Thanks Michael. I¡¯ll be giving it a go with the Air once I¡¯ve got the cable made up and some clear sky!
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>>>Thanks for the replies. With the AVX I had to do an align in the mount before connecting the Air.?
just curious why you had to do that? I would assume ASIAir does plate solve and supports blind solving?
On Sun, Aug 2, 2020 at 10:25 AM Bryn Evans via <brynevans2000= [email protected]> wrote: Thanks for the replies. With the AVX I had to do an align in the mount before connecting the Air.?
from the responses, it sounds like this is not necessary with Gemini. I¡¯ll hopefully have the serial cable made up in the next couple of days (waiting for parts!) then I¡¯ll update on my progress and see what works.
Thanks again
-- Brian?
Brian Valente portfolio
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Thanks for the replies. With the AVX I had to do an align in the mount before connecting the Air.?
from the responses, it sounds like this is not necessary with Gemini. I¡¯ll hopefully have the serial cable made up in the next couple of days (waiting for parts!) then I¡¯ll update on my progress and see what works.
Thanks again
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>>>So does the mount have to have a model in before using the ASIAir, achieved by warm starting? If you cold started, as I have to set up each night, would I have to get a mount model made before connecting the air? Or, would any previous model work, hence the warm start?
No. I think there's some confusion about exactly what the model is and does, and how it relates to programs that plate solve
If you are using an imaging application that provides plate solving, you don't need a model at all. you can cold start every night and the pointing will be as good as your plate solver (mine is set to center targets within 50 pixels and usually achieves this within 2-3 solves).?
The first plate solve after cold start may go to a blind solve, which isn't unusual. After that the plate solve should work quickly and easily. A lot of people mistakenly see the first plate solve fail and failover to the blind and think it isn't working correctly.
Brian
?
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Hi,
I often do a Warm Start, using the prior night's model which is always saved in the SRAM.??
Or I may choose Cold start, skip the "Align to 1st bright star" step, and just use Stellarium with Stellarium-scope and Ascom/Gemini.net to go-to [Ctl-1 in Stellariim] all kinds of targets.??
Targets can be anything with a distinct center, like any star in the star chart, or any planet.? The sky chart is telling Gemini the location so Gemini does not even need it in its own database.?
Once I recenter at any target from the sky chart, I can use the Synch [Ctl-3] (only does a local Align at that point, not changing the existing Model) or "Add Align Point"? in the Gemini.net applet to build or improve a model.? (That latter Add Align Point at current position is hidden in the diamond top menu panel, under the left side lower drop down menu. )
If you are well polar aligned, and shooting only a few targets a night, you might skip building a model at all.??
It also depends on your scope field of view.? If you have a wide field of view you likely won't need a model.??
If shooting a narrow field of view I find this: Gemini will sleep to a target, but stop when it feels "close enough". I can see the scope is still off center looking at the Stellarium sky chart. If my field of view is small, I'll use hand centering commands or the Gemini net applet to precisely center the object...and usually there it is centered in the image.??
I know Gemini has an entry for Telescope FL, (in Gemini.net too in the Telescope panel) and maybe I have that info wrong...not sure how Gemini uses this info.? Perhaps it centers the object closer for a long FL scope??
Anyway....sorry for such a long winded answer to your question!
Best, Michael
On Sun, Aug 2, 2020, 7:18 AM brynevans2000 via <brynevans2000= [email protected]> wrote: So does the mount have to have a model in before using the ASIAir, achieved by warm starting? If you cold started, as I have to set up each night, would I have to get a mount model made before connecting the air? Or, would any previous model work, hence the warm start?
I¡¯ve just moved from an AVX to a GM-8 with Gemini 1, so am still very much feeling my way around. I¡¯m currently making up a serial to RJ22 lead to connect the Air to the mount
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If you are having to set up your mount each night, then I wouldn't bother with building a model. ?
Keep in mind the model only improves go-to accuracy. ?Once it arrives at the target, the model does nothing for the performance of the mount (it doesn't improve tracking, etc.). ?
You can use ASIair to plate-solve on go-to, it will sync, and then repeat the go-to. ? If you're imaging, you probably are sticking with very few targets per night, and the amount of time to plate-solve and sync on them is probably far less time than the time needed to completely rebuild a model each time you setup.
Clear Skies,
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On Aug 2, 2020, at 10:19 AM, brynevans2000 via groups.io <brynevans2000@...> wrote:
?So does the mount have to have a model in before using the ASIAir, achieved by warm starting? If you cold started, as I have to set up each night, would I have to get a mount model made before connecting the air? Or, would any previous model work, hence the warm start?
I¡¯ve just moved from an AVX to a GM-8 with Gemini 1, so am still very much feeling my way around. I¡¯m currently making up a serial to RJ22 lead to connect the Air to the mount
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So does the mount have to have a model in before using the ASIAir, achieved by warm starting? If you cold started, as I have to set up each night, would I have to get a mount model made before connecting the air? Or, would any previous model work, hence the warm start?
