--- In YaesuTuner@yahoogroups.com, JD Baillie wrote:
>>> The tuner (coupler) should not need a counterpoise just a good
ground. That's why it is called a random wire length tuner. The tuner
should also be length insensitive (to a point - it won't tune a loop).
'73, JD, VA7BTL<<<

That is true about the ground. A counterpoise, however, will help in
antenna efficiency (an antenna in seawater is a whole different
story). This is also mentioned in SGC's own website
"".
And, while the coupler (and all similar auto couplers) SHOULD be
"length insensitive", they are not. That's why it JR should try adding
or subtracting the length. BTW, the FC-40 and others will tune loops.
I'm using a 205' hybrid delta loop right now with my AH-4 coupler
(with no ground rod).
73, Jeff/wb0m

I thought the rebar was to far from
> the tuner so I drove a 5 foot chunk of copper pipe into the ground
> right below the tuner. Testing afterward showed that I could only
> tune 20 meters through 6 meters. I am baffled by this. Clearly the
> copper tube and shorter ground wire should function better that the
> rebar and 15 feet of wire or is the long ground wire to the rebar
> acting like a counterpoise?

You have a good ground now, but a counterpoise is also needed. Add as
much wire as possible in the crawl space, but a couple of wire as far
apart as possible as long as possible in all directions of possible
(check a counterpoise diagram for any vertical antenna and you'll get
the idea). You will also need to add or subtract wire from your
antenna. Here's some "favorable" wire lengths from the AH-4 reflector,
with the range parenthesis.
40' (35-44)
58' (52-64)
76' (70-81)

73, Jeff/wb0m

----- Original Message -----

From: kb5oze

To: YaesuTuner@...

Sent: Tuesday, December 30, 2008 12:47 PM

Subject: [YaesuTuner] Re: Coax and output wire size + 80 meters

JR,
I have also run the FC-40 as well as SGCs' and SEA couplers. One
thing I have noticed is that the couplers sometimes have a problem
with 1/2 wavelength wires. I would either take off about 10' of wire
or add about 10' of wire on the radiating element. I have run the FC-
40 with a 9' whip and also with 48' of wire with pretty good success.

Let us know how it works out.

