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Off-The-Wall Question


 

Hi, Y'all!? Been a while since I bugged the collective so now I have a question.? It's not Hallicrafters related but there is such a wealth of knowledge around here I figure somebody might be able to help.
?
I picked up an old Lafayette HB-600 CB which is ailing.? I turn it on and get a slight hiss from the speaker and when I key the mic I show about a 5 watt carrier but no modulation.? That's just a little background info so here is where things might get interesting.? I decided to go through the alignment procedures and have injected 455 KHz at the proper point and heard exactly zero tone so I started working forward and after I got past a mechanical 455 KHz filter and an IF can I got a good solid tone and could peak the next two IF cans.? I have a stock of mini 455 IF transformers and I have ordered a ceramic 455 KHz filter from an AliExpress seller.? should the ceramic filter work as a drop in or might I need to do some modifications?
?
I know some may look at messing with an old CB as tantamount to blasphemy but CBs and SWL is what got me into Ham Radio when I was a wee shaver.
?
73,
--
Justin B.
KI5GKD


 

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Hi Justin –

?

First, I suggest you verify that the mechanical filter is bad. Easy enough to do with a signal generator and a scope. Try to match required in and out impedances with resistors. You should be able to see the passband on the scope while tuning the generator. The ceramic resonator filter will probably need to be matched to the existing circuit. So, the Z in/out of both filters need to be known. You should also check and see to make sure there are no DC voltages going to the transducers of the mechanical filter. While in a good design this is avoided, it is possible that the grid bias is going through it. If it is, you will have to re-route the grid bias. A schematic would definitely be helpful. Good luck – 73 – Mike

?

Mike B. Feher, N4FS

89 Arnold Blvd.

Howell NJ 07731

908-902-3831

?

From: [email protected] <[email protected]> On Behalf Of Justin Bowser - KI5GKD
Sent: Saturday, March 8, 2025 12:54 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: [HallicraftersRadios] Off-The-Wall Question

?

Hi, Y'all!? Been a while since I bugged the collective so now I have a question.? It's not Hallicrafters related but there is such a wealth of knowledge around here I figure somebody might be able to help.

?

I picked up an old Lafayette HB-600 CB which is ailing.? I turn it on and get a slight hiss from the speaker and when I key the mic I show about a 5 watt carrier but no modulation.? That's just a little background info so here is where things might get interesting.? I decided to go through the alignment procedures and have injected 455 KHz at the proper point and heard exactly zero tone so I started working forward and after I got past a mechanical 455 KHz filter and an IF can I got a good solid tone and could peak the next two IF cans.? I have a stock of mini 455 IF transformers and I have ordered a ceramic 455 KHz filter from an AliExpress seller.? should the ceramic filter work as a drop in or might I need to do some modifications?

?

I know some may look at messing with an old CB as tantamount to blasphemy but CBs and SWL is what got me into Ham Radio when I was a wee shaver.

?

73,

--

Justin B.
KI5GKD


Virus-free.


 

?
To rough test whether the mechanical filter is working, jury rig a .01 Mfd cap disc capacitor from filter input to filter output. If volume and noise perk up, filter is probably bad.
?
Since I worked at Lafayette and also did the service for most of the NJ stores for a number of years, when we started closing the stores as part of bankruptcy proceedings, all the service parts, cannibalized equipment, and anything else the stores didn't want and were going to throw it away, it all came home with me. So, I probably have the largest collection of NOS Lafayette parts that still exists today although I've been trying to work down the pile for the last 40 years.
?
I don't recall, since I don't have the file folder and manual?in front of me, whether we issued any service addenda on the HB-600.
?
The HB-600 was the "top-of-the-line' solid-state base transceiver we sold in 1966. It was also called the "CB Commander" (one of the marketing guys came up with that tag). Also had a? 5 stage "unique RF Noise Silencer". It sold new for $220.
?
It made the front cover of the main 1966 Lafayette catalog.
?
Pete, wa2cwa
?
?
?
On Fri, 07 Mar 2025 21:54:26 -0800 "Justin Bowser - KI5GKD" <justin.bowser@...> writes:

