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Mach4 teach/record


 

开云体育

Good morning, I am looking for some advice and ideas for a project I am brainstorming. I have built a couple CNC machines in the past using Mach4/ESS, so I am comfortable doing it again. Now I am thinking about building a CNC welder for a production beam welding job that we do. I would like to control X,Y,&Z plus at least1 rotary axis for the positioner, possibly up to 4 rotary axis total. Overall travel would be approximately, 144”X, x 48”Y, x 60”Z.

My questions are;

  1. Has anybody built something like this, that would have any experiences to share?
  2. Is anyone using Mach4 to run a robotic welder? Good/bad?
  3. If Mach4, is there a plugin or wizard or otherwise, that will allow me to build Gcode by jogging to points similar to programing a robot? Like a teach function?

I recently purchased a Vectis Cobot with UR arm, so I am familiar with robotics, but the reach of the UR arm is limited, not to mention the cost is too high for this job. I will keep using the Cobot for smaller intricate parts.

?

Thank-you!

Brian Martin



?


 

开云体育

Hi Brian,

I really love the users we have, you are 100% reading my mind! I have been dreaming about doing this and have some ideas. I have most all the code and I have things that you don't know about that we can use to help you with this project. If you want to chat about this send me a message off list and we can talk over the phone. I am in!

Thanks

______________________________

Brian Barker
Engineering / Development
ArtSoft | Newfangled Solutions
Livermore Falls, Maine (USA)
Webpage: 
On 2/21/2022 7:45 AM, Brian Martin wrote:

Good morning, I am looking for some advice and ideas for a project I am brainstorming. I have built a couple CNC machines in the past using Mach4/ESS, so I am comfortable doing it again. Now I am thinking about building a CNC welder for a production beam welding job that we do. I would like to control X,Y,&Z plus at least1 rotary axis for the positioner, possibly up to 4 rotary axis total. Overall travel would be approximately, 144”X, x 48”Y, x 60”Z.

My questions are;

  1. Has anybody built something like this, that would have any experiences to share?
  2. Is anyone using Mach4 to run a robotic welder? Good/bad?
  3. If Mach4, is there a plugin or wizard or otherwise, that will allow me to build Gcode by jogging to points similar to programing a robot? Like a teach function?

I recently purchased a Vectis Cobot with UR arm, so I am familiar with robotics, but the reach of the UR arm is limited, not to mention the cost is too high for this job. I will keep using the Cobot for smaller intricate parts.

?

Thank-you!

Brian Martin



?


 

开云体育

Thanks for the offer Brian. I will? be looking into the design some more. At this point I only have a vision. I will try to model what I want in Solidworks, and figure out the motion/ linear bearing etc.. If the project goes ahead, I will try to contact you.

?

Thank-you!

Brian Martin



?

From: [email protected] <[email protected]> On Behalf Of Brian Barker
Sent: Monday, February 21, 2022 8:25 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [MachCNC] Mach4 teach/record

?

Hi Brian,

I really love the users we have, you are 100% reading my mind! I have been dreaming about doing this and have some ideas. I have most all the code and I have things that you don't know about that we can use to help you with this project. If you want to chat about this send me a message off list and we can talk over the phone. I am in!

Thanks

______________________________
?
Brian Barker
Engineering / Development
ArtSoft | Newfangled Solutions
Livermore Falls, Maine (USA)
Webpage: 

On 2/21/2022 7:45 AM, Brian Martin wrote:

Good morning, I am looking for some advice and ideas for a project I am brainstorming. I have built a couple CNC machines in the past using Mach4/ESS, so I am comfortable doing it again. Now I am thinking about building a CNC welder for a production beam welding job that we do. I would like to control X,Y,&Z plus at least1 rotary axis for the positioner, possibly up to 4 rotary axis total. Overall travel would be approximately, 144”X, x 48”Y, x 60”Z.

My questions are;

  1. Has anybody built something like this, that would have any experiences to share?
  2. Is anyone using Mach4 to run a robotic welder? Good/bad?
  3. If Mach4, is there a plugin or wizard or otherwise, that will allow me to build Gcode by jogging to points similar to programing a robot? Like a teach function?

I recently purchased a Vectis Cobot with UR arm, so I am familiar with robotics, but the reach of the UR arm is limited, not to mention the cost is too high for this job. I will keep using the Cobot for smaller intricate parts.

?

Thank-you!

Brian Martin




?


 

开云体育

Cool, I have a welding bench here and a few welders I can hook up for testing. I was thinking I would make something that would mount to my table from weldtables.com . So if you want to do this don't worry about the software side. We can read the encoders and use that to program the motion... ALSO I can move every axis as it is moving to get the machine where the wield should be.


Thanks
Brian


______________________________

Brian Barker
Engineering / Development
ArtSoft | Newfangled Solutions
Livermore Falls, Maine (USA)
Webpage: 
On 2/21/2022 10:09 AM, Brian Martin wrote:

Thanks for the offer Brian. I will? be looking into the design some more. At this point I only have a vision. I will try to model what I want in Solidworks, and figure out the motion/ linear bearing etc.. If the project goes ahead, I will try to contact you.

?

Thank-you!

Brian Martin



?

From: [email protected] <[email protected]> On Behalf Of Brian Barker
Sent: Monday, February 21, 2022 8:25 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [MachCNC] Mach4 teach/record

?

Hi Brian,

I really love the users we have, you are 100% reading my mind! I have been dreaming about doing this and have some ideas. I have most all the code and I have things that you don't know about that we can use to help you with this project. If you want to chat about this send me a message off list and we can talk over the phone. I am in!

