Re: Managing/Processing volume
The issue for me is all about Feedback display.
Sending discrete volume levels work fine. our system uses the actual feedback of the unit to determine what the next value level will be
i.e. if I send 'x' and then receive 'x' my next increment is to send 'y', BUT if I still receive 'x' as feedback, or the unit is sluggish in returning 'y', I just send 'y' again, thinking that the unit is still at 'x' instead of 'y'
This problem results from one of two conditions
a. the unit is sluggish in returning its feedback - slower than my Inc/Dec ramping - I've seen this with a number of AVRs using RS232 and the Sony ZA series with IP control
b. The conversion from the serial text coming from the Yamaha (-80 to 16) to the Analog values are not always correct leading to weird display of the volume status
In Case A, the solution is to use a pair of analog buffers one fed with my direct ramping analog and the other with the parsed Analog from the AVR. the output of both are the FB signal going to the UI
Then I enable the first whenever I'm ramping so that the FB is just my ramping value - this provides very smooth display for the client
After 1 second of not ramping I disable Abuf 1 and enable Abuf 2, passing the ACTUAL volume level from the AVR to the UI display
This method has worked great for years with Sony ZA, Denon, Marantz, etc.
With the Yamaha units, the seeded value does not convert correctly part of the time.
The solution (So far): It seems that the Yamaha IP control delivers the volume level values fast enough that I can just use it directly as the FB without the switching, eliminating the need to have a change-over
Assuming that it continues to keep up, this will be my 'solution'...
Thanks All!
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Re: Loading VT files to CP4
I haven't heard about no spaces yet...
And this issue was resolved leaving the spaces in (Consistency, anyone! haha) - I just had to remove the brackets
Didn't work:
MiddleAtlantic RackLink Select [ipad]
Did work:
MiddleAtlantic RackLink Select - ipad
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Re: Samsung BET-H series IP Control
Was the magic packet transmitted via a Crestron processor? I have it working with Packet Sender, but my S# library for it as well as the UDP/IP symbol in Simpl are not doing the trick.
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Re: Managing/Processing volume
I just prefer to use the volume control modules available in the crestron database rather than AINC.? They already have memory for 4 volume presets built in. ? The point was that raise and lower on the AVR modules kind of sucks and they do not have an analog volume level input, so I found a way to send the direct level to the AVR precisely because it allows the AVR to be controlled like a crestron device. ? The outputs of the analog step could be connected to an EQU to and SIO to send the discrete steps. As an analog you can store it like any other signal.
As you stated, you could just use a raise/lower if the AVR has that feature and process?the feedback for user display and to store for preset/zone presets that are then decoded on recall. Lots of ways to do this.
The analog increment allows you to not deal with the rounding issues. You could always store the converted % amount and convert backed to your signed values on a preset recall. ?
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On Wed, Mar 30, 2022 at 9:50 AM MSTC < kol.mstc@...> wrote: I send the discrete volume level to the AVR.? It is much easier to deal with it that way.? Use a volume control module to generate analog value then use a bit of logic to send it.? Plus is it is then able to be treated the same as a Crestron device (SWAMP, PAD-8 . . .) and you can do the memorize preset volumes thing, initialize to a start-up level, or whatever other joy-joy stuff you might do with a multi-zone system.? Even though most of the Crestron modules I have seen use raise and lower, virtually all AVRs or processors that allow third party control allow setting volume level directly. ? For serial control of Aventage the volume direct format is @MAIN:VOL=11.0\n or @MAIN:VOL=-11.0\n.? I ASCALEL the raw volume level.? 0%,100% scales to -80, 16 (or reduce the output range to something like -50, 0 to set the volume of the AVR to a barely audible minimum and limit the top end, similar to VolMin and VolMax inputs on the PAD8.) I EQU the scaled level to get a signal for each level command.? The digitals out of EQU drive SIO. I also use AOS (* output) on the TX$ for the AVR to do a 0.2 sec disable of the EQU to allow the AVR to process the command before sending the next during ramping. ? Re: dB display - our normal clients barely understand %, dB would confuse them even more!!? HaHa!!
Re: adding the two extreme values:
I'll look at that, but I think that the basic issue is analog values being slightly different when scaled vs. our level analogs.
The root problem is that we have a consumer piece that uses Pro Audio parameters...:(
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Re: Loading VT files to CP4
It has been this way for a while- at least a year or so. Spaces are no longer allowed in mobile file names. Replace with underscore or other character.?
