Hi Tigo
Trop me a private mail (need your email address). I send you the drawings from the Pelican anti-vortex panels.?
I will also give you the position where you have to mount the panels
Cheers
Bernd
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Hi Bernd. This sounds a good solution. Where the wings would you be placed in the kd1000? I'm not happy with the centerboard case.? It is only 10 cm from the water. It will offen be hit by the waves...
Hi Claudo
The anti-vortex panels work like winglets on an aircraft.
I explain it in this report?
Cheers
Bernd
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Hi Bernard and crew, Ive recently purchased Wharram Tiki 38 in place of building a KD at this stage .
This vessel will be pulled from the water next year for a full refit at which time i was hoping to fit Anti vortex panels.
The WLL is 9.6m so about the same as your P95 or KD90.
The part I'm having trouble is working out center of effort of the sail area(see attached sail plan).
Where would you place them if it were your boat?
I'm considering only fitting one to start with, my theory is that i can test it by sailing to windward and seeing how close i can get on opposite tacks in the same conditions, does this sound correct?
Thank-you for your thoughts
Guy Ellery
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Re: A couple of questions about calculating building costs
G'day.? Dave from Gold Coast, Australia. We want build a KD860.? I know how you feel. After hearing about really bad ply coming in from Asia an stamped BS 1088 I was worried. I bought a cheap sheet last week that was a light weight? hardwood, to test. The sheet looked beautiful.? Plume veneers It failed. I cut about 6 100 mmx100mm squares and inspected. There was voids within the ply of up to 5 mm. Very disappointing.? I then boiled it in a pressure cooker for an hour it test the glue which held up fine. I have found a local business that sell boat quality timbers. And will I will by a sheet to test from them. They have a product called pink ply. A meranti ply( Philippine Mahogany, Pacific Maple etc). That priced up not to bad and is reasonably light in weight.
.
Good luck with you search
Dave Fahy
Hi everybody,
It's Paul from New Zealand and I'm new here (forum)
I've got the study plans for the 520 and would like to calculate the costs.
From distributors in Napier?I cannot find BS 1088 marine plywood so I turn to David (or any Kiwi on the forum) to find out where he bought his .
I wonder if it's not easier to build in foam core precisely because of the availability of materials.??I know very well that for an amateur, plywood is easier.
Regards
Paul
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Re: A couple of questions about calculating building costs
Hi Paul
I got my ply from BBS Timbers in Henderson, Auckland, fairly near to where I live. Good luck with your build, i will be watching, cheers Bryan
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Re: A couple of questions about calculating building costs
Hi Paul, David here. I purchased from BBS Timbers in Auckland who have a number of branches around the country, and there are other suppliers at least in the Auckland area. You may need to buy in bulk and get the ply shipped to Napier. I used Gaboon which is the best plywood to use, but you could also use Meranti which is less expensive but a bit heavier. I would not even think of building in anything other than plywood, it is tbe most practical material. Costing wise, my Eco 6 was in tbe water for about $14k and I used tbe best of everything. Cheers,? David
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Hi Claudo
The anti-vortex panels work like winglets on an aircraft.
I explain it in this report?
Cheers
Bernd
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Re: A couple of questions about calculating building costs
Hi everybody,
It's Paul from New Zealand and I'm new here (forum)
I've got the study plans for the 520 and would like to calculate the costs.
From distributors in Napier?I cannot find BS 1088 marine plywood so I turn to David (or any Kiwi on the forum) to find out where he bought his .
I wonder if it's not easier to build in foam core precisely because of the availability of materials.??I know very well that for an amateur, plywood is easier.
Regards
Paul
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Hi Milko!
I know you were asking Bernd, but I can tell you that I heard he used the Top-Reff furler. Even if you don¡¯t use that one, you can see how it works. There is a furler and a top swivel. The top swivel is attached to the mast. ?The forestay wire rotates with the sail. The sail has a large luff sleeve closed with a zipper. You could also close the sleeve with grommets and a lashing. In order for it to work well with no foil extrusion, the sail must be cut very shallow. The depth should be only about 4 per cent of the chord.?
There is a more modern version I have seen from Colligo Marine called the ELHF structural furler. They show that you can use soft shackles to attach the luff to the forestay. They call it an in/out sail. Many people don¡¯t realize that making the headsail very shallow allows it to be partially furled without an extrusion.
Cheers
Patrick
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Hello Bernd
I'm currently studying the plans for my KD860 to choose a good and faster way to build it.
If it's not inopportune, I would like to ask a question.
Just to increase my knowledge about a design , what is antivortex for? What is its function for navigation and stability?
Thanks
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----- Mensagem encaminhada -----
De: Milko Lazaneo <espacoitagua@...> Para: k-designs@... <k-designs@...> Enviado: sexta-feira, 12 de novembro de 2021 22:22:18 BRT Assunto: Sails.
Hello Bernd! I'm having the sails made for my kd 860 and would like to know how the forehead of these sails should be so that they can be rolled up without the use of aluminum profiles. Thank you Milko!
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Re: A couple of questions about calculating building costs
Hi Ivan
I like your way to calculate the approximate material costs, thanks.?
Building time is more difficult. Again, use it for comparing.?
Most important, buy the best jigsaw and sander you can afford?
These two can make the biggest difference in the construction time.
Many builders in speed, newcomers would have CNC machine parts cut. Special for the bulkheads.
But this is just the easy part. Lofting for U-section hulls is a bit difficult, but surely not for
chine hulls like all my designs. No difference in the trapezoidal, asymmetric, or multi-chine designs.
Before you have transported your plywood to the CNC shop and collected the cut pieces you have loft and cut out (for example) your bulkheads.
