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Previously when I balanced my scope/mount I start with the DEC. I set the RA to be parallel to the ground and I usually balanced the DEC so when the front of the scope is pointing North the scope stays parallel to the ground also. I can touch the scope and no matter how much pressure I place the scope it will stay in that position-just a little eye piece/camera heavy.

Today, after I changed scopes and balanced DEC, I also moved the scope to point South with some interesting results. The front of the scope moved up about 5/6 inches; interesting. I then moved the scope so it pointed North and it stayed level; interesting.

I then pointed the scope straight up and the front of the scope moved North. OK, I decided to balance the scope so it would move, slowly, back to almost straight up. I’ve never had PHD2 track better using a FLT132 925mm scope as the guider. I balanced RA as I usually do, no changing the balance routine method with RA

Any comments would be welcome.

Kenn

Hi Ken,

I have experienced similar balancing issues. If you achieve perfect balance the scope should stay still in absolutely any position you set it.

For me the key to achieve that is to not only level DEC horizontally (moving scope, at 0° relative to ground, forward or backward) but also vertically (rotating scope, at 90° relative to ground).

This video explains it much better than I did (relevant part from 5:30 onward):?

Edit: I should add that if you don't have a spring loaded worm gears, then you do not wan't perfect balance, you want slight east heavy balance.
But IMO the best is still to get perfect balance and then add the "RA worm string bias trick":?


Cheers,

Carl

Hi Kenn

usually one side of the axis is "looser" than the other when balancing. for DEC you can also rotate the RA axis past parallel to the ground to loosen up the axis even more

regarding improved guiding, i think that's just coincidence. There are so many things that go into a good night of guiding it would be unlikely that slight rebalancing (it sounds like you do a good job on balancing in general) would make much of an improvement.?

happy to review your before/after guidelogs if that's the case

Brian

While I can see Astroshed's Newtonian does achieve balance in the vertical position, am I the only one who notices his focuser/eyepiece winds up in a potentially unusable position? (Basically CWD the focuser appears to be under the scope.)

I'm all for better balancing, and I do my best. But I want to see how I can improve it.
Rotating my scope may well not be feasible since I use a smaller refractor, and my focuser is limiting in what could be done. (Basically impossible, without major revisions. But that is a personal problem.)

I'll play with these thoughts of balance on the vertical. And it goes against my common sense to be rigging up ropes and pulleys.
I have to lug my equipment out, and then back in every night I use it (which is almost every clear night.) So my thoughts are that any balancing tricks have to be more along the lines of highly mobile, and of a fixed nature.

But a lot of it is, in my honest opinion, not too critical as my "Payload" is 15.6 pounds of photographic Astro equipment from the clamp up, including my bar.
And this is riding my GM811G HD mount, which we know has a 50 pound Photographic Instrument weight rating. Which is a capacity ~3.33 times my load. So it is quite a bit stronger than my fly weight load it bares.

I'm interested in these better balancing ideas, because I can see room for improvement in my PHD2 graph. But I really only put faith in the Photographic results.
Interesting topic though.

--
SonnyE


(I suggest viewed in full screen)

Hi Kenn,?

Both my Losmandy GM8 and G11 do this even with a leveled tripod and a scope with no finders, guiders, cameras etc. just the OTA in the rings. The mounts always behave the same way and favor the same side regardless of OTA or altitude. I have even tried to eliminate this slight imbalance by ensuring that the counterweights have their locking screws pointed down and without DEC DIN cable plugged in and tried flipping the saddle 180 degrees.?

I have no idea why it works like this but it doesn't seem to hurt the guided or unguided PE so I ignore it and just get the balance as close to even as possible. But even so it is not critical for imaging or visual using the mount as it was designed in PUSH-TO mode as long as you are reasonably close. When observing visually about 95% of the time I have a 1.25" eyepiece in the diagonal so there is virtually no balance change between eyepieces even when moving from a 24mm Panoptic to a 35mm Panoptic the scope needs no rebalancing.?

--

Chip Louie - Chief Daydreamer Imagination Hardware

?As the video shows, the scope needs to be balanced vertical and horizontal. The gentleman in the video was turning the focuser into a position that makes it impossible to use visually, toward the mount. Turn the scope in the other direction so the focuser is pointed away from the mount and with a 3 foot step platform ladder it can be used visually while it is in balance.? If one is using a camera the access to the focuser is not very important. Weather one has a Newtonian or a refractor the scope should be balanced in both positions.
I have to do this every time out with my set up.
Clear Skies!
Nels Johansen

Ithinkwealldogoodadvic.bobfranklin

I appreciate all the comments and suggestions, I really do. I've been playing Astronomer since 1975 and balance was not really a major issue with visual-first few years. The I got the photograph bug and was using a fork mount, these last many years I purchased a Titan--it looked solid. Tonight the guiding is good and the stars are pin points. My balance routing will now change because of this experience. This hobby is such that one never stops learning; got to love it.
Kenn

I spent some time with my GM811G and trying the balance with the scope on the East side, in all positions, and as a matter of curiosity on the West side as well.
It seemed to be well balanced everywhere.?
--
SonnyE


(I suggest viewed in full screen)