Re: Merced / Red Peak / Isberg Passes
We attempted Isberg from Red's in 2021 and I can concur that there was, indeed, trail obliteration, and there were inaccuracies with each, as well as between, Guthooks and Gaia. I am hoping Roleigh will weigh in on this.
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On Feb 12, 2022, at 11:20 AM, Ryan <ryanwilsonjames@...> wrote:
?I went over Merced Pass last summer. It was great. Actually we went cross-country along Buena Vista Crest from Buena Vista Pass, so I don't know how the trail is south of there.
In summer 2020 I went over Red Peak Pass and Isberg Pass, though different trips. Red Peak Pass was great. Isberg itself is nice, but much of the land east (and now south) has burned. The trail was obliterated for many miles east of Hemlock Crossing from the 2018 fire — maybe more has been repaired since? But much more burned last year (including a great campsite we found at Cora Lakes), so it might be in bad shape.
|
A SNF ranger told me last fall that he didn't expect Mammoth Trail to Reds (over Granite Stairway) to open this year.? That's a key access point from Isberg to Reds, I believe.? You would be wise to call SNF to verify that it's open before setting out.? It COULD be, that the Isberg->Granite Stairway is OK, that only the lower portions of Mammoth Trail are closed.
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Re: Merced / Red Peak / Isberg Passes
Thank you for the report, Ryan! I’m interested in the sort of loop back to Yosemite and to bypass Donahue quota.
Karina Bezkrovnaia
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On Feb 12, 2022, at 11:20, Ryan <ryanwilsonjames@...> wrote:
?I went over Merced Pass last summer. It was great. Actually we went cross-country along Buena Vista Crest from Buena Vista Pass, so I don't know how the trail is south of there.
In summer 2020 I went over Red Peak Pass and Isberg Pass, though different trips. Red Peak Pass was great. Isberg itself is nice, but much of the land east (and now south) has burned. The trail was obliterated for many miles east of Hemlock Crossing from the 2018 fire — maybe more has been repaired since? But much more burned last year (including a great campsite we found at Cora Lakes), so it might be in bad shape.
|
Re: Navigation problems - how common? where?
#JMTsurvey
My first JMT hike (NOBO) I went off trail twice. ? I followed the guitar lake outlet over slabs down to to Timberline lake. ?I wasn’t lost, but I had lost the trail. ?Ironically I ran into the Crabtree Ranger going up that way which he described as a “shortcut”. I also walked off trail below Donahue again on slab granite and had to backtrack a bit. ?When the trail crosses granite I now scout ahead to make sure I see signs of the trail. ? On trail intersections I have learned to walk in a circle and inspect all the signs and often check compass and map. Those 2 minutes can save a big headache.
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On Feb 12, 2022, at 10:38 AM, John Ladd <johnladd@...> wrote:
? Mostly for people who haven't hiked the JMT before, though others may want to comment.
The annual JMT Hiker Survey has documented navigation as a common problem, reported by 33% of survey respondent in some years, even low-snowpack years like 2014.
The survey participants with navigation problems usually reported it as a relatively minor problem, presumably because they quickly realized that they have strayed off the JMT and backtrack to the point of their mistake. Navigation problems are most common in the areas where lots of trails intersect. Cutting back is much safer than cutting cross country to re-find the trail as in some location it is easy to not recognize the trail as you pass it and then think the JMT is east of you when it is actually west.
Common areas where people get lost is where there are many trail junctions (esp. near Thousand Island Lakes to Reds Meadow where the cross trails are often more distinct than the JMT because more heavily travelled). The trail signage rarely indicates "JMT this way", just the next pass or destination. I don't think you need a precise gps track (or breadcrumb trail) of the trail, but gps waypoints on a device or paper are very useful, always along with a even more useful paper map. A compass is often recommended though I haven't found them particularly useful and a very small one just generally distinguishing the cardinal directions has been enough for me.
The FB mini-survey on where people get lost: for those of you who are also members of the all-year JMT group on Facebook.
--
John Curran Ladd
1616 Castro Street
San Francisco, CA? 94114-3707
415-648-9279
|
Re: Navigation problems - how common? where?
