jazz_guitar@... wrote:
Original Message:
Date: Fri, 24 Aug 2001 15:52:09 -0700 (PDT)
From: Randy Groves <bebopguitar@...>
Subject: Bruno defense
Zeek wrote:
Jimmy left because he doesn't care to defend
statements he doesn't recall making,
Do you defend comments you didn't make? Why should he?
He may not have made them. Have you ever been
misquoted? It has happened to me, so I am less
surprised to see it happen to others. From what little
I know about Bruno, my sense is that if he had said
it, he would say so.
Randy,
I think as much was said by what he didn't say as what he did, once he said
anything at all. He did not immediately respond with, "I would never say
something like that!" Thereby, allowing wiggle room for whatever, reinforced by
suggesting a question mark may have been substituted for an explanation point.
At first, I think most of us gave him the benefit of the doubt, but then...
Casual remark, misquoted or not, Jimmy jumped from the frying pan deeper into
the fire with each subsequent response.
doesn't read
his interviews, and doesn't have time to monitor
what "his people" release about him, etc.
I can easily see how he could get to the point where
he would rather play or be with his family than
monitor all that stuff. After all, there is a lot of
press on Bruno out there. As much as I like his
playing, I don't think I would want to search out
every mention of him.
From my experience, PR firms normally send an artist everything they publish
about them, and more. Managers generally do the same thing, although some have
been know to misrepresent certain aspects. However, I know of no case where
something along the lines of a critique or an interview would be proffered as an
opinion that didn't actually come from the artist. That would get someone fired
in a New York Minute. Most artists should be smart enough to be contractually
sure anything published by or about them through their minions, first needs
their specific approval.
You you put "his people" in
quotes. Don't you think he has hired people to work on
the business end so he can concentrate more on the
music?
The quotes indicated an "et al." Sheesh!
If he
truly doesn't practice anymore, he's either stopped
growing or is fast becoming bored.
Well, it certainly doesn't show in his playing. It may
be the case that once a person has practiced a million
hours, things just occur and execution just happens.
(Buddy Rich stopped practicing at one point and still
sounded great. I have also heard advanced classical
guys say the same thing)I don't think his technique
needs any more work--and if you can fault it, you have
better ears than I have. And his last two cds (the Joe
Beck and Midnight Blue cds) seem to be departures from
his previous work, so he hasn't stopped growing. On
his boredom, I don't care if he keeps putting out
excellent music.
That's the rub. Tal Farlow got so bored and/or so arrogant he decided he had
done all that could be done in his genre. Yes, he made one amazing album, and
another from Ed Fuerst's living room in 1956 that wasn't quite as amazing. I
own both vinyls. He did a few guest shots, one in particular comes to mind with
Lenny Breau on which his playing reeked. I suppose the only thing that proves
is that if you don't stick with it, it goes away. If you don't keep growing,
either you or your audience will lose interest. Perhaps, both. I really didn't
comment on Mr. Bruno's playing, except for what I actually heard. I haven't
followed his growth, and didn't address that specifically, either. I did
address, in general, "appearances."
Every serious listener/itinerant player has their mentors/idols, and when I
remarked on Jimmy's playing, it was simply my take on my opinion that the genre
he expresses is one of many, and he is one of many within that genre, and I had
a hard time following what I heard on one song. The other stuff is extraneous,
a "bomb" being dropped first (I think) by someone suggesting Bruno's playing
smoked Metheny's, and the idea of them representing two different sub-genres got
lost in the ensuing melee of egotism, represented by what was first seemingly
arrogance that quickly became profoundly apparent as the real deal. (whew)
I find that
boring, and from cats like that, if you've heard 'em
play one tune, you've heard 'em all.
Well that's a cliche. THe question is whether it
applies to Bruno. I find all kinds of new ideas in
Bruno's work, and he continues to surprise me. That's
why I will buy everything he produces. But let's say
he was doing the same thing. What about classical
players who play the exact same music w/o improv?
What about them? As a lifetime accomplishment, there's only one plateau?
Segovia would've disagreed, and he said "mastering the guitar is a lifelong
proposition." I know many who have, and would agree today with that prospect.
I certainly do. I agree the question is whether it applies to a certain someone
and we haven't addressed that. I can't do more than generalize at this point
for that particular someone... Perhaps, my "cats like that" was an over
generalization, but the attitude seen here definitely pointed me there.
If
he does it extremely well, there would be value in
that. I think we are seeing a fairly weak aesthetic
flying around this list. I have said other things
about aesthetic theory that people have failed to pick
up on. It looks like people like to judge merely by
the seat of their pants and utter cliches rather than
engage in aesthetic argument. (I will try again in a
future post to get the aesthetic argument rolling.)
What aesthetics are you talking about? Execution? Tonality? Genre? Some
imaginary "right" to be unreasonable? What's really important in this context,
what/how you play, or your attitude about other players and/or other kinds of
styles and approaches? Doesn't one have a profound effect upon the other? Man,
there's a LOT of various and even varying aesthetics that could apply to jazz
guitar/music discussion... It's ALL fascinating, and mostly, subjective. You
aren't a Kantian philosopher BTW, are you? Or, Nietzschian? ;)
Harsh? You betcha. That's life on Earth... I
would have liked, even expected a little more
humility from Mr. Jimmy Bruno.
I didn't notice any arrogance from him. Indeed, if I
were him, I would have been tempted to let loose with
rather more than he did. What ever happened to
deference to great artists?
