Hi Chip,
This is indeed a new mount and I have been fighting this RA problem since day one. ?I've already called Scott and all he said was he's never heard of this problem before. ?Nuff said on that.
I'm getting these rapid spikes using PHD2 of 7" peak to peak that I can't figure out. ?Between those I get approx. 1.2". ?My DEC is always low in the .4 to .6 range.
Use Polemaster to align and PHD2 drift to fine tune.
As for messing with the mount, everything I've done has helped except for these rapid spikes. ?I'm thinking me cranking on that rear knob might be the issue as it smashes the needle bearing tight.
If I can't fix the darned thing I'll have to ship it to Scott which I'd like to avoid if at all possible. ?I did tell Scott I have 'messed' with it and he was unfazed about it.
-Rich-
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Hi Rich,
Is this a brand new mount? If this is a factory new G11G or a G11 that has been retrofitted by Scott at the Losmandy shop stop messing with it and call Losmandy describe the problem. Your mount is covered by warranty and they will correct any issues as long as they were not self induced.?
My own 15 year old G11 has been fully updated to G11G specs and works perfectly. Locks up tight for the Gemini 2-mini GOTOs and yet will slip easily when running the mount in PUSH-TO mode for visual observation. If your mount is still slipping with the clutches torqued down and you have some of Michael Herman's clutch discs you may have a mechanical problem. I have Michael's discs and they grip like crazy.?
Chip
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New G11G owner here. ?
I have noticed that if I tighten up my RA clutch all the way it puts a substantial drag on the worm gear. ?I found this out by pulling off the aluminum spur gear at the end of the worm gear and turning the worm using my finger. ?At full tension on the clutch it's pretty heavy to turn the worm.
Now, if I back off the clutch screw by a half turn the worm frees up BUT it just barely holds the RA axis.
I have been tightening it down all the way but have been fighting unruly RA when auto guiding. ?I'm thinking this might be the problem. ?Too much pressure on the needle bearing at the end of the RA shaft.
So what do you guys do? ?Back it off and hope nothing bumps the scope? ?That seems iffy especially when you have to move the counterweight to adjust east/west balance during an imaging session. ?I don't know if I could do it without disrupting my image target.
I have removed the shiny smooth plastic clutch disk and replaced it with some automotive casketing material and that has helped, but not enough.
Any and all help will be greatly appreciated.
-Rich-
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GM-11 general lubrication
Hello! I am the recent owner of a new ES/Losmandy G-11 (with PMC-Eight) and now I have become accustomed to the impressive engineering and manufacture, I have a question. I notice that the adjustment bolts (eg for ALT and for fixing mount to stand) are not lubricated and wonder whether it would be a good idea to lightly lubricate them to make them easier to undo and stop them seizing up. If members do this, what do you use? A light lithium grease comes to mind. If any of you is in central Europe (I live in Austria) and can recommend a brand, I should be grateful. Many thanks and best to all, David Pickett
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Re: G1 on G-11 refuses to go to bright stars
Hi!
It took a few more days than planned, due to windy weather, but tonight I thoroughly tested the setup again.
Here are some screenshots of the settings as seen on the HC:
It seems that I failed to take a picture of the longitude setting - it is E13 32 (not sure about the minutes right now though).
Same behavior as before. I could Go To Bright star Albireo, then Vega, Deneb, and synch with these (Additional alignment - Synchronize). Then going to Mizar (NorthWest of me) renders an Interrupted, GoToBright Star Polaris gives Interrupted. Interestingly enough Dubhe worked OK.
Then on the East side: Alpheratz was OK, but Mirfak gives Interrupted. M 31 worked, but M33 gets Interrupted. Aldebaran gives Interrupted but Castor works OK.
So it does not seem like a nothern sector that is Interrupted, at least not consistently.
Then I experienced that M33 got an interrupted, when closing in on the meridian. However, a few minuted later, it worked, being close to the meridian but not yet there.
Anything wrong with my settings? I guess the UTC + 2 is actually wrong, since we switched from summer time this weekend. But CET is corrrect.
I found out that with mount on east side pointing west, but very close to the safety limit, there is no meridian flip option on the HC. Should there not be one, even though it is east poiting west? Trying to go even further east from there renders an interrupt, not a meridian flip either.
Any idea? What should I try tomorrow?
