Re: replacement hatch covers
Greetings Roger, welcome to the group. I believe Alex W. was the previous owner of your boat? I spoke with him just after he sold it.聽 Have you been able to do an about the hatches? I thought long and hard about your dilemma,聽 the only thing I could think of was either to build some plywood boxes and reinforce with glass and epoxy, or build something out of teak or mahogany strips and reinforce from below the same way. If you use meranti or okoume ply you could finish them clear. Obviously the ply edges would need to be saturated with epoxy Imho. I have the same dilemma coming up.聽 I'm in your area and I'm off for a bit if you want to meet. Working on my Allied at GCS marina still. - - - - - - - - - -聽 Rob Harvey Middleburg Fl T 27 hull #12 still sitting in Eden Md Allied Chance 30/30 GCS Fl
Greetings all,聽
I recently purchased T27 #273 and am working on a number of projects including replacing the cover for the stern center and forward hatches. The old ones are functional but unattractive - one is covered over with fiberglass and painted. Would like them to match or come close to matching the teak cockpit seat benches. Having them fabricated gets expensive fast with yard rates for carpentry and I wondered if anyone had an alternative thought.聽
Thanks, Roger Wight June Song, Hull 273 Jacksonville FL
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I believe the yawl is a bout 6 inches shorter on the foot and 1 foot shorter on the luff, so it may be reasonable to cut a sloop main down
聽by cutting about a foot off the bottom and maybe tweaking the length of the bottom panel.聽
That is based on the published dimensions.
Carl Damm
DAMSELv
1976 #593
Stuart Fl
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Try Bacon and Associats in Annapolis. A fine second hand / consignment / yacht chandlery / new and used
Good luck,
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On Jul 29, 2020, at 11:59 AM, Robert Harvey <cswim093@...> wrote:
锘� I know a sailor from South Africa with a Sailrite machine could probably make you whatever you need if you get him a good used sail. Green Cove Springs Florida. I spoke with him a few times, pretty sure hes qualified. I'd be happy to help as I'm off for a bit working on my Allied. You could do the same in your area--find someone who has a Sailrite or equivalent.聽 Regards, Rob. My old main finally blew out on my #226 T27 yawl.
Can't afford a new one and have been searching the used lofts.
Anyone got a lead?
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Probably not, I'm assuming that's part of the issue.
On Wed, Jul 29, 2020, 12:47 PM < acc_t@...> wrote: If you're interested in a used sail let me know.聽
I have an extra mail sail that came with the boat.
Haven't even taken it out of it's sail bag yet, but if this is a possibility for you I'll lay it out on my driveway and take some photos.
Just occurred to me - are the dimensions the same for yawl / single pole?
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If you're interested in a used sail let me know.聽
I have an extra mail sail that came with the boat.
Haven't even taken it out of it's sail bag yet, but if this is a possibility for you I'll lay it out on my driveway and take some photos.
Just occurred to me - are the dimensions the same for yawl / single pole?
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I know a sailor from South Africa with a Sailrite machine could probably make you whatever you need if you get him a good used sail. Green Cove Springs Florida. I spoke with him a few times, pretty sure hes qualified. I'd be happy to help as I'm off for a bit working on my Allied. You could do the same in your area--find someone who has a Sailrite or equivalent.聽 Regards, Rob.
My old main finally blew out on my #226 T27 yawl.
Can't afford a new one and have been searching the used lofts.
Anyone got a lead?
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My old main finally blew out on my #226 T27 yawl.
Can't afford a new one and have been searching the used lofts.
Anyone got a lead?
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I got some inexpensive generic fuel pump of the correct line size on
eBay when I was first troubleshooting this engine (boat was sold to
me with the diesel not running) and I'd figured out I was having
some fuel supply issue (from the lack of fuel out of the lift pump).
Worked fine and was definately faster than the Kubota's mechanical
pump, but went back to the mechanical pump after figuring out it was
working and the cause was a 2nd hidden filter between the cockpit
and the fuel tank that was clogged. But I still carry it for priming
fuel filters, testing if needed, transferring fuel if ever needed, etc.
I gave it a cigeratte lighter plug. But actually using it instead of
the mechanical one would certainly make bleeding faster tho maybe
a bit fast and messy if I'm not careful. I imagine the existing
mechanical pump would need to be removed and the hole sealed or
else given a closed loop of oil to pump so that it didn't wreck
itself and wedge.