Thanks

______________________________
?
Brian Barker
Engineering / Development
ArtSoft | Newfangled Solutions
Livermore Falls, Maine (USA)
Webpage: 

On 2/21/2022 7:45 AM, Brian Martin wrote:

Good morning, I am looking for some advice and ideas for a project I am brainstorming. I have built a couple CNC machines in the past using Mach4/ESS, so I am comfortable doing it again. Now I am thinking about building a CNC welder for a production beam welding job that we do. I would like to control X,Y,&Z plus at least1 rotary axis for the positioner, possibly up to 4 rotary axis total. Overall travel would be approximately, 144”X, x 48”Y, x 60”Z.

My questions are;

  1. Has anybody built something like this, that would have any experiences to share?
  2. Is anyone using Mach4 to run a robotic welder? Good/bad?
  3. If Mach4, is there a plugin or wizard or otherwise, that will allow me to build Gcode by jogging to points similar to programing a robot? Like a teach function?

I recently purchased a Vectis Cobot with UR arm, so I am familiar with robotics, but the reach of the UR arm is limited, not to mention the cost is too high for this job. I will keep using the Cobot for smaller intricate parts.

?

Thank-you!

Brian Martin




?


 

开云体育

Greeaat!! On my last mill I built I used Clearpath servos. Is that a good option, or do you have another favorite?

?

Thank-you!

Brian Martin



?

From: [email protected] <[email protected]> On Behalf Of Brian Barker
Sent: Monday, February 21, 2022 10:57 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [MachCNC] Mach4 teach/record

?

Cool, I have a welding bench here and a few welders I can hook up for testing. I was thinking I would make something that would mount to my table from weldtables.com . So if you want to do this don't worry about the software side. We can read the encoders and use that to program the motion... ALSO I can move every axis as it is moving to get the machine where the wield should be.

?

Thanks
Brian

?

______________________________
?
Brian Barker
Engineering / Development
ArtSoft | Newfangled Solutions
Livermore Falls, Maine (USA)
Webpage: 

On 2/21/2022 10:09 AM, Brian Martin wrote:

Thanks for the offer Brian. I will? be looking into the design some more. At this point I only have a vision. I will try to model what I want in Solidworks, and figure out the motion/ linear bearing etc.. If the project goes ahead, I will try to contact you.

?

Thank-you!

Brian Martin




?

From: [email protected] <[email protected]> On Behalf Of Brian Barker
Sent: Monday, February 21, 2022 8:25 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [MachCNC] Mach4 teach/record

?

Hi Brian,

I really love the users we have, you are 100% reading my mind! I have been dreaming about doing this and have some ideas. I have most all the code and I have things that you don't know about that we can use to help you with this project. If you want to chat about this send me a message off list and we can talk over the phone. I am in!

Thanks

______________________________
?
Brian Barker
Engineering / Development
ArtSoft | Newfangled Solutions
Livermore Falls, Maine (USA)
Webpage: 

On 2/21/2022 7:45 AM, Brian Martin wrote:

Good morning, I am looking for some advice and ideas for a project I am brainstorming. I have built a couple CNC machines in the past using Mach4/ESS, so I am comfortable doing it again. Now I am thinking about building a CNC welder for a production beam welding job that we do. I would like to control X,Y,&Z plus at least1 rotary axis for the positioner, possibly up to 4 rotary axis total. Overall travel would be approximately, 144”X, x 48”Y, x 60”Z.

My questions are;

  1. Has anybody built something like this, that would have any experiences to share?
  2. Is anyone using Mach4 to run a robotic welder? Good/bad?
  3. If Mach4, is there a plugin or wizard or otherwise, that will allow me to build Gcode by jogging to points similar to programing a robot? Like a teach function?

I recently purchased a Vectis Cobot with UR arm, so I am familiar with robotics, but the reach of the UR arm is limited, not to mention the cost is too high for this job. I will keep using the Cobot for smaller intricate parts.

?

Thank-you!

Brian Martin





?


 



On Mon, Feb 21, 2022 at 6:45 AM Brian Martin <bmm@...> wrote:

Good morning, I am looking for some advice and ideas for a project I am brainstorming. I have built a couple CNC machines in the past using Mach4/ESS, so I am comfortable doing it again. Now I am thinking about building a CNC welder for a production beam welding job that we do. I would like to control X,Y,&Z plus at least1 rotary axis for the positioner, possibly up to 4 rotary axis total. Overall travel would be approximately, 144”X, x 48”Y, x 60”Z.

My questions are;

  1. Has anybody built something like this, that would have any experiences to share?
  2. Is anyone using Mach4 to run a robotic welder? Good/bad?
  3. If Mach4, is there a plugin or wizard or otherwise, that will allow me to build Gcode by jogging to points similar to programing a robot? Like a teach function?

I recently purchased a Vectis Cobot with UR arm, so I am familiar with robotics, but the reach of the UR arm is limited, not to mention the cost is too high for this job. I will keep using the Cobot for smaller intricate parts.


I've thought of running the Cobot on a x-y sled? - - - maybe underslung to keep the crap out of things.?
Then the rotary dimensions are handled separately.?
Simple - - no - - - doable - - - I think so.??


 

开云体育

??? ??? Now , there's a company with it's customers in mind !!!!!

??? ??? Wish there were more like that .

??? ??? animal

On 2/21/2022 5:24 AM, Brian Barker wrote:

Hi Brian,

I really love the users we have, you are 100% reading my mind! I have been dreaming about doing this and have some ideas. I have most all the code and I have things that you don't know about that we can use to help you with this project. If you want to chat about this send me a message off list and we can talk over the phone. I am in!