Magnus
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Re: G1 on G-11 refuses to go to bright stars
At the risk of repeating myself, make sure you enter your coordinates only through the hand unit. It¡¯s really finicky about how that data is entered. If you aren¡¯t sure, reset the sites and start again ? ? ? Thanks ? Brian ? ? Brian Valente Brianvalentephotography.com ?
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From: Losmandy_users@... [mailto:Losmandy_users@...]
Sent: Friday, October 27, 2017 4:23 AM
To: Losmandy_users@...
Subject: Re: [Losmandy_users] Re: G1 on G-11 refuses to go to bright stars? ? Hi!
Well. In the evening, at 21.00 to 23.00 circa, when I've been doing this, Ursa Major is North of Polaris, but Andromeda is not - it's to my East. Both those areas were "no-goto".
I'll check the latitude again. Although I do not use ASCOM. But the same information is in my Ekos/Indi-software.
As for cold start: good, that was my understanding - it starts from scratch, resetting the model. Now: doing 1 star (for instance Albireo), alingning with that, then Goto another that is acceptable (for instance Deneb) places the scope very close to the second star. That would to me indicate that the model at that point in time is fairly accurate (after 1 point). Adding the second, then going to a third (for instance Vega) works nicely - again getting very close to the star and then aligning. THis would indicate to me that the model for the South and South-West is OK. I mean, on the correct altitude. So how then, can it "think" that Dubhe and Mizar are below the horizon? It "knows" the altitude of Deneb, Albireo, and Vega.....? Just trying to understand the model.
"It almost seems like the Gemini thinks your Latitude is too far near the equator...and perhaps Gemini thinks they are below your horizon.? My guess is that this could be the source of the trouble"
This makes very much sense. But: how can it belive both Ursa Major and Andromeda is below the horizon (not very close in the sky....)? I guess I would need to see if there is anything North of Ursa Major that I can slew to, to see if it is a coherent sector of the sky, or if it is 2 sectors (as have been my understanding up until now). This will be tested tonight.
My guess is that there is some setting that is off and maybe my thinking is terribly wrong somewhere, and when I find it, it will be obvious.
Best,
Magnus
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Re: G1 on G-11 refuses to go to bright stars
Hi!
Well. In the evening, at 21.00 to 23.00 circa, when I've been doing this, Ursa Major is North of Polaris, but Andromeda is not - it's to my East. Both those areas were "no-goto".
I'll check the latitude again. Although I do not use ASCOM. But the same information is in my Ekos/Indi-software.
As for cold start: good, that was my understanding - it starts from scratch, resetting the model. Now: doing 1 star (for instance Albireo), alingning with that, then Goto another that is acceptable (for instance Deneb) places the scope very close to the second star. That would to me indicate that the model at that point in time is fairly accurate (after 1 point). Adding the second, then going to a third (for instance Vega) works nicely - again getting very close to the star and then aligning. THis would indicate to me that the model for the South and South-West is OK. I mean, on the correct altitude. So how then, can it "think" that Dubhe and Mizar are below the horizon? It "knows" the altitude of Deneb, Albireo, and Vega.....? Just trying to understand the model.
"It almost seems like the Gemini thinks your Latitude is too far near the
equator...and perhaps Gemini thinks they are below your horizon.? My
guess is that this could be the source of the trouble"
This makes very much sense. But: how can it belive both Ursa Major and Andromeda is below the horizon (not very close in the sky....)? I guess I would need to see if there is anything North of Ursa Major that I can slew to, to see if it is a coherent sector of the sky, or if it is 2 sectors (as have been my understanding up until now). This will be tested tonight.
My guess is that there is some setting that is off and maybe my thinking is terribly wrong somewhere, and when I find it, it will be obvious.
Best,
Magnus
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Re: G1 on G-11 refuses to go to bright stars
Hi!
Yes, of course, you are right. When using HC and doing Go To Bright star, it is align, then additional align. The computer does sync. Sorry for this.
Magnus
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Re: G1 on G-11 refuses to go to bright stars
Hi!
Yes, return to CWD works well (at least no problem with it so far). And yes, 1.04 level 5 (I'm at work now so cannot triple check but that's what is use to say). I upgraded to level 5 some 2 years ago. Bought a new EEPROM from some reliable place that I cannot recall right now - that is, not home made.
But I cannot slew without motors attached, can I? It typically says "Motor stalls" when I've tried to do that.
Best,
Magnus
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Re: G1 on G-11 refuses to go to bright stars
Hi Magnus,
Just looking at a sky chart for a Sweden location...?