Hi, Y'all!? Been a while since I bugged the collective so now I have a question.? It's not Hallicrafters related but there is such a wealth of knowledge around here I figure somebody might be able to help.
?
I picked up an old Lafayette HB-600 CB which is ailing.? I turn it on and get a slight hiss from the speaker and when I key the mic I show about a 5 watt carrier but no modulation.? That's just a little background info so here is where things might get interesting.? I decided to go through the alignment procedures and have injected 455 KHz at the proper point and heard exactly zero tone so I started working forward and after I got past a mechanical 455 KHz filter and an IF can I got a good solid tone and could peak the next two IF cans.? I have a stock of mini 455 IF transformers and I have ordered a ceramic 455 KHz filter from an AliExpress seller.? should the ceramic filter work as a drop in or might I need to do some modifications?
?
I know some may look at messing with an old CB as tantamount to blasphemy but CBs and SWL is what got me into Ham Radio when I was a wee shaver.
?
73,
--
Justin B.
KI5GKD


 

Mike - It's solid state so no tubes or HV to worry about.? I've tested low-pass filters with my Nano VNA a long time ago and seem to remember that one channel is hooked to input and the other hooked to output.
?
Pete - I'll give that a try and let you know.? I also got another rare/unusual bird coming, an HE-43C.? I've never seen a CB where you transmit with crystal and receive by VFO.? What I plan doing is to put in a circuit that replaces the crystals with an Arduino controlled 5351 module.
?
73,
--
Justin B.
KI5GKD


 

This may help if your bad filter was made by Kokusai:
It seems that the insertion loss is pretty much the same as the Collins mechanical filters of the same era, about 20 dB.
Good luck,
Jim

Logic: Method used to arrive at the wrong conclusion, with confidence.? Murphy


On Saturday, March 8, 2025 at 02:55:07 AM CST, Peter A Markavage via groups.io <pmarkavage@...> wrote:


To rough test whether the mechanical filter is working, jury rig a .01 Mfd cap disc capacitor from filter input to filter output. If volume and noise perk up, filter is probably bad.
?
Since I worked at Lafayette and also did the service for most of the NJ stores for a number of years, when we started closing the stores as part of bankruptcy proceedings, all the service parts, cannibalized equipment, and anything else the stores didn't want and were going to throw it away, it all came home with me. So, I probably have the largest collection of NOS Lafayette parts that still exists today although I've been trying to work down the pile for the last 40 years.
?
I don't recall, since I don't have the file folder and manual?in front of me, whether we issued any service addenda on the HB-600.
?
The HB-600 was the "top-of-the-line' solid-state base transceiver we sold in 1966. It was also called the "CB Commander" (one of the marketing guys came up with that tag). Also had a? 5 stage "unique RF Noise Silencer". It sold new for $220.
?
It made the front cover of the main 1966 Lafayette catalog.
?
Pete, wa2cwa
?
?
?
On Fri, 07 Mar 2025 21:54:26 -0800 "Justin Bowser - KI5GKD" <justin.bowser@...> writes:

Hi, Y'all!? Been a while since I bugged the collective so now I have a question.? It's not Hallicrafters related but there is such a wealth of knowledge around here I figure somebody might be able to help.
?
I picked up an old Lafayette HB-600 CB which is ailing.? I turn it on and get a slight hiss from the speaker and when I key the mic I show about a 5 watt carrier but no modulation.? That's just a little background info so here is where things might get interesting.? I decided to go through the alignment procedures and have injected 455 KHz at the proper point and heard exactly zero tone so I started working forward and after I got past a mechanical 455 KHz filter and an IF can I got a good solid tone and could peak the next two IF cans.? I have a stock of mini 455 IF transformers and I have ordered a ceramic 455 KHz filter from an AliExpress seller.? should the ceramic filter work as a drop in or might I need to do some modifications?
?
I know some may look at messing with an old CB as tantamount to blasphemy but CBs and SWL is what got me into Ham Radio when I was a wee shaver.
?
73,
--
Justin B.
KI5GKD


 

开云体育

For what it’s worth I converted an Eico CB transceiver to 10 meters (29.6) many years ago.? It was crystal transmit and VFO receive.

Not sure, but if I remember correctly, it was a model 761.

Mike/
K5MGR
__________________________________________

?

Mike Langner
929 Alameda Road NW
Albuquerque, NM 87114-1901

(505) 898-3212 home/home office
(505) 238-8810 cell
mlangner@...

?