Huh? What's that supposed to mean? Deference to "authority?" LOL! Gimme a
break! Or, do you mean we should tolerate artist's "eccentricities?" ;)
Others here took some of his remarks here as arrogant. I saw only one glaringly
arrogant one, "I don't see anyone bidding to take a lesson with you. Or did I
miss it???" Directed to Steve Gallagher, someone on this list, on Monday 8/20.
Maybe he was joking? Didn't look like it...
Had he said
something like, "I never meant to imply Metheny
can't play jazz, I just don't care for his kind of
music." End of discussion.
Didn't he? He said he didn't say it and then said he
liked a lot of what Metheney has done. Isn't that good
enough?
Not exactly. He said he didn't recall saying it. His subsequent remarks seemed
like backpedalling. (Ah, Gary Condit Syndrome!;) He responded emotionally and
angrily, apparently didn't think things through, and wrote in the same fashion I
found his playing; intense, with extended lines, incomplete thoughts, changing
to another thought in the midst of a line. Hey, that makes for interesting jazz
at times, don't get me wrong. But, I would have taken a bit more time to
respond with less inflammation if I were in his shoes, or (better yet) simply
ignored the original accusation, completely.
Good job, you managed to alienate a great artist, and
you were wrong on pretty much every point.
Nonsense. If he's truly a "great artist," what I say would be of little
consequence to him. This reminds me of the old Downbeat Blindfold Tests. Years
ago, I read some stuff there that made some "great artists" sound like idiots,
yet it sure didn't seem to affect their record sales OR their playing. However,
I vowed that if I were ever asked, I'd bow out. :)))
The world of music making has a number of interesting trick bags; here's just a
couple. One, a cat can spend his entire life learning and growing, playing
whatever, whenever they choose, letting their own ability be their "guide," and
things either just happen for them, or not. Two, a cat can be very ambitious
and make a lot happen; ready or not, here they come. In either scenario, career
wise, direction is of paramount importance. In any case, focus is key, and some
folks narrow their scope to the point where, like Tal Farlow, all they see is
one very specific genre. IMO, there's nothing wrong with that per se, as long
as the attitude that precludes their interest in other genres doesn't become one
of "hipper than thou." Unfortunately, that happens to a lot of BeBop type cats
especially, bringing to mind comments like "I don't play Disco, I don't know the
chord." Balderdash.
I think what has spurred this thread so far is an image that needs to be
overcome, one that's just as bad as Rockers tearing up hotel rooms; that of
"arrogant jazzers." My remarks come from over 40 years of playing guitar, over
30 as a working professional sideman (nope, no "day gig"), with a few original
projects under my belt. I don't have a Ph.D. in Psychology, but I have a pretty
good musical education, especially in eking out a living at it. So, I think I'm
entitled to my opinion. :)
BTW, I've received private email applauding the very statements of mine you've
objected to, here. One wrote he has met Mr. Bruno and while impressed with his
playing, was put off by the "chip on his shoulder." Interesting, huh? :D
If you'd like to discuss the correlation I see between this subject and Philip
Zimbardo's "prison experiment," we should do that off the list. Perhaps, you
already see it. ;)
Maybe we should start a sub-list for "The Psychology of Jazz Guitar as Art, It's
Creation and the Artist, Public Perception, and Reality." Nah... Good book
title though, maybe. ;D
My (almost) final point; I've met a lot of fantastic musicians who were/are so
humble as to be honestly surprised by their acceptance and popularity. I've
also met a few who would not stoop to speaking to a fan or particularly, to a
novice who makes the mistake of introducing themselves as an aspiring musician.
Does that affect the quality of the music either makes? I believe it does,
eventually. With age, one either learns humility or loses their ability to
grow, along with their public appreciation. Some, like Kenny Burrell (whom I've
met), Chet Atkins (I gigged playing Gypsy Jazz with Jethro Burns, Chet's
brother-in-law with many a kind word for Chet) or even BB King (whom I met in
his dressing room), stay humble from the git-go. Nice.
A couple of years ago, after Larry Carlton had joined FourPlay and they went on
tour promoting FourPlay IV, my wife and I had the good fortune to see them in a
fairly small local venue. I believe it was their second gig with Carlton. I
had met Larry Carlton about 35 years ago when he was with the Jazz Crusaders and
had met Harvey Mason also, also sometime in the 60s. Naturally, it being so
long ago, neither recalled either meeting, but both were talkative, cordially
warm and friendly, as were Bob James, and Nathan East (who had my wife
spellbound, but not speechless;). All four had come out front after the show to
meet and greet fans, sign autographs, etc. (Yes, it helped sell a few hundred
pieces of memorabilia, but it was still very cool, and the stuff would've sold
well, regardless.) How much confidence did they all four need for Larry Carlton
to have replaced Lee Ritenour in one of the most popular jazz groups around and
continue on as though nothing had happened, yet have so much humility as to be
open to all commentary after only their second performance together? Tired and
sweaty? Maybe. Burned out? Not even close, yet the gig had just plain
smoked. Great, shining example, IMHO.
I believe I've about said all I care to on the matter on the list, I think this
thread should now evolve into something else. The bottom line; I'm sure none of
this was intended by anyone to specifically hurt Jimmy Bruno's feelings. But,
if it did, he just needs to take a good, long, hard look in the mirror. Zeek's
Soapbox Mode, "OFF." ;)
Regards,
...z
Faced with the choice between changing one's mind and proving that
there is no need to do so, almost everyone gets busy on the proof.
-- John Kenneth Galbraith
-- =---Seek the truth, speak the truth!---= --
L.G. "Zeek" Duff
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