Thanks,

Mike-KB5OZE

--- In YaesuTuner@yahoogroups.com, "jay_hendershott"
wrote:
>
> Thanks for all the helpful information. I have found a combination
> that works pretty well although I still cannot tune 75/80 meters.
I
> am really baffled though about the current ground setup. The
ground
> I have in plave is the original 4' long rebar. It is approximately
> 15 feet away from the tuner with a 12 guage wire running from the
> tuner to the rebat. I am able to tune 160, 40, 20 up to 6 meters.
I
> can not tune 80 or 30 meters. I thought the rebar was to far from
> the tuner so I drove a 5 foot chunk of copper pipe into the ground
> right below the tuner. Testing afterward showed that I could only
> tune 20 meters through 6 meters. I am baffled by this. Clearly
the
> copper tube and shorter ground wire should function better that the
> rebar and 15 feet of wire or is the long ground wire to the rebar
> acting like a counterpoise? I tried running counterpoises with the
> copper pipe but they seemed to make no difference. I am limited on
> counterpoise because the tuner is located in my crawl space. It
> would not be easy for me to move the tuner outside. I made a few
> contacts over the weekend, one being a station in Tokyo, Japan so I
> cannot complain but I would like to get 75/80 meters back. One
> poster noted the addition of a capacitior in series with the output
> wire. How should I determine size and rating of the capacitior?
> Again thanks for the help, it has been a learning experience so
far.
>
> --- In YaesuTuner@yahoogroups.com, "wb0m" wrote:
> >
> > Is there anyway to move the coupler outside the house? Your
antenna
> > starts at the coupler, which means you are probably getting RFI
and
> > such from a couple of thing: your antenna is radiating next to
all
> the
> > wires in the house and your ground my not be sufficient. Is the
> ground
> > rod driven into the dirt? And copper will work better than rebar.
> > Your long wire antenna sounds fine in length, but you still need a
> > counterpoise of some sort. Also, there my be high voltage at the
end
> > of the antenna so if anyone can come in contact with it, you might
> > move it up out of the way. - Jeff/wb0m
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > --- In YaesuTuner@yahoogroups.com, "jay_hendershott"
> wrote:
> > The antenna starts off at the corner of my
> > > fence which is about 5' up from the ground. It then runs
> straight to
> > > the top peak of my house which is about 30'+ high. This run is
> about
> > > 65'. The wire passes through a ceramic insulator then it comes
> down
> > > to the left corner of my house were it is looped in a ceramic
> > > insulator. It then passes through the wall to the tuner which
is
> > > inside the crawl space. The tail from the insulator to the
tuner
> is
> > > about 14 inches long. I have buried a 4' long piece of rebar
> into the
> > > moist dirt of the crawl space. I attached a ground rod lug and
a
> > > piece of 12 guage wire from the tuner to the lug. One question
I
> have
> > > , does distance from ground rod to tuner matter? After some
> testing
> > > last night I confirmed again that I cannot tune 80 or 30
meters.
> I
> > > have also picked up rfi in one tv and the surround sound of
> another.
> > > This was not a problem with my OCF. Hope this helps, I will be
> > > experimenting more today. Thanks again.
> > >
> > > 73
> > >
> > > JR
> > >
> > >
> > > > Hi JR,
> > > > You shouldn't have to do anything to the tuner. This tuner,
> or more
> > > > accurately, antenna coupler, is a great tuner when used
> correctly
> > > > (similar to Icom's AH-4. and SCG couplers).
> > > > We need more info on your antenna. You said you're have
about
> 90'of
> > > > wire, but how is it set up, i.e. long wire, inverted L, etc.)
> and most
> > > > importantly, what are you using for a counterpoise?
> > > > And the coax is fine. The SWR from the tuner to your radio
> will
> > > > (almost) always be around 1.5 to 1 so loss should low, even
with
> > > > longer lengths.
> > > > I will also e-mail a PDF on antenna's from the SCG company.
> It's very
> > > > good reading. I use an AH-4 with a vertical loop, about 200'
of
> wire.
> > > > Keep asking questions and we'll help. 73, Jeff/wb0m
> > > >
> > >
> >
>

----- Original Message -----

From: jay_hendershott

To: YaesuTuner@...

Sent: Monday, December 29, 2008 9:21 PM

Subject: [YaesuTuner] Re: Coax and output wire size + 80 meters

Thanks for all the helpful information. I have found a combination
that works pretty well although I still cannot tune 75/80 meters. I
am really baffled though about the current ground setup. The ground
I have in plave is the original 4' long rebar. It is approximately
15 feet away from the tuner with a 12 guage wire running from the
tuner to the rebat. I am able to tune 160, 40, 20 up to 6 meters. I
can not tune 80 or 30 meters. I thought the rebar was to far from
the tuner so I drove a 5 foot chunk of copper pipe into the ground
right below the tuner. Testing afterward showed that I could only
tune 20 meters through 6 meters. I am baffled by this. Clearly the
copper tube and shorter ground wire should function better that the
rebar and 15 feet of wire or is the long ground wire to the rebar
acting like a counterpoise? I tried running counterpoises with the
copper pipe but they seemed to make no difference. I am limited on
counterpoise because the tuner is located in my crawl space. It
would not be easy for me to move the tuner outside. I made a few
contacts over the weekend, one being a station in Tokyo, Japan so I
cannot complain but I would like to get 75/80 meters back. One
poster noted the addition of a capacitior in series with the output
wire. How should I determine size and rating of the capacitior?
Again thanks for the help, it has been a learning experience so far.