#JMTsurvey
Must have been down in Los Angeles or San Diego for those train
routes.
Two Dogs
On 2/12/2022 12:19, Ethan wrote:
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Funniest story I heard was from the Ranger at Rae
Lakes who said when he asked a hiker where he was going, the
hiker pulled out the then Guthooks App and replied, "I'm taking
the Red Line to the Blue Line."
Ethan
Ethan Gallogly, PhD
author of The Trail, an Amazon Bestseller
"When you see a new
trail, or a footprint you do not know, follow it to the
point of knowing."? - Uncheedah
Hi Ethan
I was lost twice on the High Sierra Trail due to over
reliance on AllTrailsPro. The trails "disappeared" and the
pre-recorded AllTrails trail just did not exist. Our
Garmin GPS didn't help as well except to indicate our
current lat / long. We were able to locate ourselves on a
printed map based on that information, trace our way back
to the trail, and with the help of the printed map found
our way.
John,
Not sure if you include it in your mini-survey, but
you might add "method of navigation".? I have noticed
many relying on Apps such as Guthooks (now Far Out)
getting lost when cell phones fail or just having a
lower awareness of their surroundings and where things
connect than those using maps or both. Curious if my
personal observations are supported by the data.
Ethan
Ethan Gallogly, PhD
author of The Trail, an Amazon Bestseller
"When you see a new trail, or a
footprint you do not know, follow it to the point
of knowing."? - Uncheedah
On Sat, Feb 12, 2022
at 10:38 AM John Ladd < johnladd@...>
wrote:
Mostly for people who haven't hiked the JMT before, though others may want to comment.
The annual JMT Hiker Survey has documented navigation as a common problem, reported by 33% of survey respondent in some years, even low-snowpack years like 2014.
The survey participants with navigation problems usually reported it as a relatively minor problem, presumably because they quickly realized that they have strayed off the JMT and backtrack to the point of their mistake. Navigation problems are most common in the areas where lots of trails intersect. Cutting back is much safer than cutting cross country to re-find the trail as in some location it is easy to not recognize the trail as you pass it and then think the JMT is east of you when it is actually west.
Common areas where people get lost is where there are many trail junctions (esp. near Thousand Island Lakes to Reds Meadow where the cross trails are often more distinct than the JMT because more heavily travelled). The trail signage rarely indicates "JMT this way", just the next pass or destination. I don't think you need a precise gps track (or breadcrumb trail) of the trail, but gps waypoints on a device or paper are very useful, always along with a even more useful paper map. A compass is often recommended though I haven't found them particularly useful and a very small one just generally distinguishing the cardinal directions has been enough for me.
The FB mini-survey on where people get lost: for those of you who are also members of the all-year JMT group on Facebook.
--
John
Curran Ladd
1616
Castro Street
San
Francisco, CA? 94114-3707
415-648-9279
--
anand
|
Re: Navigation problems - how common? where?
#JMTsurvey
Re On Sat, Feb 12, 2022 at 10:47 AM, Ethan wrote:
John,
?
Not sure if you include it in your mini-survey, but you might add "method of navigation".? I have noticed many relying on Apps such as Guthooks (now Far Out) getting lost when cell phones fail or just having a lower awareness of their surroundings and where things connect than those using maps or both. Curious if my personal observations are supported by the data.
?
Ethan
The FB mini survey was done years ago. The annual survey has had the same questions since at least 2016 (with lots of overlap in 2014 and 2015) and I would hate to change them if I decide to continue the Survey into 2022. In any case, 2021 may have been the last year of the survey since I don't think 2022 would add much to 2014-21 (which already provide a variety of differing challenges). Maybe someone else can take it over, and modify the questions in light of experience in about 5 years to add a greater longitudinal aspect to the survey ? -- John Curran Ladd1616 Castro StreetSan Francisco, CA? 94114-3707415-648-9279
|
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[Edited Message Follows]
Spellchecked edit to my recent comment
There are significant differences between the JMT-relationship of the post that started this thread vs. calling COVID the "China virus" a post here without any need to use the very charged word.