I¡¯ve just moved from an AVX to a GM-8 with Gemini 1, so am still very much feeling my way around. I¡¯m currently making up a serial to RJ22 lead to connect the Air to the mount
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Hi John,
Also make note of the worm material color. The original worms were silver that oxidized to a brownish color and they were fine for visual use but not great for imaging. The later HP (High Precision) worms are made of a different material that looks obviously brass in color. They are much better worms, smoother and were held to a closer tolerance. The HP worms make a big difference.?
?
--
Chip Louie - Chief Daydreamer Imagination Hardware
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Re: Apology to the polar alignment scope
Les, Brian,
I used to eyeball it but that gave me sort of inconsistent results, stacks on stacks as it were. I was already guesstimating the position to position the reticle based on the constellation lines and positions and by adding yet another layer of estimation I think caused me to get too far from the correct position. It would work mostly but when it didn't I sort of struggled with GOTO accuracy.
My reticles were fine but old and I got tired of guessing and finding that I was a poor guesser. So I updated them and problem solved.?
Oh, the updated reticles are still available from Hutech Astro down in the OC> Look at the link: .? ? ?
--
Chip Louie - Chief Daydreamer Imagination Hardware
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Re: Apology to the polar alignment scope
Brian,?
We have more common experiences than is allowed here. I just left them in the mounts NOT because I'm lazy but mostly due to inertia. Because - a) they don't get in the way, b) by leaving them there I won't lose them, c) I would need to find the caps, d) I would need to sell or store them and they seemed to be stored just fine already, e) the thought that it may be handy if the lappy fails, I forget the cable etc. See, not lazy!?
But as it turned out, being a frequent visual observer made me realize what a good tool it is to have on hand. I mean I can't forget it, it's already in the mount, takes up no space and has a very useful function when using the Gemini or the Nexus DSC but not using the laptop or imaging.??
But seriously though I just think it is funny that we so frequently come to such similar conclusions about Losmandy things.??
--
Chip Louie - Chief Daydreamer Imagination Hardware
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You can also swap the worms. Sometimes the DEC worm will be better (half the time in general!).??
Better if you can perform a PE evaluation and quantify the PE of each worm.
New brass high precision worms are $100 each from Losmandy.? If you have the old steel worms you should consider replacing at least the RA worm...or buy two and use the better one for RA.
Very best, Michael
On Sat, Aug 1, 2020, 12:28 PM John Hawk < jhawk@...> wrote: Thanks Michael,
I'll swap the RA and Dec Motors and see what happens as I mentioned the RA worm gear is questionable. Thanks!
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The ?stars are gradually moving in one direction. Have a Feathertouch focuser that I lock down after focus. I always retighten Alt and Az after Sharp Cap polar align and check for any changes. I'm going to focus on the RA worm gear and check things again tonight. thanks for all you help!
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Thanks Michael,
I'll swap the RA and Dec Motors and see what happens as I mentioned the RA worm gear is questionable. Thanks!
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Thanks Michael, I found it.
Tom
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On 8/1/20 1:33 PM, Michael Herman wrote: Hi Tom
The PECprep.exe is made by the EQMOD owners group for the Orion EQ6 mounts.? Please look for links to download EQNOD and you will find PECPrep there in the list of downloads.? It will analyze PE data for frequency components taken by PHD2 for a large variety of mounts, including G11, GM8, Titan and many other brands and types.
SourceForge is a very good place to get software downloads.? Many groups use that.
I hope that helps.? If you encounter further problems please let me know. You can email me directly at mherman346 at Gmail dot com.
Very best,
Michael
On Sat, Aug 1, 2020, 5:40 AM wa1vta01452 <loeblt@... <mailto:loeblt@...>> wrote:
Michael,
your attached document suggests downloading PECPrep.exe. The link in
the document didn't work for me. It eventually takes me to
Sourceforge where it downloads TrueVoiceSounds.zip. Do you have
another source for it or can you send it via personal email?
Thanks,
Tom
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Re: Apology to the polar alignment scope
you can kind of eyeball the precession too
fortunately my reticle is good through 2030
On Sat, Aug 1, 2020 at 11:59 AM Les Niles < les@...> wrote: An out-of-date polar scope reticle will work fine for visual use. Even if it¡¯s 40 years out of date, the resulting polar misalignment will cause a drift of only a few arc seconds per minute.? ?Hi Brian,
I found it funny that the PoleMaster was so amazingly essential to me that I almost sold off all my Losmandy Polar scopes thinking who needs them? But I also came to realize that if I'm not imaging that night why carry the laptop out into the dark with me when I have that optical device already installed in the mount to do the same thing? For a visual observer using the same mount for imaging IME the PoleMaster camera is as essential as a polar scope. I had to own both at the same time to come to that realization, I even updated both of my polar scopes with the reticles to the 2030 version years ago because of the PoleMaster.??
In case you need an updated polar scope reticle for your Losmandy or AP polar scope Astro Hutech was who I bought them from. I am not sure they are still available but they might have more by now.?
