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Re: Peerless Jewelers Lathe for auction on Goodwill
I took a peek, and ran away clutching my poor empty wallet, too. I've already got five lathes right now, and only one is truly working as it should. I think I need to up that number before I buy another project lathe. Though I must say that the Unimat-sized lathes are a great deal easier to work on!?? Bill in OKC William R. Meyers, MSgt, USAF(Ret.) Aphorisms to live by: Good judgement comes from experience. Experience comes from bad judgement.? SEMPER GUMBY! Physics doesn't care about your schedule. The only reason I know anything is because I've done it wrong enough times to START to know better
On Thursday, August 11, 2022 at 07:22:06 PM CDT, Tamra <tamrabrogdon@...> wrote:
<danger!>? ?Acquisition will lead to collet chase!? I've been able to resist so far, but clearly lathe acquisition disease continues to be a problem. It is the accessories where the real cost is.... I'm leaving the computer now so I won't bid! Best of Luck!? This is a pretty piece of equipment. Tamra |
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Re: first Pen and thoughts on moving forward
so ya the 6 I did the close up on have been working alright, I have done a few things with them the odd shaped ones (like the two Tamra pointed out) I have not touched? going back to where I bought the set the reviews are saying its not just lathe tools but a mix 9 wood working chisels and 3 lathe chisels (all of these were posted after I?bought it) |
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Re: Wheels
From Jarrod,? >>> am wondering what is the difference between machines with plastics vs. metal hand wheels
From my viewpoint, pre-conceived prejudices...? I've learned that Delrin is a very respectable plastic, but still I would not look seriously at a machine with plastic hand wheels and anything that requires lots of use or precision. and after Dear Husband finds it on my bench, I'm going to get the look if it has too much plastic...? I got yelled at when I bought a FP (Fisher Price) dremel lathe, and he was right, no way to hold the material on the lathe, if only I had listened to him.? (Please don't be offended if you love your Dremel lathe, I do love my Dremel Table saw!)? Opinions are free though... and life experiences are your best teacher, if it is junk, can you afford the mistake and does it have re-sale value?? If there are a lot of this item listed on eBay perhaps users are finding NO good use. Tamra |
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Re: Peerless Jewelers Lathe for auction on Goodwill
<danger!>? ?Acquisition will lead to collet chase!? I've been able to resist so far, but clearly lathe acquisition disease continues to be a problem.
It is the accessories where the real cost is.... I'm leaving the computer now so I won't bid! Best of Luck!? This is a pretty piece of equipment. Tamra |
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Re: first Pen and thoughts on moving forward
Lex, I've been wood turning since 2015.? I've not once seen a set of lathe chisels that the underside of the metal of lathe chisel is curved.? I do think the set of 12, 6 of the set are photographed on green are more likely carving chisels vs. lathe chisels, because two of them are curved on the underside and they are obviously a set.? ?I'm not an expert, but just an observation based upon our tool collection.??
