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In a message dated 1/3/2011 3:42:02 P.M. Central Standard Time, bobbybmusic@... writes:

On 1/3/2011 10:27 AM, Jon Lori wrote:

One thing he did do was give the chords that he feels a jazz pianist would/should play

to many songs, in particular standards that have become part of the jazz repertoire.

That is what comes to my memory. It's been so long that I hesitate to comment, but I will say this. The number one complaint that pianists have always voiced about guitarists is that they play different ("wrong") changes. A classic example of this is the progression E-7 - A7 - D-7 - G7 - C. To do it with a descending bass line, a typical pianist would play E-7 - Eb7 - D-7 - Db7 - C (which is correct), while a typical guitarist would play E-7 - Eb-7 - D-7 - Db7 - C (which lays on the fingers easier). While this example is crude, it serves (imo) to show that guitarists should at least spend some time exploring a pianist's approach. I THINK that that's what he was offering which was most beneficial to guitarists (who were not the target of his books), but, as I said, it's been a long, long time.

Perhaps someone else with a fresher memory regarding them could comment on them in a much more meaningful way. When I can get around to it, I'll give them another look myself, although I also remember finding them to be of limited usefulness, even to pianists.

best,
Bobby

Hi Brian,

The irony in this is that it’s the communists who are taking the artist money, supporting the trade union and condemning the Jews.

I'm not sure exactly what it is that you mean by this. It seems to me that everybody has something to say about the Socialists and the Communists, but nobody (including the Communists and Socialists) can agree on exactly what they are. The terms are referents with no real meaning. By strict Marxist definition, even Russia and China were not truly Communist, but, rather, just thieves at the top of the pyramid robbing those at the base.

Anyway, there is an excellent book I'd recommend on the topic called, "Tyranny of Words". I'm pretty sure it's still in print, but even if it's out of print, there are plenty of copies to be found in used book stores, garage sales, and libraries. It directly challenges throwing around words without meaning to provoke an emotional spark, and thereby "win" a pointless argument. "Talk Radio" uses this tactic every day, and people lick it up like ambrosia from the gods.

I'm neither Communist nor Socialist (by whatever definition it is that I espouse...), but I do recognize the need for certain government services which just don't work well in the private sector. For example, Public Education, City garbage pick-up and removal, Police, Prisons (the privatization of the prison system has proven to be a disaster), the Military, &c., basic needs for a society. I also see the need for the Social Security administration, Medicare, and Medicaid because of the conditions of society as they have existed since the time of the Industrial Revolution.

That said, you are right. The Trade Unions are no innocents here, either. For example, the deliberate work slowdown of the Union NYC Dept. of Transportation (I think that that's who it was) during the last blizzard in NYC was criminal. How does one draw a line, though, when both sides of the argument are crooks.

My point is that no one is innocent here - not the Capitalists, the Communists, the Socialists, the Trade Unions, the Christians, the Muslims, nor the Jews. Not the blacks, the whites, the yellows, nor the reds. Especially not Goldman-Sachs, who are so greedy, crooked, and powerful as to belong in a category of crookedness all to themselves. And we certainly haven't heard much from BP lately about how that oil clean-up in the Gulf is going. Everyone is out for themselves, and our business schools teach fundamentally that the driving force behind any successful business is and should always remain to be that of all obsessive greed.

What's going on in the music business is absolute copyright infringement and thievery by plain ol' fashioned Capitalists. Those who feel that they are entitled to the fruits of their labors, while they should be able to steal the intellectual properties of others (including music) in the name of "free speech" (not the "free" the founding fathers had in mind) never-ever offer to work for free themselves, and so they are most certainly NOT Communists, by any definition.

As I warned in this Subject Header, this reply is long and off-topic, for which I apologize. As well as it being long, it's an issue which we've beaten to death here. I only replied as a personal respect to Brian, whose posts are always worthy of replies.

best,
Bobby

Among other things, Mehegan wrote a four volume set on Jazz Improvisation.

I have this set. A buddy of mine used to be his gardener and he studied

with Mehegan for a while. He met Miles Davis through him.

The books are targeted at piano, but of course in a general sense they are useful in terms of theory.



He talks about major, minor, dominant, half-diminished and diminished chord families

and their inversions. Big on things like scale tone sevenths. Went through inversions

and cycles.



One thing he did do was give the chords that he feels a jazz pianist would/should play

to many songs, in particular standards that have become part of the jazz repertoire.

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On 1/3/2011 3:57 AM, BluesRenegade wrote:

Great quote, Bob!

Thanks. We haven't heard from Angelo since pretty much around the time I posted that. I hope my argument with him didn't chase him away (he claimed to have a pretty thick skin). I fall into the category of those musicians who are not directly losing royalties, but who feel the pain of those who are, and who are hit by the "pin action" of the whole situation. I'm sure that, in spite of my rant at the time, John Hall is sleeping just fine, and hasn't missed any meals lately.

Anyway I hope Angelo is doing well.

best,
Bobby

Take That (who I loath,) have reported album sales of 1.8m of their
latest CD.

It really does seem to me that if a label manages to tap into
public popularity CD sales do very well. Piracy or not.

Will

Bonne anne 2011 vous tous et longue vie "jazz_guitar"!
(Sorry Guys but French is the language of passion par excellence...)

