Great story Scott - but I doubt that water pressure will work in this case.
There are at least two blockages. One about ten feet down from the top, another about six feet up from the base and who knows what in between.
And they occupy the entire cross section of the mast.
They do seem to be styrofoam-like. I'll try poking at them with a long steel rod that I happen to have, and report back.
Hmmm - is there anything that will dissolve styrofoam and not attack aluminum?
|
This is probably goofy and unhelpful, but I'm reminded of the
frequently occuring problem of wetvac hose clogs, and the easiest way
to clear them... running water through. If you run out of other ideas,
hoist up one end and put the garden hose in it. Water pressure per
square inch is a function of the depth of the water and 40 feet,
by ,
is about 17psi, if you stood it bolt upright and filled it with water.
At a 45 degree angle, half that.
This is probably another braindead thing, but I got tired of water
running in to the bilge during heavy rains, so I put a bunch of
polyurathane foam in the mast above the deck level and stuck a
poker through an existing disused rivet/bolt hole also above
deck level but a bit lower than the foam and and poked up
through the polyurathane, effectively causing the same problem
you are now dealing with. Oops.
Anyway, bats got in to the house last night, probably lured in
by the fresh baked strawberry rhubarb pie. Couldn't possibily be
a coincidence. So if water doesn't work, maybe try luring badgers
in to the mast.
Good luck. Let us know how it goes. Sadly, this might not be
the bottom of the barrel.
-scott
(sending in duplicate but from the correct address hoping one copy, no
more, no less, goes through)
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
On 6/15/22, acc_t@... <acc_t@...> wrote: We unstepped the mast last fall and just now are getting around to upgrading
the lights and wiring on the mast.
To my surprise it seems that a snake cannot be run down the inside of the
mast.
There are at least two blocks of an unknown material in the mast and there
seems to be no way to get new wires past them.
Or even pull an existing wire through.
Has anyone encountered this?
And if so, how to remove then? Or get through them?
Thanks
Barry
|
If it hasn't been in the water since 82, your rigging might be fine depending on how it was stored. That's 40 less years of outside exposure, shock-loading, and other problems that age the rigging and eventually require replacement. It's worth the close look and inspection. That said, you've also got the mast down now... it's a good time to take care of all the preventative maintenance.?
One thing I will caution is that if you're missing parts, it might make sense to back into full replacement of the stays/shrouds. It could be pretty difficult to piece together a full kit between old parts and modern components. Not to mention, you'd then have new strong parts and older (slightly weaker) parts working together in the same system.?
Hopefully it's all there, and hopefully after being out of the water for 40 years, it's still in pretty good shape.?
|
I ran into this when trying to run the wires up the existing conduit in the mast. I was able to slowly push the obstructions further up the mast with some pressure on the snake. However, it eventually wouldn't budget further.?Unfortunately, I had to run the wires outside the conduit. I used the old 'zip-tie' trick to try to keep wires from slapping. A couple of weeks in, seems to be working.?
How far up is the obstruction? If it's not too far, you might be able to get a hold of some sort of rod or pole and poke through as Rick is suggesting.?
-Lee: T27-2 Dawn (#663)
|
The blocks might be styrofoam or something to keep the internal wires from slapping around making noise. Sharpen a pole and try to break through perhaps.?
On Wed, Jun 15, 2022 at 6:39 PM < acc_t@...> wrote: We unstepped the mast last fall and just now are getting around to upgrading the lights and wiring on the mast.
To my surprise it seems that a snake cannot be run down the inside of the mast.?
There are at least two blocks of an unknown material in the mast and there seems to be no way to get new wires past them.
Or even pull an existing wire through.
Has anyone encountered this?
And if so, how to remove then? Or get through them??
Thanks
Barry
|
We unstepped the mast last fall and just now are getting around to upgrading the lights and wiring on the mast.
To my surprise it seems that a snake cannot be run down the inside of the mast.?