You would have to be clueless to not understand that "China virus" is a polemical, partisan intrusion of political identity inserted into a JMT related discussion about permit frustration.
Please stop.
BTW I was the owner of the Yahoo group for over 10 years before its migration here and remain one of the owners. We have developed over the years a particular aversion to the insertion of the political issues into the group. We have deleted comments that stray
into politics both in the liberal and conservative direction and will continue to do so. Members who repeatedly flout those rules risk being banned from the group. Thee three Facebook groups on the JMT have the same policy. Maybe you can try Reddit. I understand
there is a JMT forum there that maybe has a more permissive attitude.
We also have Chinese-American and Chinese members here that might well have left the group if we did not take a position as your moderators on this.
--
John Curran Ladd
1616 Castro Street
San Francisco, CA? 94114-3707
415-648-9279
|
Re: Navigation problems - how common? where?
#JMTsurvey
LOL.
I have not used Guthook much (except last year on a long section hike on the JMT last year), but I did find it useful campsites and water locations.
To John's original point, yes, the trail between Thousand Island and Reds Meadow is confusing, but thankfully I have hiked Ediza Lake, Garnet Lake area a few times, through many different trails so I was aware of that.
The places I do get lost are when I go off-trail for a bathroom break or at night. The last time this happened, I was at Stanford Point, on the edge of the South Rim there. Not a good place to be walking in the wrong direction.? I need to get better to be aware of where I am at night.
Funniest story I heard was from the Ranger at Rae Lakes who said when he asked a hiker where he was going, the hiker pulled out the then Guthooks App and replied, "I'm taking the Red Line to the Blue Line."
Ethan
Ethan Gallogly, PhD author of The Trail, an Amazon Bestseller
"When you see a new trail, or a footprint you do not know, follow it to the point of knowing."? - Uncheedah
Hi Ethan
I was lost twice on the High Sierra Trail due to over reliance on AllTrailsPro. The trails "disappeared" and the pre-recorded AllTrails trail just did not exist. Our Garmin GPS didn't help as well except to indicate our current lat / long. We were able to locate ourselves on a printed map based on that information, trace our way back to the trail, and with the help of the printed map found our way.
John,
Not sure if you include it in your mini-survey, but you might add "method of navigation".? I have noticed many relying on Apps such as Guthooks (now Far Out) getting lost when cell phones fail or just having a lower awareness of their surroundings and where things connect than those using maps or both. Curious if my personal observations are supported by the data.
Ethan
Ethan Gallogly, PhD author of The Trail, an Amazon Bestseller "When you see a new trail, or a footprint you do not know, follow it to the point of knowing."? - Uncheedah
On Sat, Feb 12, 2022 at 10:38 AM John Ladd < johnladd@...> wrote: Mostly for people who haven't hiked the JMT before, though others may want to comment.
The annual JMT Hiker Survey has documented navigation as a common problem, reported by 33% of survey respondent in some years, even low-snowpack years like 2014.
The survey participants with navigation problems usually reported it as a relatively minor problem, presumably because they quickly realized that they have strayed off the JMT and backtrack to the point of their mistake. Navigation problems are most common in the areas where lots of trails intersect. Cutting back is much safer than cutting cross country to re-find the trail as in some location it is easy to not recognize the trail as you pass it and then think the JMT is east of you when it is actually west.
Common areas where people get lost is where there are many trail junctions (esp. near Thousand Island Lakes to Reds Meadow where the cross trails are often more distinct than the JMT because more heavily travelled). The trail signage rarely indicates "JMT this way", just the next pass or destination. I don't think you need a precise gps track (or breadcrumb trail) of the trail, but gps waypoints on a device or paper are very useful, always along with a even more useful paper map. A compass is often recommended though I haven't found them particularly useful and a very small one just generally distinguishing the cardinal directions has been enough for me.
The FB mini-survey on where people get lost: for those of you who are also members of the all-year JMT group on Facebook.
--
John Curran Ladd
1616 Castro Street
San Francisco, CA? 94114-3707
415-648-9279
--
anand
|
Re: Navigation problems - how common? where?
