Re: G11 RA needle bearings
Molybdenum disulfide? is like that. it embeds a lubricating surface that is very tough to remove. That is why is is an excellent lubricant. " What is molybdenum disulfide grease used for?
Molybdenum-Sulfur Compounds in?Lubrication.?Molybdenum disulfide?is?used as?a dry?lubricant?in, e.g.?greases, dispersions, friction materials and bonded coatings.?Molybdenum-sulfur complexes may be?used in?suspension but more commonly dissolved in lubricating oils at concentrations of a few percent."
More here:?
It's good stuff, Marc.
The best advice is to follow the manufacturers recommendations.
--?
SonnyE (I suggest viewed in full screen)
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Re: G11 RA needle bearings
Thanks for the feedback guys. So it sounds like I'm already using the right stuff. I'll check again how much I put in there. I tend to agree with Sonny for the cylindrical needle bearings. There's room in between the rollers to pack a fair bit of the stuff. The thrust bearings I'm quite happy with a "light dressing" as previously mentionned between the tracks and a dab of paste. That's interesting Brian that you use MP50 moly on the bearings. Got a can of it here and used that in the past and I definitely could feel roughness by hand in the RA axis. That's when I went back to the superlube. I had a lot of noise and jumps in RA tracking. I think you saw the PEMpro log posted on the Gemini group before. And this stuff is so messy to remove. It just doesn't give up...
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The attached log files have the detail and show ra and Dec values stop changing after the pulse. I'm not familiar enough with the protocol to say that the mount behavior is correct, but there does seem to be an issue with PhD Indi etc since it should not be sending guide commands when I selected "stop guiding when slewing" in PhD.
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Hi!
I really cannot see much in this, there is far too little detail
about what is sent or the state of the mount. Do you say the the
problem here is that in the second slew it never reaches the
target? However, this log says nothing about where the mount is
pointing. You need the Kstars log with verbose logging turned on
in the Indi manager, verbose on all, scope and driver etc. And in
the module for guide scope.
Anyway, this seems to be fully Indi/Ekos, and not much
Gemini-related. Or do I misinterpret you?
Magnus
Den 2020-05-28 kl. 22:28, skrev Jamie
Amendolagine:
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
You can also see in this log this exact thing happening. In the
bad slew case, we stop getting slew updates after a pulse, and we
never get a "slew completed" event.?
The attached files have more detail, but this shows what goes
wrong:
Successful slew:
2020-05-27T06:42:04: Driver indi_lx200gemini: read message
Losmandy Gemini? ?'[INFO] Slewing to RA: 15:40:08 - DEC:
36:34:18' Slew Command
2020-05-27T06:42:04: Driver indi_lx200gemini: read
setNumberVector Losmandy Gemini TARGET_EOD_COORD Idle
2020-05-27T06:42:04: Driver indi_lx200gemini: read
setNumberVector Losmandy Gemini EQUATORIAL_EOD_COORD Busy Slew
updates
2020-05-27T06:42:05: Driver indi_lx200gemini: read
setSwitchVector Losmandy Gemini TELESCOPE_TRACK_STATE Idle
2020-05-27T06:42:05: Driver indi_lx200gemini: read