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Hi, ? the VLAN ?rewriting“ method you describe below sounds insane to me and i?d never even think about using that in a production environment. I can?t imagine that this is how it?s supposed to work… ? Cheers, Thorsten ? ? On Wed, Mar 30, 2022 at 2:14 PM eoqualls <ed@...> wrote: Jeff, I’m not sure how you reached the understanding that we are only point-to-point, but it is not right.? Just Add Power has always provided many-to-many functionality (our original CEDIA demo was a 5x9 many to many matrix).? This has been true since 2008.? All of our current offerings provide many-to-many support and have been successfully implemented in a wide range of settings.? This includes VLAN and Multicast implementations.? We have countless installations with 100+ devices.? For example, the Cincinnati Reds ballpark installation is a many to many with over 300 end points.
I appreciate the reply. As I said, "they are (were?)". Can you clarify if the routing method has changed? Our issue in 2010(?) was that the routing of the units we purchased for testing onsite was accomplished by rewriting switch port VLANs rather than traditional multicast network routing/IGMP Snooping. I.e. to route a JAP unit on port 1 of a switch to port 20, 25, 33 and 46 you would use the JAP software to command the network switch to change the ports to be on the same VLAN via network switch commands and the receiving JAP units would display whatever streaming video came over that VLAN. If you wanted to route across switches in larger systems, we also would have to add those VLANs to the uplink ports and command the other switches to change the target port VLANs as well. If memory serves, you could only command one switch with the JAP control software, which could be a "real" or "virtual" switch. A "real" switch system would be limited to what you could physically stack together (1U switches with stacking cables) or how many cards you could fit in, say, a Cisco 6800 chassis or similar. All of our network cables would have to be home run to that physical switch, which would have been very problematic for us. A "virtual?switch" was also possible, and would allow you to have multiple switch groups to avoid having to home run everything, i.e. the Cisco Nexus line where the core and FEC expanders can all over a site but be seen as one single switch. We'd considered that idea, but found the FEC expanders to be way too loud to be located in conference and training rooms (think Cisco 3850 fans when it first starts up...but ALL the time...yuck). SVSi, Electrosonic/Extron, Evertz, Crestron NVX (which actually wasn't available at the time of our install) and other network protocol streaming products are routed like any other network traffic. I can have all my control devices on VLAN10, streaming devices on VLAN11 and VTC camera/touch panel control on VLAN12, and those assignments never change. Rather than communicating with switches to route things around, we command the decoders directly from the Crestron control system to pull in this or that encoder stream .? If JAP products are now using standard network routing like the SVSi and NVX systems are, rather than changing switch?VLANs, that's great as that would give us another product to consider. If it's still routed via commanding network switches to change VLANs for routing, that's not something that works well for our large systems (and our network departments weren't too keen on that either). Interested in your thoughts,
Jeff ? ------------------------------------- Jeff Klein, DMC-E
Head Volunteer AV Geek
Faith Baptist Church
Glen Burnie, Maryland "Clothe yourselves, all of you, with humility toward one another, for God opposes the proud but gives grace to the humble." 1 Peter 5:5
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On Wed, Mar 30, 2022 at 2:14 PM eoqualls < ed@...> wrote: Jeff, I’m not sure how you reached the understanding that we are only point-to-point, but it is not right.? Just Add Power has always provided many-to-many functionality (our original CEDIA demo was a 5x9 many to many matrix).? This has been true since 2008.? All of our current offerings provide many-to-many support and have been successfully implemented in a wide range of settings.? This includes VLAN and Multicast implementations.? We have countless installations with 100+ devices.? For example, the Cincinnati Reds ballpark installation is a many to many with over 300 end points.
Hi Ed,? I appreciate the reply. As I said, "they are (were?)". Can you clarify if the routing method has changed? Our issue in 2010(?) was that the routing of the units we purchased for testing onsite was accomplished by rewriting switch port VLANs rather than traditional multicast network routing/IGMP Snooping. I.e. to route a JAP unit on port 1 of a switch to port 20, 25, 33 and 46 you would use the JAP software to command the network switch to change the ports to be on the same VLAN via network switch commands and the receiving JAP units would display whatever streaming video came over that VLAN. If you wanted to route across switches in larger systems, we also would have to add those VLANs to the uplink ports and command the other switches to change the target port VLANs as well. If memory serves, you could only command one switch with the JAP control software, which could be a "real" or "virtual" switch. A "real" switch system would be limited to what you could physically stack together (1U switches with stacking cables) or how many cards you could fit in, say, a Cisco 6800 chassis or similar. All of our network cables would have to be home run to that physical switch, which would have been very problematic for us. A "virtual?switch" was also possible, and would allow you to have multiple switch groups to avoid having to home run everything, i.e. the Cisco Nexus line where the core and FEC expanders can all over a site but be seen as one single switch. We'd considered that idea, but found the FEC expanders to be way too loud to be located in conference and training rooms (think Cisco 3850 fans when it first starts up...but ALL the time...yuck).