#JMTsurvey
Funniest story I heard was from the Ranger at Rae Lakes who said when he asked a hiker where he was going, the hiker pulled out the then Guthooks App and replied, "I'm taking the Red Line to the Blue Line."
Ethan
Ethan Gallogly, PhD author of The Trail, an Amazon Bestseller
"When you see a new trail, or a footprint you do not know, follow it to the point of knowing."? - Uncheedah
Hi Ethan
I was lost twice on the High Sierra Trail due to over reliance on AllTrailsPro. The trails "disappeared" and the pre-recorded AllTrails trail just did not exist. Our Garmin GPS didn't help as well except to indicate our current lat / long. We were able to locate ourselves on a printed map based on that information, trace our way back to the trail, and with the help of the printed map found our way.
John,
Not sure if you include it in your mini-survey, but you might add "method of navigation".? I have noticed many relying on Apps such as Guthooks (now Far Out) getting lost when cell phones fail or just having a lower awareness of their surroundings and where things connect than those using maps or both. Curious if my personal observations are supported by the data.
Ethan
Ethan Gallogly, PhD author of The Trail, an Amazon Bestseller "When you see a new trail, or a footprint you do not know, follow it to the point of knowing."? - Uncheedah
On Sat, Feb 12, 2022 at 10:38 AM John Ladd < johnladd@...> wrote: Mostly for people who haven't hiked the JMT before, though others may want to comment.
The annual JMT Hiker Survey has documented navigation as a common problem, reported by 33% of survey respondent in some years, even low-snowpack years like 2014.
The survey participants with navigation problems usually reported it as a relatively minor problem, presumably because they quickly realized that they have strayed off the JMT and backtrack to the point of their mistake. Navigation problems are most common in the areas where lots of trails intersect. Cutting back is much safer than cutting cross country to re-find the trail as in some location it is easy to not recognize the trail as you pass it and then think the JMT is east of you when it is actually west.
Common areas where people get lost is where there are many trail junctions (esp. near Thousand Island Lakes to Reds Meadow where the cross trails are often more distinct than the JMT because more heavily travelled). The trail signage rarely indicates "JMT this way", just the next pass or destination. I don't think you need a precise gps track (or breadcrumb trail) of the trail, but gps waypoints on a device or paper are very useful, always along with a even more useful paper map. A compass is often recommended though I haven't found them particularly useful and a very small one just generally distinguishing the cardinal directions has been enough for me.
The FB mini-survey on where people get lost: for those of you who are also members of the all-year JMT group on Facebook.
--
John Curran Ladd
1616 Castro Street
San Francisco, CA? 94114-3707
415-648-9279
--
anand
|
|
|
Re: Navigation problems - how common? where?
#JMTsurvey
Hi Ethan
I was lost twice on the High Sierra Trail due to over reliance on AllTrailsPro. The trails "disappeared" and the pre-recorded AllTrails trail just did not exist. Our Garmin GPS didn't help as well except to indicate our current lat / long. We were able to locate ourselves on a printed map based on that information, trace our way back to the trail, and with the help of the printed map found our way.
John,
Not sure if you include it in your mini-survey, but you might add "method of navigation".? I have noticed many relying on Apps such as Guthooks (now Far Out) getting lost when cell phones fail or just having a lower awareness of their surroundings and where things connect than those using maps or both. Curious if my personal observations are supported by the data.
Ethan
Ethan Gallogly, PhD author of The Trail, an Amazon Bestseller "When you see a new trail, or a footprint you do not know, follow it to the point of knowing."? - Uncheedah
On Sat, Feb 12, 2022 at 10:38 AM John Ladd < johnladd@...> wrote: Mostly for people who haven't hiked the JMT before, though others may want to comment.
The annual JMT Hiker Survey has documented navigation as a common problem, reported by 33% of survey respondent in some years, even low-snowpack years like 2014.