Thanks

______________________________

Brian Barker
Engineering / Development
ArtSoft | Newfangled Solutions
Livermore Falls, Maine (USA)
Webpage: 
On 2/21/2022 7:45 AM, Brian Martin wrote:

Good morning, I am looking for some advice and ideas for a project I am brainstorming. I have built a couple CNC machines in the past using Mach4/ESS, so I am comfortable doing it again. Now I am thinking about building a CNC welder for a production beam welding job that we do. I would like to control X,Y,&Z plus at least1 rotary axis for the positioner, possibly up to 4 rotary axis total. Overall travel would be approximately, 144”X, x 48”Y, x 60”Z.

My questions are;

  1. Has anybody built something like this, that would have any experiences to share?
  2. Is anyone using Mach4 to run a robotic welder? Good/bad?
  3. If Mach4, is there a plugin or wizard or otherwise, that will allow me to build Gcode by jogging to points similar to programing a robot? Like a teach function?

I recently purchased a Vectis Cobot with UR arm, so I am familiar with robotics, but the reach of the UR arm is limited, not to mention the cost is too high for this job. I will keep using the Cobot for smaller intricate parts.

?

Thank-you!

Brian Martin



?


 

开云体育

The Clear path motors are okay but I think the best ones to use for this would be closed loop steppers! I know stepper and you want to say NO! but hear me out. The Closed loop steppers are really a 50 pole AC servo motors. We can read the encoder and use that data for telling the machine where it is while your teaching it. Not need for any real fancy drive! We can use a chain to move the welding head. for all I care and direct drive off the stepper motor. I have done machines like this in the past this way and they work slick! The issue with the Clear path is that you will have inertia mismatch and the motor will not be able to be tuned properly (I have some here that I can't use for that reason). If you don't want to use a closed loop stepper we can use a normal stepper and I can watch the position of some Aux encoders and use them to look for missed steps and for the teach function. Okay I think that is me blowing off at the mouth long enough. I am such a sucker for a cool project LOL


Thanks

Brian


______________________________

Brian Barker
Engineering / Development
ArtSoft | Newfangled Solutions
Livermore Falls, Maine (USA)
Webpage: 
On 2/21/2022 11:06 AM, Brian Martin wrote:

Greeaat!! On my last mill I built I used Clearpath servos. Is that a good option, or do you have another favorite?

?

Thank-you!

Brian Martin



?

From: [email protected] <[email protected]> On Behalf Of Brian Barker
Sent: Monday, February 21, 2022 10:57 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [MachCNC] Mach4 teach/record

?

Cool, I have a welding bench here and a few welders I can hook up for testing. I was thinking I would make something that would mount to my table from weldtables.com . So if you want to do this don't worry about the software side. We can read the encoders and use that to program the motion... ALSO I can move every axis as it is moving to get the machine where the wield should be.

?

Thanks
Brian

?

______________________________
?
Brian Barker
Engineering / Development
ArtSoft | Newfangled Solutions
Livermore Falls, Maine (USA)
Webpage: 

On 2/21/2022 10:09 AM, Brian Martin wrote:

Thanks for the offer Brian. I will? be looking into the design some more. At this point I only have a vision. I will try to model what I want in Solidworks, and figure out the motion/ linear bearing etc.. If the project goes ahead, I will try to contact you.

?

Thank-you!

Brian Martin




?

From: [email protected] <[email protected]> On Behalf Of Brian Barker
Sent: Monday, February 21, 2022 8:25 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [MachCNC] Mach4 teach/record

?

Hi Brian,

I really love the users we have, you are 100% reading my mind! I have been dreaming about doing this and have some ideas. I have most all the code and I have things that you don't know about that we can use to help you with this project. If you want to chat about this send me a message off list and we can talk over the phone. I am in!

Thanks

______________________________
?
Brian Barker
Engineering / Development
ArtSoft | Newfangled Solutions
Livermore Falls, Maine (USA)
Webpage: 

On 2/21/2022 7:45 AM, Brian Martin wrote:

Good morning, I am looking for some advice and ideas for a project I am brainstorming. I have built a couple CNC machines in the past using Mach4/ESS, so I am comfortable doing it again. Now I am thinking about building a CNC welder for a production beam welding job that we do. I would like to control X,Y,&Z plus at least1 rotary axis for the positioner, possibly up to 4 rotary axis total. Overall travel would be approximately, 144”X, x 48”Y, x 60”Z.

My questions are;

  1. Has anybody built something like this, that would have any experiences to share?
  2. Is anyone using Mach4 to run a robotic welder? Good/bad?
  3. If Mach4, is there a plugin or wizard or otherwise, that will allow me to build Gcode by jogging to points similar to programing a robot? Like a teach function?

I recently purchased a Vectis Cobot with UR arm, so I am familiar with robotics, but the reach of the UR arm is limited, not to mention the cost is too high for this job. I will keep using the Cobot for smaller intricate parts.

?

Thank-you!

Brian Martin





?


 

开云体育

My dream is to not need the Cobot... why because they are small and lots of money. I dream of making some software that will do the anything over 6" weld for me so I can drink my coffee and watch it get sunburn. ;)

______________________________

Brian Barker
Engineering / Development
ArtSoft | Newfangled Solutions
Livermore Falls, Maine (USA)
Webpage: 
On 2/21/2022 11:19 AM, o1bigtenor wrote:



On Mon, Feb 21, 2022 at 6:45 AM Brian Martin <bmm@...> wrote:

Good morning, I am looking for some advice and ideas for a project I am brainstorming. I have built a couple CNC machines in the past using Mach4/ESS, so I am comfortable doing it again. Now I am thinking about building a CNC welder for a production beam welding job that we do. I would like to control X,Y,&Z plus at least1 rotary axis for the positioner, possibly up to 4 rotary axis total. Overall travel would be approximately, 144”X, x 48”Y, x 60”Z.