I put a black dot on the two curved carving chisels - commonly used to carve spoons, or a recessed surface below the normal plane of the wood. I think the angle of the grind could be different in carving tools vs. lathe chisels.? If the angle of the grind is different you could have an unhappy experience turning with a wrong grind angle on steel and wood.? All kinds of un-fun things can happen.? I'm really not going to experiment as everything in my gut says do not experiment with carving tools and a piece of wood spinning at x rpm. Let's switch to the Unimat Desktop, and I love turning on a this size machine, but I do my normal wood turning on a wood lathe, and I've kept my unimat for metals as indicated in the post from other members, oil and wood, bad mix for the cool unimat.?These tools photographed set of 12 and 6 on green are pretty large to comfortably use on a desktop lathe the size of our Unimat / Sherline or Taig machines.? Our desktop lathes are much easier to set up to drill the insides of a pen blank.? I drill on a drill press when I use my Jet mini lathe for turning pen blanks. I do have a small set of lathe chisels from Benjamin's best - but they were not sharp upon arrival.? When lathe chisels are not sharp, you don't get a great finish on wood, and it is tearing. This micro set is OK, but still large for a unimat lathe. There is a bazillion $$ industry selling stuff to us for sharpening; I have not mastered this art.? I like sharpening with stone best though. I use my Taig Lathe for 1/12th scale wood parts or precision wood parts and use the cross slide and jewelry gravers and am happiest with this combination for wood. I do most of my woodturning on a Jet Mini Lathe with Variable Speed, and I'm reasonably skilled at this point in my journey.? I turned 30 pair of similar lace bobbins last year. This year, I am turning stump work tools for me and my needlework friend.? I don't use a duplicator, nothing wrong with duplicators, but I want to 'hone' my skills, subsequently I don't use a duplicator. My first project many years ago was to turn handles for my jewelry gravers and it worked out, but I turned them on the Jet Variable Speed Mini lathe. I have turned probably less then 10 pens, but it is fun activity for kids of all ages, so I always keep some pen kits around and I gift pens to special people in my circle. I recently turned a tiny hat stand about 3/8" tall for a friend - kinda of a dare, and did this on my jet mini lathe and incidentally I've only turned wood for pens on the jet mini wood lathe.... you can still pen parts on a Unimat lathe, but you are not likely to get a pen mandrel off the shelf for the unimat. What ever you use, hang on to your lathe chisels, and I run a fan behind me when I'm wood turning and my allergies have been ok.... for fine dust I do wear a mask.?? From an experience perspective, I'm happier finishing on a wood lathe then finishing off, but I love waterlox and most everything gets finished after it is parted off. Carbide Insert tools can be re-sharpened.? I bought a 3 piece set from Rockler and love them, they are 3 of my favorite lathe tools. FWIW, I've also, after many years finally figured out that wood curls are easier for me to make with a hand plane then a lathe chisel and spindle - I have no idea why, but that is my experience! I love my sewing machine, but I've spent a lot more time with my lathe(s) then my sewing machine! Tamra |
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Re: Milling with the DB 200
Despite my dismay at you cutting up a perfectly good Unimat base, I have to say it looks quite good. May you get many happy and productive years of use from it. Bill in OKC? William R. Meyers, MSgt, USAF(Ret.) Aphorisms to live by: Good judgement comes from experience. Experience comes from bad judgement.? SEMPER GUMBY! Physics doesn't care about your schedule. The only reason I know anything is because I've done it wrong enough times to START to know better
On Tuesday, August 9, 2022 at 02:35:10 PM CDT, John Hutnick <johnhutnick@...> wrote:
Here is the final work of art with the Unimat head mounted and the 2 1/2" Sherline handwheel installed on the top shaft.? I made a little brass pointer.? With washers under the hand wheel, the head screws up and down fairly smoothly.? I ordered from Sherline on Friday and got the handwheel Monday.
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Re: Milling with the DB 200
Here is the final work of art with the Unimat head mounted and the 2 1/2" Sherline handwheel installed on the top shaft.? I made a little brass pointer.? With washers under the hand wheel, the head screws up and down fairly smoothly.? I ordered from Sherline on Friday and got the handwheel Monday.