setNumberVector Losmandy Gemini EQUATORIAL_EOD_COORD Busy
2020-05-27T06:42:06: Driver indi_lx200gemini: read
setNumberVector Losmandy Gemini EQUATORIAL_EOD_COORD Busy
2020-05-27T06:42:07: Driver indi_lx200gemini: read
setNumberVector Losmandy Gemini EQUATORIAL_EOD_COORD Busy
2020-05-27T06:42:08: Driver indi_lx200gemini: read
setNumberVector Losmandy Gemini EQUATORIAL_EOD_COORD Busy
2020-05-27T06:42:09: Driver indi_lx200gemini: read
setNumberVector Losmandy Gemini EQUATORIAL_EOD_COORD Busy
2020-05-27T06:42:10: Driver indi_lx200gemini: read
setNumberVector Losmandy Gemini EQUATORIAL_EOD_COORD Busy
2020-05-27T06:42:11: Driver indi_lx200gemini: read
setNumberVector Losmandy Gemini EQUATORIAL_EOD_COORD Busy
2020-05-27T06:42:12: Driver indi_lx200gemini: read
setNumberVector Losmandy Gemini EQUATORIAL_EOD_COORD Busy
2020-05-27T06:42:13: Driver indi_lx200gemini: read
setNumberVector Losmandy Gemini EQUATORIAL_EOD_COORD Busy
2020-05-27T06:42:14: Driver indi_lx200gemini: read
setNumberVector Losmandy Gemini EQUATORIAL_EOD_COORD Busy
2020-05-27T06:42:15: Driver indi_lx200gemini: read
setSwitchVector Losmandy Gemini TELESCOPE_SLEW_RATE Ok
2020-05-27T06:42:15: Driver indi_lx200gemini: read message
Losmandy Gemini? ?'[INFO] Slew is complete. Tracking...' Slew
done event
Failed Slew:
2020-05-27T06:42:20: Driver indi_lx200gemini: read message
Losmandy Gemini? ?'[INFO] Slewing to RA: 16:42:24 - DEC:
36:25:22' Slew Command
2020-05-27T06:42:20: Driver indi_lx200gemini: read
setNumberVector Losmandy Gemini TARGET_EOD_COORD Idle
2020-05-27T06:42:20: Driver indi_lx200gemini: read
setNumberVector Losmandy Gemini EQUATORIAL_EOD_COORD Busy Slew
Update
2020-05-27T06:42:20: Driver indi_lx200gemini: queuing
responsible for <newNumberVector device='Losmandy Gemini'
name='TELESCOPE_TIMED_GUIDE_WE'> Pulse Command
2020-05-27T06:42:20: Driver indi_lx200gemini: read
setNumberVector Losmandy Gemini TELESCOPE_TIMED_GUIDE_WE Busy
2020-05-27T06:42:20: Driver indi_lx200gemini: read
setSwitchVector Losmandy Gemini TELESCOPE_TRACK_STATE Idle
2020-05-27T06:42:20: Driver indi_lx200gemini: read
setNumberVector Losmandy Gemini EQUATORIAL_EOD_COORD Busy Slew
Update
2020-05-27T06:42:21: Driver indi_lx200gemini: read
setNumberVector Losmandy Gemini EQUATORIAL_EOD_COORD Busy Slew
Update
2020-05-27T06:42:22: Driver indi_lx200gemini: read
setNumberVector Losmandy Gemini EQUATORIAL_EOD_COORD Idle Slew
Idle
2020-05-27T06:42:22: Driver indi_lx200gemini: read
setNumberVector Losmandy Gemini TELESCOPE_TIMED_GUIDE_WE Idle
2020-05-27T06:42:22: Driver indi_lx200gemini: queuing
responsible for <newNumberVector device='Losmandy Gemini'
name='TELESCOPE_TIMED_GUIDE_NS'>?Pulse Command
2020-05-27T06:42:22: Driver indi_lx200gemini: read
setNumberVector Losmandy Gemini TELESCOPE_TIMED_GUIDE_NS Busy
2020-05-27T06:42:23: Driver indi_lx200gemini: read
setNumberVector Losmandy Gemini EQUATORIAL_EOD_COORD Idle
2020-05-27T06:42:23: Driver indi_lx200gemini: read
setNumberVector Losmandy Gemini TELESCOPE_TIMED_GUIDE_NS Idle
2020-05-27T06:42:24: Driver indi_lx200gemini: read
setNumberVector Losmandy Gemini EQUATORIAL_EOD_COORD Idle
2020-05-27T06:42:27: Driver indi_lx200gemini: queuing
responsible for <newSwitchVector device='Losmandy Gemini'
name='TELESCOPE_ABORT_MOTION'> Abort command This
is from me hitting "stop" in skysafari after the mount stops
before getting close to the target.?
