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New Ancient DNA Paper
A new paper led by now in pre-print has only 1 new ancient U106+ individual (I2902) However, this individual is now the second oldest U106+ sample and is C14 dated to 2554-2202 calBCE. It has one positive read for U106 and one positive read for A2151 (which we call A2150). This clade is VERY small today but appears to be a very early branch of U106.
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This individual has been added to my
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Ray |
Dear Raymond Thanks for this interesting update. I was looking for my Haplogroup connection ( FGC17464> FGC 17467) and the nearest?Ancient I could find is Danish Medieval? ( no 384) ?Am I correct? Please advise. Many thanks for your help. Sincerely David On Thu, Mar 27, 2025 at 12:20?PM Raymond Wing via <wing.genealogist=[email protected]> wrote:
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Also the new individual, I12902, seems very low ?Steppe and high WHG. ?Very interesting guy.?
On Thursday, March 27, 2025 at 05:20:31 AM PDT, Raymond Wing via groups.io <wing.genealogist@...> wrote:
A new paper led by now in pre-print has only 1 new ancient U106+ individual (I2902) However, this individual is now the second oldest U106+ sample and is C14 dated to 2554-2202 calBCE. It has one positive read for U106 and one positive read for A2151 (which we call A2150). This clade is VERY small today but appears to be a very early branch of U106.
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This individual has been added to my
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Ray
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On Thu, Mar 27, 2025 at 12:20 PM, Raymond Wing wrote:
And the location, North Holland! What does this indicate?
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Kevin Terry |
Hi folks, ? This is indeed an interesting new result. Now let's think about how it changes our views of the early expansion of R-U106. ? I'm going to use my half-finished phylogeography document as a starting point. Here (Figure 4), I demonstrated that R-U106's earliest burials were in the Corded Ware Culture in Bohemia in the 30th century BC, with an expansion here primarily north-westwards, with R-Z156 reaching Holland by the 21st century BC at the latest, and R-Z18 reaching Denmark by the 24th century BC. I posited that the majority of R-U106 nevertheless carried on north-westwards, settling somewhere in the north of modern Germany or nearby, but are generally missing from the archaeological record. ? I12902 (Ray - note number!) is found in the north of Holland, somewhere between the late 26th and late 23rd centuries BC. This is generally consistent with the above ideas. What it does, however, is force the migration to the North Sea to slightly earlier on in this history, expand the early western boundary of R-U106's early migration, and specify the route that R-A2150 in particular is likely to have taken. ? The large "native" (EHG) European autosomal fraction is consistent with what we know about early Corded Ware Culture (CWC) expansion. The migrants from the step culture that formed the CWC were majority male, and interbred (willingly or forcefully) with the native EHG women, so the steppe ancestry fraction ended up diluted, particularly as one travels west into the "purer" EHG populations. Remembering that I12902 is at least 400 years and as much as 800 years after the initial CWC migrations, the steppe ancestry fraction has had a dozen or two generations to have been diluted away. ? Holland is an important staging point for early R-U106, and this result strengthens that connection. However, it is also important to remember that R-U106 didn't form a major part of the early migrations to the British Isles, France, Iberia and Italy that were dominated by the R-P312 Bell Beaker groups. We see R-U106 in Bell Beaker culture burials, but these are primarily northern and eastern groups (e.g. R-Z18 in Denmark). Consequently, R-U106's main stamping grounds cannot have been much further south-west than Holland, and I12902 may represent our haplogroup's most western early outpost. One intriguing possibility about why R-U106>A2150 didn't succeed in the same way that R-U106>Z2265 did could be that it was out-competed by the R-P312 Bell Beaker groups during the Corded Ware Culture to Bell Beaker transition, which wasn't a sharp one. ? Holland at the time was very different from the fertile paradise of tulip-growing fame it is today. It was much more like the English fenlands (which were themselves much more extensive) - a wide expanse of salt marsh and peat marsh, cut by mud-filled channels and fringed by wind-blown sandy islands. Some small sandy islands persisted (cf. Isle of Ely in England) on which settlements could thrive - easily defended for those who knew the landscape, but hard to build an empire on. ? In short, this is a region in which a small haplogroup like R-A2150 could have made a home, but not somewhere from which a massive Bell Beaker population boom is going to start. That is likely from further up the Rhine. We also know that R-A2150 was found in the Unetice culture about 600 years later, so it's very likely that this isn't the only population of R-A2150 that existed. Before this paper, I put the origin of R-A2150 in western Germany, and that still looks reasonable to me. ? Cheers, ? Iain. |
Is it possible, easily (?), to express the number of R-U106 positive results from ancient burial places, as a percentage of all the DNA results from each burial place for various time periods in the past?
Could this be an indicator of the percentage of ancient populations positive for R-U106 at various time periods in the past?
Perhaps the total number of ancient dna sample results is way too sporadic and small to be meaningful in any way.
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Kevin Terry |
开云体育Is this statement correct?“?Mr. P311"?whose clan is now represented by around half of western European men, with a tard of a?billion?diaspora worldwide” On Mar 30, 2025, at 3:02?AM, Iain via groups.io <gubbins@...> wrote:
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It took me a while to work out where the source of this quote was - and to my surprise it was something I wrote myself back in 2015. ? We've got access to much better data than we did 10 years ago, so we can make a much better guess at this number. The answer also depends on whether by "diaspora" you count only men who've inherited the Y chromosome themselves, or include women who have R-P311 up their direct male line. If you count women, then my guess from our current data is somewhere in the region of 600-700 million. If you don't, it's obviously half of this - about 300-350 million. ? To get these percentages, I've estimated the percentage of R-P311 in each country by dividing the R-P311 testers at Family Tree DNA by the A-PR2921 testers, then multiplied that by the population of the country. I haven't been through each country exhaustively, only European countries and the populous ones in which R-P311 is common. Of these 600-700 million, around 175 million are in European countries (in which I'm including Russia and Turkey but not the Caucasus countries). Around 200 million are in the USA, around 23 million are in South Africa, at least 45 million are in former British empire colonies (Canada, Australia, NZ), and at least 187 million are in Latin America. ? - Iain. |
One interesting thing about the Rhine/Meuse Beaker paper with the new samples is they re-ran some IBD with new and older samples.?? In the case of Oostwoud sample I4070, dated?1880-1627 calBCE, who is just?U106 at FTDNA, (but maybe also Z381>R-Z301/Z304?), he shares a 16 cM block with 3DT16 from Driffield Terrace, who is?U106>Z2265>BY30097>FTT8>Z381>Z156>Z306 at FTDNA (and maybe also R-Z156>DF96>S11515>L1), despite the two samples being ~1700 years apart. |