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Bluetooth problems AA-55 Zoom
I have had problems with the Bluetooth feature on my AA-55 Zoom since I bought it last year.? I am running the latest firmware 1.20.
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Here is a summary of the problems.
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1.? It will not always connect to Windows 8.1 or Windows 7 via Bluetooth.
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- It always connects with the USB cable and I have no problems running in this manner. With Bluetooth I have to power it on and off a few times in order to get it to connect to Antscope2.? I have used the internal laptop Bluetooth and an external Bluetooth dongle and get the same results on both.? It always pairs OK it is just data transfer that is a problem.
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- I also have An Android tablet and it connects to that device much better but has data transfer issues.
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- I tried to run the iPad app but it will not connect at all. I read that the Bluetooth module is not compatible with iOS
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2. Dropping data.
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- The link is not reliable on Windows or Android.? It is OK with only 50 points of data transfer but with more points (like 200 or 500) it drops data and you can see it as straight lines on the plots.? When using Antscope2 on Windows I can also tell when it has dropped data because the spinning circle will keep running and I have to press single again to stop it.
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- I have attached an Android screenshot and a Windows AntScope2 plot showing the missing data dropouts.
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What I have done to find the problem
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-? As mentioned above I have tried different Bluetooth dongles and operating systems and get the same result - missing data on longer transfers.
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- It is NOT the Antscope2 program on Android or Windows.? I know this because I used a serial communications program in Windows to access the AA-55 Zoom .? What I did was issue the "ver" command and looked for the response from the device.? As I mentioned above sometimes it would not connect.? But once it did I would send the command "frxNNNN" to get the data.? With NNNN =50 it works just about every time.? Above that it starts to drop data and with NNNN = 500 it always drops data and this can be seen clearly on the screenshots.
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-? ?I am only 1 to 2 meters away so it is not? weak reception problem. So my suspicion is that there is a buffer overrun on the Bluetooth link.? Maybe the Bluetooth module is not configured correctly to accept data and is losing characters.
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I have seen others report having a similar problem with the Bluetooth in this group and on the RigExpert Facebook group. I sent a copy of this report to RigExpert support a week ago but have not heard back from them? ?In general I find the AA-55 to be well made and very useful device and hope that my Bluetooth problem can be fixed.? I suspect it is a firmware timing problem.?
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Have any other members of this group had the same problem?
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Doug VE7DXK
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Yes. I also have a AA-55 zoom with the bluetooth option.? I cannot connect via bluetooth to antscope on my laptop or my tablet.? The unit pairs properly,? but does not work with antscope.? Connection via the usb cable works ok.
I am also puzzled that when I pair the unit to my laptop, in windows device manager, it shows two comports associated with the bluetooth (AA-55) device.? ?Yet in antscope settings, you can only select one com port. Neither work.? Am I missing something here? Carl KP2L? |
It seems a few of us are having problems with Bluetooth on our RigExpert? analyzers.? I saw the comments below on the RigExpert Facebook group.? I am surprised that RigExpert does not respond to my detailed bug report or those of other owners.? I guess they just don't care if the product has a defect....
Doug VE7DXK |
Here is some more information on this problem for those interested.? I used a Bluetooth Protocol Analyzer to monitor the?
traffic going from my AA-55 Zoom to an Android Tablet.? RigExpert sends the data in formatted ASCII with each line?
containing one frequency and its measured data. The format looks like this 2.420000,53.32,135.94 where the first field is the?
frequency and the second and third are the data.??
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The Protocol Analyzer time stamps each line of data.? If you look through the attached pdf you can see two times where it?
dropped 11 lines of data.??
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I repeated the test on my Windows machine to see if the Bluetooth in the Android or the CPU speed was causing the problem.? I?
got the same results in Windows where bursts of multiple lines are being lost.??
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The next step was to record the data from the AA-55 Zoom when transferring 500 points to AntScope 2 using the USB cable.??
This was error free and no errors were observed in Single or Continuous mode.?
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For the last test I purchased a small Bluetooth module like the one you see when you open the battery compartment.? I?
connected it to a Serial USB to TTL converter so I could send and receive data using a Windows Program called RealTerm.??
Using this setup RealTerm can "fake" being an AA-55 Zoom and send/receive data to AntScope 2 over a Bluetooth connection.??
