|
T he original OEM battery for FT-60 is NiMH chemistry, rated 7.2V nom, and involves 6 x 1.2V cells. Today we get Lithium cells type 18650, rated 3.6V nominal and it should be possible to power the FT-60R with two Lithium cells to get the same voltage level as the original OEM battery. I know this change is not just replacing the cells as it requires extras like a BMS board and possibly a new/different charger to suit. The original wall-wart may not work.?
?
I wonder if anyone has tried making a case that can hold two 18650 cells using a 3D printer. Any thoughts or leads??
?
Thanks?
Prasad
AB3EH
|
I use 2500mAH Maha NiMH AA cells in the Yaesu FBA-25 tray.
Double the longevity.
THEN I improve my antenna and turn TX power down to 2W - doubling AGAIN my?
battery life. (If you are not making it at 2W line-of-sight 2M/440, you won't make it at 5W.)
So that quadruples battery life.
And to make 'em last even longer: Use an audio accessory - speaker-mic or earpiiece.
What is the first thing you do with the VOLume control when using an earpiece? You
turn the VOLume DOWN ... what eats up batteries? Keying the mic to TX, and LOUD audio ...
Clint K6LCS
www.work-sat.com
?
PS Worked an astronaut at 2W when he was about 450 miles downrange ...?
https://www.work-sat.com/iss-062814.html
--
Clint Bradford K6LCS
http//www.work-sat.com
|
Clint
Thanks. All points taken. They are great ideas. I still want to go the Lithium way because it is new tech with a few advantages over NiMH. I love them for a couple of reasons - like, they hold charge much longer and their charge density is far superior to NiMH. You can leave them alone and pick them up after a year and you will still see them at the same level of charge. NiMH cells do not behave that way. Moreover, NiMH cells die too soon compared to Lithium-Ion. I have built a couple of batteries for other applications using Lithium 18650 cells with good experience.?
Prasad
AB3EH
|
Aren’t the batteries your talking about a good bit larger than AA?
Tom
|
AA cell measures 49.2–50.5 mm (1.94–1.99 in) in length, including the button terminal—and 13.5–14.5 mm (0.53–0.57 in) in diameter.
The 18650 part number provides it nominal dimensions. The first two digits of the part number indicate the cell is 18 mm in diameter. The last three digits provide the length of 65 mm.
On April 20, 2021 at 7:52 PM, "Tom via groups.io" <tjgerard@...> wrote: Aren’t the batteries your talking about a good bit larger than AA?
Tom
|
On Tue, Apr 20, 2021 at 03:54 PM, Prasad wrote:
... Istill want to go the Lithium way because it is new tech with a few advantages over NiMH.?
?NiMH good for 2-3 times the total number of discharge-charge cycles of Lithium. Yes, Lithium holds its charge longer. But I don’t charge up a pack and leave it un-used for a year.
Lithium perform better in freezing environments. I live in Southern California - if it gets below 60, we start dying ...
--
Clint Bradford K6LCS
http//www.work-sat.com
|
I put together one of these for my FT-60r.
If you already use 18650 cells for other applications then it’s nice to have the option for your ft-60. By the time you 3D print, source parts, wire up the BMS, figure out a charging solution, and procure a couple 18650 cells, you’re deep into another hobby.
|
Will you share the following?
"source parts, wire up the BMS, figure out a charging solution"
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
-------- Original message -------- From: "Luis Vasquez via groups.io" <looiz@...> Date: 4/21/21 7:39 AM (GMT-05:00) Subject: Re: [Yaesu-FT-60] Making 3D printed battery case for FT-60R
I put together one of these for my FT-60r.
If you already use 18650 cells for other applications then it’s nice to have the option for your ft-60. By the time you 3D print, source parts, wire up the BMS, figure out a charging solution, and procure a couple 18650 cells, you’re deep into another hobby.
|
UNLESS you are already deep into another hobby!??
