Hi, ? Swapping the cards between the two instruments is a good idea, you will have a better idea which cards are faulty. And if you have a fully functional generator, you can work on the first one in your spare time. Now is there any impact on the calibration, you will know if you do some performance test measurements (service manual section 4). There are also adjustments on the output card if necessary (service manual section 3). For the timing board, this alignment is done in the factory only according to the manual. ? 
? ? I assume you already have the manuals, but here is a link anyway. Yesterday I uploaded both the user's and service guide to the site. ? /g/HP-Agilent-Keysight-equipment/files/All%20HP,%20Agilent%20and%20Keysight%20instruments%20in%20folders%20by%20part%20numbers/8000%20to%208999/8131A%20High%20speed%20pulse%20generator%20%28pulse%20width%20500%20ps%20to%2099.9%20ms%29 ? Yves ? ? ? Yes that's true, I may have been a bit hasty. I had a brief look at it today and Channel 2 does indeed work correctly. I also found that channel 1 although it has the same error code as my existing 8131A it appears to be a different fault.? Unit 1 (single channel) - Channel 1 just outputs DC, the DC level varies as the output level is changed. Unit 2 (dual channel) - Channel 1 does output a pulse/square wave, but at a reduced amplitude from what it should be. Channel 2 works normally.? With Unit 1 I 100% know the fault is on the timing board as I tested the other boards in a known good working unit I borrowed. I don't know if it's a fault that affects both channels as it's only a single channel unit. I'll have to try it with an extra output board and see if it throws an error for channel 2 as well (E404) With unit 2 the fault could be on the timing board or output board, I haven't got into it yet. It's possible the output board is at fault here. So I maybe able to take the known good output board from the first unit and fit it to this one to fix it.? Admittedly wouldn't be learning much, but at least it would work.? Unit 2 also has a defective power button (it won't stay latched pushed in), some sticky front panel buttons, an old schaffner filter, and rather sluggish fans. All of these are good in the first unit so definitely going to be swapping bits around to make one good unit.??
|
Re: problems with an E4407B spectrum analyzer
Hi, In my case I did not have the B72 option. I had bought and installed the missing circuits on the flash card and repositioned a jumper. I also used an old PC under XPpro to create the diskettes. But during the installation there were difficulties with the loader diskette and another diskette during the second attempt. I had recreated another diskette kit and everything had worked fine. Don't worry too much, you will eventually get there ? Yves ? Hi guys I am trying to learn about the ESA 4407B analyzer. I have "bricked" a unit. I pressed ESC + view/trace key during powerup. So the EEprom is erased. I need to enter new firmware now. But it will not take my floppy(s). It starts to blink the light on the floppy but nothing then happens. Unit has option B72 so the EEProm size is 12Mb to store the firmware. The unti was working before the upgrade. What I am doing wrong how can I load new firmware.
|
Here's a link I found online to the service manual for 8131A if you don't have it already. ? https://www.doe.carleton.ca/~nagui/labequip/datagen/8131A_Service%20Manual.pdf
|
Re: E8401A VXI Mainframe Power Supply
That's what I first thought - no signs or smell. I took the filter out and nothing suspicious on the outside.
?
Thx, Wolfgang
|
Re: problems with an E4407B spectrum analyzer
Hi Peter,
I have used second option Razvan mentioned to upgrade my 4402B
(after upgrading flash module by soldering 2 more memory chips).
What I did:
1. download A.14.06 firmware package (.exe) from Keysight (or
A.07.06 version for smaller 8MB flash option)
2. create 9 floppy disks - I used old WinXP computer with
internal floppy drive (tried external USB connected floppy drive
but it didn't work) to run exe file from keysight, some feature sw
packages are also downloadable in exe form and this exe writes it
to floppy disks
3. erase flash by holding ESC + view/trace key during turn-on
4. wait 10 minutes for flash erase completion, then turn
off analyser by disconnecting power plug (power button doesn't
work)
5. for a while disconnect battery what
is placed on CPU board - this will clear NVRAM but you wont loose
any hardware based options (software based will have to be enabled
again after firmware installation with appropriate pass keys)
6. insert floppy disk 1 with bootloader
and turn analyser on
You should see that floppy drive will
start reading disk, it will take 20-30s, then it will display
bootloader on the screen and will show you what to do next. If
floppy drive will try to read disk just for few seconds and then
nothing happens, something is wrong - dirty floppy drive,
incorrectly created or faulty floppy disk, or....