Replacing hardened fuel lines and keeping hose clamps snug could
help prevent drawing air in to the system. I was having trouble
there too.
"All a diesel needs is fuel and engine oil" is surprisingly tricky.
-scott, #93
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On 0, "JAMES DOBBS via groups.io" <jdob3542@...> wrote: to T27Owners
I concur with your actions and assessment of the cause. I found
bleeding the injectors which is as far as the air can be trapped, is
the only proven way to get the air out, so you may want to fix the
rusted high pressure lines and connections. The Yanmar mechanical pump
has a very slow pumping rate and it takes FOREVER to get the fuel
through the engine pump, lines, governor and to the injectors. I am
trying to find a small in-line electric booster pump that will keep
positive pressure on the governor, but also allow syphoning if the pump
is turned off, similar to what is found in aviation.
I have also found that the system between the tank and engine pump can
get a vapor lock in the lines just by sitting which can lead to a
unexpected loss of power or even kill the engine....maybe old fuel
makes that more likely.
Just my experience and 2 cents.
Hope it helps
-----Original Message-----
From: Howard Fidel <howard@...>
To: [email protected]
Sent: Thu, Jul 2, 2020 8:02 am
Subject: Re: [T27Owners] Yanmar 2GM20F
We checked the filters and bled the lines. Couldn't get the injectors
due to rust. Also, I learned after the event the fuel is very old. That
probably was the root cause of the problem. We didn't have the pump to
pump it out, and since we were far from home, we decided to have the
mechanic work on it. He didnn;t get to it yesterday, but will
definitely work on it today.
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I
concur with your actions and assessment of the cause.聽 I found bleeding
the injectors which is as far as the air can be trapped, is the only proven way to get the air out, so you may
want to fix the rusted high pressure lines and connections.聽 The Yanmar
mechanical pump has a very slow pumping rate and it takes FOREVER to get
the fuel through the engine pump, lines, governor and to the
injectors.聽 I am trying to find a small in-line electric booster pump
that will keep positive pressure on the governor, but also allow
syphoning if the pump is turned off, similar to what is found in
aviation.
I have also found that the system
between the tank and engine pump can get a vapor lock in the lines just
by sitting which can lead to a unexpected loss of power or even kill the
engine....maybe old fuel makes that more likely.聽
Just my experience and 2 cents.
Hope it helps
-----Original Message-----
From: Howard Fidel <howard@...>
To: [email protected]
Sent: Thu, Jul 2, 2020 8:02 am
Subject: Re: [T27Owners] Yanmar 2GM20F
We checked the filters and bled the lines. Couldn't get the injectors due to rust. Also, I learned after the event the fuel is very old. That probably was the root cause of the problem. We didn't have the pump to pump it out, and since we were far from home, we decided to have the mechanic work on it. He didnn;t get to it yesterday, but will definitely work on it today.
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We checked the filters and bled the lines. Couldn't get the injectors due to rust. Also, I learned after the event the fuel is very old. That probably was the root cause of the problem. We didn't have the pump to pump it out, and since we were far from home, we decided to have the mechanic work on it. He didnn;t get to it yesterday, but will definitely work on it today.
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I installed a 2GM20F in my Tartan and the only problem I have had with it is air in the fuel system....which will kill the engine in a heartbeat.聽 I would check the fuel system, be sure everything is clean, replace filters (2) as needed and bleed the system at the injectors.聽 If you are at all handy you can do it yourself.聽 Need metric tools and a manual, all available, and you must have them since you changed the cooling pump.
The only thing that stops a diesel once it is running is lack of fuel.聽 If you had no overheating alarms then the cooling system should not be at fault.聽 Hope this helps.
Jim
T27 Morgenfrau
5 Mile River
Rowayton
-----Original Message-----
From: Howard Fidel <howard@...>
To: [email protected]
Sent: Wed, Jul 1, 2020 11:47 am
Subject: [T27Owners] Yanmar 2GM20F
We just purchased a T27. We need we needed to replace the fresh water pump, and were told to purchase part # YM-128695-42010 That part has the pump and the alternator bracket mounted behind it. Does anyone know if the pump is available by itself? I have attached 2 photos, one with the new pump (the shiny metal) installed on the old alternator mount, and the second with a the old pump that was removed with the new bracket.