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Re: Alternative motor for the Unimat SL
@juliushenrymarx
The flat on arbor is more than OK. Set screw will naturally? try to find its lowest position. ?As Bill in OKC?says,?you don't need (in the beginning?:) expensive tools but more practice. This is rule of thumb for everybody, including me. More expensive tools are as fragile as traditional/ cheaper ones. Only result - your mistakes will cost more. And you will always notice you need a 100 years old tool which you cannot replace with anything else. This kind of hand tool I consider is compulsory, especially when it has a flex-shaft (which you can adapt to your lathe).? It can speed-up your hand driven operations. I think it is the most versatile hand-tool. And very powerful; with a diamond disk there is nothing in this world to withstand it. You just have to learn to fit its abilities. And have to learn by yourself what are its precision limits. Because it is a hand-driven tool...And it's quite cheap, even with some bits set. For the rest, I suggest the fastest path. You want to know the difference brought by this motor. Than, don't make too?flamboyant plans. You will notice they come with lots expenses and less benefits. You have the motor, you have the pulley -just mate them. Centering the pulley hole is desirable. Good fit also. So do it carefully or let somebody skilled do it for you. Sorry, you might have some experience - some more... Hope it does not bother you. I speak as I would for me some time ago. -- NapierDeltic |
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Re: Alternative motor for the Unimat SL
Get or make a set of parallels for your machine vise. That can be flats of metal precisely ground to different heights, or round stock the same size or a bit smaller than the part you're clamping in the vise. They let you clamp a piece at a particular depth to expose what you want exposed to file or mill off. Then you can use the top of the vise to guide your file AND set your depth of cut. Up here in the US, a set of import graduated parallels can be had for around $40 and on up into the stratosphere. In my machining class,? we were required to make ours from pieces of ground flat tool steel. They come in pairs, one goes pressed up against each jaw of the vise to hold the part where you need it. You'll see Quinn of Blondihacks using them in her milling videos quite often.? The only way to get better at filing is to file! Practice, Practice, Practice! When I was a kid, and we needed to make stuff, we had a drill press, and an arc welder, hacksaws, files and chisels. And hammers. ;) You can do a lot with just those. I wasn't allowed to use the welder, but got a fair amount of practice with the others. You can watch videos. You can download the Nicholson files company manuals on how to file, and you can watch videos of people doing that, too. Only doing it yourself will actually help you. That said, you did a fine job on your motor shaft! It may not be perfect, but perfection is the enemy of good enough!? And as you try this stuff, you'll learn things, make things, and buy things that make your work easier, more pleasant, and faster.? ?for example of the parallels I mentioned.??? ?an example of ground flat tool steel stock. You can use drill bits, dowel pins, etc., as well. Also for non-critical uses, any old chunk of flat stock will probably do. you're not building rocket parts, and neither am I. And of course you can stack pieces to get the height you want. Sort of like shimming a lathe tool to the correct center height on a lathe. ;) Bill in OKC William R. Meyers, MSgt, USAF(Ret.) Aphorisms to live by: Good judgement comes from experience. Experience comes from bad judgement.? SEMPER GUMBY! Physics doesn't care about your schedule. The only reason I know anything is because I've done it wrong enough times to START to know better
On Tuesday, August 9, 2022 at 08:05:26 AM CDT, sawbona@... <sawbona@...> wrote:
Hello: Here replying to myself ... Pity posts here cannot be previewed/edited/corrected, at least for the first 24 hours. Syntax errors/spelling mistakes and bad photos don't look nice. On Tue, Aug 9, 2022 at 09:00 AM, @juliushenrymarx wrote: Holding the motor's rotor in a jig/vice to use the scribed lines as a guide to get a proper ...Done. Shaft was not hard but it is something that conspires against you if your hand file abilities are limited, like mine. That's what a lack of adecquate shop training gets you.? 8^¡ã Not withstanding, the end result does not look too bad ... ? ... and will do fine. But it is not the same as a properly milled/filed flat. The flat is ~ 5.0 mm x ~ 13.5 mm, quite enough for a set screw in any part of the OEM motor pulley. There is a very slight difference in the distance from flat to circumference between one end of the flat to the other but my MM says it is less than 0.01, so it is good enough. Now to see about the pulley. Best, JHM |