--- In YaesuTuner@yahoogroups.com, "wb0m" wrote:
>
> Is there anyway to move the coupler outside the house? Your antenna
> starts at the coupler, which means you are probably getting RFI and
> such from a couple of thing: your antenna is radiating next to all
the
> wires in the house and your ground my not be sufficient. Is the
ground
> rod driven into the dirt? And copper will work better than rebar.
> Your long wire antenna sounds fine in length, but you still need a
> counterpoise of some sort. Also, there my be high voltage at the end
> of the antenna so if anyone can come in contact with it, you might
> move it up out of the way. - Jeff/wb0m
>
>
>
>
> --- In YaesuTuner@yahoogroups.com, "jay_hendershott"
wrote:
> The antenna starts off at the corner of my
> > fence which is about 5' up from the ground. It then runs
straight to
> > the top peak of my house which is about 30'+ high. This run is
about
> > 65'. The wire passes through a ceramic insulator then it comes
down
> > to the left corner of my house were it is looped in a ceramic
> > insulator. It then passes through the wall to the tuner which is
> > inside the crawl space. The tail from the insulator to the tuner
is
> > about 14 inches long. I have buried a 4' long piece of rebar
into the
> > moist dirt of the crawl space. I attached a ground rod lug and a
> > piece of 12 guage wire from the tuner to the lug. One question I
have
> > , does distance from ground rod to tuner matter? After some
testing
> > last night I confirmed again that I cannot tune 80 or 30 meters.
I
> > have also picked up rfi in one tv and the surround sound of
another.
> > This was not a problem with my OCF. Hope this helps, I will be
> > experimenting more today. Thanks again.
> >
> > 73
> >
> > JR
> >
> >
> > > Hi JR,
> > > You shouldn't have to do anything to the tuner. This tuner,
or more
> > > accurately, antenna coupler, is a great tuner when used
correctly
> > > (similar to Icom's AH-4. and SCG couplers).
> > > We need more info on your antenna. You said you're have about
90'of
> > > wire, but how is it set up, i.e. long wire, inverted L, etc.)
and most
> > > importantly, what are you using for a counterpoise?
> > > And the coax is fine. The SWR from the tuner to your radio
will
> > > (almost) always be around 1.5 to 1 so loss should low, even with
> > > longer lengths.
> > > I will also e-mail a PDF on antenna's from the SCG company.
It's very
> > > good reading. I use an AH-4 with a vertical loop, about 200' of
wire.
> > > Keep asking questions and we'll help. 73, Jeff/wb0m
> > >
> >
>

fence which is about 5' up from the ground. It then runs straight to
the top peak of my house which is about 30'+ high. This run is about
65'. The wire passes through a ceramic insulator then it comes down
to the left corner of my house were it is looped in a ceramic
insulator. It then passes through the wall to the tuner which is
inside the crawl space. The tail from the insulator to the tuner is
about 14 inches long. I have buried a 4' long piece of rebar into the
moist dirt of the crawl space. I attached a ground rod lug and a
piece of 12 guage wire from the tuner to the lug. One question I have
, does distance from ground rod to tuner matter? After some testing
last night I confirmed again that I cannot tune 80 or 30 meters. I
have also picked up rfi in one tv and the surround sound of another.
This was not a problem with my OCF. Hope this helps, I will be
experimenting more today. Thanks again.

73

JR

Hi JR,
You shouldn't have to do anything to the tuner. This tuner, or more
accurately, antenna coupler, is a great tuner when used correctly
(similar to Icom's AH-4. and SCG couplers).
We need more info on your antenna. You said you're have about 90'of
wire, but how is it set up, i.e. long wire, inverted L, etc.) and most
importantly, what are you using for a counterpoise?
And the coax is fine. The SWR from the tuner to your radio will
(almost) always be around 1.5 to 1 so loss should low, even with
longer lengths.
I will also e-mail a PDF on antenna's from the SCG company. It's very
good reading. I use an AH-4 with a vertical loop, about 200' of wire.
Keep asking questions and we'll help. 73, Jeff/wb0m

----- Original Message -----

From: jay_hendershott

To: YaesuTuner@...

Sent: Sunday, December 21, 2008 4:32 PM

Subject: [YaesuTuner] Re: Coax and output wire size + 80 meters

Thanks for the replies. The antenna starts off at the corner of my
fence which is about 5' up from the ground. It then runs straight to
the top peak of my house which is about 30'+ high. This run is about
65'. The wire passes through a ceramic insulator then it comes down
to the left corner of my house were it is looped in a ceramic
insulator. It then passes through the wall to the tuner which is
inside the crawl space. The tail from the insulator to the tuner is
about 14 inches long. I have buried a 4' long piece of rebar into the
moist dirt of the crawl space. I attached a ground rod lug and a
piece of 12 guage wire from the tuner to the lug. One question I have
, does distance from ground rod to tuner matter? After some testing
last night I confirmed again that I cannot tune 80 or 30 meters. I
have also picked up rfi in one tv and the surround sound of another.
This was not a problem with my OCF. Hope this helps, I will be
experimenting more today. Thanks again.