When AntScope 2 starts it issues a VER command and a RigExpert product will reply with the model number and the firmware?
date. RealTerm was configured to reply with AA-55 Zoom 120? and then AntScope 2 would be activated.? I setup AntScope 2 to?
request 500 data points.? RealTerm can send files so it was configured to send the 500 data points recorded earlier. AntScope 2 received the data and plotted the results without errors.? This test was repeated multiple times in Single and Continuous mode with no errors.? The speed used was 115,200 baud which is much faster than what the AA-55 appears to use.? It looks like the AA-55 Bluetooth uses 9600 baud.
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Conclusions?
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1. Test were done on two computers: A Windows PC and an Android tablet.? Using the AA-55 Zoom with Bluetooth resulted in?
errors on both which makes Bluetooth option almost unusable.
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2. Using another Bluetooth module and the RealTerm program to "fake" AA-55 Zoom operation results in error-free data exchange?
with AntScope2 on Windows.? So the problem is not the PC CPU speed, the PC Bluetooth hardware or AntScope.? That leaves the?
AA-55 Zoom Bluetooth hardware or firmware? implementation as the problem.? It is either a faulty Bluetooth module inside my AA-55, a firmware?
buffering problem, insufficient link speed or some other programming issue.?
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3. RigExpert has been silent on this issue in this group. I wrote to support@... twice and did not get a reply.?I hope this detailed report and the last one I made will get a response and a solution.? It is disappointing to spend money on a product that does not work properly.
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VE7DXK |
Doug VE7DXK and I have been comparing notes. I'm having similar problems with my AA-55 Zoom BT with USB vs BT connections when using Antscope 2. I used the 1.1.14 version that Alex posted the link for in this Group. I just installed an Alpha Delta EE 40-10M Fan Dipole. Attached are two SWR sweeps in PNG format and two CSV files of the data. One pair is for a USB connection while the other is for a BT connection. Same antenna. All using a Win 10 x64 laptop (Lenovo Thinkpad T420s) with the latest Win updates. I've attached screenshots of the Bluetooth installation (it's BT 3.0). The AA-55 was two inches from the laptop for the BT sweep.
My results confirm Doug's in the sense that the USB sweep returns the 300 data points (actually 302!) while the BT returns fewer than the 300 spec (291). Now, 9 fewer points may not seem like much when we're sampling across a broad RF spectrum. But it does confirm that the BT connection is not behaving as reliably as the USB connection for Antscope 2. For a sweep that needs a more precise and not interpolated representation, this can be a problem. In any case, I'd ask Alex (or RigExpert in general) to assess the problem that Doug originally reported and that I've now confirmed. If there are others who can post with their own data, that would be great. I've added the details on the BT driver in this particular setup so as to assist RigExpert in evaluating how they are communicating from their BT stack to clients. Love both my AA-55 and my 230 Stick...and look forward to getting the BT connections to both working reliably. And on all platforms, LOL! 73, Frank K4FMH ADEE_300pts_BT.csv
ADEE_300pts_BT.csv
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ADEE_300pts_BT.png
ADEE_300pts_USB.csv
ADEE_300pts_USB.csv
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ADEE_300pts_USB.png
IMG_0498.JPG
IMG_0499.JPG
IMG_0500.JPG
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Thank you Frank Howell for posting a report on your problems with the AA-55 Zoom Bluetooth.
