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Trim molding for lockers and hatches - first tirade


 

Jim,
If I understand the initial question correctly the teak 'trim' that covers the fiberglass hull-deck joint is usually called a rub rail or toe rail. I have had to replace sections of this in the past due to unfortunate circumstances. The lazarette covers (seat covers in cockpit) are made of a teak skinned plywood (mine are anyway) and you used to be able to buy these pre-made from tartanparts.com for the T27, for an arm and a leg. I am not sure where you would find teak skinned plywood but I would think that 1/2" mahogany ply would look handsome and hold up well and be a lot cheaper if you are do-it-yourselfer. The trim under the hatch is also just teak stock (probably 1" x 1-1/2") which I have not replaced yet.
To do the toe rail/rub rail replacement you will need to find some teak stock lumber from a cabinet makers supplier (not your average lumberyard). I got a hunk that was full 1" stock, about 10" wide and about 11' long for about $100 around 5 years ago. With this hunk of wood, a table saw, belt sander, saber saw etc I fashioned new pieces to replace the old broken ones. The trick to this to rail is that it is made of 2 pieces (one on top and one mounted over the side) that are roughly 1/2" thick and about 2-1/2" wide. The two pieces butt together and are held in place by brass screws with bungs (teak plugs) covering the screws. Once the pieces are joined together successfully you can then round over the joint with a router or by sanding. After I had replaced a few sections I read somewhere that you should also 'bed' these pieces (at least the top piece) to the boat using a caulk like 3M 4200 (oh well, next time!).
This is kind of an involved process as I recall but it is kind of fun once you understand how to do it. If you still have some (or all) of the old pieces on the boat then pay attention to how each section (board) is butted to the next one (all with 45 degree angle cuts) and what size screws you will need for each part (cap rail = top piece, rub rail = outside piece). You can probably re-use some of the old screws but if you need to get all new ones (they don't make 'em like they used to) I believe they were #6 brass flat headed wood screws in both 3/4" and 1" or 1-1/4" sizes. You can also get a plug cutter to cut the bungs (teak plugs) out of some thinner teak stock (say 1/4") - buy some if you can find them as cutting them yourself is a bit time consuming. The size of the bung is important and I believe that I used a 3/8" drill and 3/8" plug cutter to do the job. You will also want to have a 3/8" countersink to make the initial holes for the screws - see, size does matter! Once the screw is in you then take your plug and pound it into the hole and sand each bung smooth - PITA, but it looks great once oiled and finished.
The outer pieces on the port and starboard sides can be made from a basically 'square' piece of teak that is 1/2" thick by 2" wide by however long. These pieces will bend to take the shape of the boat as you put the screws into them starting at one end and finishing up on the other. The top pieces must be cut to conform with the arc of the boat. The alternative is to steam these pieces while under pressure in some kind of jig overnight so they take on the actual shape you want. I can try to find a website that details the intricacies of this process. The rail over the stern or transom is a bit more shapely and would probably require some steaming to get the right shapes needed.
I am sure you were hoping that there was a place to buy these pieces of wood cut to size (as I did when I approached this project) but I could not find anywhere that did. A footnote to all of this is that once I had restored all the teak on the toe rail and had it nicely oiled and varnished the whole affair we got bumped by a launch boat that cracked the aft starboard corner. The observation here is that teak is not really all that strong and in the event of a collision with another object the teak usually loses and splits along its grain. It looks great but does not offer much 'rub' protection so i would look into some of the rub rail options out there that include a rubber strip that would give your boat some 'rub' protection (it wont look as good but you will be less upset if it does not need to be repaired). I can try to look up some of these extruded pre-made rub rails that are available and might just work on a T27 if you like.
Another observation I will offer is that keeping this teak toe rail nicely varnished is an ongoing chore. I am about to try Cetol after watching my nice varnish job fade and peel each season.
dobbsjim@... - where are you located? I may be able to find you a supplier of teak lumber on the web.
Still not sure that I answered the question(s) being asked.
Caleb Davison
T27 #328 Odalisque, 1967
NY

-----Original Message-----
From: dobbsjim <dobbsjim@...>
To: T27Owners@...
Sent: Mon, 14 Jan 2008 9:20 pm
Subject: [T27Owners] Trim molding for lockers and hatches

As a great user of the last web site, I am certainly glad that someone
else has the skills, enthusiasm and time to start another one.
Thanks!!!
I am repairing my deck and would like to replace the molding that goes
over the fiberglass lip and seals the hatches and cockpit seat
lockers. Can anyone tell me where to find a replacement with the same
or similar cross section. Thanks, Jim




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Robert Watts
 

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?I would really like to know where to find the NON-TEAK replacement for this.? Southern Horizon (hull #257) had a piece broken off the port side this fall during a storm--.

?

Thanks for any help

?

Robbie Watts

?