My questions are;

  1. Has anybody built something like this, that would have any experiences to share?
  2. Is anyone using Mach4 to run a robotic welder? Good/bad?
  3. If Mach4, is there a plugin or wizard or otherwise, that will allow me to build Gcode by jogging to points similar to programing a robot? Like a teach function?

I recently purchased a Vectis Cobot with UR arm, so I am familiar with robotics, but the reach of the UR arm is limited, not to mention the cost is too high for this job. I will keep using the Cobot for smaller intricate parts.


I've thought of running the Cobot on a x-y sled? - - - maybe underslung to keep the crap out of things.?
Then the rotary dimensions are handled separately.?
Simple - - no - - - doable - - - I think so.??


 

开云体育

Jokes on you, I'm having fun ! LOL

It is true... Most people don't like what they do. I really enjoy it, to the point that I am a coach for a local Robotics team.


______________________________

Brian Barker
Engineering / Development
ArtSoft | Newfangled Solutions
Livermore Falls, Maine (USA)
Webpage: 
On 2/21/2022 12:56 PM, mike allen wrote:

??? ??? Now , there's a company with it's customers in mind !!!!!

??? ??? Wish there were more like that .

??? ??? animal

On 2/21/2022 5:24 AM, Brian Barker wrote:

Hi Brian,

I really love the users we have, you are 100% reading my mind! I have been dreaming about doing this and have some ideas. I have most all the code and I have things that you don't know about that we can use to help you with this project. If you want to chat about this send me a message off list and we can talk over the phone. I am in!

Thanks

______________________________

Brian Barker
Engineering / Development
ArtSoft | Newfangled Solutions
Livermore Falls, Maine (USA)
Webpage: 
On 2/21/2022 7:45 AM, Brian Martin wrote:

Good morning, I am looking for some advice and ideas for a project I am brainstorming. I have built a couple CNC machines in the past using Mach4/ESS, so I am comfortable doing it again. Now I am thinking about building a CNC welder for a production beam welding job that we do. I would like to control X,Y,&Z plus at least1 rotary axis for the positioner, possibly up to 4 rotary axis total. Overall travel would be approximately, 144”X, x 48”Y, x 60”Z.

My questions are;

  1. Has anybody built something like this, that would have any experiences to share?
  2. Is anyone using Mach4 to run a robotic welder? Good/bad?
  3. If Mach4, is there a plugin or wizard or otherwise, that will allow me to build Gcode by jogging to points similar to programing a robot? Like a teach function?

I recently purchased a Vectis Cobot with UR arm, so I am familiar with robotics, but the reach of the UR arm is limited, not to mention the cost is too high for this job. I will keep using the Cobot for smaller intricate parts.

?

Thank-you!

Brian Martin



?


 

开云体育

I actually talked to Vectis about this before I got my Cobot. It was still too far of a stretch for the Cobot arm though. Also the cost vs. benefit ratio was too low to do an overhead mount.

Actually Brian I am completely open at this point as far as components. What motion card would you use, will the smooth stepper work with encoders?

I like the idea of using ethernet, my thought is to have the pc mounted on a wheeled work station with a single cable to the machine.

?

Thank-you!

Brian Martin



?

From: [email protected] <[email protected]> On Behalf Of o1bigtenor
Sent: Monday, February 21, 2022 11:20 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [MachCNC] Mach4 teach/record

?

?

?

On Mon, Feb 21, 2022 at 6:45 AM Brian Martin <bmm@...> wrote:

Good morning, I am looking for some advice and ideas for a project I am brainstorming. I have built a couple CNC machines in the past using Mach4/ESS, so I am comfortable doing it again. Now I am thinking about building a CNC welder for a production beam welding job that we do. I would like to control X,Y,&Z plus at least1 rotary axis for the positioner, possibly up to 4 rotary axis total. Overall travel would be approximately, 144”X, x 48”Y, x 60”Z.

My questions are;

  1. Has anybody built something like this, that would have any experiences to share?
  2. Is anyone using Mach4 to run a robotic welder? Good/bad?
  3. If Mach4, is there a plugin or wizard or otherwise, that will allow me to build Gcode by jogging to points similar to programing a robot? Like a teach function?

I recently purchased a Vectis Cobot with UR arm, so I am familiar with robotics, but the reach of the UR arm is limited, not to mention the cost is too high for this job. I will keep using the Cobot for smaller intricate parts.

?

I've thought of running the Cobot on a x-y sled? - - - maybe underslung to keep the crap out of things.?

Then the rotary dimensions are handled separately.?

Simple - - no - - - doable - - - I think so.??


 

开云体育

??? ??? Good deal !! . I really enjoyed my last profession for probably the first 15 or so years , & after that I was just sick & tired of the people I had to deal with ., but I always? ( well almost ) kept my ??? ??? ??? ??? cool . Passing on knowledge is a pretty honorable trait in my book .

??? ??? thanks

??? ??? animal

On 2/21/2022 12:51 PM, Brian Barker wrote:

Jokes on you, I'm having fun ! LOL

It is true... Most people don't like what they do. I really enjoy it, to the point that I am a coach for a local Robotics team.


______________________________

Brian Barker
Engineering / Development
ArtSoft | Newfangled Solutions
Livermore Falls, Maine (USA)
Webpage: 
On 2/21/2022 12:56 PM, mike allen wrote:

??? ??? Now , there's a company with it's customers in mind !!!!!

??? ??? Wish there were more like that .