Not talking about the costs you safe when you do it bt yourself
More important is to use the right tools. A very good quality jigsaw and a very good sander. Best a slow-turning, big radius sander.
It is not funny and time-consuming when the Epoxy gets thermoplastic again clocked sanding paper.?
Bernd?
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Re: A couple of questions about calculating building costs
Hello Bernd,
Hope you are well. When I read your reply about the three cm I must admit to facepalming myself for having missed that haha. I really love the notion of green epoxy and will definitely be looking that up! Also thanks for the tip Ivan about build costs (I was shocked how close it was to my painstakingly slow totting up I'd done), it certainly helps in sizing things up.
Jack, that is such a lovely offer! If you're willing I would most gratefully like to take you up on that offer. Your insights would be really helpful. Same goes to you Pepijn (I'd missed that in the first read through sorry). It is ever so touching to see how welcoming you all are. Thanks guys.
all the best,
Zachary.?
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Re: A couple of questions about calculating building costs
Hi Philip
As always very good remarks
Thank's for the reminder to work carefully with Epoxy. But Sicomin in France sells now tox-free and Green epoxy. This is no advertisement, I get nothing out of it by the way.
I can subscribe to all your remarks.
The 3 cm remark from me, I made out of fun with a through. 40,66666667 multiplied by 3 cm means 1 plywood panel more
Cheers
Bernd
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Re: A couple of questions about calculating building costs
Hi Zachary,
Be informed that I'm building the ECO 75 ( in extended version) in the Netherlands.
I'm living in Prinsenbeek, Noord-Brabant, if want to have a look at the build, contact me.
Groeten,? Jack
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Can the seagull use outboard motors in place of the inboard motors ,also can it be made longer ?
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Re: A couple of questions about calculating building costs
Hi Zachary. A rough and ready way to compare cost and construction time between two boats with similar materials is to way to take the weight in kg and multiply it by say 10Eu per kg. i.e. for cost the houseboat will cost say 450kg X 10 = 4500 eu and the cat will cost say 750kg X10eu= 7500eu. add 20% for motor for the houseboat an 40% for rig and sails for the cat. For building time the cat will take 750/450 = 1.66 times longer than the houseboat to build.
The Duo900 cat won't really be suitable for long term living. If you want to sail I would look at the Eco 7.5 which is more suited for long term living (although not ideal) and would cost a similar amount to build but would be a bit slower to sail..
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Re: A couple of questions about calculating building costs
Hello everyone!
I'm really touched that you all took the time and effort to respond and chip in with useful insights, tips, links etc.
Bernd suggested the eco 7.5 and the more I look at it the more in love I fall with it. From the side it kind of reminds me of the fancy speedboat/yachts I used to see in Italy on holidays as a child, and from the front it looks like it's coming for you. Yet inside it has just the accommodations I was looking for, plus the load capacity is almost exactly what I was hoping for as a (semi-) liveaboard. My local geography consists of three decent sized lakes and the famed IJsselmeer connected by not too huge waterways (eyeballed at about 15 meters ish wide). After looking at the study plans for the eco 7.5 it looks like it will just fit the bill in really getting the most out of the lakes and being able to ferry along the waterways between them quite nicely. Plus, with a boat that quick and seaworthy, a lot of distance could be covered when I have more time during the holidays.
I live in the heart of tulip country so will see if I know anyone who knows anyone with a corner in their barn that I could use (thanks for the tip Philip). Thanks Mick and Jack for the links, they definitely helped. The advice about the build location being as close to home as possible was something I'd not taken so seriously but on further thought I can totally see the point and will be making sure I find somewhere close by (or move house to a disused farm ?). With regards the time and cost to build I think I just have to admit that it will take as long as it takes and keep committing time, money and effort while enjoying the process (the whole reason I want to build is because I love the way long physical projects come together piece by piece and at the end of every day you can point to something and say "I did that". When the whole this is done you can see every hour of toil you poured into it to the point where it almost feels like an extension of you.... at least I'm assuming boatbuilding is the same).
Toolwise I'm looking forward to investing in a high powered staple gun (for the plastic staples), and an electric planer. Anyone got any recommendations?
anyway, after keeping it short once more ( I bet I'm singlehandedly making the moderators consider a 140 character limit ?... sorry about that), thanks once again for all the input and encouragement. It is most appreciated.
All the best,
Zachary.
ps: Bryan you're a bad influence... I LIKE IT ??
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Re: A couple of questions about calculating building costs
In my part of the world fused or fumed silica is usualy sold as cabosil. You can also use microfibre for a glue additive which is stronger and does not have the health risk of a silica product. Generaly most light weight filleting additives have some cabosil in it to reduce slump or sag.? Cheers.......Andrew.
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Re: A couple of questions about calculating building costs
From: [email protected] < [email protected]> On Behalf Of info@... Sent: Monday, November 8, 2021 6:29 AM To: [email protected]Subject: Re: [K-Designs-Multihull-Sailboats] A couple of questions about calculating building costs ? Welcome on board, Zachary,
1. my planset and studyplan (both February 2017) are stating 2.50 m * 1.22 m so it schould be possible. But better ask Bernd, maybe he has changed it since. (I used 3.10 m * 1.53 m because my supplier was offering only this format.)
2. Same here. I used a table saw do cut the battens I bought to the right dimensions. You won't find every piece of wood you need for this build in proper dimensions from the shelf of your supplier.
3. I'm not a dutch speaker, but the dutch Wikipedia is calling it "Niet-kristallijne (amorfe) siliciumdioxide"?
4. I'm building my boat (Eco 62) in a large tent (8 m * 4 m) in my garden. Not easy but possible.
I have no intention to discourage you, just saying it will cost more and last longer than you think before.
Regards, G¨¹nter
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Bernd Kohler
bryanandmarycox
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