The survey participants with navigation problems usually reported it as a relatively minor problem, presumably because they quickly realized that they have strayed off the JMT and backtrack to the point of their mistake. Navigation problems are most common in the areas where lots of trails intersect. Cutting back is much safer than cutting cross country to re-find the trail as in some location it is easy to not recognize the trail as you pass it and then think the JMT is east of you when it is actually west.
Common areas where people get lost is where there are many trail junctions (esp. near Thousand Island Lakes to Reds Meadow where the cross trails are often more distinct than the JMT because more heavily travelled). The trail signage rarely indicates "JMT this way", just the next pass or destination. I don't think you need a precise gps track (or breadcrumb trail) of the trail, but gps waypoints on a device or paper are very useful, always along with a even more useful paper map. A compass is often recommended though I haven't found them particularly useful and a very small one just generally distinguishing the cardinal directions has been enough for me.
The FB mini-survey on where people get lost: for those of you who are also members of the all-year JMT group on Facebook.
--
John Curran Ladd
1616 Castro Street
San Francisco, CA? 94114-3707
415-648-9279
|
Re: Merced / Red Peak / Isberg Passes
I went over Merced Pass last summer. It was great. Actually we went cross-country along Buena Vista Crest from Buena Vista Pass, so I don't know how the trail is south of there.
In summer 2020 I went over Red Peak Pass and Isberg Pass, though different trips. Red Peak Pass was great. Isberg itself is nice, but much of the land east (and now south) has burned. The trail was obliterated for many miles east of Hemlock Crossing from the 2018 fire — maybe more has been repaired since? But much more burned last year (including a great campsite we found at Cora Lakes), so it might be in bad shape.
|
Re: Navigation problems - how common? where?
#JMTsurvey
John,
Not sure if you include it in your mini-survey, but you might add "method of navigation".? I have noticed many relying on Apps such as Guthooks (now Far Out) getting lost when cell phones fail or just having a lower awareness of their surroundings and where things connect than those using maps or both. Curious if my personal observations are supported by the data.
Ethan
Ethan Gallogly, PhD author of The Trail, an Amazon Bestseller "When you see a new trail, or a footprint you do not know, follow it to the point of knowing."? - Uncheedah
On Sat, Feb 12, 2022 at 10:38 AM John Ladd < johnladd@...> wrote: Mostly for people who haven't hiked the JMT before, though others may want to comment.
The annual JMT Hiker Survey has documented navigation as a common problem, reported by 33% of survey respondent in some years, even low-snowpack years like 2014.
The survey participants with navigation problems usually reported it as a relatively minor problem, presumably because they quickly realized that they have strayed off the JMT and backtrack to the point of their mistake. Navigation problems are most common in the areas where lots of trails intersect. Cutting back is much safer than cutting cross country to re-find the trail as in some location it is easy to not recognize the trail as you pass it and then think the JMT is east of you when it is actually west.
Common areas where people get lost is where there are many trail junctions (esp. near Thousand Island Lakes to Reds Meadow where the cross trails are often more distinct than the JMT because more heavily travelled). The trail signage rarely indicates "JMT this way", just the next pass or destination. I don't think you need a precise gps track (or breadcrumb trail) of the trail, but gps waypoints on a device or paper are very useful, always along with a even more useful paper map. A compass is often recommended though I haven't found them particularly useful and a very small one just generally distinguishing the cardinal directions has been enough for me.
The FB mini-survey on where people get lost: for those of you who are also members of the all-year JMT group on Facebook.
--
John Curran Ladd
1616 Castro Street
San Francisco, CA? 94114-3707
415-648-9279
|
Navigation problems - how common? where?
#JMTsurvey
Mostly for people who haven't hiked the JMT before, though others may want to comment.
The annual JMT Hiker Survey has documented navigation as a common problem, reported by 33% of survey respondent in some years, even low-snowpack years like 2014.
The survey participants with navigation problems usually reported it as a relatively minor problem, presumably because they quickly realized that they have strayed off the JMT and backtrack to the point of their mistake. Navigation problems are most common in the areas where lots of trails intersect. Cutting back is much safer than cutting cross country to re-find the trail as in some location it is easy to not recognize the trail as you pass it and then think the JMT is east of you when it is actually west.