Vladimir
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
Hello
Peter,
The E4407B is not having EEPROMs, it has NAND flash memory. In
total
there are 4 NAND chips, one is on the CPU board soldered directly
there
and the other 3 are on a so called Flash SIMM board parallel to
the RAM
memory stick. Each NAND chip is 4MB in size for the total of 16MB
flash
if you have B72 option.
Now for the floppy disks. First disk is the called LOADER disk and
this
is a little bit tricky since it needs to be written in a way that
the SA
will read it.
You can try the following 2 options:
1) format the floppy on the analyzer and after that move it to PC
and
copy the LOADER files.
2) use an old PC/Laptop with windows xp/2000 and run the .exe file
that
makes all disks. It will not work on newer windows machines.
I think point 1) you cannot try because you already formatted the
NAND
flash and the analyzer will not boot now...
Try second one with the old windows xp or windows 2000.
Regards,
Razvan
On 04/10/2024 10:59, Peter Hansen via groups.io wrote:
Hi guys I am trying to learn about the ESA
4407B analyzer. I have
"bricked" a unit. I pressed ESC + view/trace key during powerup.
So the
EEprom is erased. I need to enter new firmware now.
But it will not take my floppy(s). It starts to blink the light
on the
floppy but nothing then happens. Unit has option B72 so the
EEProm size
is 12Mb to store the firmware. The unti was working before the
upgrade.
What I am doing wrong how can I load new firmware.
best regards OZ1LPR
_._,_._,_
|
Re: problems with an E4407B spectrum analyzer
Hello Peter,
The E4407B is not having EEPROMs, it has NAND flash memory. In total
there are 4 NAND chips, one is on the CPU board soldered directly there
and the other 3 are on a so called Flash SIMM board parallel to the RAM
memory stick. Each NAND chip is 4MB in size for the total of 16MB flash
if you have B72 option.
Now for the floppy disks. First disk is the called LOADER disk and this
is a little bit tricky since it needs to be written in a way that the SA
will read it.
You can try the following 2 options:
1) format the floppy on the analyzer and after that move it to PC and
copy the LOADER files.
2) use an old PC/Laptop with windows xp/2000 and run the .exe file that
makes all disks. It will not work on newer windows machines.
I think point 1) you cannot try because you already formatted the NAND
flash and the analyzer will not boot now...
Try second one with the old windows xp or windows 2000.
Regards,
Razvan
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
On 04/10/2024 10:59, Peter Hansen via groups.io wrote: Hi guys I am trying to learn about the ESA 4407B analyzer. I have
"bricked" a unit. I pressed ESC + view/trace key during powerup. So the
EEprom is erased. I need to enter new firmware now.
But it will not take my floppy(s). It starts to blink the light on the
floppy but nothing then happens. Unit has option B72 so the EEProm size
is 12Mb to store the firmware. The unti was working before the upgrade.
What I am doing wrong how can I load new firmware.
best regards OZ1LPR
_._,_._,_
|
Re: E8401A VXI Mainframe Power Supply
Could the bang be the mains filter (X1,X2 caps) if it has one? These are notorious for that type of failure ¨C usually with a spectacularly noxious smell¡ ? Just my initial 2p worth. ? Regards Nigel ?
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
From: [email protected] <[email protected]> On Behalf Of Wolfgang Schraml via groups.io
Sent: 04 October 2024 13:05
To: [email protected]
Subject: [HP-Agilent-Keysight-equipment] E8401A VXI Mainframe Power Supply? I have an "interesting" scenario:
?
I bought an E8401A VXI mainframe from our favorite auction site to dabble in the world of test automation. It arrived incredibly dirty and grimy (it has no air filter), but powered on. I spent several hours blowing out dust and dirt, including the fan and power supply. It still worked fine afterward.
I then installed the first VXI card (E1405B Command Module) and let it run overnight - no issues. The next day, a second card I ordered arrived and I installed it. When powering on with the two cards, the power went out within about a second. I removed the second card, and still, the unit was dead. No standby LED or any other sign of life.
?
I figured the power supply had died on me.
?