SVSi, Electrosonic/Extron, Evertz, Crestron NVX (which actually wasn't available at the time of our install) and other network protocol streaming products are routed like any other network traffic. I can have all my control devices on VLAN10, streaming devices on VLAN11 and VTC camera/touch panel control on VLAN12, and those assignments never change. Rather than communicating with switches to route things around, we command the decoders directly from the Crestron control system to pull in this or that encoder stream .?
If JAP products are now using standard network routing like the SVSi and NVX systems are, rather than changing switch?VLANs, that's great as that would give us another product to consider. If it's still routed via commanding network switches to change VLANs for routing, that's not something that works well for our large systems (and our network departments weren't too keen on that either).
Interested in your thoughts,
Jeff
------------------------------------- Jeff Klein, DMC-E
Head Volunteer AV Geek
Faith Baptist Church
Glen Burnie, Maryland
(Website / Twitter)
?/ @FBC_TechTeam "Clothe yourselves, all of you, with humility toward one another, for God opposes the proud but gives grace to the humble." 1 Peter 5:5
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Re: Loading VT files to CP4
Arrggghhh...
well, it seems that having '[ ]' in the file name of the VT file is half rejected by the 4-series...
The file name was? Blah-Blah [ipad].vtp
Took away the [ ] and it showed up...
"How many ways, Mr. Speaker...How many ways..."?
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I just ran into an issue when I can load Some VT files into the web/mobility section of a CP4, BUT not others????
Both are iPad/Crestron App files
One loads, the other doesn't - both say project successfully loaded but only one shows up in the tool
I can load the 'problem' file into a CP3 no problem
Anyone else see this issue??? I'm running the latest FW -?v2.7000.00052
TIA!
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QSYS with Mat Klucznyk Github
Hello.
I was forced to use the Github QSYS modules.
I reached out to Mat Klucznyk on FB but thought I might ask here as I have seen some previous posts.
First. I could not get the QSYS 2.21 Modules to work. The Fader MUTE ON worked. but the Toggle and OFF did not work.
And when trying to fade up/down it would only move one step and no further.?
I rolled back to version 2.0.0 and that seemed to resolve. so not sure if that is a known issue or not.?
Second. the CP4 is getting slammed with the following RX Message {"jsonrpc":"2.0","method":"ChangeGroup.Poll","params":{"Id":"1","Changes":[]}}\x00
Is that normal? should I be worried I am going to bog down the processor?
Thank you
-Scott??
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Re: calendar sync modules
also not opposed to an interfacing solution I could run on docker or a vm. Seems like there might be some program invented for another purpose that I might be able to use as middleware.
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Do you guys know of any modules for sale that could sync up with a cloud calendar and display upcoming events on a panel? No talking about fusion or room scheduling.
Basically I want to see if i could populate a list on a touch panel/dge of google calendar events for the day
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? Jeff, I’m not sure how you reached the understanding that we are only point-to-point, but it is not right.? Just Add Power has always provided many-to-many functionality (our original CEDIA demo was a 5x9 many to many matrix).? This has been true since 2008.? All of our current offerings provide many-to-many support and have been successfully implemented in a wide range of settings.? This includes VLAN and Multicast implementations.? We have countless installations with 100+ devices.? For example, the Cincinnati Reds ballpark installation is a many to many with over 300 end points. ? With regards to downmixing, we have a series of Transmitters that provide a stereo downmix at the rack/source, whilst also supporting Dolby 5.1 distribution over the LAN. ? Please send me a message if you would like to get a loaner system to evaluate the Just Add Power solution for AV over IP. ? Ed Qualls Chief Executive Officer +1-727-475-7033 ed@... ? ?
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Re: Managing/Processing volume
The outputs of the analog step could be connected to an EQU to and SIO to send the discrete steps. As an analog you can store it like any other signal.
As you stated, you could just use a raise/lower if the AVR has that feature and process?the feedback for user display and to store for preset/zone presets that are then decoded on recall. Lots of ways to do this.
The analog increment allows you to not deal with the rounding issues. You could always store the converted % amount and convert backed to your signed values on a preset recall.
I send the discrete volume level to the AVR.? It is much easier to deal with it that way.? Use a volume control module to generate analog value then use a bit of logic to send it.? Plus is it is then able to be treated the same as a Crestron device (SWAMP, PAD-8 . . .) and you can do the memorize preset volumes thing, initialize to a start-up level, or whatever other joy-joy stuff you might do with a multi-zone system.? Even though most of the Crestron modules I have seen use raise and lower, virtually all AVRs or processors that allow third party control allow setting volume level directly. ? For serial control of Aventage the volume direct format is @MAIN:VOL=11.0\n or @MAIN:VOL=-11.0\n.? I ASCALEL the raw volume level.? 0%,100% scales to -80, 16 (or reduce the output range to something like -50, 0 to set the volume of the AVR to a barely audible minimum and limit the top end, similar to VolMin and VolMax inputs on the PAD8.) I EQU the scaled level to get a signal for each level command.? The digitals out of EQU drive SIO. I also use AOS (* output) on the TX$ for the AVR to do a 0.2 sec disable of the EQU to allow the AVR to process the command before sending the next during ramping. ? Re: dB display - our normal clients barely understand %, dB would confuse them even more!!? HaHa!!