Common areas where people get lost is where there are many trail junctions (esp. near Thousand Island Lakes to Reds Meadow where the cross trails are often more distinct than the JMT because more heavily travelled). The trail signage rarely indicates "JMT this way", just the next pass or destination. I don't think you need a precise gps track (or breadcrumb trail) of the trail, but gps waypoints on a device or paper are very useful, always along with a even more useful paper map. A compass is often recommended though I haven't found them particularly useful and a very small one just generally distinguishing the cardinal directions has been enough for me.
The FB mini-survey on where people get lost: for those of you who are also members of the all-year JMT group on Facebook.
--
John Curran Ladd
1616 Castro Street
San Francisco, CA? 94114-3707
415-648-9279
|
Always great to hear from you , John! Thank you ?? On the topic of trail alternatives - anyone recently done Merced Pass- Read Peak pass - Iceberg pass all way to Reds? Karina Bezkrovnaia
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Show quoted text
On Feb 12, 2022, at 09:39, Ger Murphy via groups.io <germurphymail@...> wrote:
?Thanks John for being a voice of reason here. I got a permit for the JMT this year after a few false starts due to Covid.
Really appreciate the community and all the helpful information that is shared.
Geraldine? On Sat, 12 Feb 2022 at 4:23 pm, John Ladd <johnladd@...> wrote: There are significant differences between the JMT-relationship of the post that started this thread vs. calling COVID the "China virus" a post here without any need to use the very charged word.
You would have to be clueless to not understand that "China virus" is a polemical, partisan intrusion of political identity inserted into a JMT elated discussion. Please stop.
Btw I was the owner of the Yahoo group before its migration here and remain one of the owners. We have developed over the years a particular aversion to the insertion of the political issues into the group. We have deleted comments that stray into politics both in the liberal and conservative direction and will continue to do so. Members who repeated l flout those rules risk banning from the group. Thee three Facebook groups on the JMT have the same policy. Maybe you can try Reddit. I understand there is a JMT forum there that maybe has a more permissive attitude.
We also have Chinese-American and Chinese members here that might well have left the group if we did not take a position as your moderators on this.
--
John Curran Ladd
1616 Castro Street
San Francisco, CA? 94114-3707
415-648-9279
|
Re: Send bear canister to post office in Lone Pine.
#gear
Thank you Lauralyn for supporting us.
As far as Bear canisters go, I own both the Bear Vault and the
Bearikade. I haven't used my BV for a while because:
- It's too hard to open (especially with cold or gloved hands,
and yes I know the credit card trick.)
- The opening is slightly smaller then the internal storage area
making it clumsy at times to dig around for your goodies.
- It is heavy for the amount of storage it affords.
The Garcia Backpacker Cache has the same small mouth issue as the
Bear Vault. I have never used one so my review is worthless. They
used to rent them at the Yosemite Wilderness centers.
But the Bear Vault and the Garcia Cache are much cheaper than the
Bearikade. The Bearikade however is tough, light and easily to
open, as long as you have a Quarter ($0.25) handy ;-) Actually, I
carry a steel washer with me when I hike to open it with, and as a
screwdriver prying tool. The opening is the same as the storage
area so digging around your "stuff" is easier.
If someone tries to sell you a Ursack for the JMT...soft
"Bear-proof"? bags are not allowed in the Parks in the Sierras
(unless they changed that lately). Besides who wants to eat food
that has been abused by a bear...think crunched, trampled and
crumbled.
If you can afford it would go with the Bearikade. I live in
Sacramento, so the Sierras are my backyard...the Bearikade gets
plenty of use.
Disclaimer: I do not work for Wild Ideas...I am just wild about
their ideas ;-)
--Rick
On 2/12/2022 9:21 AM, steve herr via
groups.io wrote:
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
In the US, you can send
something to yourself or anybody as follows:
[your name]
c/o General Delivery
[Post Office, ST ZIP]
In your case, the address
would be:
Dieter Mossbrucker
c/o General Delivery
Lone Pine, CA 93545
The post office will hold it
for up to 30 days for you to pick it up.? It helps the post
office if you can mark the package with the date you expect to
pick it up.