From: [email protected] <[email protected]> On Behalf Of Justin Bowser - KI5GKD
Sent: Saturday, March 8, 2025 9:47 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [HallicraftersRadios] Off-The-Wall Question

?

Mike - It's solid state so no tubes or HV to worry about.? I've tested low-pass filters with my Nano VNA a long time ago and seem to remember that one channel is hooked to input and the other hooked to output.

?

Pete - I'll give that a try and let you know.? I also got another rare/unusual bird coming, an HE-43C.? I've never seen a CB where you transmit with crystal and receive by VFO.? What I plan doing is to put in a circuit that replaces the crystals with an Arduino controlled 5351 module.

?

73,

--

Justin B.
KI5GKD


 

开云体育

Justin –

?

The likelihood of DC going through it is even greater if it is solid state. You just have to verify that DC still goes to where it is supposed to when you install the ceramic filter. 73 – Mike

?

Mike B. Feher, N4FS

89 Arnold Blvd.

Howell NJ 07731

908-902-3831

?

From: [email protected] <[email protected]> On Behalf Of Justin Bowser - KI5GKD
Sent: Saturday, March 8, 2025 11:47 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [HallicraftersRadios] Off-The-Wall Question

?

Mike - It's solid state so no tubes or HV to worry about.? I've tested low-pass filters with my Nano VNA a long time ago and seem to remember that one channel is hooked to input and the other hooked to output.

?

Pete - I'll give that a try and let you know.? I also got another rare/unusual bird coming, an HE-43C.? I've never seen a CB where you transmit with crystal and receive by VFO.? What I plan doing is to put in a circuit that replaces the crystals with an Arduino controlled 5351 module.

?

73,

--

Justin B.
KI5GKD


Virus-free.


 

Hi,

re: your Lafayette HB-600 CB

The Kokusai mechanical filter might be repairable.
A common failure mode is that the foam plastic originally used
within the filter case to dampen mechanical shock
has turned to gunk over the years.

Here is a repair article:


I'm guessing that the filter is not used during transmit.
For an A.M. - only CB it is more likely to have a high level A.M.
modulated class C final. So, your lack of modulation
may be due to another problem in the audio chain.

73,
Ed Knobloch K4PF


 

?
Lafayette HE-43C is not rare. It is identical to the HE-20C (which we sold 1000's of these sets - HE-20, 20A, 20B, 20C(relay and electronic switching versions), 43C) except the 43C works on 110V AC and 6 volts DC. The 20C works on 110V AC and 12 volts DC. Other then that, they are identical. I just finished a HE-43C manual for a customer. Both the HE-20C and 43C were made by United Scientific Laboratories (USL) in Long Island City, NY.
A tunable receive and a crystal controlled transmitter was quite common with a number of manufacturers in the early 60's. A Spot switch obviously was common on these transceivers.
?
The HB-600 had one major service bulletin. There were excessive failures in the 2N2949 RF Power Amplifier so a board and circuitry with a different RF Power Amplifier transistor was designed and circuit diagram and install instructions were provided.
?
For a short period, The HB-600 was replaced by a HB-600A which had the revised RF Power Amplifier already installed. There were also some other circuit changes but don't recall what they were.
?
?
On Sat, 08 Mar 2025 08:46:48 -0800 "Justin Bowser - KI5GKD" <justin.bowser@...> writes:

?
Pete - I'll give that a try and let you know.? I also got another rare/unusual bird coming, an HE-43C.? I've never seen a CB where you transmit with crystal and receive by VFO.? What I plan doing is to put in a circuit that replaces the crystals with an Arduino controlled 5351 module.
?
73,
--
Justin B.
KI5GKD
?


 

?
For what its worth - the Lafayette mechnical filter Part Number in the HB-600 is 1253-24.
?
Pete, wa2cwa
?
On Sat, 8 Mar 2025 17:35:22 GMT "k2orsfan via groups.io" <k4pf@...> writes:

Hi,

re: your Lafayette HB-600 CB

The Kokusai mechanical filter might be repairable.
A common failure mode is that the foam plastic originally used
within the filter case to dampen mechanical shock
has turned to gunk over the years.

Here is a repair article:


I'm guessing that the filter is not used during transmit.
For an A.M. - only CB it is more likely to have a high level A.M.
modulated class C final. So, your lack of modulation
may be due to another problem in the audio chain.

73,
Ed Knobloch K4PF
_._,_._,_