Is it appropriate to discuss ATSF reefers on this list?

Glad to see you with us.

Discussions on these reefers (or PFE for that matter) are quite
appropriate for this group.

Yahoo has several Santa Fe, SP and UP groups which would be better
places for discussions of other types of cars, plus this group's
links include links to the historical societies for these railroads.

Bob Chaparro
Owner-Moderator.

Paul-

This model and an image are featured in this group's files section
on the "Models and > Supplies" list. This list takes a bit of time
to download due to the images so be patient.

I will say the footprint is quite large. The Library of Congress
website has drawings of this structure and you can calculate the
scale footprint of the building from the drawings.

And thanks again for that wonderful presentation on the railroads
last September at the PSR Cobvention in Glendale.

Bob Chaparro
Group Owner & Moderator
(also PSR/NMRA Layout Coordinator)

开云体育

开云体育

Some of you may be wondering what happened to Yesteryear's model of
the National Orange Company packing house once located in Riverside,
Calif.? The model has been advertised a few times in the hobby press
but never seems to appear on Yesteryear's website.? This model (and
an image) is listed in this group's files section on the "Models and
Supplies" list.

First of all, models actually have been produced and sold in recent
months.? Mike Aldridge of the Orange County Module Railroaders
built one for his module.? I hope to have a photo of the module on
this site very soon.?

I talked with a representative of Yesteryear at the World's Greatest
Hobby Show this weekend.? She told me they are somewhat at the mercy
of Intermountain, who actually makes the HO and N-scale kits of this
model.? Intermountain is going strong with a lot of kits so these
particular kits compete for production time.

Yesteryear hopes to have more kits of this model in the coming
months and when they do, they will be put on the website and offered
for sale.

Bob Chaparro
Mission Viejo, CA






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I reviewed the InterMountain HO scale Santa Fe refrigerator cars when they were first introduced, in the March 1996 "Model Railroader," pages 40-42. They were quite good then and they're even a little better now.

Note that they carry "SFRD" reporting marks, as is correct for Santa Fe Refrigerator Department, not "ATSF." In car clerks' and switchmen's shorthand they were often just "RDs."

So long,

Andy

Andy Sperandeo
Executive Editor
MODEL RAILROADER Magazine
262-796-8776, ext. 461
Fax 262-796-1142
asperandeo@...

Is it appropriate to discuss ATSF reefers on this list? I'm looking
for someone who can speak about, or direct me to good information
regarding, the accuracy of the Intermountain HO scale ATSF reefers.
(I haven't bought any yet.)

If this is the wrong list for this subject (I see rolling stock has
been conspicuously ignored so far), I apologize.


Thanks,

Jack P.






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George Hollwedel
Prototype N Scale Models
georgeloop@...
310 Loma Verde Street
Buda, TX 78610-9785
512-796-6883

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Yahoo! Search presents -

Is it appropriate to discuss ATSF reefers on this list? I'm looking
for someone who can speak about, or direct me to good information
regarding, the accuracy of the Intermountain HO scale ATSF reefers.
(I haven't bought any yet.)

If this is the wrong list for this subject (I see rolling stock has
been conspicuously ignored so far), I apologize.


Thanks,

Jack P.

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Hi Jim:

?

Under what section of the American Memory site from the Library of Congress did you find the photos and track diagrams for the packing house ?? ...

?

Thanks,

?

Pepper

I am currently finishing the Yesteryear kit "National Orange
Packing", which I purchased last year...
I lived for 50 years near the beach in the Los Angeles area just
south of LAX, and last year moved to a small town just west of
Indianapolis.

I first became interested in modeling Southern California as a way
of staying with my life in California, and having met Bob Smaus,
remembered his articles on modeling various aspects of the citrus
industry, including the area around Fillmore, CA, which my wife and
I visited many times while teaching geology.

Using the 'net, I found the Library of Congress American Memory site
about the National Orange Packing Plant, and after reading its
history, discovered that in 1928 Louis Crowell (relation? who knows?
but totally cool just the same) purchased it for $800,000. With
that piece of information, I just had to build it, and after
downloading all the diagrams from the 'net, planned on
scratchbuilding it.