It seems strange that your "forbidden" locations are very far North of Polaris (which for you is very high in the sky).
All your stars that are South of Polaris seem that you can GoTo them OK, but those North of Polaris at that time of night at your location seem "forbidden."
It almost seems like the Gemini thinks your Latitude is too far near the equator...and perhaps Gemini thinks they are below your horizon.? My guess is that this could be the source of the trouble.
So try and look at your Location information and especially the Latitude and see if that has got the right information.
The Gemini.net "Setup - Configure Telescope" will show the Longitude and Latitude entries.? You can also send that data to the Gemini from that applet.??
You can also choose "Gemini expects J2000" instead of the default "Jnow".? There seems to be about a 15 minute difference between the two in RA, though this cannot be your trouble.
Paul is correct in that a "Synch" only resets the Tick counter, and it does not actually change the Pointing model. When you did a Cold boot, your model values were all reset to zero, and that still should be OK.? You must press more buttons on the hand controller to register an "Align" that actually results in new model parameter calculations.? (And... for Gemini to get its calculations correct, you want to do 3 Align on one side of the Meridian first, then do 3 on the other side of the Meridian.? )
All the best, and hope your mystery clears up...
Michael
On Fri, Oct 27, 2017 at 12:20 AM, brenatlilydale@... [Losmandy_users] <Losmandy_users@...> wrote:
?
Magnus
Thanks Magnus, so it'll return to CWD on command ok and not interrupt from one of these goto slew fails?? I'm guessing yes this is ok.?? If ok kinda tells me the servo system is ok.
Which is wired.? I'm going to have to stop drinking booze to get a clear head to think about all this....Haaaaa!? Sorry bad joke!
If it was a com's error with spurious HC commands happening then this would occur when trying to slew to park!
You still on EPROM 1.04 and haven't changed it?? If you have changed EPROM...its a possible EPROM data fail?? Don't know really clutching at straws.?? I kinda get the feeling this could be the issue but still wouldn't rule out HC/main PCB spurious commands occurring somewhere not necessarily in the HC.? But this appears to occur when commanding via RS232 as well, so, then we now go back to servo loop or EPROM!
Real odd issue....that I am not sure of.?
Does this occur if if you disconnect the motors from the axes and do some fake setup cold boots and slews to known stars available at that time?? Yes I know you have no idea if the system actually completed the correct goto but I'm looking for "interrupted" occurrences.
regards and get back
Brendan
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Re: G1 on G-11 refuses to go to bright stars
Magnus,
I think there is some confusion in your statements.
Synching does not add to the model, only aligning does that.
Synching just says to the software that I am here.
Regards
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Hi all!
Thanks for all suggestions on this issue! I've now tried a lot, but unfortunately, the problem is still there.?
I measure the voltage from the battery: 3.09 V.?
I checked and checked and triple checked lat and long - correct. So is UTC time.?
I set the safety limits, first to default, then to how I'd like them. Checked and checked.?
And it is still there. Very systematically (which leads me to think not HC issue). Yesterday night, I did a cold start, Go To Bright star to Albireo and sync (first point in model). Then I tried Go To Bright Star Dubhe - and get Interrrupted. I tries Deneb - works OK! Sync - second point in model. Tried Dubhe - Interrupted. Tried Mirfak (which means a meridian flip) - Interrupted. Tried Vega - OK! Sync - third point.?
Then I used the HC to manually slew to Mizar in Ursa Major, did a sync there, and then tried Go To Bright Star Dubhe again. Interrupted.?
Then (only then) did I attach the RS232 cable and the computer. That is, shut the mount down and did a warm restart. I tried slewing with the computer (not ASCOM, but Ekos/Indi). And i works with the same stars, but refuses to slew to anything in Andromeda or Perseus. When using the computer to slew to Perseus, the HC reports Interrupted, and the computer says "Slew complete" (well...).?
I was going to image M33. So I used the HC to manually slew to somewhere around M33 (I could not use HC nor computer to GoTo M33). Then I used the computer to plate solve and "sync". I am not sure how that sync interacts with the point model in Losmandy though. Now I used the computer to slew to M33 - and it worked!! And I could plate solve and have it adjust postion to center om M33.?
So: first nothing in Andromeda is allowed for a GoTo. But after having the computer (Ekos/indi) plate solve very close to my intended target, it worked.?
