X-Air H Brake upgrade info

[email protected] All Messages By This Member #12458 Hey All, I recently bought a 2008 X - Air H. With original type shoes brakes. I was wanting Idea's about brake upgrade info. Thanks? Todd? Mooresboro, N,C,??
Clive Cunningham All Messages By This Member #12459 开云体育 I have fitted disc brakes to mine.? Using mechanical cable operated calipers and stainless steel disc rotors.? Fabricated mounts from aluminium. Not pretty, I admit, but works fantastic! ?Way more braking with less pedal effort. Probably shouldn't say where the brakes came from, but they are Shimano, and the shop had lots of lycra/ spandex pants for sale...... Cliffy.? Clive Cunningham K&M HD Motorcycles U2 5-9 Kingston Ave? Richmond? South Australia 5033?? Ph +61 8? 8234 1090? kmmotor@... kmmotorcycles.com.au toggle quoted message Show quoted text From: [email protected] <[email protected]> on behalf of gillis@... <gillis@...> Sent: Sunday, 11 December 2022 5:13 AM To: [email protected] <[email protected]> Subject: [XAIR] X-Air H Brake upgrade info ? Hey All, I recently bought a 2008 X - Air H. With original type shoes brakes. I was wanting Idea's about brake upgrade info. Thanks? Todd? Mooresboro, N,C,?? 20201115_104210_resized.jpg 20201115_104159_resized.jpg
Justin Gregoris All Messages By This Member #12460 开云体育 Hello Clive May you take more pictures of your aftermarket design in regards to your front and rear landing gear / suspension system on your X Air?? I am quite interested in what you did and how you like it - do you still have the bungee cord system in conjunction with the shocks? If you may please elaborate on how you changed from bungees to shocks with measurements and/or overall design and size of actual shocks - would be greatly appreciated!? Thanks Justin? toggle quoted message Show quoted text From: [email protected] <[email protected]> on behalf of Clive Cunningham <kmmotor@...> Sent: Sunday, December 11, 2022 6:48:40 PM To: [email protected] <[email protected]> Subject: Re: [XAIR] X-Air H Brake upgrade info ? I have fitted disc brakes to mine.? Using mechanical cable operated calipers and stainless steel disc rotors.? Fabricated mounts from aluminium. Not pretty, I admit, but works fantastic! ?Way more braking with less pedal effort. Probably shouldn't say where the brakes came from, but they are Shimano, and the shop had lots of lycra/ spandex pants for sale...... Cliffy.? Clive Cunningham K&M HD Motorcycles U2 5-9 Kingston Ave? Richmond? South Australia 5033?? Ph +61 8? 8234 1090? kmmotor@... kmmotorcycles.com.au From: [email protected] <[email protected]> on behalf of gillis@... <gillis@...> Sent: Sunday, 11 December 2022 5:13 AM To: [email protected] <[email protected]> Subject: [XAIR] X-Air H Brake upgrade info ? Hey All, I recently bought a 2008 X - Air H. With original type shoes brakes. I was wanting Idea's about brake upgrade info. Thanks? Todd? Mooresboro, N,C,??