We installed the pump yesterday, and had no issues. We ran the motor for 20 minutes while the bilge pumped out, and then started on our 6 hour trip from Huntington LI to City Island, NY. We were 45 minutes along, when the motor slowed down and died. We were able to sail back to our starting point and tried to figure out what was wrong, but struck out. A mechanic will look at the motor later today. 
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Congrats on your Tartan 27 and welcome to the group.
Was raw water actually flowing? If you have a wet exhaust setup,
exhaust will sputter water out. Do you have a temperature
gauge for the engine?
Most likely with a diesel, it's a fuel issue, either water
getting in to the fuel or solids (potentially solids that formed
in the tank) clogging filters or injectors, or air getting in
to the fuel lines and needing to bleed and possibily fuel lines
sealed better.
Detach the line going out of the fuel lift pump and try pumping
fuel in to a jar while you turn over the engine (for only 10 seconds
at a time then a 30 second rest). Fuel should flow. If that works,
plug it back in to the pump then bleed the injectors. If it doesn't,
test bypassing fuel filters with little clear plastic in-line filters
of the right size and then bleed until spurts of diesel shoot out.
After bleeding, try firing up the engine. If there's a valve
release lever, use it while bleeding and testing the lift pump.
Whichever thing you that gets fuel flowing again likely indicates the
problem: clogged filter, air in the fuel lines, etc. If injectors
are clogged, none of those will work. Send the injectors out for
service. If the fuel that gets pumped out of the lift pump separates
in to water and oil, you had water in the fuel. Get a separating
filter and check it each time you use the engine.
If the engine isn't even turning over but the starter selenoid clicks,
it may have overheated and seized, but you'd likely have noticed that
it was very unhappy before that would happen.
When draining the water out of a water pump, such as when replacing
it like you did, you may have to prime it by pouring water in or
opening a bleed screw and letting air bleed out and water flow in.
That potential for getting air trapped in the pump is part of why
it's a good idea to always make sure water is flowing through the
system and sputtering out in the exhaust (or whereever it comes out)
when starting the engine.
You said you have a mechanic coming but posting this troubleshooting
guide anyway as some of these items are pre-flight checks and the
others can be useful to have the next time you're troubleshooting
underway. Also, carrying a spare starter and selenoid (which may
be combined in to the same unit) is a really good idea. And
spare filters. Always spare filters, even if they're just the
little clear in-line dealies.
Cheers,
-scott
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On 0, Howard Fidel <howard@...> wrote: We just purchased a T27. We need we needed to replace the fresh water
pump, and were told to purchase part #YM-128695-42010 That part has the
pump and the alternator bracket mounted behind it. Does anyone know if
the pump is available by itself? I have attached 2 photos, one with the
new pump (the shiny metal) installed on the old alternator mount, and
the second with a the old pump that was removed with the new bracket.
We installed the pump yesterday, and had no issues. We ran the motor
for 20 minutes while the bilge pumped out, and then started on our 6
hour trip from Huntington LI to City Island, NY. We were 45 minutes
along, when the motor slowed down and died. We were able to sail back
to our starting point and tried to figure out what was wrong, but
struck out. A mechanic will look at the motor later today.
[cid:[email protected]]
[cid:[email protected]]
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We just purchased a T27. We need we needed to replace the fresh water pump, and were told to purchase part # YM-128695-42010 That part has the pump and the alternator bracket mounted behind it. Does anyone know if the pump is available by itself? I have attached 2 photos, one with the new pump (the shiny metal) installed on the old alternator mount, and the second with a the old pump that was removed with the new bracket.
We installed the pump yesterday, and had no issues. We ran the motor for 20 minutes while the bilge pumped out, and then started on our 6 hour trip from Huntington LI to City Island, NY. We were 45 minutes along, when the motor slowed down and died. We were able to sail back to our starting point and tried to figure out what was wrong, but struck out. A mechanic will look at the motor later today. 
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Re: replacement hatch covers
Hi Roger,
Congrats on your purchase and glad you could join us here.
Can't claim much experience here but the very rear part of my rubrail
was rotted and encased in fiberglass (which led to which unknown) when
I got west-coast hull #93 and I'm hoping to replace the dry rotted
sill at the bottom of the companion way hatch.
It helps to have some experience with a yard. Some places will
charge you a large number of hours for simple tasks (realizing
that many tasks that should be simple are not). Other places
also have high hourly rates but this is something skilled
workers could do in a small handful of hours.
