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Re: Problems Posting To Yahoo
On 4/15/2018 4:29 AM, John Ellard johnellard1@... [jazz_guitar] wrote:
Apparently, the posting problem on Yahoo is happening when the emails originate from non-Yahoo email addresses.Actually, When I re-signed in, Yahoo said it was because I was on a different computer. I wasn't... best, Bobby |
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Re: Problems Posting To Yahoo
Got it, Juan.
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Apparently, the posting problem on Yahoo is happening when the emails originate from non-Yahoo email addresses. Thanks a lot for screwing up Yahoo, Verizon.
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Re: There Will Never Be Another You
¿ªÔÆÌåÓýOn 4/14/2018 11:09 PM, 'J. Vega'
JVegaTrio@... [jazz_guitar] wrote:
"This ain't an easy tune" if you try to think/play it the way you suggested below, that's fo' sho'. Try this instead: &c. Your answer is solid, as was Ming's. We tend to get into discussions about scales and key centers, &c in depth, and that is, of course, very important to the understanding of music. But it's rarely what a player is thinking when he is improvising - it can be too cumbersome. We learn that to internalize it, and to be able to draw upon it. Usually, he is thinking about the chords, the melody, and the form, and usually he is using ideas he's gotten down after a long period of years and experience to push into new territory (on a good night). He usually finds remembering the lyrics far more useful than the scales involved. One has to study great solos by great soloists. Yes, understanding the scales and key centers is an invaluable help in that endeavor, but it does not replace hours spent poring over solos until you can actually play and HEAR them for what they are. Improvising is the process of putting it all together, and on-the-fly. Playing is a hands-on sport. Most students today simply do not practice, play, jam, and listen enough. They simply don't live music, but, rather, squeeze it in when they are not too busy with something else. They are more interested in the 'understanding' than they are the real work it takes to actually perform. I say 'most' because this was pretty much always the case. Those rare ones who actually love music in their very core and? 'shed'? to rise to the challenge are always exactly that - rare. Just my 2-cents, Bobby |
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Re: Problems Posting To Yahoo
¿ªÔÆÌåÓýOn 4/14/2018 11:01 PM, 'J. Vega'
JVegaTrio@... [jazz_guitar] wrote:
My posts haven't been appearing as well... I got it, Juan best, Bobby |
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Re: There Will Never Be Another You
Folks,
This is a post I sent that got lost. I think it's worth a look, and fwiw: if you insist, a C minor scale will work for this whole song. It's a huge mistake to try to reduce a song to chord/scale relationships; music doesn't work that way, as I hear it. Cheers. Here goes:
OK, against my better judgment:
"This ain't an easy tune" if you try to think/play it the way you suggested below, that's fo' sho'. Try this instead:
1. Set up a backing track (BIAB, whatever works, at a comfortable tempo).
2. Play eighth-note ( 1& 2& 3& 4&) Gs (either 1st string 3rd fret or 2nd string 8th fret) over the whole form of the song. There, you've "soloed" over this song, and never once had to think about scales/modes/etc. For the most part the note "G" works for every set of changes in this tune (for reasons I won't get into here); some sound hipper than others, but it's all good. Not a Mixolydian in sight, lol.
Remember, the chord changes serve the melody, and not the other way around; most people are too tied up in knots to keep that in mind. (The note "C" also works quite well with this approach; try it. Eb is also a possibility.) As a logical outgrowth of this approach try adding notes as you hear them as you practice soloing and pretty soon you'll be sounding way more "organic" and "natural" than you would trying the other stuff.
Listen to how the same note sounds over different chords & you'll start to widen and increase your sonic vocabulary. That's historically how jazz was developed; ("jazz education" has only been around since the '60s, fyi) and is still the best way (in my opinion) to develop and approach improv. Improvisation is a "language" and oftentimes what's in the "book" isn't very similar to what's on the "street" or in the "real world".
Now, would you solo this way? Perhaps not, but if you wanted to you could; if you changed up your rhythmic choices a bit and laid out in some spots, nobody'd kick you off the stand. (BTW, not taking the rhythmic aspect(s) of jazz improvisation into account is one of the biggest weaknesses of the chord/mode/scale approach.)
And fwiw, there's no "bridge" in this song; its an "A" "A1" form with each being 16 bars long; the last 4 bars of the A1 section are different (in order to end the song).
Not trying to be a smart-ass or anything, just saying this stuff isn't "rocket science" and to really learn it's a way better use of one's time to listen and transcribe than it is to "dissect". YMMV and that's ok too but I'm a big believer in not making things harder than they are...