There are at least two blocks of an unknown material in the mast and there seems to be no way to get new wires past them.
Or even pull an existing wire through.
Has anyone encountered this?
And if so, how to remove then? Or get through them??
Thanks
Barry
|
There is a SS "strap" that lays across the mast head fitting. It takes the the head stay and back stay. And is secured by the three bolts in the top of the cap. The bail on the front of the cap casting is for the spinnaker/ gennaker halyard block.
--
Carl Damm
DAMSELv
1976 #593
Stuart Fl
|
Thank You for all the info!?definitely?helps piecing these boxes and boxes of stuff together.
My tangs for the shrouds are ~1ft below?the top of the mast and are bolted thru 2 sheaves.??
I think when I bought the boat he mentioned the SS cables were newer, but this boat hasn't?been in the water since 82, and not sure what newer means as it has had a couple of owners since it last sailed....
Now to look for more parts that can attach to the mast head.
Cheers,
On Tue, Jun 14, 2022 at 4:48 AM lm53187 < muellerl@...> wrote: Hey Jeff,?
I recently finished re-rigging #663. It's a bit pricey, but was worth the effort while I had the mast down. To the best of my knowledge, the standing rigging was original (over 40 years old) and in need of replacement. Now, #663 is a T27-2 and I know there are plenty of differences (I can already see the masthead is different), but I'm not sure how far that extends to the rest of the rig. So... the advice I can give may or may not be helpful.?
A few things of note:?
- The upper ends of all your shrouds will likely terminate in an eye for fitting to a tang with a clovis pin. The lower end will likely have a threaded stud for fitting into a turnbuckle (the turnbuckles may or may not be there). The forestay might be a little different, and have an eye on the top and lower end (or some other termination). I've seen some different approaches to forestays.?
- Your mast will likely have tangs on it (see the fork-like stainless steel attachments below the masthead on the attached photo). These should be through-bolted on the mast. Both uppers and lowers should have tangs on which to attach. The uppers near the masthead, the lowers beneath the spreaders. The attachment will likely be made with an eye fitting (on the end of a stay) with a clovis pin.?
- My masthead has a bolt on the fore and aft ends that are fitted with a stainless steel toggle. The forestay and backstay attach to this toggle with a clovis pin through the eye. On the attached photos, only the backstay is installed. At the time of the photo, I hadn't yet installed the uppers or forestay. Either way, your masthead looks different.?
- All of my clovis pins are 3/8". Yours may differ.?
- Caleb mentions the awkward fitting of the lower/uppers on most T27s. They cross to reach the chainplates. [It is worth note that this is NOT the case on the T27-2 (in case others are reading)].
- When running the uppers through the spreaders, the spreaders should be bent slightly up, not down or horizontal. I believe further discussion of this and even the exact angle can be found in the group's documents.?
- Replacing the stays is well within the capabilities of most old boat caretakers if you use sta-lok or similar terminals. I had never done this before and learned a ton from this group, the T27 facebook group, and various other sources. Our cost to do this was around ~$1,200 and well worth the peace of mind.?
I have numerous additional photos from our re-rigging, but thought the attached two of the masthead were most helpful as you explore your rig. Again, yours looks significantly different (early vs late model), but it might help explain some of what I found on our rig.
?
|
Hey Jeff,?
I recently finished re-rigging #663. It's a bit pricey, but was worth the effort while I had the mast down. To the best of my knowledge, the standing rigging was original (over 40 years old) and in need of replacement. Now, #663 is a T27-2 and I know there are plenty of differences (I can already see the masthead is different), but I'm not sure how far that extends to the rest of the rig. So... the advice I can give may or may not be helpful.?
A few things of note:?
- The upper ends of all your shrouds will likely terminate in an eye for fitting to a tang with a clovis pin. The lower end will likely have a threaded stud for fitting into a turnbuckle (the turnbuckles may or may not be there). The forestay might be a little different, and have an eye on the top and lower end (or some other termination). I've seen some different approaches to forestays.?
