¿ªÔÆÌåÓý

Patent: Shield Can for High Q Coil


 

Hi:

When I was spending a lot of time winding high Q coils and testing them on the Boontoon 160 it was clear than anything closer than maybe a few coil diameters would effect the readings.? So this patent that claims to allow using a small shield can (less than a coil radius) on an air core multilayer coil without degrading Q is quite a claim.? Has anyone experience with this idea.



PS found when looking for General Radio patents for something else.? This one is assigned to General Motors Radio Corp, just a happenstance.
-- 
Have Fun,

Brooke Clarke
https://www.PRC68.com
axioms:
1. The extent to which you can fix or improve something will be limited by how well you understand how it works.
2. Everybody, with no exceptions, holds false beliefs.


 

What I discovered over the years was a lot of people already walked the
path I was currently following. No where did this become more self
evident than the construction of? helical wound inductors.

The general rules mentioned in many writings, both amateur and profes-
sional state that to obtain highest possible Q the coil should:

(1) present a width to height ratio of 1. In other words if the coil is going
to be 1 inch high, then use a former slightly less than 1 inch so the the
center to center space of the wire conductor helix? is 1.

(2) Use as large as practical wire diameter. If you look at skin effect and
quantify the resulting resistance at RF, you will marvel that you can obtain
Q's nearly as high as being achieved.

(3) Space the turns of the inductor no less than one wire diameter from
each other across the former's surface.

(4) Use a single layer on the former. Just one turn overlapping the beginning
of the coil can shed nearly 80% of the Q and matters only become worse
with more overlapping turns.

(5) Know the source of your wire. Not all copper wire is high grade 99%
copper.

(6) If you are going for that last 2% of Q, then bite the bullet and either have
the wire silver plated or bump the conductor up to the next larger diameter
wire size.


 

¿ªÔÆÌåÓý

On 18/11/2022 22:00, Chuck Moore via groups.io wrote:

(6) If you are going for that last 2% of Q, then bite the bullet and either have
the wire silver plated or bump the conductor up to the next larger diameter
wire size.

I use solid silver wire and polish it before winding. It's relatively low cost and much less trouble than plating.
--

Neil G4DBN


 

If you use silver wire, make sure it is pure silver. Sterling Silver has an IACS conductivity of 96% - which means that pure anealed copper is actually ~4% better.


 

Definitely pure soft silver from my bullion supplier.? They do recycled and Sterling, but it's no use as you rightly say.
Neil

On 18/11/2022 22:47, SCMenasian wrote:
If you use silver wire, make sure it is pure silver. Sterling Silver has an IACS conductivity of 96% - which means that pure anealed copper is actually ~4% better.


 

You may want to try Cool-Amp, but it's awfully expensive.

73
Jim N6OTQ

On Fri, Nov 18, 2022 at 5:00 PM Neil Smith G4DBN <neil@...> wrote:

Definitely pure soft silver from my bullion supplier. They do recycled
and Sterling, but it's no use as you rightly say.
Neil

On 18/11/2022 22:47, SCMenasian wrote:
If you use silver wire, make sure it is pure silver. Sterling Silver
has an IACS conductivity of 96% - which means that pure anealed copper
is actually ~4% better.


 

On Fri, Nov 18, 2022 at 03:03 PM, Jim Strohm wrote:
You may want to try Cool-Amp, but it's awfully expensive.
You have to ask the question, how the thickness of that plating compares the the skin thickness.
At 1 MHz, skin thickness is 0.0025". I don't have any guess for the thickness of that plating,
but I don't thing it is near 0.0025".
?I wonder if you can put more than one layer on or if the bond is only copper to silver and not silver to silver.
?????????????????????? Mikek


 

Cool-Amp is easier than electroplating ... but if you're up for
electroplating, it's not too difficult and you can just leave the
copper coil in the "soup" until you think the plating is thick enough.
You're right, the thickness of Cool-Amp is more cosmetic than
skin-effect thick.

73
Jim N6OTQ

On Fri, Nov 18, 2022 at 5:46 PM Mikek <amdx@...> wrote:

On Fri, Nov 18, 2022 at 03:03 PM, Jim Strohm wrote:

You may want to try Cool-Amp, but it's awfully expensive.

You have to ask the question, how the thickness of that plating compares the the skin thickness.
At 1 MHz, skin thickness is 0.0025". I don't have any guess for the thickness of that plating,
but I don't thing it is near 0.0025".
I wonder if you can put more than one layer on or if the bond is only copper to silver and not silver to silver.
Mikek


 

On Fri, Nov 18, 2022 at 11:48 AM, Brooke Clarke wrote:
When I was spending a lot of time winding high Q coils and testing them on the Boontoon 160 it was clear than anything closer than maybe a few coil diameters would effect the readings.?
?I have a few 6" high Q coils, get within 18" and you can watch the Q drop on the Q meter.
?????????????????????????? Mikek


 

Generally, mil-spec silver plating starts at 0.0005" thickness, however a number of shops
now plate upwards of 0.015" if ordered. If you do silver plate you want to be sure to use
silver's characteristics for skin depth as it is a few microns more shallow than copper,
about 3%.

One positive for using silver plate is, that electrodeposited Class T silver plate has
additives which dramatically inhibit tarnishing. That is useful in many corner cases,
especially if foods cooked in the home have fair amount of sulfur in them. Included
food are eggs and onions as well as a myriad of other pungent vegetables when
cooked.


 

On Fri, 18 Nov 2022, Chuck Moore via groups.io wrote:

Iodide electrolyte is very good for this. A bit expensive because of high
potassium iodide price but very stable unlike cheaper cyanide bath and no
free cyanide is a big plus. Plated surface is a bit yellowish but pretty
tarnish resistant and the color doesn't actually matter in this case.

Generally, mil-spec silver plating starts at 0.0005" thickness, however a number of shops
now plate upwards of 0.015" if ordered. If you do silver plate you want to be sure to use
silver's characteristics for skin depth as it is a few microns more shallow than copper,
about 3%.

One positive for using silver plate is, that electrodeposited Class T silver plate has
additives which dramatically inhibit tarnishing. That is useful in many corner cases,
especially if foods cooked in the home have fair amount of sulfur in them. Included
food are eggs and onions as well as a myriad of other pungent vegetables when
cooked.
---
*
* KSI@home KOI8 Net < > The impossible we do immediately. *
* Las Vegas NV, USA < > Miracles require 24-hour notice. *
*