Cheers,
JV
Juan Vega
In a message dated 4/4/2018 1:05:47 PM Pacific Standard Time,?jazz_guitar@...?writes:
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Re: Problems Posting To Yahoo
Got it, Bobby. Welcome back here.
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Re: There Will Never Be Another You
Ralph Patt used to hang out here sometimes. His Vanilla Changes are loved by some and leave others indifferent.? I like the concept of reducing music to its skeletal outline in time. We have to memorize lots of music. No Real Books on the stand if you want to be taken seriously.....I believe if i had to think of a new scale for every chord of a song I would know fewer tunes. That feels like energy wasted to me. Just my take on things. jim |
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Re: There Will Never Be Another You
Hey, y'all,? ? In regard to 3rd's and 7th's: What happens when a dominant 7th chord resolves to a tonic? G7 --- C? The 7th of G7, F, wants to resolve to the third of C, E and the 3rd, B wants to go to C. What happens often enough when one is playing scales is that the notes may be "correct" but the context off. For example nailing a big C note on the G7. Or playing a long F over the C chord. Hear what i mean? Those are good notes in the key but not so good in context. Of course, we need scales. Or we might drown... ;-) but chord tones keep the boat afloat. What we need to do is Harmonize the various scales and follow where they lead. Jim |
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Re: There Will Never Be Another You
¿ªÔÆÌåÓýAccording the Real Book, Version 5, Pocket Changes Volume 1 and my teacher, the tune is in Bb. Sent from my T-Mobile 4G LTE Device -------- Original message -------- From: "william_v_nicholson@... [jazz_guitar]" Date:04/05/2018 12:01 PM (GMT-08:00) To: jazz_guitar@... Subject: Re: [jazz_guitar] There will never be another you ? I'm curious what version of the changes you have for There Will Never Be Another You and what key you play the tune in, Larry?? Your suggested scales seem an idiosyncratic choice for the chord changes as they appear in my copy of the Real Book 1 (which is the "C edition" and has the tune in Eb major) - at least according to my amateur knowledge of jazz/ music theory, William
---In jazz_guitar@..., <llethrift@...> wrote : Arv: Try this:? Measure 1=BbMajor, M2=Eb Mixolydian, M3=C dim, M4=G Mixolydian, M 5&6=C Mixolydian, M 7&8= C Dorian, M9= C Mixolydian, M10= C Dorian, M11=C dim, M12= G Mixolydian, M12= C Mixolydian, M14= C Dorian, M15&16= Bb Major. Bridge:? M17= C dorian, M18= G Dorian, M19= C Dorian, M20= G dorian, M21= C Dorian, M22= G Dorian, M23= C Mixolydian, M24= F Mixolydian Measures 25-32 are a repeat of measures 9 - 13. Hope this helps.? This ain't an easy tune Larry
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Re: There Will Never Be Another You
I'm curious what version of the changes you have for There Will Never Be Another You and what key you play the tune in, Larry?? Your suggested scales seem an idiosyncratic choice for the chord changes as they appear in my copy of the Real Book 1 (which is the "C edition" and has the tune in Eb major) - at least according to my amateur knowledge of jazz/ music theory,
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William ---In jazz_guitar@..., <llethrift@...> wrote : Arv: Try this:? Measure 1=BbMajor, M2=Eb Mixolydian, M3=C dim, M4=G Mixolydian, M 5&6=C Mixolydian, M 7&8= C Dorian, M9= C Mixolydian, M10= C Dorian, M11=C dim, M12= G Mixolydian, M12= C Mixolydian, M14= C Dorian, M15&16= Bb Major. Bridge:? M17= C dorian, M18= G Dorian, M19= C Dorian, M20= G dorian, M21= C Dorian, M22= G Dorian, M23= C Mixolydian, M24= F Mixolydian Measures 25-32 are a repeat of measures 9 - 13. Hope this helps.? This ain't an easy tune Larry
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Re: There Will Never Be Another You
¿ªÔÆÌåÓýBTW Jim,I agree with you. Dave sometimes makes my head spin with these changes. It is however, a great learning exercise. One thing I loved about Chet Atkins was that you could always hear the melody.? Sent from my T-Mobile 4G LTE Device -------- Original message -------- From: "Jim MIngs jmings2003@... [jazz_guitar]" Date:04/05/2018 7:53 AM (GMT-08:00) To: jazz_guitar@... Subject: [jazz_guitar] Re: There will never be another you ? Hey Larry, I would fall out with all this to think about. The traditional method of running the changes allows for more stylish results than parsing every chord for righteous scales. Just follow the 3rd's and 7th's and they will take you to solid melodies. Play on. jim |
james mings
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