Marc

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Myspace Mulls Significant Layoffs, With Potential Sale Looming
by Liz Gannes
Posted on December 31, 2010 at 1:34 AM PT


Myspace–the long-troubled social networking site turned social entertainment hub–is in the midst of planning that could soon result in significant layoffs of its staff, according to multiple sources familiar with the situation.

That number could be as much as 50 percent of the 1,100 employees at Myspace, largely based in the U.S., but also in international locations.

While the decision of what cuts to make to its employee base have not been made yet, nearly the entire Myspace staff was given the last week of December off from work to save money. Update: Myspace tells us via email the week off was an employee perk, not a cost-cutting measure.

Sources stressed that management was still working out the details of more drastic cost-cutting measures that owner News Corp. has been wanting from Myspace, as its revenues and traffic have declined.

On 11/02/2010 02:24 PM, Bob Hansmann wrote:

On 11/2/2010 1:07 PM, Angelo wrote:

I seriously wonder how many here who are defending the record
companies vs.
the internet have lost great fortunes (or even .30) due to piracy on the
intertubes...

They came first for the Communists,
and I didn't speak up because I wasn't a Communist.

Then they came for the trade unionists,
and I didn't speak up because I wasn't a trade unionist.

Then they came for the Jews,
and I didn't speak up because I wasn't a Jew.

Then they came for me
and by that time no one was left to speak up.

Great quote, Bob!

--- In jazz_guitar@..., jazz_guitar@... wrote:

Hello,
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Thanks Glenn,
This is a file that I find VERY useful, and hope others do as well.
Cheers!
--Jay

Alistair,

Was this question for me?

I have spent a good deal of time singing arps. I've spent a little bit of time singing modes. I've spent a lot of time playing melodies on both guitar and chromatic harmonica. The latter was to help with naming the intervals in my mind -- I found that I could play melodies accurately (the first time) but not know the notes -- that is, my fingers would go to the right note, but I would struggle in trying to write it down. I wanted to be able to hear a line in, say, the piano, and know what it was.

I don't know if I can hear modally and tonally. I'm really not certain about what that means, exactly. Some things sound more obvious to me than others.

Rick

Hello,

This email message is a notification to let you know that
a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the jazz_guitar
group.

File : /Members Files/Graphics & PDF Files /JazzStandards A_Z_141210.pdf
Uploaded by : glennbetcher <glennbetcher@...>
Description : Song Index

You can access this file at the URL:


To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit:

Regards,

glennbetcher <glennbetcher@...>

I used B and G as an example, only to make it clear that I was talking about descending lines. It applies to all adjacent strings.

16ths at 200? Is that right? That's faassst.

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I like it is F for the same reason. There are lots of open strings available as soon as you get off the F that is.





Brian

The question of "Musical Theory or Not" is a wide open question.

The subject of Music Theory is vast. One musician may see "scale practice" as music theory while another views it as "music practice". Once we define what we mean when we say Music Theory, we can discuss it in earnest. Does theory refer to voice leading? Chord substitution? Relative minor key? Secondary Dominants? Modes? Harmonized minor scales? Some musicians do these things by ear without formal or informal study. Others learn them from books or instruction. Some musicians only refer to the musical rudiments or musical notation as "theory".

Some like to learn from their instrument. The instrument teaches us what we need to know to play it. Some want a process whereby they study theory in a programmed step-by-step method that somehow fits with their practical hands-on development.

Does the musician, as an artist, view music differently than the musician who sees it as a science? Do some musicians use theoretical terms to describe their art? Do others explore without a map because discovery is more enjoyable to them?

Music Theory seems essential to professional musical leaders such as composers, conductors and directors. I've never heard of one not educated in music theory. I suppose there may be one or two. Music Theory is not essential in order to play a musical instrument, but it is the underlying logic behind what we do. And it's fun.

I elect to avoid the "Music is Language" parallel, because analogy is often a creative refuge for those who would like to avoid the current situation and segue onto friendlier grounds with terms more conducive to their version of the truth. To be absolute, one should focus on the subject at hand. But then, not everyone wants to lawyer up or be philosophically disciplined.

I'm not anti-inflector, but I rarely do it. Just because I believe pitch is not essential to the English language, does not mean that I bear any ill will to those who require it.

Musical theory certainly becomes useful when we do not have the instrument at hand. Especially in communicating with other musicians. I only have a limited time here on earth and I don't wish to end up on my death-bed wishing that I had studed music theory.

You see, I want to understand what I do as completely as I can. So I study music theory to understand what I am doing on the bass and the guitar. I strongly advise any beginning musician to include music theory in their schedule, a bit at a time. My first three guitar lessons (with Frank Quinn of Montreal) were not exciting, but what he showed me about notation and constructing scales would have probably taken years to get on my own. Had I gone to a teacher who only taught guitar licks, I would have missed the theory train. What I understand about music today is based on those early lessons.

Ernest, I don't know exactly why you asked this, but the dominant (and romantic) notion that many musicians have is that music theory gets in the way of true artistry. And that true artists like a Miles Davis, don't rely on music theory, but that their playing is simply inspired improvisation expressed from the soul without the need of theory. Of course, this is a fallacy, as Miles Davis was a Juilliard student.

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I checked out some of Mehegan's materials back in the late 70s, and as I recall they were just so-so, but it's a dim memory.? Had to do with substituting quartal voicings for "standard" chords, ala McCoy Tyner...

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Cheers,
JV

Juan Vega

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In a message dated 1/2/2011 7:24:55 P.M. Pacific Standard Time, bobbybmusic@... writes:

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