Clive Cunningham All Messages By This Member #12461 开云体育 Ah, I may have introduced confusion! The disc brakes are on my X -Air standard, with shocks I also own an X-Air Hanuman, which has the bungee suspension. I will be putting the disc system on that one soon, now I have proven that it works! Cheers, Clive Cunningham K&M HD Motorcycles U2 5-9 Kingston Ave? Richmond? South Australia 5033?? Ph +61 8? 8234 1090? kmmotor@... kmmotorcycles.com.au toggle quoted message Show quoted text From: [email protected] <[email protected]> on behalf of Justin Gregoris <jgregoris789@...> Sent: Monday, 12 December 2022 12:34 PM To: [email protected] <[email protected]> Subject: Re: [XAIR] X-Air H Brake upgrade info ? Hello Clive May you take more pictures of your aftermarket design in regards to your front and rear landing gear / suspension system on your X Air?? I am quite interested in what you did and how you like it - do you still have the bungee cord system in conjunction with the shocks? If you may please elaborate on how you changed from bungees to shocks with measurements and/or overall design and size of actual shocks - would be greatly appreciated!? Thanks Justin? From: [email protected] <[email protected]> on behalf of Clive Cunningham <kmmotor@...> Sent: Sunday, December 11, 2022 6:48:40 PM To: [email protected] <[email protected]> Subject: Re: [XAIR] X-Air H Brake upgrade info ? I have fitted disc brakes to mine.? Using mechanical cable operated calipers and stainless steel disc rotors.? Fabricated mounts from aluminium. Not pretty, I admit, but works fantastic! ?Way more braking with less pedal effort. Probably shouldn't say where the brakes came from, but they are Shimano, and the shop had lots of lycra/ spandex pants for sale...... Cliffy.? Clive Cunningham K&M HD Motorcycles U2 5-9 Kingston Ave? Richmond? South Australia 5033?? Ph +61 8? 8234 1090? kmmotor@... kmmotorcycles.com.au From: [email protected] <[email protected]> on behalf of gillis@... <gillis@...> Sent: Sunday, 11 December 2022 5:13 AM To: [email protected] <[email protected]> Subject: [XAIR] X-Air H Brake upgrade info ? Hey All, I recently bought a 2008 X - Air H. With original type shoes brakes. I was wanting Idea's about brake upgrade info. Thanks? Todd? Mooresboro, N,C,??
Justin Gregoris All Messages By This Member #12462 开云体育 So your Hanuman does not have shocks? It's only your X Air standard? toggle quoted message Show quoted text From: [email protected] <[email protected]> on behalf of Clive Cunningham <kmmotor@...> Sent: Sunday, December 11, 2022 10:50:21 PM To: [email protected] <[email protected]> Subject: Re: [XAIR] X-Air H Brake upgrade info ? Ah, I may have introduced confusion! The disc brakes are on my X -Air standard, with shocks I also own an X-Air Hanuman, which has the bungee suspension. I will be putting the disc system on that one soon, now I have proven that it works! Cheers, Clive Cunningham K&M HD Motorcycles U2 5-9 Kingston Ave? Richmond? South Australia 5033?? Ph +61 8? 8234 1090? kmmotor@... kmmotorcycles.com.au From: [email protected] <[email protected]> on behalf of Justin Gregoris <jgregoris789@...> Sent: Monday, 12 December 2022 12:34 PM To: [email protected] <[email protected]> Subject: Re: [XAIR] X-Air H Brake upgrade info ? Hello Clive May you take more pictures of your aftermarket design in regards to your front and rear landing gear / suspension system on your X Air?? I am quite interested in what you did and how you like it - do you still have the bungee cord system in conjunction with the shocks? If you may please elaborate on how you changed from bungees to shocks with measurements and/or overall design and size of actual shocks - would be greatly appreciated!? Thanks Justin? From: [email protected] <[email protected]> on behalf of Clive Cunningham <kmmotor@...> Sent: Sunday, December 11, 2022 6:48:40 PM To: [email protected] <[email protected]> Subject: Re: [XAIR] X-Air H Brake upgrade info ? I have fitted disc brakes to mine.? Using mechanical cable operated calipers and stainless steel disc rotors.? Fabricated mounts from aluminium. Not pretty, I admit, but works fantastic! ?Way more braking with less pedal effort. Probably shouldn't say where the brakes came from, but they are Shimano, and the shop had lots of lycra/ spandex pants for sale...... Cliffy.? Clive Cunningham K&M HD Motorcycles U2 5-9 Kingston Ave? Richmond? South Australia 5033?? Ph +61 8? 8234 1090? kmmotor@... kmmotorcycles.com.au From: [email protected] <[email protected]> on behalf of gillis@... <gillis@...> Sent: Sunday, 11 December 2022 5:13 AM To: [email protected] <[email protected]> Subject: [XAIR] X-Air H Brake upgrade info ? Hey All, I recently bought a 2008 X - Air H. With original type shoes brakes. I was wanting Idea's about brake upgrade info. Thanks? Todd? Mooresboro, N,C,??