I contacted the seller, and they worked with me to send me a second unit (complete E8401A mainframe). When that arrived, it was even dirtier than the first one. But again, it turned on. I cleaned the power supply and put it into the first mainframe. It powered up fine but the PS fan was very noisy. So I used the one from the original PS.
?
I installed the command module, no issues. I installed the second card (the one after which the first mainframe died), and still, everything was fine.
While all this took place, a third card I had ordered arrived, and I also installed it. Again, the unit powered up without issues! My hopes were going up that I had a fully functioning unit now.
I let it run for hours without problems.
?
I then let it run overnight. Later the next morning, the temperature and fan LEDs were blinking, indicating overheating. This was strange since I had the unit next to an open window and the temperature had dropped into the low 60s that night. Within a ?few minutes, the mainframe shut down. For a brief moment, all LEDs on the front module lit, and then - dead.
?
Hmmm ¡ I disconnected the power cable, let it sit for a few minutes, and reconnected power. No signs of life, but after about 10 seconds, a loud "bang" from the inside. As bad as that was, it gave me some hope that it would be easy to identify which component had failed in such a spectacular manner. I open the power supply to investigate, and found - nothing! All looked good. No exploded caps or resistors as far as I can tell.
?
My questions are:
? ? ? Has anyone had such a mainframe and experienced similar issues??
? ? ? Does anyone have a schematic of the power supply? I have the CLIP for the mainframe, but it does not include any details for the PS.
?
One other interesting piece of information is a service note that indicates issues with a cap in the fan supply of these power supplies (). It doesn't provide further details other than a replacement part number for the PS. Thank you for any thoughts or tips.??
?
Wolfgang
KI7PFX
|
E8401A VXI Mainframe Power Supply
Hello,
?
I have an "interesting" scenario:
?
I bought an E8401A VXI mainframe from our favorite auction site to dabble in the world of test automation. It arrived incredibly dirty and grimy (it has no air filter), but powered on. I spent several hours blowing out dust and dirt, including the fan and power supply. It still worked fine afterward.
I then installed the first VXI card (E1405B Command Module) and let it run overnight - no issues.
The next day, a second card I ordered arrived and I installed it. When powering on with the two cards, the power went out within about a second. I removed the second card, and still, the unit was dead. No standby LED or any other sign of life.
?
I figured the power supply had died on me.
?
I contacted the seller, and they worked with me to send me a second unit (complete E8401A mainframe). When that arrived, it was even dirtier than the first one. But again, it turned on. I cleaned the power supply and put it into the first mainframe. It powered up fine but the PS fan was very noisy. So I used the one from the original PS.
?
I installed the command module, no issues. I installed the second card (the one after which the first mainframe died), and still, everything was fine.
While all this took place, a third card I had ordered arrived, and I also installed it. Again, the unit powered up without issues! My hopes were going up that I had a fully functioning unit now.
I let it run for hours without problems.
?
I then let it run overnight. Later the next morning, the temperature and fan LEDs were blinking, indicating overheating. This was strange since I had the unit next to an open window and the temperature had dropped into the low 60s that night. Within a ?few minutes, the mainframe shut down. For a brief moment, all LEDs on the front module lit, and then - dead.
?
Hmmm ¡ I disconnected the power cable, let it sit for a few minutes, and reconnected power. No signs of life, but after about 10 seconds, a loud "bang" from the inside. As bad as that was, it gave me some hope that it would be easy to identify which component had failed in such a spectacular manner. I open the power supply to investigate, and found - nothing! All looked good. No exploded caps or resistors as far as I can tell.
?
My questions are:
? ? ? Has anyone had such a mainframe and experienced similar issues??
? ? ? Does anyone have a schematic of the power supply? I have the CLIP for the mainframe, but it does not include any details for the PS.
?
One other interesting piece of information is a service note that indicates issues with a cap in the fan supply of these power supplies (). It doesn't provide further details other than a replacement part number for the PS.
?
Thank you for any thoughts or tips.??
?
Wolfgang
KI7PFX
?
|
Yes that's true, I may have been a bit hasty. I had a brief look at it today and Channel 2 does indeed work correctly. I also found that channel 1 although it has the same error code as my existing 8131A it appears to be a different fault.?
?
Unit 1 (single channel) - Channel 1 just outputs DC, the DC level varies as the output level is changed.