From: T27Owners@... [mailto:T27Owners@...] On Behalf Of calebjess@...
Sent: Tuesday, January 15, 2008 7:24 PM
To: T27Owners@...
Subject: Re: [T27Owners] Trim molding for lockers and hatches - first tirade

?

Jim,
If I understand the initial question correctly the teak 'trim' that
covers the fiberglass hull-deck joint is usually called a rub rail or
toe rail. I have had to replace sections of this in the past due to
unfortunate circumstances. The lazarette covers (seat covers in
cockpit) are made of a teak skinned plywood (mine are anyway) and you
used to be able to buy these pre-made from tartanparts.com for the T27,
for an arm and a leg. I am not sure where you would find teak skinned
plywood but I would think that 1/2" mahogany ply would look handsome
and hold up well and be a lot cheaper if you are do-it-yourselfer. The
trim under the hatch is also just teak stock (probably 1" x 1-1/2")
which I have not replaced yet.
To do the toe rail/rub rail replacement you will need to find some teak
stock lumber from a cabinet makers supplier (not your average
lumberyard). I got a hunk that was full 1" stock, about 10" wide and
about 11' long for about $100 around 5 years ago. With this hunk of
wood, a table saw, belt sander, saber saw etc I fashioned new pieces to
replace the old broken ones. The trick to this to rail is that it is
made of 2 pieces (one on top and one mounted over the side) that are
roughly 1/2" thick and about 2-1/2" wide. The two pieces butt together
and are held in place by brass screws with bungs (teak plugs) covering
the screws. Once the pieces are joined together successfully you can
then round over the joint with a router or by sanding. After I had
replaced a few sections I read somewhere that you should also 'bed'
these pieces (at least the top piece) to the boat using a caulk like 3M
4200 (oh well, next time!).
This is kind of an involved process as I recall but it is kind of fun
once you understand how to do it. If you still have some (or all) of
the old pieces on the boat then pay attention to how each section
(board) is butted to the next one (all with 45 degree angle cuts) and
what size screws you will need for each part (cap rail = top piece, rub
rail = outside piece). You can probably re-use some of the old screws
but if you need to get all new ones (they don't make 'em like they used
to) I believe they were #6 brass flat headed wood screws in both 3/4"
and 1" or 1-1/4" sizes. You can also get a plug cutter to cut the bungs
(teak plugs) out of some thinner teak stock (say 1/4") - buy some if
you can find them as cutting them yourself is a bit time consuming. The
size of the bung is important and I believe that I used a 3/8" drill
and 3/8" plug cutter to do the job. You will also want to have a 3/8"
countersink to make the initial holes for the screws - see, size does
matter! Once the screw is in you then take your plug and pound it into
the hole and sand each bung smooth - PITA, but it looks great once
oiled and finished.
The outer pieces on the port and starboard sides can be made from a
basically 'square' piece of teak that is 1/2" thick by 2" wide by
however long. These pieces will bend to take the shape of the boat as
you put the screws into them starting at one end and finishing up on
the other. The top pieces must be cut to conform with the arc of the
boat. The alternative is to steam these pieces while under pressure in
some kind of jig overnight so they take on the actual shape you want. I
can try to find a website that details the intricacies of this process.
The rail over the stern or transom is a bit more shapely and would
probably require some steaming to get the right shapes needed.
I am sure you were hoping that there was a place to buy these pieces of
wood cut to size (as I did when I approached this project) but I could
not find anywhere that did. A footnote to all of this is that once I
had restored all the teak on the toe rail and had it nicely oiled and
varnished the whole affair we got bumped by a launch boat that cracked
the aft starboard corner. The observation here is that teak is not
really all that strong and in the event of a collision with another
object the teak usually loses and splits along its grain. It looks
great but does not offer much 'rub' protection so i would look into
some of the rub rail options out there that include a rubber strip that
would give your boat some 'rub' protection (it wont look as good but
you will be less upset if it does not need to be repaired). I can try
to look up some of these extruded pre-made rub rails that are available
and might just work on a T27 if you like.
Another observation I will offer is that keeping this teak toe rail
nicely varnished is an ongoing chore. I am about to try Cetol after
watching my nice varnish job fade and peel each season.
dobbsjim@yahoo.com - where are you located? I may be able to find you a
supplier of teak lumber on the web.
Still not sure that I answered the question(s) being asked.
Caleb Davison
T27 #328 Odalisque, 1967
NY

-----Original Message-----
From: dobbsjim <dobbsjim@yahoo.com>
To: T27Owners@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Mon, 14 Jan 2008 9:20 pm
Subject: [T27Owners] Trim molding for lockers and hatches

As a great user of the last web site, I am certainly glad that someone
else has the skills, enthusiasm and time to start another one.
Thanks!!!
I am repairing my deck and would like to replace the molding that goes
over the fiberglass lip and seals the hatches and cockpit seat
lockers. Can anyone tell me where to find a replacement with the same
or similar cross section. Thanks, Jim

Yahoo! Groups Links

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More new features than ever. Check out the new AOL Mail ! -