We now know that data is being dropped on a Bluetooth connection on your Windows 10 PC as well as on my Windows 7 and Windows 8.1 computers and my Android laptop tablet. It is not the Antscope2 application for Windows or Android that is causing the problem.? It also drops characters if you use a terminal program like Putty or TeraTerm and send ASCII commands like?fqXXXXXXXXX,?swXXXXXXXXX and?frxNNNN.?? Therefore the problem must be with the Bluetooth hardware module or the firmware in the AA-55 Zoom. I had an email from RigExpert on Nov. 24 saying they were looking into the problem and hoped to have a solution in 1 to 2 weeks.? I have not heard anything since then but hope that they find a solution soon. Doug VE7DXK |
¿ªÔÆÌåÓýDear friends.The problem with the unstable work of bluetooth is known and is currently being solved by our specialists. A test version of AntScope for Android is currently available. In this version, the logic of working with the AA-55 Zoom analyzer was revised and new features of the Bluetooth protocol were added for versions of Android 10. Link to file: /g/RigExpert-Family/files/Other%20software/AntScope-2.22-202012041511.apk Important. For the AA-55 Zoom and Stick 230 be sure to update the firmware to latest. A test version of AntScope2 for PC will be available a little later. It is also worth noting that analyzers with a Bluetooth module with the BLE protocol (Bluetooth Low Energy) at the moment cannot be connected to a PC with AntScope2 via Bluetooth. This opportunity will be implemented after the end of the planned work with the Bluetooth protocol. Best Regards, Alex
07.12.2020 19:15, Frank Howell §á§Ú§ê§Ö:
Doug VE7DXK and I have been comparing notes. I'm having similar problems with my AA-55 Zoom BT with USB vs BT connections when using Antscope 2. I used the 1.1.14 version that Alex posted the link for in this Group. I just installed an Alpha Delta EE 40-10M Fan Dipole. Attached are two SWR sweeps in PNG format and two CSV files of the data. One pair is for a USB connection while the other is for a BT connection. Same antenna. All using a Win 10 x64 laptop (Lenovo Thinkpad T420s) with the latest Win updates. I've attached screenshots of the Bluetooth installation (it's BT 3.0). The AA-55 was two inches from the laptop for the BT sweep. |
¿ªÔÆÌåÓýDear Doug, 08.12.2020 0:06, Doug VE7DXK §á§Ú§ê§Ö:
Alex, |
¿ªÔÆÌåÓýAlex,Thank you for the detailed and helpful response! I appreciate the steps that RigExpert is taking to make your Bluetooth analyzers better. I hope that my post may be helpful in a small way.
Thanks again,
Frank
K4FMH ---
Frank M. Howell, PhD
Ridgeland, MS
frankmhowell (at) hotmail.com
---
On Dec 7, 2020, at 3:58 PM, Alex RigExpert via groups.io <support@...> wrote:
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On Tue, Dec 8, 2020 at 02:22 AM, Alex RigExpert wrote:
Alex, Here is what I used for my tests:
This is what I have found so far:
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Android Tablet
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Good news
Windows 8.1 PC
Good news
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Summary
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There are still some issues with the firmware as described above (slow transfers, lockup). AntScope 2 has some timing problems.? I have some experience in Bluetooth protocol analysis and have an idea why the transfer is slow and can share them with RigExpert if they are interested.?
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Doug VE7DXK |
Hi Alex,
Like Doug, I downloaded the 1.1.5 version of AS 2 on my Win 10 laptop. It installs fine. But even using the suggested modifications of the BT settings here () regarding the default ingoing/outgoing BT com ports, I now cannot get my AA-55 Zoom BT to successfully connect to AS 2. It shows being paired in my BT manager in Win 10 but AS 2 does not connect whether under Auto or Manual with the Outgoing com port selected. So, I'm stuck regarding BT connections it seems. USB works fine. 73, Frank K4FMH |
Alex & Doug,
I got a Samsung Galaxy Tab A tablet today...upgraded to Android 10 upon setup. I downloaded the apk file and installed AS 2. I swept a couple of antennas, varying the number of points by bandwidth of the sweep. I can confirm Doug's results about the "slow" data transfer. At times, very slow. My FW on the AA-55 is 1.25 as per Alex's recommendation above. Hope this helps... Frank K4FMH |
¿ªÔÆÌåÓýDoug, Frank, Doug, I'd appreciate any help you can give us. 09.12.2020 2:37, Frank Howell §á§Ú§ê§Ö§ä:
Alex & Doug, |
On Wed, Dec 9, 2020 at 06:14 AM, Alex RigExpert wrote:
Alex you have my email address and I would be happy to share with your developers what I know? about Bluetooth and the lost data when making AA55-Zomm BT transfers.
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Here are some comments I hope you find useful.
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? ? The AA- 55 Zoom is transferring serial data using Standard Bluetooth (not BLE).? Bluetooth serial? mode is a protocol that transfers using the underlying BT RFCOMM protocol? which ensures that the serial data is transferred error-free across the BT link.? The default serial speed into the BT hardware is usually 9600 bits per second but between BT devices is much, much faster.? In fact the serial link can be run at 115,000 bps in some cases if the microprocessor, PC or Android device can buffer data at this speed.