Steve
|
Thanks John for being a voice of reason here. I got a permit for the JMT this year after a few false starts due to Covid.
Really appreciate the community and all the helpful information that is shared.
On Sat, 12 Feb 2022 at 4:23 pm, John Ladd <johnladd@...> wrote: There are significant differences between the JMT-relationship of the post that started this thread vs. calling COVID the "China virus" a post here without any need to use the very charged word.
You would have to be clueless to not understand that "China virus" is a polemical, partisan intrusion of political identity inserted into a JMT elated discussion. Please stop.
Btw I was the owner of the Yahoo group before its migration here and remain one of the owners. We have developed over the years a particular aversion to the insertion of the political issues into the group. We have deleted comments that stray into politics both in the liberal and conservative direction and will continue to do so. Members who repeated l flout those rules risk banning from the group. Thee three Facebook groups on the JMT have the same policy. Maybe you can try Reddit. I understand there is a JMT forum there that maybe has a more permissive attitude.
We also have Chinese-American and Chinese members here that might well have left the group if we did not take a position as your moderators on this.
--
John Curran Ladd
1616 Castro Street
San Francisco, CA? 94114-3707
415-648-9279
|
Thank you John!? Well said.
Ethan Gallogly "When you see a new trail, or a footprint you do not know, follow it to the point of knowing."? - Uncheedah
Agreed! Thank you.
And you moderators have done a great job of keeping the lid on this forum.? Keep it up!
Pete Klein On Sat, Feb 12, 2022 at 8:23 AM John Ladd < johnladd@...> wrote: There are significant differences between the JMT-relationship of the post that started this thread vs. calling COVID the "China virus" a post here without any need to use the very charged word.
You would have to be clueless to not understand that "China virus" is a polemical, partisan intrusion of political identity inserted into a JMT elated discussion. Please stop.
Btw I was the owner of the Yahoo group before its migration here and remain one of the owners. We have developed over the years a particular aversion to the insertion of the political issues into the group. We have deleted comments that stray into politics both in the liberal and conservative direction and will continue to do so. Members who repeated l flout those rules risk banning from the group. Thee three Facebook groups on the JMT have the same policy. Maybe you can try Reddit. I understand there is a JMT forum there that maybe has a more permissive attitude.
We also have Chinese-American and Chinese members here that might well have left the group if we did not take a position as your moderators on this.
--
John Curran Ladd
1616 Castro Street
San Francisco, CA? 94114-3707
415-648-9279
|
Re: Send bear canister to post office in Lone Pine.
#gear
In the US, you can send something to yourself or anybody as follows:
[your name] c/o General Delivery [Post Office, ST ZIP]
In your case, the address would be:
Dieter Mossbrucker c/o General Delivery Lone Pine, CA 93545
The post office will hold it for up to 30 days for you to pick it up.? It helps the post office if you can mark the package with the date you expect to pick it up.
Steve
|
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
And you moderators have done a great job of keeping the lid on this forum.? Keep it up!
Pete Klein On Sat, Feb 12, 2022 at 8:23 AM John Ladd < johnladd@...> wrote: There are significant differences between the JMT-relationship of the post that started this thread vs. calling COVID the "China virus" a post here without any need to use the very charged word.
You would have to be clueless to not understand that "China virus" is a polemical, partisan intrusion of political identity inserted into a JMT elated discussion. Please stop.
Btw I was the owner of the Yahoo group before its migration here and remain one of the owners. We have developed over the years a particular aversion to the insertion of the political issues into the group. We have deleted comments that stray into politics both in the liberal and conservative direction and will continue to do so. Members who repeated l flout those rules risk banning from the group. Thee three Facebook groups on the JMT have the same policy. Maybe you can try Reddit. I understand there is a JMT forum there that maybe has a more permissive attitude.
We also have Chinese-American and Chinese members here that might well have left the group if we did not take a position as your moderators on this.
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John Curran Ladd
1616 Castro Street
San Francisco, CA? 94114-3707
415-648-9279
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