- Your mast will likely have tangs on it (see the fork-like stainless steel attachments below the masthead on the attached photo). These should be through-bolted on the mast. Both uppers and lowers should have tangs on which to attach. The uppers near the masthead, the lowers beneath the spreaders. The attachment will likely be made with an eye fitting (on the end of a stay) with a clovis pin.?
- My masthead has a bolt on the fore and aft ends that are fitted with a stainless steel toggle. The forestay and backstay attach to this toggle with a clovis pin through the eye. On the attached photos, only the backstay is installed. At the time of the photo, I hadn't yet installed the uppers or forestay. Either way, your masthead looks different.?
- All of my clovis pins are 3/8". Yours may differ.?
- Caleb mentions the awkward fitting of the lower/uppers on most T27s. They cross to reach the chainplates. [It is worth note that this is NOT the case on the T27-2 (in case others are reading)].
- When running the uppers through the spreaders, the spreaders should be bent slightly up, not down or horizontal. I believe further discussion of this and even the exact angle can be found in the group's documents.?
- Replacing the stays is well within the capabilities of most old boat caretakers if you use sta-lok or similar terminals. I had never done this before and learned a ton from this group, the T27 facebook group, and various other sources. Our cost to do this was around ~$1,200 and well worth the peace of mind.?
I have numerous additional photos from our re-rigging, but thought the attached two of the masthead were most helpful as you explore your rig. Again, yours looks significantly different (early vs late model), but it might help explain some of what I found on our rig.
?
|
#1? Anti chaf rubber belongs at spreader #2? Life lines #4? Shroud tang to connect shroud #5? 316 stainless strap belongs over this mast head piece for fore and aft stays to connect.?
On Mon, Jun 13, 2022 at 5:40 PM Caleb Davison via <calebjess= [email protected]> wrote:
Jeff,
There is a file in the "files" section of the page.? It contains an item called "information.htm" which I copied from an older T27 website.?
What is good about it is that it has all the specific sizes for the running and standing rigging (among other items of interest).
In this case the thickness of the wire determines if it is a forestay/backstay or inner/outer shroud.? The back stay and forestay are the same thickness (3/16") but the back stay will be longer than the forestay.? There are only the upper and lower shroud and these should be obvious by their diameter and length.? Worthy of note is that often the upper shroud is put on the slightly more inboard chain plate and the lower shroud is on the slightly more outboard chainplate.? I believe this is how it was designed, but it will work if you reverse them.? You will just have to tighten the rig until it is comfortable.? Good luck figuring out the rest of the hardware.??
It may also be worth your while to replace the turnbuckles (if they show any signs of age).? This can be expensive but losing the rig on a sailboat could be even more expensive.
Good luck.
Caleb D.
T27 #328
-----Original Message-----
From: Sol Rebel < bristow.jeff@...>
To: [email protected]
Sent: Mon, Jun 13, 2022 5:16 pm
Subject: [T27Owners] Standing Rigging
? Hi All,
I'm trying to make sense of the rigging that came with my boat and was hoping someone could shed light on it.? This boat came with lots of extra parts that aren't necessarily from T27...
Are there any diagrams that show how the rigging is attached to the top of the mast?
I have 6 cables (which is a good start)?
I'm assuming all the threaded ends go into the turnbuckles, which i have 6 (pic3), and they attach on the deck and the shackle ends attach at the mast head?and mast?sheaves thru bolt (pic4).
pic 1 and 2 have different "boots" on both ends, guessing these are fore and aft stays?? and the rest are the shrouds.
I have this masthead?(pic 5) , where does the rigging attach?
Finally I removed the mast sheaves, seems like these can just be cleaned up and put back in.
Thanks in advance for any help, 9yrs of slow work and hoping to maybe splash her by summer's end...