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Re: Alternative motor for the Unimat SL
Hello:
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Here replying to myself ... Pity posts here cannot be previewed/edited/corrected, at least for the first 24 hours. Syntax errors/spelling mistakes and bad photos don't look nice. On Tue, Aug 9, 2022 at 09:00 AM, @juliushenrymarx wrote: Holding the motor's rotor in a jig/vice to use the scribed lines as a guide to get a proper ...Done. Shaft was not hard but it is something that conspires against you if your hand file abilities are limited, like mine. That's what a lack of adecquate shop training gets you.? 8^¡ã Not withstanding, the end result does not look too bad ... ? ... and will do fine. But it is not the same as a properly milled/filed flat. The flat is ~ 5.0 mm x ~ 13.5 mm, quite enough for a set screw in any part of the OEM motor pulley. There is a very slight difference in the distance from flat to circumference between one end of the flat to the other but my MM says it is less than 0.01, so it is good enough. Now to see about the pulley. Best, JHM |
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Re: Alternative motor for the Unimat SL
Hello:
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On Mon, Aug 8, 2022 at 06:55 PM, Bill in OKC too wrote:
Can't say how hard but a file does not skate off. You don't get to mark it just so but slow and easy will do it. A sharp file and patience will surely get me there. Yes, that would not be an issue. A properly drilled/tapped hole in the pulley is. That's what I am concerned with, not mucking up an OEM U3 motor pulley. The shaft could be marked with blue and pair of parallel lines traced with the tips of a caliper, like this: Holding the motor's rotor in a jig/vice to use the scribed lines as a guide to get a proper the flat done may do the trick.? Provided the lines are parallel, both to themselves and the motor's axis. HTH!Always. 8^) Thanks a lot for your input. Best, JHM |
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Re: Alternative motor for the Unimat SL
How hard is the motor shaft? Will a file cut it, or does it just skate off the surface? If it's not too hard, you could put the pulley on the spindle where you want it, put a punch that fits the setscrew hole in there, and put a punch mark where you need it. Or perhaps a scribe mark if you have a tungsten carbide scribe with longish tip. That will work reasonably well even on a hard shaft. A soft graphite pencil mark would be better than nothing.? Then you can file or grind a flat or a dimple in it.? HTH! Bill in OKC William R. Meyers, MSgt, USAF(Ret.) Aphorisms to live by: Good judgement comes from experience. Experience comes from bad judgement.? SEMPER GUMBY! Physics doesn't care about your schedule. The only reason I know anything is because I've done it wrong enough times to START to know better
On Monday, August 8, 2022 at 04:31:18 PM CDT, sawbona@... <sawbona@...> wrote:
Hello: On Fri, Aug 5, 2022 at 09:24 PM, Jkle379184 wrote: My 150W motors came with flats on them.Not this one, nor was there an option for a spindle with flats. Problem is that I have the wrong size spindle ...? 8^¡ã I opened up the motor to see what was going on bearings wise as I had read of bearings on these motors being so-so. Sort of makes sense as the one component a DC motor manufacturer selling one of these for ~ US$8.00 will skimp on is the bearings. The motor comes with a pair of 602Z (8x22x7) bearings made by a company called SZSDE for which I have not found any references online. So I went to the purveyor I usually purchase these things from and came back with pair of Austrian made Steyr 608ZZ for ~ US$6.50 to replace them. Less expensive than on eBay and no shipping. Curiously enough, the Chinese made bearing is a 'Z' and not a 'ZZ', which would mean that it had a metal shield on only one side but no, it has it on both sides like the 'ZZ' Steyr. Done that, I adjusted the PS to the exact 24V DC output I will be using, set up a burn-in rig and let the motor run with no load for 120 minutes to check the temperature. I was expecting it to run a bit hot as the carbons are brand new and are not making full contact yet but that was not the case. Starting off at 21.5¡ã C and checking every 20' with a IR thermometer,? it never went over 53¡ã C. Tomorrow I will switch the leads to get the opposite rotation and run it for another 120' and that will be it for the motor's burn-in. I'm still needing some help/suggestions on how to solve the lack of a flat on the motor's spindle. I guess I can drill and tap a set screw on the original pulley but will that be enough? Thanks in advance. Best, JHM |
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Re: Train Related?