Robert Marietta All Messages By This Member #12463 Can you give us the?Shimano model or part number you used. Thanks, Bob
Michael Coates All Messages By This Member #12464 开云体育 Hello everyone, the problem with using bicycle parts is they are simply not made to stop the weight of an aircraft. The calipers are just not strong enough and will eventually fail the first time you really need them, usually breaking off where they mount. Bicycle braking systems are normally designed to pull up something that is a maximum weight of 120 kg total. Braking something 3 or 4 times this weight is much more than what the system is designed for, the rotor will build up so much heat that it will warp and the fittings holding the brake caliper will eventually break. You should be looking at systems for things like motor scooters. Even though the weight of a motor scooter is not as much as an aircraft they are continuously braking from fairly high speeds and are more than strong enough for something like the X-Air. You will see that the brake caliper itself is probably twice the weight because it has a decent casting where it attaches to the frame and also the disk itself will be 3 times thicker. Experience shows that the bicycle system especially if you go hydraulic works really well for things like engine run up at the first time you need to brake in a real emergency may end up in tears. Robert Marietta wrote on 13/12/2022 12:05 am: Can you give us the?Shimano model or part number you used. Thanks, Bob -- With regards, Michael Coates AU +61 7 5522 0583 USA +1 213 984 1237 PIPISTREL AIRCRAFT DEALER OF THE YEAR 2012 Winner of the EAA August Raspet Award 2012 PIPISTREL AIRCRAFT DEALER OF THE YEAR 2017 mailto:mcoates@... skype name: xcomavionics Please note: because of the volume of e-mail we are now receiving our replies are done using voice recognition software in an effort to speed up the reply process. Sometimes the voice recognition program inserts silly words or doesn't actually do what it is meant to do. Occasionally these mistakes get through our quick proofreading of each e-mail sent, so please accept my apologies if the odd mistake gets through. Legal Notice: The information contained in this email is confidential and intended only to be read by the person(s) to whom it is addressed. No one is authorized to copy, use, disclose, distribute or rely on this information for any purpose whatsoever. If this communication has been sent to you in error, please email the sender and delete the message. "Amateurs practice till they get it right; Professionals practice till they can’t get it wrong."
NOLTON BEALE All Messages By This Member #12465 开云体育 Good point. There are lots of options on Amazon for go kart brakes. There are mechanical and hydraulic options. What size rotors are you using? Looks like 7” +/- are standard. The hydraulic would be great other than you would need longer brake lines. toggle quoted message Show quoted text On Dec 12, 2022, at 3:01 PM, Michael Coates <mcoates@...> wrote: Hello everyone, the problem with using bicycle parts is they are simply not made to stop the weight of an aircraft. The calipers are just not strong enough and will eventually fail the first time you really need them, usually breaking off where they mount. Bicycle braking systems are normally designed to pull up something that is a maximum weight of 120 kg total. Braking something 3 or 4 times this weight is much more than what the system is designed for, the rotor will build up so much heat that it will warp and the fittings holding the brake caliper will eventually break. You should be looking at systems for things like motor scooters. Even though the weight of a motor scooter is not as much as an aircraft they are continuously braking from fairly high speeds and are more than strong enough for something like the X-Air. You will see that the brake caliper itself is probably twice the weight because it has a decent casting where it attaches to the frame and also the disk itself will be 3 times thicker. Experience shows that the bicycle system especially if you go hydraulic works really well for things like engine run up at the first time you need to brake in a real emergency may end up in tears. Robert Marietta wrote on 13/12/2022 12:05 am: Can you give us the?Shimano model or part number you used. Thanks, Bob -- With regards, Michael Coates AU +61 7 5522 0583 USA +1 213 984 1237 PIPISTREL AIRCRAFT DEALER OF THE YEAR 2012 Winner of the EAA August Raspet Award 2012 PIPISTREL AIRCRAFT DEALER OF THE YEAR 2017 mailto:mcoates@... skype name: xcomavionics Please note: because of the volume of e-mail we are now receiving our replies are done using voice recognition software in an effort to speed up the reply process. Sometimes the voice recognition program inserts silly words or doesn't actually do what it is meant to do. Occasionally these mistakes get through our quick proofreading of each e-mail sent, so please accept my apologies if the odd mistake gets through. Legal Notice: The information contained in this email is confidential and intended only to be read by the person(s) to whom it is addressed. No one is authorized to copy, use, disclose, distribute or rely on this information for any purpose whatsoever. If this communication has been sent to you in error, please email the sender and delete the message. "Amateurs practice till they get it right; Professionals practice till they can’t get it wrong."