Cheers,
Jeff
Hull 459
|
Jeff,
There is a file in the "files" section of the groups.io page.? It contains an item called "information.htm" which I copied from an older T27 website.?
What is good about it is that it has all the specific sizes for the running and standing rigging (among other items of interest).
In this case the thickness of the wire determines if it is a forestay/backstay or inner/outer shroud.? The back stay and forestay are the same thickness (3/16") but the back stay will be longer than the forestay.? There are only the upper and lower shroud and these should be obvious by their diameter and length.? Worthy of note is that often the upper shroud is put on the slightly more inboard chain plate and the lower shroud is on the slightly more outboard chainplate.? I believe this is how it was designed, but it will work if you reverse them.? You will just have to tighten the rig until it is comfortable.? Good luck figuring out the rest of the hardware.??
It may also be worth your while to replace the turnbuckles (if they show any signs of age).? This can be expensive but losing the rig on a sailboat could be even more expensive.
Good luck.
Caleb D.
T27 #328
-----Original Message-----
From: Sol Rebel <bristow.jeff@...>
To: [email protected]
Sent: Mon, Jun 13, 2022 5:16 pm
Subject: [T27Owners] Standing Rigging
? Hi All,
I'm trying to make sense of the rigging that came with my boat and was hoping someone could shed light on it.? This boat came with lots of extra parts that aren't necessarily from T27...
Are there any diagrams that show how the rigging is attached to the top of the mast?
I have 6 cables (which is a good start)?
I'm assuming all the threaded ends go into the turnbuckles, which i have 6 (pic3), and they attach on the deck and the shackle ends attach at the mast head?and mast?sheaves thru bolt (pic4).
pic 1 and 2 have different "boots" on both ends, guessing these are fore and aft stays?? and the rest are the shrouds.
I have this masthead?(pic 5) , where does the rigging attach?
Finally I removed the mast sheaves, seems like these can just be cleaned up and put back in.
Thanks in advance for any help, 9yrs of slow work and hoping to maybe splash her by summer's end...
Cheers,
Jeff
Hull 459
|
? Hi All,
I'm trying to make sense of the rigging that came with my boat and was hoping someone could shed light on it.? This boat came with lots of extra parts that aren't necessarily from T27...
Are there any diagrams that show how the rigging is attached to the top of the mast?
I have 6 cables (which is a good start)?
I'm assuming all the threaded ends go into the turnbuckles, which i have 6 (pic3), and they attach on the deck and the shackle ends attach at the mast head?and mast?sheaves thru bolt (pic4).
pic 1 and 2 have different "boots" on both ends, guessing these are fore and aft stays?? and the rest are the shrouds.
I have this masthead?(pic 5) , where does the rigging attach?
Finally I removed the mast sheaves, seems like these can just be cleaned up and put back in.
Thanks in advance for any help, 9yrs of slow work and hoping to maybe splash her by summer's end...
Cheers, Jeff Hull 459
|
Re: Centerboard Cable thru hull question.
The boat is on the hard in Cambridge, I'm in Royal Oak, hope to
moor on Edge Creek off off Broad Creek.
On 6/12/2022 1:16 PM, Patrick McGough
wrote:
Keating
Where on the Chesapeake?? I am on Frog Mortar
Creek off of Middle River.
Patrick
#079 (I think)
-------- Original message --------
Date: 6/12/22 12:42 PM (GMT-05:00)
Subject: Re: [T27Owners] Centerboard Cable thru hull
question.
Carl, I just purchased 1975 Hull #618, she was a Great Lakes boat
most
of her life. She will be sailing the Chesapeake. Do you have any
advise
you can share on thru hulls ? I have read that it is advisable to
replace all of them. Many Thanks, Keating
On 6/12/2022 7:33 AM, Carl Damm wrote:
> On my 1965 and 1975 the original thru hulls where pipe
nipples
> threaded into the glass. A proper thru hull will have a skin
fitting
> and a valve with a flange that is bolted to the hull. The
thru hull is
> the skin fitting. The valve is the sea cock. DeBond breaks
down 5200
> and most caulks that are not silcone based, leave any sicone
at home.