It feels to me like there is something wrong with th e point model. But if I cold start, do I not build it from scratch? Could there be someting corrupting the point model, that I am not aware of?
Or is my G1 more severely ill.....?
Big problem with this, is that I cannot trust the scope to work automatically. That is, I'd like to use a scheduler and have it start in the middle of the night and image until dawn, for instance with M33. As it is now, I need to manually manipualte it to be able to reach the intended target. So it is a practical problem.?
Magnus
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Re: G1 on G-11 refuses to go to bright stars
Magnus Thanks Magnus, so it'll return to CWD on command ok and not interrupt from one of these goto slew fails?? I'm guessing yes this is ok.?? If ok kinda tells me the servo system is ok. Which is wired.? I'm going to have to stop drinking booze to get a clear head to think about all this....Haaaaa!? Sorry bad joke! If it was a com's error with spurious HC commands happening then this would occur when trying to slew to park! You still on EPROM 1.04 and haven't changed it?? If you have changed EPROM...its a possible EPROM data fail?? Don't know really clutching at straws.?? I kinda get the feeling this could be the issue but still wouldn't rule out HC/main PCB spurious commands occurring somewhere not necessarily in the HC.? But this appears to occur when commanding via RS232 as well, so, then we now go back to servo loop or EPROM! Real odd issue....that I am not sure of.? Does this occur if if you disconnect the motors from the axes and do some fake setup cold boots and slews to known stars available at that time?? Yes I know you have no idea if the system actually completed the correct goto but I'm looking for "interrupted" occurrences. regards and get back Brendan
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Re: G1 on G-11 refuses to go to bright stars
Magnus Thanks Magnus, so it'll return to CWD on command ok and not interrupt from one of these goto slew fails?? I'm guessing yes this is ok.?? If ok kinda tells me the servo system is ok. Which is wired.? I'm going to have to stop drinking booze to get a clear head to think about all this....Haaaaa!? Sorry bad joke! If it was a com's error with spurious HC commands happening then this would occur when trying to slew to park! You still on EPROM 1.04 and haven't changed it?? If you have changed EPROM...its a possible EPROM data fail?? Don't know really clutching at straws.?? I kinda get the feeling this could be the issue but still wouldn't rule out HC/main PCB spurious commands occurring somewhere not necessarily in the HC.? But this appears to occur when commanding via RS232 as well, so, then we now go back to servo loop or EPROM! Real odd issue....that I am not sure of.? Does this occur if if you disconnect the motors from the axes and do some fake setup cold boots and slews to known stars available at that time?? Yes I know you have no idea if the system actually completed the correct goto but I'm looking for "interrupted" occurrences. regards and get back Brendan
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Re: G1 on G-11 refuses to go to bright stars
Hi!
Yes, one motor was exchanged for a new, the other repaired, later also exchanged for a new.
And yes, it is that Doc Goerlich page I use to have the UTC, and I enter it exactly as displayed (at least that's what it looks like).
Best,
Magnus
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Re: G1 on G-11 refuses to go to bright stars
Magnus
I'm looking back thru threads trying to get a handle on this.? Previous you had motor issues but these have been resolved.? So atm I just want to confirm you have put in DTG as per Gemini fashion:
Gemini UTC display (yymm.dd: hh.mm.ss):
see link right at the bottom of Rene's site .
Also check you are or are not using daylight savings time and have gained or lost an hr.
Brendan
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Re: G1 on G-11 refuses to go to bright stars
Hi all!
Thanks for all suggestions on this issue! I've now tried a lot, but unfortunately, the problem is still there.
I measure the voltage from the battery: 3.09 V.
I checked and checked and triple checked lat and long - correct. So is UTC time.
I set the safety limits, first to default, then to how I'd like them. Checked and checked.
And it is still there. Very systematically (which leads me to think not HC issue). Yesterday night, I did a cold start, Go To Bright star to Albireo and sync (first point in model). Then I tried Go To Bright Star Dubhe - and get Interrrupted. I tries Deneb - works OK! Sync - second point in model. Tried Dubhe - Interrupted. Tried Mirfak (which means a meridian flip) - Interrupted. Tried Vega - OK! Sync - third point.
Then I used the HC to manually slew to Mizar in Ursa Major, did a sync there, and then tried Go To Bright Star Dubhe again. Interrupted.