Re: adding the two extreme values:
I'll look at that, but I think that the basic issue is analog values being slightly different when scaled vs. our level analogs.
The root problem is that we have a consumer piece that uses Pro Audio parameters...:(
|
Re: Managing/Processing volume
I send the discrete volume level to the AVR.? It is much easier to deal with it that way.? Use a volume control module to generate analog value then use a bit of logic to send it.? Plus is it is then able to be treated the same as a Crestron device (SWAMP, PAD-8 . . .) and you can do the memorize preset volumes thing, initialize to a start-up level, or whatever other joy-joy stuff you might do with a multi-zone system.? Even though most of the Crestron modules I have seen use raise and lower, virtually all AVRs or processors that allow third party control allow setting volume level directly. ? For serial control of Aventage the volume direct format is @MAIN:VOL=11.0\n or @MAIN:VOL=-11.0\n.? I ASCALEL the raw volume level.? 0%,100% scales to -80, 16 (or reduce the output range to something like -50, 0 to set the volume of the AVR to a barely audible minimum and limit the top end, similar to VolMin and VolMax inputs on the PAD8.) I EQU the scaled level to get a signal for each level command. ?The digitals out of EQU drive SIO. I also use AOS (* output) on the TX$ for the AVR to do a 0.2 sec disable of the EQU to allow the AVR to process the command before sending the next during ramping. ? Re: dB display - our normal clients barely understand %, dB would confuse them even more!!? HaHa!!
Re: adding the two extreme values:
I'll look at that, but I think that the basic issue is analog values being slightly different when scaled vs. our level analogs.
The root problem is that we have a consumer piece that uses Pro Audio parameters...:(
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Re: Managing/Processing volume
Have you tried using an Analog Increment set to the actual 97 steps that you are using? The delayed feedback would force it back in a native format so that you aren't dealing with rounding issues.
You could then use an Analog Scaler with IO Limits to present a % to the use that is never used in the actual control and feedback correction.
?Re: dB display - our normal clients barely understand %, dB would confuse them even more!!? HaHa!!“ ? Ouch! ? ? ? ? Re: dB display - our normal clients barely understand %, dB would confuse them even more!!? HaHa!!
Re: adding the two extreme values:
I'll look at that, but I think that the basic issue is analog values being slightly different when scaled vs. our level analogs.
The root problem is that we have a consumer piece that uses Pro Audio parameters...:(
|
Re: Managing/Processing volume
?Re: dB display - our normal clients barely understand %, dB would confuse them even more!!? HaHa!!“ ? Ouch! ? ? ? ? Re: dB display - our normal clients barely understand %, dB would confuse them even more!!? HaHa!!
Re: adding the two extreme values:
I'll look at that, but I think that the basic issue is analog values being slightly different when scaled vs. our level analogs.
The root problem is that we have a consumer piece that uses Pro Audio parameters...:(
|
Re: Managing/Processing volume
Re: dB display - our normal clients barely understand %, dB would confuse them even more!!? HaHa!!
Re: adding the two extreme values:
I'll look at that, but I think that the basic issue is analog values being slightly different when scaled vs. our level analogs.
The root problem is that we have a consumer piece that uses Pro Audio parameters...:(
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Topics in Home Automation - New Article in Residential Tech Today
My latest article, "NFC Tags – An Inexpensive Smart Home
Automation Application” is being published by the good folks at
Residential Tech Today Magazine on their web site.
If you are interested in, for example:
- Using your smart phone to open your garage overhead door by
simply tapping the phone against the wood that frames the garage
door
- Using your smart phone to control outdoor lighting by simply
tapping the phone against the arm of your favorite outdoor chair
Then NFC tags provide an easy, and inexpensive, way to accomplish
this; and much more.
The article looks at what NFC tags are, how they can be used in a
smart home, and how to integrate them into a number of different
smart home platforms.? For Crestron programmers the article
includes a link to a driver I've written that can be downloaded
from my GitHub.
You can find the article here:?
For those interested in earlier articles that I've written, you
can find those here:
Finally, for those that want to see even more content I've written
about smart home technology you can find that here:
Thanks
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I tried various different modules from the sx80 v1.4 to Cisco room devices 4.0.? At the end?of the day I used a combination of the SX80 v2.3.9 and some serial I/Os for certain xcommand functions we needed.
?
We have 3 deployments with this combination and it has worked?well.
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BruteForceIsUnderRated