are available here:?
Video(s) here:?
YouTube has an automatic subtitle and translate option for those who don't understand German. It works reasonably well.
Gerrit
|
John D
Thanks I may build one? the most expensive item is the pump
John
On Sat, 21 Aug 2021 at 18:23, John Dammeyer < johnd@...> wrote: I cut the page into smaller pieces and translated to English and added the links. ? ? Product information "Pump control 1.5" ? With this board it is possible to control the peristaltic pump, which is necessary to fully use the ColdEND. The board takes over the control of 2 valves (air and liquid) The stepper motor is also controlled. ? There are 3 inputs on the controller. ? ??? 1. For the coolant - If this input is activated, the valve for the coolant also switches automatically ??? 2. A fast feed - this means that the minimum quantity lubrication can be filled directly when the milling machine is switched on without having to adjust the settings again. ??? That was one point that always annoyed me the most about needle valves. Here you simply press the button and the pump pumps the hose for the MQL fully again. Because despite the non-return valve, some liquid keeps pulling back in the hose over the course of the day. ??? 3. The input for switching the compressed air valve - this input can optionally be used if you only want to cool with air. If this is not desired, the inlet for the cooling lubricant and the inlet for the air can simply be bridged. ? All 3 inputs work both with 24V control voltage from the CNC control (provided that GND is connected to one another) and with a switching contact. The pump output and the duration of the "spit mode" are determined via the potentiometer. If the potentiometer for the spit mode is turned all the way to the left, it is deactivated. The function of the spit mode enables the cooling lubricant to be delivered quickly every time the minimum quantity lubrication is switched on, e.g. by means of an M7 command. Thus becomes either the cooling nozzle is filled and cooling lubricant is immediately available again on the tool. Or if more time has been set using the potentiometer the tool is pre-lubricated before it is engaged. ? The pump control board is supplied without additional components. So further components and a little soldering experience are needed to finish assembling the board! ? All links marked with * are affiliate links, if you buy with them I get a small commission, nothing changes for you. The links lead to products that are examples of what you want to use in the end with your ColdEND. It is just a matter of a suggestion. No liability is assumed for the correct functioning of components from the links! ? !ATTENTION! Unfortunately, I made a labeling error on the board with Rev. 1.3! GND and 5V for the relay board are labeled incorrectly. Here 5V = GND and vice versa. As of Rev. 1.4, this error has already been resolved! ? I do not accept any liability for injuries and / or damage to people, animals or equipment caused by working with the soldering iron or improper handling of electricity! ? Boards on which soldering work has started cannot be exchanged! ? If you have no basic electronic knowledge or have never had a soldering iron in hand, please get help from friends, acquaintances or a qualified electrician! ? Subject to changes No liability is accepted for improper use. Boards that have been assembled (soldering, etc.) cannot be exchanged. ? Related links to "Pump control 1.5" ? ??? Questions about the article?
? ??? Arduino Nano Compatible Controller *
? ??? A4988 stepper motor driver *
??? The relay board *
? ??? pump
??? The firmware for the ColdEND (now also with display)
??? More products from END-CNC
? Available downloads: ? ???Download description and assembly instructions Rev 1.3 and 1.4
? ??? Download circuit diagram Rev. 1.3 and 1.4
? ??? Download the board as a .Step file
? ??? Download description and assembly instructions Rev 1.5
? ? ? ? A full schematic and software are available here:?
Video(s) here:?
YouTube has an automatic subtitle and translate option for those who don't understand German. It works reasonably well.
Gerrit
--
John
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Thanks John D
The most expensive item is the pump
I may build a unit later
John L
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John
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I can get a pump in about two weeks through amazon.ca for $58 Cdn. ?Way too expensive if we're going to use the "Obliterate North American and European Manufacturing" (ONAEM) approach.? You can make this by purchasing this pump, then also order a small stepper motor from China.?
? Connectors and other bits from China. I'm sure it can be manufactured without using a single North American part or supplier. ? John Dammeyer. ? ? ? ?