--
Chip Louie - Chief Daydreamer Imagination Hardware
-- Brian?
Brian Valente portfolio
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Re: Apology to the polar alignment scope
An out-of-date polar scope reticle will work fine for visual use. Even if it¡¯s 40 years out of date, the resulting polar misalignment will cause a drift of only a few arc seconds per minute.?
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
On Aug 1, 2020, at 11:45 AM, Chip Louie <chiplouie@...> wrote:
?Hi Brian,
I found it funny that the PoleMaster was so amazingly essential to me that I almost sold off all my Losmandy Polar scopes thinking who needs them? But I also came to realize that if I'm not imaging that night why carry the laptop out into the dark with me when I have that optical device already installed in the mount to do the same thing? For a visual observer using the same mount for imaging IME the PoleMaster camera is as essential as a polar scope. I had to own both at the same time to come to that realization, I even updated both of my polar scopes with the reticles to the 2030 version years ago because of the PoleMaster.??
In case you need an updated polar scope reticle for your Losmandy or AP polar scope Astro Hutech was who I bought them from. I am not sure they are still available but they might have more by now.?
--
Chip Louie - Chief Daydreamer Imagination Hardware
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Re: Apology to the polar alignment scope
Chip i think you and I have/had a similar experience!
i'm very lucky and fortunate i kept my polar scope, mostly out of laziness haha. but now I picked up a LW tripod and hope to do more interesting things in the field
On Sat, Aug 1, 2020 at 11:45 AM Chip Louie < chiplouie@...> wrote: Hi Brian,
I found it funny that the PoleMaster was so amazingly essential to me that I almost sold off all my Losmandy Polar scopes thinking who needs them? But I also came to realize that if I'm not imaging that night why carry the laptop out into the dark with me when I have that optical device already installed in the mount to do the same thing? For a visual observer using the same mount for imaging IME the PoleMaster camera is as essential as a polar scope. I had to own both at the same time to come to that realization, I even updated both of my polar scopes with the reticles to the 2030 version years ago because of the PoleMaster.??
In case you need an updated polar scope reticle for your Losmandy or AP polar scope Astro Hutech was who I bought them from. I am not sure they are still available but they might have more by now.?
--
Chip Louie - Chief Daydreamer Imagination Hardware
-- Brian?
Brian Valente portfolio
|
Re: Apology to the polar alignment scope
Hi Brian,
I found it funny that the PoleMaster was so amazingly essential to me that I almost sold off all my Losmandy Polar scopes thinking who needs them? But I also came to realize that if I'm not imaging that night why carry the laptop out into the dark with me when I have that optical device already installed in the mount to do the same thing? For a visual observer using the same mount for imaging IME the PoleMaster camera is as essential as a polar scope. I had to own both at the same time to come to that realization, I even updated both of my polar scopes with the reticles to the 2030 version years ago because of the PoleMaster.??
In case you need an updated polar scope reticle for your Losmandy or AP polar scope Astro Hutech was who I bought them from. I am not sure they are still available but they might have more by now.?
--
Chip Louie - Chief Daydreamer Imagination Hardware
|
Hi Tom
The PECprep.exe is made by the EQMOD owners group for the Orion EQ6 mounts.? Please look for links to download EQNOD and you will find PECPrep there in the list of downloads.? It will analyze PE data for frequency components taken by PHD2 for a large variety of mounts, including G11, GM8, Titan and many other brands and types.??
SourceForge is a very good place to get software downloads.? Many groups use that.
I hope that helps.? If you encounter further problems please let me know. You can email me directly at mherman346 at Gmail dot com.
Very best, Michael
On Sat, Aug 1, 2020, 5:40 AM wa1vta01452 < loeblt@...> wrote: Michael,
your attached document suggests downloading PECPrep.exe. The link in the document didn't work for me. It eventually takes me to Sourceforge where it downloads TrueVoiceSounds.zip. Do you have another source for it or can you send it via personal email?
Thanks,
Tom
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Clicking through your subs in rapid succession can reveal a lot.
- If the stars are gradually moving in one direction, it is most likely
? - Polar misalignment.? If your polar alignment looks super in SharpCap, re-check it after you tighten the bolts because that can easily throw it off again.
? - Flexure.?
? ? - Is the OTA mounted on rings? (Probably not the case)
? ? - Is the focuser sloppy so it shifts under the camera's weight?? Check any screws you can find, add extenders to get the eyepiece tube under them if necessary so it is tight.
? ? - Tripod feet not stable enough (Probably not the case)
- If the stars are making a cyclic motion, it is PE.? Apply PEC analysis and control.
- If the stars are making irregular movements in one direction (RA), the worm may be too tight and the motors are skipping steps at the high points of the crown wheel.
This may get you a quicker answer than doing test runs for PE analysis or drift alignment (while the PA may also not be the same).? Good luck.
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Michael Herman
Timothy Campbell
Chip Louie