??? ??? animal

On 2/21/2022 5:24 AM, Brian Barker wrote:

Hi Brian,

I really love the users we have, you are 100% reading my mind! I have been dreaming about doing this and have some ideas. I have most all the code and I have things that you don't know about that we can use to help you with this project. If you want to chat about this send me a message off list and we can talk over the phone. I am in!

Thanks

______________________________

Brian Barker
Engineering / Development
ArtSoft | Newfangled Solutions
Livermore Falls, Maine (USA)
Webpage: 
On 2/21/2022 7:45 AM, Brian Martin wrote:

Good morning, I am looking for some advice and ideas for a project I am brainstorming. I have built a couple CNC machines in the past using Mach4/ESS, so I am comfortable doing it again. Now I am thinking about building a CNC welder for a production beam welding job that we do. I would like to control X,Y,&Z plus at least1 rotary axis for the positioner, possibly up to 4 rotary axis total. Overall travel would be approximately, 144”X, x 48”Y, x 60”Z.

My questions are;

  1. Has anybody built something like this, that would have any experiences to share?
  2. Is anyone using Mach4 to run a robotic welder? Good/bad?
  3. If Mach4, is there a plugin or wizard or otherwise, that will allow me to build Gcode by jogging to points similar to programing a robot? Like a teach function?

I recently purchased a Vectis Cobot with UR arm, so I am familiar with robotics, but the reach of the UR arm is limited, not to mention the cost is too high for this job. I will keep using the Cobot for smaller intricate parts.

?

Thank-you!

Brian Martin



?


 

开云体育

Hi Brian,

We can use the ESS if you like. The motion card to me is a little transparent (mach 4 is hardware agnostic). As long as we can support the reading of encoders we can make this work. If we did Ethercat I could look at the current and make it basically a Cobot. We could sense the current and kill motion and stop on quickly increased loads.? May be a bit much for what your looking to do but we really can do anything ;)? . Closed loop steppers and an ESS with the encoders going back to the ESS so we can see the position, I think is about as good as it is going to get for a minimal investment. You will be able to move the bot to position manually (you will need to make some sort of way to counterbalance the Z axis) and teach it positions . Jogging for a use case like this just to slow. I want to move to position and hold the head where I would like to weld and press a button to set the positions to weld . Simple and fast is what I am looking for. This may just be me, but when I pick up a welder and start working I am not in the mood to be a programmer. When I am in welding mode I pull out the C clamps and hammers ;) CNC machine should be as useful, if not... it's a fail!


Okay enough of me running at the mouth.. Time to work with the boy and get this engine painted so he can rebuild his first engine on his own. I figure a 1939 9N is a good simple start. I guess looking at it I should be teaching him electric motors and how to program a BMS... Never thought it would happen but I think I am getting dated (Yeah, I didn't want to say old)


Thanks

Brian


______________________________

Brian Barker
Engineering / Development
ArtSoft | Newfangled Solutions
Livermore Falls, Maine (USA)
Webpage: 
On 2/21/2022 4:20 PM, Brian Martin wrote:

I actually talked to Vectis about this before I got my Cobot. It was still too far of a stretch for the Cobot arm though. Also the cost vs. benefit ratio was too low to do an overhead mount.

Actually Brian I am completely open at this point as far as components. What motion card would you use, will the smooth stepper work with encoders?

I like the idea of using ethernet, my thought is to have the pc mounted on a wheeled work station with a single cable to the machine.

?

Thank-you!

Brian Martin



?

From: [email protected] <[email protected]> On Behalf Of o1bigtenor
Sent: Monday, February 21, 2022 11:20 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [MachCNC] Mach4 teach/record

?

?

?

On Mon, Feb 21, 2022 at 6:45 AM Brian Martin <bmm@...> wrote:

Good morning, I am looking for some advice and ideas for a project I am brainstorming. I have built a couple CNC machines in the past using Mach4/ESS, so I am comfortable doing it again. Now I am thinking about building a CNC welder for a production beam welding job that we do. I would like to control X,Y,&Z plus at least1 rotary axis for the positioner, possibly up to 4 rotary axis total. Overall travel would be approximately, 144”X, x 48”Y, x 60”Z.

My questions are;

  1. Has anybody built something like this, that would have any experiences to share?
  2. Is anyone using Mach4 to run a robotic welder? Good/bad?
  3. If Mach4, is there a plugin or wizard or otherwise, that will allow me to build Gcode by jogging to points similar to programing a robot? Like a teach function?

I recently purchased a Vectis Cobot with UR arm, so I am familiar with robotics, but the reach of the UR arm is limited, not to mention the cost is too high for this job. I will keep using the Cobot for smaller intricate parts.

?

I've thought of running the Cobot on a x-y sled? - - - maybe underslung to keep the crap out of things.?

Then the rotary dimensions are handled separately.?

Simple - - no - - - doable - - - I think so.??


 



On Tue, Feb 22, 2022 at 6:15 AM Brian Barker <brianb@...> wrote:

Hi Brian,

We can use the ESS if you like. The motion card to me is a little transparent (mach 4 is hardware agnostic). As long as we can support the reading of encoders we can make this work. If we did Ethercat I could look at the current and make it basically a Cobot. We could sense the current and kill motion and stop on quickly increased loads.? May be a bit much for what your looking to do but we really can do anything ;)? . Closed loop steppers and an ESS with the encoders going back to the ESS so we can see the position, I think is about as good as it is going to get for a minimal investment. You will be able to move the bot to position manually (you will need to make some sort of way to counterbalance the Z axis) and teach it positions . Jogging for a use case like this just to slow. I want to move to position and hold the head where I would like to weld and press a button to set the positions to weld . Simple and fast is what I am looking for. This may just be me, but when I pick up a welder and start working I am not in the mood to be a programmer. When I am in welding mode I pull out the C clamps and hammers ;) CNC machine should be as useful, if not... it's a fail!