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of John Lindo
Sent: August-21-21 10:25 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [digitalhobbyist] A Drip Coolant System #MISC? the most expensive item is the pump ? On Sat, 21 Aug 2021 at 18:23, John Dammeyer <johnd@...> wrote: I cut the page into smaller pieces and translated to English and added the links. ? ? Product information "Pump control 1.5" ? With this board it is possible to control the peristaltic pump, which is necessary to fully use the ColdEND. The board takes over the control of 2 valves (air and liquid) The stepper motor is also controlled. ? There are 3 inputs on the controller. ? ??? 1. For the coolant - If this input is activated, the valve for the coolant also switches automatically ??? 2. A fast feed - this means that the minimum quantity lubrication can be filled directly when the milling machine is switched on without having to adjust the settings again. ??? That was one point that always annoyed me the most about needle valves. Here you simply press the button and the pump pumps the hose for the MQL fully again. Because despite the non-return valve, some liquid keeps pulling back in the hose over the course of the day. ??? 3. The input for switching the compressed air valve - this input can optionally be used if you only want to cool with air. If this is not desired, the inlet for the cooling lubricant and the inlet for the air can simply be bridged. ? All 3 inputs work both with 24V control voltage from the CNC control (provided that GND is connected to one another) and with a switching contact. The pump output and the duration of the "spit mode" are determined via the potentiometer. If the potentiometer for the spit mode is turned all the way to the left, it is deactivated. The function of the spit mode enables the cooling lubricant to be delivered quickly every time the minimum quantity lubrication is switched on, e.g. by means of an M7 command. Thus becomes either the cooling nozzle is filled and cooling lubricant is immediately available again on the tool. Or if more time has been set using the potentiometer the tool is pre-lubricated before it is engaged. ? The pump control board is supplied without additional components. So further components and a little soldering experience are needed to finish assembling the board! ? All links marked with * are affiliate links, if you buy with them I get a small commission, nothing changes for you. The links lead to products that are examples of what you want to use in the end with your ColdEND. It is just a matter of a suggestion. No liability is assumed for the correct functioning of components from the links! ? !ATTENTION! Unfortunately, I made a labeling error on the board with Rev. 1.3! GND and 5V for the relay board are labeled incorrectly. Here 5V = GND and vice versa. As of Rev. 1.4, this error has already been resolved! ? I do not accept any liability for injuries and / or damage to people, animals or equipment caused by working with the soldering iron or improper handling of electricity! ? Boards on which soldering work has started cannot be exchanged! ? If you have no basic electronic knowledge or have never had a soldering iron in hand, please get help from friends, acquaintances or a qualified electrician! ? Subject to changes No liability is accepted for improper use. Boards that have been assembled (soldering, etc.) cannot be exchanged. ? Related links to "Pump control 1.5" ? ??? Questions about the article?
? ??? Arduino Nano Compatible Controller *
? ??? A4988 stepper motor driver *
??? The relay board *
? ??? pump
??? The firmware for the ColdEND (now also with display)
??? More products from END-CNC
? Available downloads: ? ???Download description and assembly instructions Rev 1.3 and 1.4
? ??? Download circuit diagram Rev. 1.3 and 1.4
? ??? Download the board as a .Step file
? ??? Download description and assembly instructions Rev 1.5
? ? ? ? A full schematic and software are available here:?
Video(s) here:?
YouTube has an automatic subtitle and translate option for those who don't understand German. It works reasonably well.
Gerrit
--
John
|
Hey Julian,
Here's a link to the post I've seen a peristaltic pump being used:
The maker doesn't go into a lot of detail, but you can get the general idea.
You can find a lot of these pumps by searching "dosing pump" on eBay.
From my understanding, for dosing low amounts you probably want, it's best to get one for the smallest diameter tubing.
I bought a second-hand medical pump myself, I think they are normally used for IV transfusions, for about 60 EUR, it's called Gilson Minipuls 2.
A bit bulky compared to the cheap one from eBay, but everything is integrated, and provides a very wide range of adjustment via a multi-turn potentiometer and very smooth flow due to using 10 rollers instead of 3.
Even though you didn't ask for it, in case anyone is interested, here is my other collection of links on FogBuster-style DIY systems:
Cheers
Gene
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John Lindo