On Wednesday, April 21, 2021, 06:39:28 AM PDT, Christian Sweningsen KD2LIN <csweningsen@...> wrote:
Will you share the following?
"source parts, wire up the BMS, figure out a charging solution"
-------- Original message -------- From: "Luis Vasquez via groups.io" <looiz@...> Date: 4/21/21 7:39 AM (GMT-05:00) Subject: Re: [Yaesu-FT-60] Making 3D printed battery case for FT-60R
I put together one of these for my FT-60r.
If you already use 18650 cells for other applications then it’s nice to have the option for your ft-60. By the time you 3D print, source parts, wire up the BMS, figure out a charging solution, and procure a couple 18650 cells, you’re deep into another hobby.
|
Before anything else,
"I use 2500mAH Maha NiMH AA cells in the Yaesu FBA-25 tray."
-Clint Bradford K6LCS
If you look through the link posted, there is information on the parts needed, including a wiring diagram.?
I used??to have the parts printed. I usually have 2 sets printed just in case. That case was really well designed. ColdWarPatriot did a great job and he also has a charger. You might want to order/print that at the same time.
The BMS is a common 2s1p (2 series 1 parallel for 7.4v) for lithium ion cells. There is a??on Thingiverse, but these things are common and you can get them on Amazon sooner/quicker. I used something like?. I ordered a couple extra just in case.
I ordered the battery contacts mentioned on Thingiverse off?. Hopefully there are sellers selling smaller packs of 4 or so.
Then you need some 18650 cells. That's really a personal preference. I had some laying around for other projects. Search Google or Reddit for a source of quality 18650 cells. Having a backup pair and a way to charge them out of the pack is handy.
Some things I assume you have because this is ham radio related: solder, soldering iron, electrical tape, random small screws (pair), random lengths of thiner-gauge wire (24/26), ingenuity, desire to tinker and learn.
If your taking on this project and have built similar packs it should be no problem; microscopic compared to some DIY packs being built. If this is your first battery pack build, order a few extra parts just in case. If the first time around doesn't work out, try again. If you nail it first time, build a second one.
|
Hello, Luis et. al.,
Wow, this looks like a great solution!? Could you share with us how much it cost to buy the printed part?
I just bought a used FT-60R.? Its battery was worn out.? I cut through the thin covering plastic with a knife and found that 2 of the 6 AA NiMH cells have failed.? Rather than replace them, I'm considering the lithium route, too.? I could install 6 unprotected Li-ion AA cylindrical cells and wire them in series-parallel, but I'm concerned the parallel wiring might bring unpleasant surprises further down the road.? I found some lithium polymer pouch cells on ebay that should fit inside the original holder.? I also found a battery tray for USD$5 on Amazon, into which I could simply install 6 2.5 Ah NiMH cells; that's a much easier solution.? I'm still interested in the Li-Po solution.? It costs about the same and gives about the same capacity.? It's a lot more work, but it will be lighter.? Has anyone else tried the pouch cell route?
Halden VE7UTS
|
Halden,
I had mine repacked with high quality NiMH cells and haven't looked back.
Andrew VK5CV
?
Sent from for Windows 10
?
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
From: HF via groups.io
Sent: Monday, 24 May 2021 1:59 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [Yaesu-FT-60] Making 3D printed battery case for FT-60R
?
Hello, Luis et. al.,
Wow, this looks like a great solution!? Could you share with us how much it cost to buy the printed part?
I just bought a used FT-60R.? Its battery was worn out.? I cut through the thin covering plastic with a knife and found that 2 of the 6 AA NiMH cells have failed.? Rather than replace them, I'm considering the lithium route, too.? I could install 6 unprotected
Li-ion AA cylindrical cells and wire them in series-parallel, but I'm concerned the parallel wiring might bring unpleasant surprises further down the road.? I found some lithium polymer pouch cells on ebay that should fit inside the original holder.? I also
found a battery tray for USD$5 on Amazon, into which I could simply install 6 2.5 Ah NiMH cells; that's a much easier solution.? I'm still interested in the Li-Po solution.? It costs about the same and gives about the same capacity.? It's a lot more work,
but it will be lighter.? Has anyone else tried the pouch cell route?