2020-05-27T06:42:27: Driver indi_lx200gemini: read
setSwitchVector Losmandy Gemini TELESCOPE_ABORT_MOTION Ok
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You can also see in this log this exact thing happening. In the bad slew case, we stop getting slew updates after a pulse, and we never get a "slew completed" event.?
The attached files have more detail, but this shows what goes wrong:
Successful slew:
2020-05-27T06:42:04: Driver indi_lx200gemini: read message Losmandy Gemini? ?'[INFO] Slewing to RA: 15:40:08 - DEC: 36:34:18' Slew Command
2020-05-27T06:42:04: Driver indi_lx200gemini: read setNumberVector Losmandy Gemini TARGET_EOD_COORD Idle
2020-05-27T06:42:04: Driver indi_lx200gemini: read setNumberVector Losmandy Gemini EQUATORIAL_EOD_COORD Busy Slew updates
2020-05-27T06:42:05: Driver indi_lx200gemini: read setSwitchVector Losmandy Gemini TELESCOPE_TRACK_STATE Idle
2020-05-27T06:42:05: Driver indi_lx200gemini: read setNumberVector Losmandy Gemini EQUATORIAL_EOD_COORD Busy
2020-05-27T06:42:06: Driver indi_lx200gemini: read setNumberVector Losmandy Gemini EQUATORIAL_EOD_COORD Busy
2020-05-27T06:42:07: Driver indi_lx200gemini: read setNumberVector Losmandy Gemini EQUATORIAL_EOD_COORD Busy
2020-05-27T06:42:08: Driver indi_lx200gemini: read setNumberVector Losmandy Gemini EQUATORIAL_EOD_COORD Busy
2020-05-27T06:42:09: Driver indi_lx200gemini: read setNumberVector Losmandy Gemini EQUATORIAL_EOD_COORD Busy
2020-05-27T06:42:10: Driver indi_lx200gemini: read setNumberVector Losmandy Gemini EQUATORIAL_EOD_COORD Busy
2020-05-27T06:42:11: Driver indi_lx200gemini: read setNumberVector Losmandy Gemini EQUATORIAL_EOD_COORD Busy
2020-05-27T06:42:12: Driver indi_lx200gemini: read setNumberVector Losmandy Gemini EQUATORIAL_EOD_COORD Busy
2020-05-27T06:42:13: Driver indi_lx200gemini: read setNumberVector Losmandy Gemini EQUATORIAL_EOD_COORD Busy
2020-05-27T06:42:14: Driver indi_lx200gemini: read setNumberVector Losmandy Gemini EQUATORIAL_EOD_COORD Busy
2020-05-27T06:42:15: Driver indi_lx200gemini: read setSwitchVector Losmandy Gemini TELESCOPE_SLEW_RATE Ok
2020-05-27T06:42:15: Driver indi_lx200gemini: read message Losmandy Gemini? ?'[INFO] Slew is complete. Tracking...' Slew done eventFailed Slew:
2020-05-27T06:42:20: Driver indi_lx200gemini: read message Losmandy Gemini? ?'[INFO] Slewing to RA: 16:42:24 - DEC: 36:25:22' Slew Command
2020-05-27T06:42:20: Driver indi_lx200gemini: read setNumberVector Losmandy Gemini TARGET_EOD_COORD Idle
2020-05-27T06:42:20: Driver indi_lx200gemini: read setNumberVector Losmandy Gemini EQUATORIAL_EOD_COORD Busy Slew Update
2020-05-27T06:42:20: Driver indi_lx200gemini: queuing responsible for <newNumberVector device='Losmandy Gemini' name='TELESCOPE_TIMED_GUIDE_WE'> Pulse Command
2020-05-27T06:42:20: Driver indi_lx200gemini: read setNumberVector Losmandy Gemini TELESCOPE_TIMED_GUIDE_WE Busy
2020-05-27T06:42:20: Driver indi_lx200gemini: read setSwitchVector Losmandy Gemini TELESCOPE_TRACK_STATE Idle
2020-05-27T06:42:20: Driver indi_lx200gemini: read setNumberVector Losmandy Gemini EQUATORIAL_EOD_COORD Busy Slew Update
2020-05-27T06:42:21: Driver indi_lx200gemini: read setNumberVector Losmandy Gemini EQUATORIAL_EOD_COORD Busy Slew Update
2020-05-27T06:42:22: Driver indi_lx200gemini: read setNumberVector Losmandy Gemini EQUATORIAL_EOD_COORD Idle Slew Idle
2020-05-27T06:42:22: Driver indi_lx200gemini: read setNumberVector Losmandy Gemini TELESCOPE_TIMED_GUIDE_WE Idle