When I saw the advertisement for the building, at just twice what I
figured it would cost to scratch, I knew I had to have it, and
called to order it... it came about a month later, as was explained,
due to the Intermountain delays.

Since I wanted to build the complete building, I took the back of
the kit and moved it to the right side, now producing a building
twice the length with half the depth, still about six inches deep
and since it was going against the wall at eye level, just fine for
me.

The kit went together practically by itself, a true testament to the
design of the kit. I decided to use my own computer designed
tarpaper for the original building, while using corrugated metal for
the addition (1928).

Using the National Orange crate label, I sized it with the computer
to what looked right, pasted it up about 500 times, and used a laser
color printer to produce two pages of color labels, which I then
glued to wood which went inside the building representing hundreds
of boxes ready to be loaded. I have produced in similar manner
several other label designs from the 'net, and plan on using them
for a couple of other packing plants.

Using the American Memory site, I printed out the location plan for
the track and surrounding buildings, as well as the location of
several orange groves and streets in the Riverside area and plan on
loosely following the diagrams to create my scene.

Incidently, I found a new good friend back in Los Angeles, who is
also building the kit, and have been corresponding almost daily with
him on life in general, and model railroading in particular.

I wholeheartedly am satisfied with this kit, and recommend it to
anyone who is looking for a real, historic southern Calfornia citrus
packing plant.

Jim Crowell
just west of Indy

Some of you may be wondering what happened to Yesteryear's model of
the National Orange Company packing house once located in Riverside,
Calif. The model has been advertised a few times in the hobby press
but never seems to appear on Yesteryear's website. This model (and
an image) is listed in this group's files section on the "Models and
Supplies" list.

First of all, models actually have been produced and sold in recent
months. Mike Aldridge of the Orange County Module Railroaders
built one for his module. I hope to have a photo of the module on
this site very soon.

I talked with a representative of Yesteryear at the World's Greatest
Hobby Show this weekend. She told me they are somewhat at the mercy
of Intermountain, who actually makes the HO and N-scale kits of this
model. Intermountain is going strong with a lot of kits so these
particular kits compete for production time.

Yesteryear hopes to have more kits of this model in the coming
months and when they do, they will be put on the website and offered
for sale.

Bob Chaparro
Mission Viejo, CA

Bob Chaparro wrote:

Your photos and the models are fantastic. Would you care to share with us the techniques you >used to construct some of the items in the grove and the precooler details?

Thanks for the compliment! :-) My model was almost entirely kitbashed from Walthers parts--R. J. Frost Cold Storage, icing platforms, and foundry canopy. The pre-cooler apparatus are four sections of flexible straws, telescoped together and painted. I used Walthers ice decks for the top surface of both decks and the underpinnings of the ice-only deck. The pre-cooler deck has solid concrete walls, so is done with styrene. The shed needs roofing material, and everything still needs weathering. Even at about a fourth of the size of the prototype, it is still a very large building in HO.

The shed is 24" x 12", the main building is 20" x 7" and the machinery section is 7" x
4". I didn't have much room for a "B Yard" itself, so I use it only for reefers--my "A Yard" is my main freight facility on the San Bernardino end of the layout. My "B Yard" will hold about 24 reefers.

All of my 130 or so orange trees were done by my wife Carol, who grew up in an orange grove in Fontana and said she knew what they should look like. Basically they are sponge pieces cut to shape and put on a stick, and then Woodland Scenics foam pieces were hot-glued over the sponge base. Several shapes, densities and colors were used, for variety. They were then sprayed with Scenic Cement adhesive and Woodland Scenics oranges sprinkled on, followed, when dry, by more spray adhesive. She found that you have to go easy on the spray or the oranges turn white.

I routed grooves for irrigation ditches and painted them earth color, then "flooded" with clear varnish. Standpipes are styrene tube with a couple of rows of tape wrapped around them, followed by several coats of thick paint to blend in the tape. Various Preiser and other figures were adapted to orange picking--Preiser makes some nice painters on ladders, which take only a little judicious snipping and painting to become pickers.