I don't know the state of the hatches right now, but teak
battens could be glued down with 4200 or similar bedding
compound. Basically that is done for soles and decks and
other things and is preferable to screwing the teak down
as screw holes, especially in great number, leak eventually.
If the old teak has been painted over, take an orbital to it
and keep taking off material (paint, dry rotted teak, busted
fiberglass) until you have a base to work with then fix the
fiberglass, repaint edges, and bed down teak strips (small lumber
or battens as makes sense).
That's one thought (or two? lost track). Hiring a handyperson
and giving them the old hatches as a template is an alternative
to using the yard too.
Cheers,
-scott
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On 0, Roger Wight <rogerfwight@...> wrote: Greetings all,�
I recently purchased T27 #273 and am working on a number of projects
including replacing the cover for the stern center and forward hatches.
The old ones are functional but unattractive - one is covered over with
fiberglass and painted. Would like them to match or come close to
matching the teak cockpit seat benches. Having them fabricated gets
expensive fast with yard rates for carpentry and I wondered if anyone
had an alternative thought.�
Thanks,
Roger Wight
June Song, Hull 273
Jacksonville FL
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Greetings all,聽
I recently purchased T27 #273 and am working on a number of projects including replacing the cover for the stern center and forward hatches. The old ones are functional but unattractive - one is covered over with fiberglass and painted. Would like them to match or come close to matching the teak cockpit seat benches. Having them fabricated gets expensive fast with yard rates for carpentry and I wondered if anyone had an alternative thought.聽
Thanks, Roger Wight June Song, Hull 273 Jacksonville FL
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Re: Replacing wire runing rigging with Dyneema
In that case go with 5/16". Rope is not chosen for strength often but more for hand. 5/16 is about the smallest you can handle easily to pull. One continuous length is best.
On Fri, Jun 26, 2020 at 11:03 AM j c < anvil3a@...> wrote: Hello Richard, Brian, and all reading
Sorry to be so long in responding, but Life,
Brian, i was not thing in terms of replacing the whole thing with the 1/8th dyneema, just the wire parts. BBBBUUUUT as Richard so rightly slaps me up side the head with聽 the "Duh" stick. :D The connections the weak link, so why reintroduce a weak link into the system :) thanks Richard :)
Brian you recommend 5/16 or 3/8 Dia. I have no experience with any of this so any more input would be welcome, but Assuming the halyards in mine are 3/8" as is spec. they seem to big to run easily through the shives?
Again thanks to all
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Re: Replacing wire runing rigging with Dyneema
Hello Richard, Brian, and all reading
Sorry to be so long in responding, but Life,
Brian, i was not thing in terms of replacing the whole thing with the 1/8th dyneema, just the wire parts. BBBBUUUUT as Richard so rightly slaps me up side the head with聽 the "Duh" stick. :D The connections the weak link, so why reintroduce a weak link into the system :) thanks Richard :)
Brian you recommend 5/16 or 3/8 Dia. I have no experience with any of this so any more input would be welcome, but Assuming the halyards in mine are 3/8" as is spec. they seem to big to run easily through the shives?
Again thanks to all
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Re: Removing old mast wires, and mast cap question
I am at the same point, I got new sheeves from Zephyrworks. My fasteners were #10 slotted. Any that are stripped I will take upto #12. Also going to hex heads.
--
Carl Damm
DAMSELv
1976 #593
Stuart Fl
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Re: Amount of Outhaul Travel?
Certainly, two opposed clam cleats would work. But honestly, I was looking for a little more spare/simple/elegant a solution. I kinda picture some sort of bastardized window lock, the kind with the cam you turn to lock it. lf I had a turn-to-lock cam, and that pushed a rubberized clamp closed, that鈥檚 kinda what I had in mind. It might not be boat gear, but maybe mountain-climbing gear; I don鈥檛 know. I agree that normally, an outhaul tends to be a set-it-and-forget-it kind of adjustment; but that鈥檚 not the sort of sailing I would prefer to actually practice, or to teach my son; so a real simple, real quick, open-the-cam-and-set-the-outhaul kind of convenience, and then maybe do it again shortly thereafter, so it gets adjusted a lot, is what I鈥檓 striving for. Yeah, I can drive myself nuts... FWIW.
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On Jun 25, 2020, at 7:59 PM, Caleb Davison via groups.io <calebjess@...> wrote:
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Re: Amount of Outhaul Travel?