> It has no use on a boat.
> Check out spartan hardware from Robinhood marine or Blake's
secocks.
> For proper fittings that will last 50+ years.
>
> Our center board pennant pipe was also threaded and glassed.
We
> sourced a long bronze nipple and re attached with west
system.
>
> Carl Damm
> DAMSELv
> 1976 #593
> Stuart Fl
>
>
>
--
Bowie Insurance Group Inc.
21 North Hanson Street Suite 105
Easton, Maryland 21601
800-787-9274
410-820-4500
Fax 410-819-0105
--
Bowie Insurance Group Inc.
21 North Hanson Street Suite 105
Easton, Maryland 21601
800-787-9274
410-820-4500
Fax 410-819-0105
|
Re: Centerboard Cable thru hull question.
Keating Where on the Chesapeake?? I am on Frog Mortar Creek off of Middle River. Patrick #079 (I think)
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
-------- Original message -------- From: Keating Bowie <keating@...> Date: 6/12/22 12:42 PM (GMT-05:00) Subject: Re: [T27Owners] Centerboard Cable thru hull question.
Carl, I just purchased 1975 Hull #618, she was a Great Lakes boat most of her life. She will be sailing the Chesapeake. Do you have any advise you can share on thru hulls ? I have read that it is advisable to replace all of them. Many Thanks, Keating On 6/12/2022 7:33 AM, Carl Damm wrote: > On my 1965 and 1975 the original thru hulls where pipe nipples > threaded into the glass. A proper thru hull will have a skin fitting > and a valve with a flange that is bolted to the hull. The thru hull is > the skin fitting. The valve is the sea cock. DeBond breaks down 5200 > and most caulks that are not silcone based, leave any sicone at home. > It has no use on a boat. > Check out spartan hardware from Robinhood marine or Blake's secocks. > For proper fittings that will last 50+ years. > > Our center board pennant pipe was also threaded and glassed. We > sourced a long bronze nipple and re attached with west system. > > Carl Damm > DAMSELv > 1976 #593 > Stuart Fl > > > -- Bowie Insurance Group Inc. 21 North Hanson Street Suite 105 Easton, Maryland 21601 800-787-9274 410-820-4500 Fax 410-819-0105 www.bowieinsurance.com
|
Re: Centerboard Cable thru hull question.
Carl, I just purchased 1975 Hull #618, she was a Great Lakes boat most of her life. She will be sailing the Chesapeake. Do you have any advise you can share on thru hulls ? I have read that it is advisable to replace all of them. Many Thanks, Keating
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
On 6/12/2022 7:33 AM, Carl Damm wrote: On my 1965 and 1975 the original thru hulls where pipe nipples threaded into the glass. A proper thru hull will have a skin fitting and a valve with a flange that is bolted to the hull. The thru hull is the skin fitting. The valve is the sea cock. DeBond breaks down 5200 and most caulks that are not silcone based, leave any sicone at home. It has no use on a boat.
Check out spartan hardware from Robinhood marine or Blake's secocks. For proper fittings that will last 50+ years.
Our center board pennant pipe was also threaded and glassed. We sourced a long bronze nipple and re attached with west system.
Carl Damm
DAMSELv
1976 #593
Stuart Fl
--
Bowie Insurance Group Inc.
21 North Hanson Street Suite 105
Easton, Maryland 21601
800-787-9274
410-820-4500
Fax 410-819-0105
www.bowieinsurance.com
|
Re: Centerboard Cable thru hull question.
On my 1965 and 1975 the original thru hulls where pipe nipples threaded into the glass. A proper thru hull will have a skin fitting and a valve with a flange that is bolted to the hull. The thru hull is the skin fitting. The valve is the sea cock. DeBond breaks down 5200 and most caulks that are not silcone based, leave any sicone at home. It has no use on a boat.