Clive Cunningham All Messages By This Member #12466 开云体育 Just some notes here. I found the drum brakes to be primitive and less than efficient. Mine failed when the shoes kinked sideways and destroyed the drum, shoes and backing plate.? No parts were available at that time? ( blame Covid ) I wanted to upgrade using cable operation. I looked into hydraulic, but it involves a lot to convert, and is considerably heavier and more expensive.? I consulted with an engineer, and he stated that the forces on the brakes from a 120kg cyclist trying to stop from 50 kmh, would be greater than slowing a 300 kg aircraft taxiing at 20kmh, or holding the aircraft at full throttle- the usual application of the brakes. Perhaps in a severe emergency stop situation, the brakes may be near, at, or above their failure load? I'm not sure what the same situation would do to the drum brakes? The mount supports the calipers as much as possible, with large mating surfaces, and? minimising stress points. The rotational force is directed at the original lug on the axle? ( which the backing plate mated to ). High tensile bolts are used on caliper and disc mounting, using Loctite. Overall, the pedal effort to hold or slow the aircraft feels about 30% less than the drums. Braking is smoother, and more positive. The pads can be inspected or changed without removing the wheels. The discs are also visible for inspection. Adjustment takes about 5 seconds to do. Replacement parts are readily available and reasonably priced.? The whole conversion cost me about $300 Aussie , and about 4 hours on the mill, plus 2 hours to fit.? Cheers Clive Cunningham K&M HD Motorcycles U2 5-9 Kingston Ave? Richmond? South Australia 5033?? Ph +61 8? 8234 1090? kmmotor@... kmmotorcycles.com.au toggle quoted message Show quoted text From: [email protected] <[email protected]> on behalf of Michael Coates <mcoates@...> Sent: Tuesday, 13 December 2022 7:31 AM To: [email protected] <[email protected]> Subject: Re: [XAIR] X-Air H Brake upgrade info ? Hello everyone, the problem with using bicycle parts is they are simply not made to stop the weight of an aircraft. The calipers are just not strong enough and will eventually fail the first time you really need them, usually breaking off where they mount. Bicycle braking systems are normally designed to pull up something that is a maximum weight of 120 kg total. Braking something 3 or 4 times this weight is much more than what the system is designed for, the rotor will build up so much heat that it will warp and the fittings holding the brake caliper will eventually break. You should be looking at systems for things like motor scooters. Even though the weight of a motor scooter is not as much as an aircraft they are continuously braking from fairly high speeds and are more than strong enough for something like the X-Air. You will see that the brake caliper itself is probably twice the weight because it has a decent casting where it attaches to the frame and also the disk itself will be 3 times thicker. Experience shows that the bicycle system especially if you go hydraulic works really well for things like engine run up at the first time you need to brake in a real emergency may end up in tears. Robert Marietta wrote on 13/12/2022 12:05 am: Can you give us the?Shimano model or part number you used. Thanks, Bob -- With regards, Michael Coates AU +61 7 5522 0583 USA +1 213 984 1237 PIPISTREL AIRCRAFT DEALER OF THE YEAR 2012 Winner of the EAA August Raspet Award 2012 PIPISTREL AIRCRAFT DEALER OF THE YEAR 2017 mailto:mcoates@... skype name: xcomavionics Please note: because of the volume of e-mail we are now receiving our replies are done using voice recognition software in an effort to speed up the reply process. Sometimes the voice recognition program inserts silly words or doesn't actually do what it is meant to do. Occasionally these mistakes get through our quick proofreading of each e-mail sent, so please accept my apologies if the odd mistake gets through. Legal Notice: The information contained in this email is confidential and intended only to be read by the person(s) to whom it is addressed. No one is authorized to copy, use, disclose, distribute or rely on this information for any purpose whatsoever. If this communication has been sent to you in error, please email the sender and delete the message. "Amateurs practice till they get it right; Professionals practice till they can’t get it wrong."

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