Greetings

(I think I am getting confused as to 'which' Brian I am addressing but - - - )

I have only briefly looked into Ethercat.?
Would you please direct me to some resources? so that I could better understand Ethercat,?
including its benefits and negatives.?

I have further questions on this - - - - maybe this should be broken into?
a new thread? Argh - - - whatever - - - please for the info?

TIA


 

开云体育

No problem, o1bigtenor. I want to know more about Ethercat also. Go ahead with the discussion!

Does an Ethercat drive network directly to the PC, or is there still a motion control interface/card?

?

Thank-you!

Brian Martin



?

From: [email protected] <[email protected]> On Behalf Of o1bigtenor
Sent: Tuesday, February 22, 2022 7:53 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [MachCNC] Mach4 teach/record

?

?

?

On Tue, Feb 22, 2022 at 6:15 AM Brian Barker <brianb@...> wrote:

Hi Brian,

We can use the ESS if you like. The motion card to me is a little transparent (mach 4 is hardware agnostic). As long as we can support the reading of encoders we can make this work. If we did Ethercat I could look at the current and make it basically a Cobot. We could sense the current and kill motion and stop on quickly increased loads.? May be a bit much for what your looking to do but we really can do anything ;)? . Closed loop steppers and an ESS with the encoders going back to the ESS so we can see the position, I think is about as good as it is going to get for a minimal investment. You will be able to move the bot to position manually (you will need to make some sort of way to counterbalance the Z axis) and teach it positions . Jogging for a use case like this just to slow. I want to move to position and hold the head where I would like to weld and press a button to set the positions to weld . Simple and fast is what I am looking for. This may just be me, but when I pick up a welder and start working I am not in the mood to be a programmer. When I am in welding mode I pull out the C clamps and hammers ;) CNC machine should be as useful, if not... it's a fail!

?

Greetings

?

(I think I am getting confused as to 'which' Brian I am addressing but - - - )

?

I have only briefly looked into Ethercat.?

Would you please direct me to some resources? so that I could better understand Ethercat,?

including its benefits and negatives.?

?

I have further questions on this - - - - maybe this should be broken into?

a new thread? Argh - - - whatever - - - please for the info?

?

TIA


 



On Tue, Feb 22, 2022 at 7:02 AM Brian Martin <bmm@...> wrote:

No problem, o1bigtenor. I want to know more about Ethercat also. Go ahead with the discussion!

Does an Ethercat drive network directly to the PC, or is there still a motion control interface/card?

?

Greetings

My phrase is 'what I know I can write on paper with big block letters and there is still plenty of room?
inside the thimble, after inserting the paper, for my finger' - - - - which is to say - - precious little.?

AIUI its a ethernet modification - - - to speed communications between devices, specifically?
- - again, AIUI, for drives to controls. There is a master info source at:?
?

my search engine (duckduckgo) included this with that address:?

The?EtherCAT?technology overcomes the system limitations of other Ethernet solutions: The Ethernet packet is no longer received, then interpreted and copied as process data at every connection. Instead, the Ethernet frame is processed on the fly.

So - - - it would seem that the value is in high speed connections.?

I'm not sure at what level ethercat comes into its own - - - haven't been able to?
find anything like 'a noobs guide to ethercat' . As usual one is expected to be?
at least sorta of a master form the get go - - - - docs are so tedious to write?
is what needs to be remembered (NOT - - -imo!). So the whole seems like it?
could be useful - - - but exactly how - - - well - - - that's why I was asking for?
info tips.?

(One more technology to master)

From the still quite befogged mind of?

(LOL)



 

开云体育

Hi Guys,

EtherCat is basically a distributed motion controller. So picture an ESS that? is in the drives as well as in the IO blocks . Its sort of like a Modbus setup but is all in realtime. You can mix and match hardware in an Ethercat system. So you can have drives from Yaskawa , Elmo, Omron , Delta , Leadshine and so on all on the same network. The drives could power Steppers or servos (the system has no idea what one it is..) You can also use IO from in the drives OR add IO modules as well. The Ethernet cable just goes from drive to drive and IO to IO. With the Kingstar / Mahc4 setup you can also to ABS encoders so you do not need to home the machine when you start it. This is REALLY cools because you don't need to have home switches or any of that other hardware. You can also read as much data about the drive as you would like. So you can see what current the motor is using for example .


Now you can do this without the Kingstar software and add a hardware master like the board Vital systems has. This is a little more limiting but is much more flexible as to what PC it will work with. This is not the be all end all but it is the best way to make a high end system. It is the future... Well it really is here and the prices have been dropping like crazy.


Okay I think that made more confusion than it helped ;)


Thanks

Brian



______________________________

Brian Barker
Engineering / Development
ArtSoft | Newfangled Solutions
Livermore Falls, Maine (USA)
Webpage: 
On 2/22/2022 10:11 AM, o1bigtenor wrote:


On Tue, Feb 22, 2022 at 7:02 AM Brian Martin <bmm@...> wrote:

No problem, o1bigtenor. I want to know more about Ethercat also. Go ahead with the discussion!

Does an Ethercat drive network directly to the PC, or is there still a motion control interface/card?

?

Greetings

My phrase is 'what I know I can write on paper with big block letters and there is still plenty of room?
inside the thimble, after inserting the paper, for my finger' - - - - which is to say - - precious little.?

AIUI its a ethernet modification - - - to speed communications between devices, specifically?
- - again, AIUI, for drives to controls. There is a master info source at:?
?

my search engine (duckduckgo) included this with that address:?