2020-05-27T06:42:22: Driver indi_lx200gemini: queuing responsible for <newNumberVector device='Losmandy Gemini' name='TELESCOPE_TIMED_GUIDE_NS'>?Pulse Command
2020-05-27T06:42:22: Driver indi_lx200gemini: read setNumberVector Losmandy Gemini TELESCOPE_TIMED_GUIDE_NS Busy
2020-05-27T06:42:23: Driver indi_lx200gemini: read setNumberVector Losmandy Gemini EQUATORIAL_EOD_COORD Idle
2020-05-27T06:42:23: Driver indi_lx200gemini: read setNumberVector Losmandy Gemini TELESCOPE_TIMED_GUIDE_NS Idle
2020-05-27T06:42:24: Driver indi_lx200gemini: read setNumberVector Losmandy Gemini EQUATORIAL_EOD_COORD Idle
2020-05-27T06:42:27: Driver indi_lx200gemini: queuing responsible for <newSwitchVector device='Losmandy Gemini' name='TELESCOPE_ABORT_MOTION'> Abort command This is from me hitting "stop" in skysafari after the mount stops before getting close to the target.?
2020-05-27T06:42:27: Driver indi_lx200gemini: read setSwitchVector Losmandy Gemini TELESCOPE_ABORT_MOTION Ok
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Good idea about the kstars log, my first thought was to be able to see what the low layer was doing so I went with Indi. I run the Indi stack from init.d so it's separate from kstars.?
This is my understanding of the wild slew problem: first failure happens with a pulse during a slew. This results in a slew aborted in the mount, and Indi not knowing that it was aborted. Subsequent slews issued from this bad state end up going heywire. I tested this last night and have seen the behavior before. I did many successful slews followed by one slew while guiding and it failed.
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Hi!
OK, then I understand a bit more. How come you do not take the
Kstars log? At least I feel that is more readable, and you can see
what Ekos is doing.
Few more things:
Do you run PHD2 connected to Ekos or fully independent?
I run PHD2 as well with Ekos, I do not have the "Stop guiding
when mount slews" checked, but I have no experience of that
causing any problems.
Is your issue the wild runaway slews (what I understand as what
you mean by "bad slew"), or that slews are aborted by guiding? I'm
not sure I understand which. And what in the log makes you
conclude that the guide pulse leads to aborted slew? I don't
follow you there.
Again, maybe you know more about this than I do, I'm not a
programmer but have been using this setup for a rather
considerable time now.
Magnus
Den 2020-05-28 kl. 20:52, skrev Jamie
Amendolagine:
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
Hey Magnus,?
This log is from indi. I run the indi server with -vvv argument
(giving a massive log file). I parsed it and found both a good
slew and a failed one. As you mentioned the good slew does not
have any guide pulses in it. The bad slew does though. The log for
the bad slew is attached a few messages before the good one. I
broke down the log in this post in this thread:?/g/Losmandy_users/message/66491
The bad one has this just after issuing the slew:
2020-05-27T06:42:20: Driver indi_lx200gemini: queuing
responsible for <newNumberVector device='Losmandy Gemini'
name='TELESCOPE_TIMED_GUIDE_WE'>
It's not clear to me what the gemini is supposed to do if it
get's a pulse during a slew. What it appears to do is abort the
slew, but the indi driver never seems to realize that the slew
is aborted.?