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? ? I did a 500 frequency point BT transfer from the AA-55 Zoom to an Android protocol analyzer in my tablet.? Each point is one line with approximately 21 characters (depends on frequency value). The total number of characters transferred was 10,296. Characters are sent in serial ASCII with 8 bits plus one stop bit and one start bit. The total time to transfer was 29.12 seconds.? The transfer speed was (10,296 characters*10 bits)/29.12 equals 3535 bits per second.? This is very slow for a Bluetooth connection.
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? ? A small BT HC-05 module was connected to my PC using a USB to TTL converter.? The BT module has a default serial port input speed of 9600 bits per second (baud).? The 500 data points that were sent by the AA-55 Zoom to the Android tablet in the test above were stored in a test file.? This 500 point data file was then sent across BT to the Android tablet and recorded in the serial BT protocol analyzer.? The transfer ran without errors at the full 9600 bps transfer speed.? This is 3 times faster than the AA-55 Zoom and proves that the Android tablet and software can transfer at this speed.? Similar results occur on a Windows PC and it should be easily possible to go much faster although this was not tested.
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? ? The original BT transfer problem reported here and in emails to your support group was that data was being lost in bursts.? These bursts were 10 or 11 lines of data or approximately 200 to 250 ASCII characters.? This could be happening in the BT module itself or in the character buffers used by the microprocessor.? ?9600 bps is a pretty slow input rate? for a BT module so I don't suspect a buffering problem inside the module. I suspect it is in the microprocessor code.? Why the problem with Bluetooth and not USB?? The microprocessor is usually sending the data over a high speed USB link and the link is faster than the sweep rate of the analyzer so buffering requirements are minimal.? However when using a slow serial BT link it is possible that the firmware buffers are periodically overflowing with larger transfers (>50 points I found).
In the current 1.25 firmware it is my guess that the RigExpert developers just delay transmission after every character sent or after every line of data to avoid buffer overflow.? This is a simple fix but it slows down the transfer speed considerably.? A better buffer management scheme would permit much faster transfers.? It could be almost as fast as USB with higher BT serial speeds like 38,400.? ?
Alex this is just some input to help resolve the problem.? I look forward to testing your next software and firmware release.
Doug VE7DXK ? |
Frank,
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I find that the beta AntScope2 program takes a long time to connect to the Zoom when using BTooth. It is almost instantaneous with USB but I have waited 6 or 7 seconds when connecting with Bluetooth. Sometimes it won't connect at all. Make sure you have fresh batteries installed or use a USB power pack. Try this... - set up AntScope2 for manual and the desired COM port - exit AntScope 2 - turn off you AA-55 Zoom if on, wait 20 seconds or so and turn it on - wait at least 20 seconds for a BT connection - start Antscope 2 and hopefully it will connect in 10 seconds or so. You can see that RigExpert has gone quiet again. The only reason they responded to this BT problem is because I contacted the Canadian supplier who sold me the unit and complained about the lack of support and how my emails and groups.io posts were being ignored. He contacted the president of the company and that is why Alex started to respond to the problem. But I have heard nothing from their developers or tech support.. Some time ago they posted with great fanfare on the NanoVNA groups.io that AntScope 2 would support the NanoVNA. They had a buggy release and it was fixed somewhat with promises for a new release. Months went by and they were never heard from again. I don't hold out much hope for ever getting this BT problem fixed to users satisfaction. We will have to see. I appreciate you supporting me on this problem. Doug On 2020-12-08 13:06 p.m., Frank Howell wrote:
Hi Alex, |
Doug,
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I¡¯ll try this weekend. Plus, I¡¯m going to use my more recent Thinkpad Carbon X1 with newer BT as a second variability test. More when I have it! Frank --- Frank M. Howell, PhD Ridgeland, MS frankmhowell (at) hotmail.com --- On Dec 11, 2020, at 2:10 PM, Doug VE7DXK <ve7dxk@...> wrote: |
Dear Doug,
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Yes indeed. The developers informed me that they have set delays in packet exchange in order to avoid data loss.
Of course, this is not the most efficient solution. But this was done to solve the problem at the moment.
In the future, a different, more optimal solution will be used (for example, a binary protocol, no buffering, etc.)
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We do not ignore your messages. As this case has shown, it takes more time not to make hasty conclusions and offer a better solution.
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Thank you again for your assistance.
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Sincerely yours, Alex |
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