The?EtherCAT?technology overcomes the system limitations of other Ethernet solutions: The Ethernet packet is no longer received, then interpreted and copied as process data at every connection. Instead, the Ethernet frame is processed on the fly.

So - - - it would seem that the value is in high speed connections.?

I'm not sure at what level ethercat comes into its own - - - haven't been able to?
find anything like 'a noobs guide to ethercat' . As usual one is expected to be?
at least sorta of a master form the get go - - - - docs are so tedious to write?
is what needs to be remembered (NOT - - -imo!). So the whole seems like it?
could be useful - - - but exactly how - - - well - - - that's why I was asking for?
info tips.?

(One more technology to master)

From the still quite befogged mind of?

(LOL)



 

开云体育

That mostly makes sense, I have a Senfeng 4KW laser that has a mixture Yaskawa and Delt drives on it. I will do some more reading on Ethercat.

?

Thank-you!

Brian Martin



?

From: [email protected] <[email protected]> On Behalf Of Brian Barker
Sent: Tuesday, February 22, 2022 11:06 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [MachCNC] Mach4 teach/record

?

Hi Guys,

EtherCat is basically a distributed motion controller. So picture an ESS that? is in the drives as well as in the IO blocks . Its sort of like a Modbus setup but is all in realtime. You can mix and match hardware in an Ethercat system. So you can have drives from Yaskawa , Elmo, Omron , Delta , Leadshine and so on all on the same network. The drives could power Steppers or servos (the system has no idea what one it is..) You can also use IO from in the drives OR add IO modules as well. The Ethernet cable just goes from drive to drive and IO to IO. With the Kingstar / Mahc4 setup you can also to ABS encoders so you do not need to home the machine when you start it. This is REALLY cools because you don't need to have home switches or any of that other hardware. You can also read as much data about the drive as you would like. So you can see what current the motor is using for example .

?

Now you can do this without the Kingstar software and add a hardware master like the board Vital systems has. This is a little more limiting but is much more flexible as to what PC it will work with. This is not the be all end all but it is the best way to make a high end system. It is the future... Well it really is here and the prices have been dropping like crazy.

?

Okay I think that made more confusion than it helped ;)

?

Thanks

Brian

?

?

______________________________
?
Brian Barker
Engineering / Development
ArtSoft | Newfangled Solutions
Livermore Falls, Maine (USA)
Webpage: 

On 2/22/2022 10:11 AM, o1bigtenor wrote:

?

?

On Tue, Feb 22, 2022 at 7:02 AM Brian Martin <bmm@...> wrote:

No problem, o1bigtenor. I want to know more about Ethercat also. Go ahead with the discussion!

Does an Ethercat drive network directly to the PC, or is there still a motion control interface/card?

?

Greetings

?

My phrase is 'what I know I can write on paper with big block letters and there is still plenty of room?

inside the thimble, after inserting the paper, for my finger' - - - - which is to say - - precious little.?

?

AIUI its a ethernet modification - - - to speed communications between devices, specifically?

- - again, AIUI, for drives to controls. There is a master info source at:?

?

?

my search engine (duckduckgo) included this with that address:?

?

The?EtherCAT?technology overcomes the system limitations of other Ethernet solutions: The Ethernet packet is no longer received, then interpreted and copied as process data at every connection. Instead, the Ethernet frame is processed on the fly.

?

So - - - it would seem that the value is in high speed connections.?

?

I'm not sure at what level ethercat comes into its own - - - haven't been able to?

find anything like 'a noobs guide to ethercat' . As usual one is expected to be?

at least sorta of a master form the get go - - - - docs are so tedious to write?

is what needs to be remembered (NOT - - -imo!). So the whole seems like it?

could be useful - - - but exactly how - - - well - - - that's why I was asking for?

info tips.?

?

(One more technology to master)

?

From the still quite befogged mind of?

?

(LOL)

?

?


 

开云体育

That is using step and direction if it is running the Chinese control software. I took that all out of my laser and have been putting in Mach4 with Ethercat :) . We are working on trying to talk to the Raycus fiber generator now ... That is NO fun to try and get support from them

______________________________

Brian Barker
Engineering / Development
ArtSoft | Newfangled Solutions
Livermore Falls, Maine (USA)

Webpage: 
On 2/22/2022 2:21 PM, Brian Martin wrote:

That mostly makes sense, I have a Senfeng 4KW laser that has a mixture Yaskawa and Delt drives on it. I will do some more reading on Ethercat.

?

Thank-you!

Brian Martin



?

From: [email protected] <[email protected]> On Behalf Of Brian Barker
Sent: Tuesday, February 22, 2022 11:06 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [MachCNC] Mach4 teach/record

?

Hi Guys,

EtherCat is basically a distributed motion controller. So picture an ESS that? is in the drives as well as in the IO blocks . Its sort of like a Modbus setup but is all in realtime. You can mix and match hardware in an Ethercat system. So you can have drives from Yaskawa , Elmo, Omron , Delta , Leadshine and so on all on the same network. The drives could power Steppers or servos (the system has no idea what one it is..) You can also use IO from in the drives OR add IO modules as well. The Ethernet cable just goes from drive to drive and IO to IO. With the Kingstar / Mahc4 setup you can also to ABS encoders so you do not need to home the machine when you start it. This is REALLY cools because you don't need to have home switches or any of that other hardware. You can also read as much data about the drive as you would like. So you can see what current the motor is using for example .

?

Now you can do this without the Kingstar software and add a hardware master like the board Vital systems has. This is a little more limiting but is much more flexible as to what PC it will work with. This is not the be all end all but it is the best way to make a high end system. It is the future... Well it really is here and the prices have been dropping like crazy.