Check out spartan hardware from Robinhood marine or Blake's secocks. For proper fittings that will last 50+ years.
Our center board pennant pipe was also threaded and glassed. We sourced a long bronze nipple and re attached with west system.
Carl Damm
DAMSELv
1976 #593
Stuart Fl
|
I have listed my beloved T27 for sale on craigslist and may post it elsewhere. (Advice welcomed!)?
Here is the link:
She was put on the hard for centerboard repair and rebedding deck hardware, as well as surface treatments, fixed lights, rudder repair, and other miscellaneous projects.
She is a 1966, and therefore perhaps the best iteration of the T27¡¯s legendary production run, having solid decks and internal ballast¡ªthe only year where I understand these two features overlap. She also has other desirable features, like a Monel tank, and a full mizzen rig to convert her if desired!
She is no derelict! Do the key projects and go sailing. Asking $2000.
I have MANY other pieces collected for the project. These are negotiable, and/or they will all be listed for sale as I am able to get to it.
Please ask if you have any questions!
|
Re: Selling our T27 in CT.
Hi Kevin,
I do not have very many pix right now as the boat is still under cover.? I have two attached, the engine when it was just installed, and one last fall.? The rest of the boat is stock with exception of the mast which is modern with internal halyards.
If you are interested, I can show it to you at just about any time....
Thanks for the interest,
Jim
203-838-0039 home
-----Original Message-----
From: Kevin Morrissey <Krmorrissey@...>
To: [email protected]
Sent: Tue, Apr 26, 2022 2:08 pm
Subject: Re: [T27Owners] Selling our T27 in CT.
Do you have pictures posted somewhere?
Hi All,
It's time...."you have to know when to hold'em and when to fold'em'...and it is the time for us to sell our boat of 42 years sailed on Western Long Island Sound.? It is a type one '64 hull #123 with many upgrades including Yanmar diesel, modern mast with standing\running rigging and chainplates, propane stove, rebuilt\redesigned CB, head with holding tank and much more.? All the heavy reconstruction work is done to make it a safe sailer.? It just needs cosmetics such as paint and a little fiberglass work.? I would sail this boat anywhere, it is that seaworthy.? Asking 7,500.00 which includes spring launching in Norwalk CT.? So sad to let it go, but it is time to fold'em.
Contact:
--
|
Re: Selling our T27 in CT.
Do you have pictures posted somewhere?
Hi All,
It's time...."you have to know when to hold'em and when to fold'em'...and it is the time for us to sell our boat of 42 years sailed on Western Long Island Sound.? It is a type one '64 hull #123 with many upgrades including Yanmar diesel, modern mast with standing\running rigging and chainplates, propane stove, rebuilt\redesigned CB, head with holding tank and much more.? All the heavy reconstruction work is done to make it a safe sailer.? It just needs cosmetics such as paint and a little fiberglass work.? I would sail this boat anywhere, it is that seaworthy.? Asking 7,500.00 which includes spring launching in Norwalk CT.? So sad to let it go, but it is time to fold'em.
Contact:
|
Hi All,
It's time...."you have to know when to hold'em and when to fold'em'...and it is the time for us to sell our boat of 42 years sailed on Western Long Island Sound.? It is a type one '64 hull #123 with many upgrades including Yanmar diesel, modern mast with standing\running rigging and chainplates, propane stove, rebuilt\redesigned CB, head with holding tank and much more.? All the heavy reconstruction work is done to make it a safe sailer.? It just needs cosmetics such as paint and a little fiberglass work.? I would sail this boat anywhere, it is that seaworthy.? Asking 7,500.00 which includes spring launching in Norwalk CT.? So sad to let it go, but it is time to fold'em.
Contact:
?jdob3542@..., mention T27 in subject to avoid spam
|
Sol Rebel