Warren,
On the boat I am crewing on now there is a control line for the height of the spinnaker pole attachment along the mast.聽 It is a continuous loop of line that runs along the mast from fairly low (for setting up pole) to above head height for flying the spinnaker.聽 It is controlled (held in place) by two of those clam cleats (one facing each direction).聽 To operate this control line you must first take this line out of both clam cleats and it will move freely in either direction.聽 When desired pole height is reached you merely put the line back in both clam cleats (that are mounted in-line with the line they are intended to "hold").聽 I can try to take a picture of this the next time we race (next Wednesday).聽 It works fairly well but is a little annoying as you have to disengage the clam cleats before adjusting it, then re-engage them.聽 Not the worst downside since pole height is not a control that gets tweaked a lot (similarly for an outhaul which is usually set to handle the current wind strength).聽聽
Caleb D
T27 #328
-----Original Message-----
From: Warren Stein via groups.io <wrsteinesq@...>
To: [email protected]
Sent: Thu, Jun 25, 2020 7:16 pm
Subject: Re: [T27Owners] Amount of Outhaul Travel?
Thank you, Caleb; good to hear from you.聽 A clam cleat WAS the intended cleating device.聽 Problem is, clam cleats hold only in ONE direction, not both.聽 What I need is a device to hold against either being pulled out OR pulled in.聽 Thoughts?聽
> On Jun 25, 2020, at 6:15 PM, Warren Stein via groups.io <wrsteinesq= [email protected]> wrote: > > 锘縊K, here鈥檚 another question for the group:聽 Suggestions for an appropriate cleating device for the outhaul in my last post?聽 What I think I need is, at least functionally, a pair of visegrips with rubber jaws, to easily and readily clamp or release a piece of straight 8mm line, so it can鈥檛 move either way, In or out.聽 It has to mount on the boom and not be a head-knocker, and not be too big; and be weatherproof. > > My son and I got ambitious and moved forward with the project.聽 It was a bear, but I think we鈥檝e succeeded.聽 The system is basically two separate multi-part purchases, joined together by their running parts:聽 The outhaul itself is Dyneema, running from the clew, into the boom, running forward internally, where it is spliced to the becket of one of two Harken three-sheave blocks, the little mini ones.聽 The other 鈥榮ide鈥� of that 6:1 purchase is a reciprocal Harken mini, with its becket anchored to the gooseneck internally.聽 So far, nothing unusual.聽 But then, the running part between those two blocks, the part you鈥檇 haul in or let out to control the outhaul, is then spliced to 8mm Salsa line, running outside the boom, coming out of the boom thru one exit box and re-entering the boom thru another.聽 That鈥檚 the only part In this system external to the boom.聽 So what that means is, on the lower starboard side of the boom, running from about above the companionway, to about 15鈥� in from the end of the boom, or about 7鈥�, is this Salsa line.聽 If you pull it from forward to aft, it takes in the outhaul, 6:1.聽 So it takes 6鈥� of Salsa to move the outhaul 1鈥�.聽 If you pull it from aft to forward, you鈥檙e pulling against the shock cord take-up, but that allows the outhaul to pay out, again, 6:1. > > All of this cumbersome description leads to the question:聽 what sort of cleating device can anyone suggest for that Salsa line?聽 It runs fore-to-aft along the boom, and its slack is automatically taken up, so at all times it鈥檚 just a straight piece of line, but pull-able, either way.聽 You can pull it forward; you can pull it aft.聽 Either way it鈥檚 just a straight tensioned piece of line.聽 What I hadn鈥檛 counted on was this:聽 with no cleating device, if you just let it go, the shock cord take-up system goes to work, tensioning the outhaul and pulling it tight.聽 I had expected to have to cleat it against pull from the sail, not the pull from the (opposing) shock cord.聽 聽 Now, in heavier weather, I WILL need to cleat against It being pulled OUT from the force of the main.聽 But in calmer weather, it seems that I may have to cleat against it being pulled IN, by the shock cord.聽 So I think what I want is some sort of small, non-head-smacking gripping device,聽 Mounted on the boom above the cockpit, so I can open it easily, adjust the outhaul, and then close it, cinching the line both ways, so it can鈥檛 be either pulled out by the sail or in by the shock cord.聽 I鈥檓 thinking of something like that Tiller-Tamer.聽 聽 Any ideas?聽 Thanks!
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