I did buy an 7x10 Mini-Lathe simply because I could lay hands on one the day I decided I wasn't going to let the sun set on a shop without a lathe, and had a lot of trouble learning to use it. Turned out not to be the lathe, but the lathe operator. Talking to people and watching videos did not help me figure out the problem. Even Mert Baker couldn't figure out what I was doing wrong, from talking to him online on several groups. Turns out it's very difficult to take accurate measurements, as needed to make parts to proper sizes per the blueprints, if you can't tell if the caliper or micrometer is closed just right. A few hours in my class with a set of gauge blocks and the micrometers and calipers practice on know-size blocks fixed that. Fortunately for me they had a set of Grade A blocks. You can get a set of Grade B blocks for not too much money, and a few good used blocks, dowel pins, or other objects of known sizes to practice on if you are having problems such as I was having.? "It's a poor worksman who blames his tools."? Or as we said in the Air Force: There was a screw loose in the stick actuator. Mind you I'd been a mechanic of several sorts for several decades by the time I got my lathe, but I'd never had to measure small parts accurately before. My sister, who used to build big block Chevy engines probably wouldn't have had this problem. ;)? I did take a machine shop course in high school, in 1973, but I made a hammer and a tap wrench, and there wasn't a lot of precise measurement in those. And I forgot every little thing I'd learned in the first class long before I got the lathe except that I really needed a lathe and shaper.? Bill in OKC William R. Meyers, MSgt, USAF(Ret.) Aphorisms to live by: Good judgement comes from experience. Experience comes from bad judgement.? SEMPER GUMBY! Physics doesn't care about your schedule. The only reason I know anything is because I've done it wrong enough times to START to know better
On Monday, August 8, 2022 at 04:24:27 PM CDT, paul b via groups.io <pointfivebsw@...> wrote:
I took it as being posted in the wrong group (easily done) but interesting nonetheless, especially as at a quick glance some of the components look to be sourced from a Unimat 3. Model train stuff is my reason for owning a pair of Unimats. I do have an issue with junk like these being sold, they look to be completely unfit for purpose yet priced to appeal to someone who knows little about machines. Someone could end up buying one and being put off making stuff for life. Paul B., in the sunny UK.
On Monday, 8 August 2022 at 16:40:45 BST, Jim Korman <jimkorman@...> wrote:
"Train related" and "not generally interested in Machine Shop stuff" Makes me wonder if this was either posted to the wrong group or is SPAM. -- Jim Korman |
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Re: Alternative motor for the Unimat SL
Hello:
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Show quoted text
On Fri, Aug 5, 2022 at 09:24 PM, Jkle379184 wrote: My 150W motors came with flats on them.Not this one, nor was there an option for a spindle with flats. Problem is that I have the wrong size spindle ...? 8^¡ã I opened up the motor to see what was going on bearings wise as I had read of bearings on these motors being so-so. Sort of makes sense as the one component a DC motor manufacturer selling one of these for ~ US$8.00 will skimp on is the bearings. The motor comes with a pair of 602Z (8x22x7) bearings made by a company called SZSDE for which I have not found any references online. So I went to the purveyor I usually purchase these things from and came back with pair of Austrian made Steyr 608ZZ for ~ US$6.50 to replace them. Less expensive than on eBay and no shipping. Curiously enough, the Chinese made bearing is a 'Z' and not a 'ZZ', which would mean that it had a metal shield on only one side but no, it has it on both sides like the 'ZZ' Steyr. Done that, I adjusted the PS to the exact 24V DC output I will be using, set up a burn-in rig and let the motor run with no load for 120 minutes to check the temperature. I was expecting it to run a bit hot as the carbons are brand new and are not making full contact yet but that was not the case. Starting off at 21.5¡ã C and checking every 20' with a IR thermometer,? it never went over 53¡ã C. Tomorrow I will switch the leads to get the opposite rotation and run it for another 120' and that will be it for the motor's burn-in. I'm still needing some help/suggestions on how to solve the lack of a flat on the motor's spindle. I guess I can drill and tap a set screw on the original pulley but will that be enough? Thanks in advance. Best, JHM |
Bill in OKC too
Tamra
Carl
NapierDeltic