Then (only then) did I attach the RS232 cable and the computer. That is, shut the mount down and did a warm restart. I tried slewing with the computer (not ASCOM, but Ekos/Indi). And i works with the same stars, but refuses to slew to anything in Andromeda or Perseus. When using the computer to slew to Perseus, the HC reports Interrupted, and the computer says "Slew complete" (well...).
I was going to image M33. So I used the HC to manually slew to somewhere around M33 (I could not use HC nor computer to GoTo M33). Then I used the computer to plate solve and "sync". I am not sure how that sync interacts with the point model in Losmandy though. Now I used the computer to slew to M33 - and it worked!! And I could plate solve and have it adjust postion to center om M33.
So: first nothing in Andromeda is allowed for a GoTo. But after having the computer (Ekos/indi) plate solve very close to my intended target, it worked.
It feels to me like there is something wrong with the point model. But if I cold start, do I not build it from scratch? Could there be someting corrupting the point model, that I am not aware of?
Or is my G1 more severely ill.....?
Big problem with this, is that I cannot trust the scope to work automatically. That is, I'd like to use a scheduler and have it start in the middle of the night and image until dawn, for instance with M33. As it is now, I need to manually manipualte it to be able to reach the intended target. So it is a practical problem.
Magnus
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Re: "Speed" to use when building a model
Somewhere in the Gemini1 manual it says something like...:
Align to 3 stars on one side (only) of the meridian? (go West of meridian and align to 3 stars).
Then, after those 3 on one side, align to 3 stars on the other side (say East of meridian).
Give that method a try and see if your pointing gets better.
Also be aware of the difference between the words "Align" and "Synch."? A "Synch" only adjusts the offsets of RA and DEC, but does not change the Model parameter values.? "Align" does not change the RA or DEC offsets, but instead adds new calculated Model parameter values.
On a cold boot, all Model parameters are 0.? After your first star Align/Synch, the values are still 0...only the offsets are adjusted.? Each "Align" after that Gemini actually does calculations of the Model.? You can watch the model values change after each step, if you use the Gemini.net applet for example.
I don't have the software source code, but the data fitting algorithm method must be why the 1st 3 "Align" stars must be on the same side of the Meridian....so the calculations come out right.
Other mounts do not have this requirement, or use triangulation rather than a sophisticated sky model.??
Anyway...see what your tests show.
Best, Michael?
On Oct 24, 2017 11:18 AM, " bill.krosney@... [Losmandy_users]" < Losmandy_users@...> wrote:
?
Thanks,?
This probably should be posted over in the Gemini-II forum.? So, just shut this down and I'll re-post over there.
Sorry....
... Bill
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Re: "Speed" to use when building a model
Thanks,?
This probably should be posted over in the Gemini-II forum.? So, just shut this down and I'll re-post over there.
Sorry....
... Bill
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Re: "Speed" to use when building a model
Bill
the speed has nothing to do with building the model. you just need to accurately center the goto target. it's tricky to do with slew or move, but it can be done. the more accurately centered, the better your model
it's just easier to just center, it's a slower speed. that's the only difference
B
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"Speed" to use when building a model
Took my relatively new GM811 out and tried my first attempts at building a model and doing GOTO's.
Have used the mount in the past, but never played with the GOTO capability or building a model.? All did not go well.
Had some issues, GOTO's were always out by a few degrees.? Familiar with GEM mounts, polar alignment and such, just new to GOTO's.? All the initial parameters; lat, long, time offset, date and time were all entered correctly.? And my CWD was set initially as best as I good visually set it.? A Polemaster was available, so we even used that for Polar alignment.
But, yes,?did not fully work my way through the Gemini-2.com website beforehand.
In hindsight, and working through the website, I found this comment ...
WARNING: ONLY USE THE CENTER OR GUIDE SPEED TO CENTER THE STAR. USING SLEWING SPEED WILL TAKE YOU OUT OF THE MODELING FUNCTION AND RETURN YOU TO NORMAL GOTO MODE.
To center the star to model I would use the "MOVE"? speed.? The comment above is explicit about NOT using SLEW because it takes you out of the modeling function, and explicitly says to use CENTER or GUIDE.? But what about "MOVE".? Would using "MOVE" not allow me to build a model?
Could this of been a source of my trouble?
Also to center a star, didn't use a cross-hair or anything like that, just did a visual "close enough to the center of the field of view" at about 80x magnification.? When you have to "center the star" how close is close enough?
Thanks in advance...
... Bill
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Michael Herman
Bill Krosney