I looked it up in the indi code lx200telescope.cpp, and
lx200gemini.cpp and don't see any logic for aborting pulses
during slews. There is logic for that in phd2, but it does not
seem to be working. I didn't look up that code...?
Jamie
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Hey Magnus,? This log is from indi. I run the indi server with -vvv argument (giving a massive log file). I parsed it and found both a good slew and a failed one. As you mentioned the good slew does not have any guide pulses in it. The bad slew does though. The log for the bad slew is attached a few messages before the good one. I broke down the log in this post in this thread:? /g/Losmandy_users/message/66491The bad one has this just after issuing the slew:
2020-05-27T06:42:20: Driver indi_lx200gemini: queuing responsible for <newNumberVector device='Losmandy Gemini' name='TELESCOPE_TIMED_GUIDE_WE'>
It's not clear to me what the gemini is supposed to do if it get's a pulse during a slew. What it appears to do is abort the slew, but the indi driver never seems to realize that the slew is aborted.?
I looked it up in the indi code lx200telescope.cpp, and lx200gemini.cpp and don't see any logic for aborting pulses during slews. There is logic for that in phd2, but it does not seem to be working. I didn't look up that code...?
Jamie
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Hi!
I'm not sure if I'm helping or just confusing, but thought I'd
chip in since I have a similar setup.
I found your log for a good slew here:
/g/Losmandy_users/message/66498
However, I'm not sure what kind of log this is. Is it from Kstars
(~/.local/share/kstars/log)? Or from Skysafari?
In either case, I cannot see any pulses during slew. And no slew
command as such. Mine looks like:
[2020-05-26T23:46:02.089 CEST DEBG ][????
org.kde.kstars.ekos.mount] - Slewing to RA= "18h 29m 41s" DEC= "
32¡ã 15' 39\""
[2020-05-26T23:46:02.092 CEST DEBG ][???? org.kde.kstars.indi] -
ISD:Telescope sending coords RA: "18h 29m 41s" ( 18.4947 ) DE: "
32¡ã 15' 39\"" ( 32.261 )
If you could point me towards where you see pulse guiding during
slew, I'd be happy to see if I can make something of that.
Best,
Magnus
Den 2020-05-28 kl. 17:41, skrev Jamie
Amendolagine:
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
I did enable "stop guiding when mount slews" in phd. That feature
seems to be broken? on the PhD/Indi stack for some reason. I let
the Indi people know as well. So my workaround is to stop guiding
before each slew, and that seems to solve the problem.?
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>>>
So my workaround is to stop guiding before each slew, and that seems to solve the problem.?
yeah it seems that way. what a hassle, sorry to hear that but glad there's a temp fix
I'm surprised this hasn't come up sooner
I did enable "stop guiding when mount slews" in phd. That feature seems to be broken? on the PhD/Indi stack for some reason. I let the Indi people know as well. So my workaround is to stop guiding before each slew, and that seems to solve the problem.?
-- Brian?
Brian Valente portfolio
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I did enable "stop guiding when mount slews" in phd. That feature seems to be broken? on the PhD/Indi stack for some reason. I let the Indi people know as well. So my workaround is to stop guiding before each slew, and that seems to solve the problem.?
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Jamie
I looked at that thread - again, it seems specific to the Indi driver.
i have not experienced that problem with the ASCOM driver. if i can find the time i may try out the indi driver to see if I can replicate that
[Edited Message Follows]
I've posted and analized the logs in this thread. If you look at them you'll see the guide pulses after the slew starts. I've also started an Indi thread and posted a link here.
-- Brian?
Brian Valente portfolio
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Hi Jamie
>>> But it sounds like the Gemini software should be able to handle guide pulses while slewing, and it seems that it doesn't, so that's the second issue.?
Did you try enabling "stop guiding when mount slews"?
PHD for my windows ASCOM setup will continue issuing guiding commands when I forget to enable the option to stop guiding while slewing. I haven't run into any issues with that on the windows platform.?