73

JR

> Hi JR,
> You shouldn't have to do anything to the tuner. This tuner, or more
> accurately, antenna coupler, is a great tuner when used correctly
> (similar to Icom's AH-4. and SCG couplers).
> We need more info on your antenna. You said you're have about 90'of
> wire, but how is it set up, i.e. long wire, inverted L, etc.) and most
> importantly, what are you using for a counterpoise?
> And the coax is fine. The SWR from the tuner to your radio will
> (almost) always be around 1.5 to 1 so loss should low, even with
> longer lengths.
> I will also e-mail a PDF on antenna's from the SCG company. It's very
> good reading. I use an AH-4 with a vertical loop, about 200' of wire.
> Keep asking questions and we'll help. 73, Jeff/wb0m
>

----- Original Message -----

From: wb0m

To: YaesuTuner@...

Sent: Sunday, December 21, 2008 3:46 PM

Subject: [YaesuTuner] Re: Coax and output wire size + 80 meters

--- In YaesuTuner@yahoogroups.com, "jay_hendershott" wrote:
. I do need to find a way to get at
> least 75/80 back into the mix. Anyways wondering if anyone has
> upgraded the input connection cable and the internal output wire size?
> If so was any improvement noted? I believe that the benefits would
> not outway the time, effort and risk but I could be wrong. Any hints
> on gaining 75/80 meters back would be appreciated. Thanks and 73
>
> JR
> K7GFH

Hi JR,
You shouldn't have to do anything to the tuner. This tuner, or more
accurately, antenna coupler, is a great tuner when used correctly
(similar to Icom's AH-4. and SCG couplers).
We need more info on your antenna. You said you're have about 90'of
wire, but how is it set up, i.e. long wire, inverted L, etc.) and most
importantly, what are you using for a counterpoise?
And the coax is fine. The SWR from the tuner to your radio will
(almost) always be around 1.5 to 1 so loss should low, even with
longer lengths.
I will also e-mail a PDF on antenna's from the SCG company. It's very
good reading. I use an AH-4 with a vertical loop, about 200' of wire.
Keep asking questions and we'll help. 73, Jeff/wb0m

Hi JR,
You shouldn't have to do anything to the tuner. This tuner, or more
accurately, antenna coupler, is a great tuner when used correctly
(similar to Icom's AH-4. and SCG couplers).
We need more info on your antenna. You said you're have about 90'of
wire, but how is it set up, i.e. long wire, inverted L, etc.) and most
importantly, what are you using for a counterpoise?
And the coax is fine. The SWR from the tuner to your radio will
(almost) always be around 1.5 to 1 so loss should low, even with
longer lengths.
I will also e-mail a PDF on antenna's from the SCG company. It's very
good reading. I use an AH-4 with a vertical loop, about 200' of wire.
Keep asking questions and we'll help. 73, Jeff/wb0m

----- Original Message -----

From: jay_hendershott

To: YaesuTuner@...

Sent: Saturday, December 20, 2008 5:43 PM

Subject: [YaesuTuner] Coax and output wire size + 80 meters

Hello,

New to the group and to the FC-40. I have owned an 857D for a few
years now running barefoot into a homebrew OCF. Within the last few
days I purchased the FC-40 and have strung up about 90' of wire. After
looking over the FC-40 I found it a little odd that they supply you
with 8X or larger coax but the connection into the unit is RG-58
sized. Internally the output wire which connects to the ceramic
insulator seems a little small, sized 12 guage wire. Not trying to
sound negative here, the unit works great. The only bands I cannot
tune now is 80 and 30 meters. I have never been able to tune 160 on
my OCf which is exciting for me. I do need to find a way to get at
least 75/80 back into the mix. Anyways wondering if anyone has
upgraded the input connection cable and the internal output wire size?
If so was any improvement noted? I believe that the benefits would
not outway the time, effort and risk but I could be wrong. Any hints
on gaining 75/80 meters back would be appreciated. Thanks and 73

JR
K7GFH