?

Okay I think that made more confusion than it helped ;)

?

Thanks

Brian

?

?

______________________________
?
Brian Barker
Engineering / Development
ArtSoft | Newfangled Solutions
Livermore Falls, Maine (USA)
Webpage: 

On 2/22/2022 10:11 AM, o1bigtenor wrote:

?

?

On Tue, Feb 22, 2022 at 7:02 AM Brian Martin <bmm@...> wrote:

No problem, o1bigtenor. I want to know more about Ethercat also. Go ahead with the discussion!

Does an Ethercat drive network directly to the PC, or is there still a motion control interface/card?

?

Greetings

?

My phrase is 'what I know I can write on paper with big block letters and there is still plenty of room?

inside the thimble, after inserting the paper, for my finger' - - - - which is to say - - precious little.?

?

AIUI its a ethernet modification - - - to speed communications between devices, specifically?

- - again, AIUI, for drives to controls. There is a master info source at:?

?

?

my search engine (duckduckgo) included this with that address:?

?

The?EtherCAT?technology overcomes the system limitations of other Ethernet solutions: The Ethernet packet is no longer received, then interpreted and copied as process data at every connection. Instead, the Ethernet frame is processed on the fly.

?

So - - - it would seem that the value is in high speed connections.?

?

I'm not sure at what level ethercat comes into its own - - - haven't been able to?

find anything like 'a noobs guide to ethercat' . As usual one is expected to be?

at least sorta of a master form the get go - - - - docs are so tedious to write?

is what needs to be remembered (NOT - - -imo!). So the whole seems like it?

could be useful - - - but exactly how - - - well - - - that's why I was asking for?

info tips.?

?

(One more technology to master)

?

From the still quite befogged mind of?

?

(LOL)

?

?


 

开云体育

Ok, it is running CypCut which has some nice features but I’d rather run Mach4!

?

Thank-you!

Brian Martin



?

From: [email protected] <[email protected]> On Behalf Of Brian Barker
Sent: Tuesday, February 22, 2022 4:15 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [MachCNC] Mach4 teach/record

?

That is using step and direction if it is running the Chinese control software. I took that all out of my laser and have been putting in Mach4 with Ethercat :) . We are working on trying to talk to the Raycus fiber generator now ... That is NO fun to try and get support from them

______________________________
?
Brian Barker
Engineering / Development
ArtSoft | Newfangled Solutions
Livermore Falls, Maine (USA)
?
Webpage: 

On 2/22/2022 2:21 PM, Brian Martin wrote:

That mostly makes sense, I have a Senfeng 4KW laser that has a mixture Yaskawa and Delt drives on it. I will do some more reading on Ethercat.

?

Thank-you!

Brian Martin




?

From: [email protected] <[email protected]> On Behalf Of Brian Barker
Sent: Tuesday, February 22, 2022 11:06 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [MachCNC] Mach4 teach/record

?

Hi Guys,

EtherCat is basically a distributed motion controller. So picture an ESS that? is in the drives as well as in the IO blocks . Its sort of like a Modbus setup but is all in realtime. You can mix and match hardware in an Ethercat system. So you can have drives from Yaskawa , Elmo, Omron , Delta , Leadshine and so on all on the same network. The drives could power Steppers or servos (the system has no idea what one it is..) You can also use IO from in the drives OR add IO modules as well. The Ethernet cable just goes from drive to drive and IO to IO. With the Kingstar / Mahc4 setup you can also to ABS encoders so you do not need to home the machine when you start it. This is REALLY cools because you don't need to have home switches or any of that other hardware. You can also read as much data about the drive as you would like. So you can see what current the motor is using for example .

?

Now you can do this without the Kingstar software and add a hardware master like the board Vital systems has. This is a little more limiting but is much more flexible as to what PC it will work with. This is not the be all end all but it is the best way to make a high end system. It is the future... Well it really is here and the prices have been dropping like crazy.

?

Okay I think that made more confusion than it helped ;)

?

Thanks

Brian

?

?

______________________________
?
Brian Barker
Engineering / Development
ArtSoft | Newfangled Solutions
Livermore Falls, Maine (USA)
Webpage: 

On 2/22/2022 10:11 AM, o1bigtenor wrote:

?

?

On Tue, Feb 22, 2022 at 7:02 AM Brian Martin <bmm@...> wrote:

No problem, o1bigtenor. I want to know more about Ethercat also. Go ahead with the discussion!

Does an Ethercat drive network directly to the PC, or is there still a motion control interface/card?

?

Greetings

?

My phrase is 'what I know I can write on paper with big block letters and there is still plenty of room?

inside the thimble, after inserting the paper, for my finger' - - - - which is to say - - precious little.?

?

AIUI its a ethernet modification - - - to speed communications between devices, specifically?

- - again, AIUI, for drives to controls. There is a master info source at:?

?

?

my search engine (duckduckgo) included this with that address:?

?

The?EtherCAT?technology overcomes the system limitations of other Ethernet solutions: The Ethernet packet is no longer received, then interpreted and copied as process data at every connection. Instead, the Ethernet frame is processed on the fly.

?

So - - - it would seem that the value is in high speed connections.?

?

I'm not sure at what level ethercat comes into its own - - - haven't been able to?

find anything like 'a noobs guide to ethercat' . As usual one is expected to be?

at least sorta of a master form the get go - - - - docs are so tedious to write?

is what needs to be remembered (NOT - - -imo!). So the whole seems like it?

could be useful - - - but exactly how - - - well - - - that's why I was asking for?

info tips.?

?

(One more technology to master)

?

From the still quite befogged mind of?

?

(LOL)

?

?