Brian
OK, so I think that I'm on to something here. M101 went behind a tree so I had just a few possible targets, each was having it's own issues, so I decided to just play around and test the guess about slewing while guiding. I hopped around the sky for close to a dozen targets. Some east some west, all over. No issues at all. I started guiding, then did one slew and I have the issue. SF is now stuck not finishing it's slew. This looks to be the problem. So the Ekos/indi/phd2 stack is supposed to not do guiding while in a slew, but it does anyway. That's one issue. But it sounds like the Gemini software should be able to handle guide pulses while slewing, and it seems that it doesn't, so that's the second issue. From now on I'm just going to be careful to turn off guiding before I do a slew.?
Jamie
-- Brian?
Brian Valente portfolio
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I've posted and analized the logs in this thread. If you look at them you'll see the guide pulses after the slew starts. I've also started an Indi thread and posted a link here.
https://indilib.org/forum/mounts/7065-losmandy-slew-goes-haywire.html
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If you can give me the cable lengths you need from the NGC box to the encoders I can make up a cable for you. A photo of your encoder hookups from the RJ1-2 jack (RJ-11s are the same size but have 4 not 6 conductor positions) to the encoder will assure they are standard pin outs. Sometimes RJ-9 4P/4C connectors are used. These are norrower than the RJ-11/12s. RJ-9 4/4s are commonly used on fax cables. Tangent built most of these early DSC displays and sort of set the standard. They were also the folks behind the 492 DD System.
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Hi!
I'm not sure I understand your problem, but you mention Ekos and
PHD2 guiding while slewing. That's more of an indi issue. Do you
have a log showing that, or what makes you think it guides while
slewing (I mean, sending pulses)? Maybe better to place in another
thread or even the indi-forum?
Magnus
Den 2020-05-28 kl. 08:17, skrev Jamie
Amendolagine:
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
OK, so I think that I'm on to something here. M101 went behind a
tree so I had just a few possible targets, each was having it's
own issues, so I decided to just play around and test the guess
about slewing while guiding. I hopped around the sky for close to
a dozen targets. Some east some west, all over. No issues at all.
I started guiding, then did one slew and I have the issue. SF is
now stuck not finishing it's slew. This looks to be the problem.
So the Ekos/indi/phd2 stack is supposed to not do guiding while in
a slew, but it does anyway. That's one issue. But it sounds like
the Gemini software should be able to handle guide pulses while
slewing, and it seems that it doesn't, so that's the second issue.
From now on I'm just going to be careful to turn off guiding
before I do a slew.?
Jamie
|
OK, so I think that I'm on to something here. M101 went behind a tree so I had just a few possible targets, each was having it's own issues, so I decided to just play around and test the guess about slewing while guiding. I hopped around the sky for close to a dozen targets. Some east some west, all over. No issues at all. I started guiding, then did one slew and I have the issue. SF is now stuck not finishing it's slew. This looks to be the problem. So the Ekos/indi/phd2 stack is supposed to not do guiding while in a slew, but it does anyway. That's one issue. But it sounds like the Gemini software should be able to handle guide pulses while slewing, and it seems that it doesn't, so that's the second issue. From now on I'm just going to be careful to turn off guiding before I do a slew.?
Jamie
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You're right, quite the drift.?
So I'm out tonight and just got one of those wild slews. This time it happened during a plate solve, so it really seems like the same issue that the beta firmware fixes. I had forgotten to hit stop on phd2 so I wasn't able to test that. It's supposed to rain in a few days, I'll install the beta firmware then. Thanks for all the help by the way.?
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i'm not sure how we got from TCP and Indi discussion to this, but absolutely give it a try and love to hear the results
Seems like this may be the same issue as Magnus found in another post. I'm going to try the beta firmware as that seems to fix it.
-- Brian?
Brian Valente portfolio
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Seems like this may be the same issue as Magnus found in another post. I'm going to try the beta firmware as that seems to fix it.
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Jamie Amendolagine