I have added a few more photos to the modeling folder I created yesterday.
Tom Cockle
Fieldbrook CA

On Sun, 20 Feb 2005 20:31:11 -0800, Tom Cockle wrote:

Originally icing was also done at the
pre-cooling deck, but in later years the shed was expanded to include
a standard icing deck of similar length, thus apparently accounting
for the two additional tracks.

Thanks for an excellent description.


Jerry
--
Porcupines are peaceful creatures but God still saw fit to give them
quills. -Unknown

Tom Cockle wrote:

For my HO San Bernardino B Yard I "guestimated" what the precooler
building would look like, not having available the great photos that
Jim Lancaster has just posted to the List. I have posted some photos
of my MUCH reduced model--my precooling and icing decks hold 8 cars
each, 4 to a side. Even at one-fourth the size of the prototype, my
model is huge. I modeled the buildings as basically windowless, but
now I see in Jim's photos that the "machinery end" has a lot of
windows--I guess I'll have to make some modifications there. :-)

Just for the record those were John Thompson's photos. He sent them to me to
post on my web site. About all I did was run them through Photoshop.

Jim

There was a nice four page article, excerpted from a May 11, 1912 Railway and Engineering Review, which included a track plan plus interior and ice deck photos, in the 4th Quarter 1988 Santa Fe Modeler. Unfortunately this issue is long-OOP. Basically the large building was a huge refrigeration plant, utilizing brine tanks, which delivered cold air to the ice deck, where flexible ducts were fitted to each end of a car's hatches. Cold air was blown in one end and sucked out the other, thus quickly cooling the already-loaded car by a number of degrees. The idea was to remove the field heat and thus reduce ice melt, and consequently reduce the need for frequent re-icings on the journey east. The pre-cooling deck had a capacity of 32 cars--16 to a side. Originally icing was also done at the pre-cooling deck, but in later years the shed was expanded to include a standard icing deck of similar length, thus apparently accounting for the two additional tracks.

Another, probably later, track plan--this time with four tracks under the shed roof rather than the original two--was (is?) available from the SFRH&MS. Neither of these track charts are to scale.

For my HO San Bernardino B Yard I "guestimated" what the precooler building would look like, not having available the great photos that Jim Lancaster has just posted to the List. I have posted some photos of my MUCH reduced model--my precooling and icing decks hold 8 cars each, 4 to a side. Even at one-fourth the size of the prototype, my model is huge. I modeled the buildings as basically windowless, but now I see in Jim's photos that the "machinery end" has a lot of windows--I guess I'll have to make some modifications there. :-)

Tom Cockle
Fieldbrook CA

On Sun, 20 Feb 2005 14:22:57 -0800, ljames1@... wrote:

The link to the in-work San Bernardino page where you can
see the precooler photos is:

I've seen the photos, but can someone please explain (or provide
a link to an explanation) of how these critters worked? Are
they just industrial air conditioners?


Jerry
--
Porcupines are peaceful creatures but God still saw fit to give them
quills. -Unknown

Bob Chaparro wrote:

We have created a new photo album titled "Icing-Cooling". This
album contains 9 photographs taken by Jack Delano in March 1943.
All are from the Library of Congress collection.

The photos were taken inside the facility that once stood in the "B"
Yard at San Bernardino. We have no exterior photographs of this
facility so if anyone has exterior shots and/or a track plan these
would greatly be appreciated.

I have some photos of the precooler that John Thompson sent me some time ago.
I have a big backlog of material for the packing house web site and these were
in that backlog. The link to the in-work San Bernardino page where you can
see the precooler photos is:
(note: you cannot yet get to this page from the home page).

I have additional San Bernardino photos to add when I get the time.

Jim Lancaster

We have created a new photo album titled "Icing-Cooling". This
album contains 9 photographs taken by Jack Delano in March 1943.
All are from the Library of Congress collection.

The photos were taken inside the facility that once stood in the "B"
Yard at San Bernardino. We have no exterior photographs of this
facility so if anyone has exterior shots and/or a track plan these
would greatly be appreciated.

Bob Chaparro
Mission Viejo, CA
Owner-Moderator
Citrus Industry Modeling Group

few more photos up tonite