Halden VE7UTS
|
Why go to Lithium?
The Yaesu FBA-25 works perfectly for Maha 2700 mAH NiMH cells.
--
Clint Bradford K6LCS
http//www.work-sat.com
|
Reduce weight.? The radio with antenna, battery case, and 6 NiMH 2.5 Ah Energizer cells has mass 364g.? I expect that substituting pouch cells will get this down to 251g which is only a little heavier than my UV-82 (227g).
-Halden VE7UTS
|
Weight difference? Just don't super-size your fries next meal ... (g)
Modern NiMh cells will provide close to 750 charge-discharge cycles. Lithium about half as many.
--
Clint Bradford K6LCS
http//www.work-sat.com
|
Where do you get your numbers for lithium cells? Bot what Bioenno had to say.
Christian KD2LIN?
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
-------- Original message -------- From: "Clint Bradford via groups.io" <clintbradford@...> Date: 5/24/21 7:09 PM (GMT-05:00) Subject: Re: [Yaesu-FT-60] Making 3D printed battery case for FT-60R
Weight difference? Just don't super-size your fries next meal ... (g) Modern NiMh cells will provide close to 750 charge-discharge cycles. Lithium about half as many. -- Clint Bradford K6LCS http//www.work-sat.com
|
HF,
I used Treatstock for printing. Cost was $7.35 USD plus shipping to have the parts printed. Once you load the drawings on Treatstock you can select materials color etc. and you will be given a list of printers and their cost to print. With smaller parts like these I order two sets and shipping costs the same.
If you could get these printed locally it might be cheaper.
Best of luck with the build.
KN6DMO
|
Guys,?
I had started this thread and here is my progress on this project. I bought a couple of Yaesu battery cases type FBA-25A. This case is meant to take 6 AA alkaline cells. I want to fit two 18650 cells in this case. I plan to use my mini-mill to cut two slots at the back of this case to accommodate the 18650 cells. I plan to reuse the contact hardware (the spring that goes at the negative side and the positive point) recovered from FBA-25A. The Li-Ion cells will go vertically and stick out at the back. (Finally, I plan on making a 3D printed shield to cover the exposed portion of these cells and this will be at the end of the project).
Oh, I have also procured a BMS circuit board for two Li-Ion cells. This tiny board will fit inside between the two 18650 cells. I have the feeling that the original wall wart charger may work.?
I read some comments on the Li-Ion cells. No, they are not low charge/discharge cycle limited. 18650 cells are used by Tesla in their cars and they last for many years. I have also studied the cells removed from laptop batteries. In most cases, the cells are still good though the laptops may have rejected them. This is the problem with the BMS board. I have replaced the BMS board in a couple of failed laptop batteries and the batteries work fine after that. That proves my point. I like Li-Ion 18650 cells because they carry a lot more mAH capacity and should last longer than NiMH.?
Thanks
73
Prasad AB3EH
|
Thanks, Prasad, for that update.? I'm also fond of the 18650 Li-ion cells.? I like them much more than the pouch cells because I think they're more durable, less likely to fail due to the dendrite effect.? Unfortunately, they're a little heavier.? If I proceed with the pouch cells I'll be careful not to compress them.
I have developed the habit of buying my 18650 cells from Tenergy and other brands that seem to care about the value of their brand.? I test their capacity when they arrive.? Until a few years ago, I would find that the less-expensive cells had about 10-20% of the seller's claimed capacity.? I got my money back, but it was a waste of my time.
Once your project is done, I'll be curious to learn what the weight or mass of the new battery pack turns out to be and what scheme you develop for charging it.
Cheers
Halden VE7UTS
|
Clint
What is the average life that you are getting with the NiMH batteries in the tray?
Mike W5SKK
|
Clint Bradford