Unit 2 (dual channel) - Channel 1 does output a pulse/square wave, but at a reduced amplitude from what it should be. Channel 2 works normally.?
?
With Unit 1 I 100% know the fault is on the timing board as I tested the other boards in a known good working unit I borrowed. I don't know if it's a fault that affects both channels as it's only a single channel unit. I'll have to try it with an extra output board and see if it throws an error for channel 2 as well (E404)
?
With unit 2 the fault could be on the timing board or output board, I haven't got into it yet. It's possible the output board is at fault here. So I maybe able to take the known good output board from the first unit and fit it to this one to fix it.? Admittedly wouldn't be learning much, but at least it would work.?
?
?
Unit 2 also has a defective power button (it won't stay latched pushed in), some sticky front panel buttons, an old schaffner filter, and rather sluggish fans. All of these are good in the first unit so definitely going to be swapping bits around to make one good unit.??
?
?
?
?
|
problems with an E4407B spectrum analyzer
Hi guys I am trying to learn about the ESA 4407B analyzer. I have "bricked" a unit. I pressed ESC + view/trace key during powerup. So the EEprom is erased. I need to enter new firmware now.
But it will not take my floppy(s). It starts to blink the light on the floppy but nothing then happens. Unit has option B72 so the EEProm size is 12Mb to store the firmware. The unti was working before the upgrade. What I am doing wrong how can I load new firmware.
best regards OZ1LPR
|
Re: HP 8568B bandpass filter alignment.
When the 8568B was first purchased, it should have included the operators manual and this is made up of several documents including the performance and adjustments document. The instructions to adjust the filters are in this document.
?
The troubleshooting and repair documents for the RF and Display sections had to be ordered separately and this is what many people refer to as the service manual for each. I don¡¯t think the instructions to adjust the filters are included in these documents. I went through all this a few years ago when my 8568B filters went out of adjustment. It is quite a fiddly and time consuming process to adjust all the filters but it is well worth it :)
|
Re: HP 8568B bandpass filter alignment.
In my Performance Test Part 1 manual (08568-90051) the adjustments for the 21.4MHz stage start on p50 and the details of the filters are on the last page.
I still think that's in the service manual, but maybe they count as two. In the big multiple volume notebooks for these models there is a section or volume for the RF unit, which could be 8566 or 8568, which are different SA models, and another for the IF/display unit, which is the same for both models, and is where all this filtering stuff physically resides. It should all be covered, but you may have to hunt for it through the volumes.
?
Ed
|
Re: Please don¡¯t upload ArtekManuals.
If you need to share a few pages tto get help, use a PDF print porogram to extract those pages into a new PDF. I use PDF995, but there are many others. Then pu it on Google Drive, Dropbox or another file ssstorage site. St it to private, them send the the link for that file. No one else can open it, , and will even know it exists. Delete it when you finish the repair.
On Thu, Oct 3, 2024 at 1:31?PM Radu Bogdan Dicher via <vondicher= [email protected]> wrote:
I wholeheartedly agree
! There's no question that Artek needs our business and deserves
our support. Give them any and all business you can. Uploading
their manuals to an open server will kill their business.
And never forget that we would never be able to maintain and
repair our instruments without such a great source for manuals !
Joel Setton
(For the record : I have no affiliation with them, I'm just a
grateful and satisfied customer of theirs ...)
|
Re: Advice or a little driver help needed with an E5504A phase noise measurement system wand VXI digitizer
Hi Peter, where can download ?version A.03.02?
?
On Thu, Mar 30, 2023 at 03:39 AM, Peter wrote:
|
Re: HP 8568B bandpass filter alignment.
I still think that's in the service manual, but maybe they count as two. In the big multiple volume notebooks for these models there is a section or volume for the RF unit, which could be 8566 or 8568, which are different SA models, and another for the IF/display unit, which is the same for both models, and is where all this filtering stuff physically resides. It should all be covered, but you may have to hunt for it through the volumes.
?
Ed
|
File /All HP, Agilent and Keysight instruments in folders by part numbers/000 to 999/130C Oscilloscope/HP 130C Manual Changes June 25 1968.pdf uploaded
#file-notice
The following items have been added to the Files area of the [email protected] group.
By: Julian_Hardstone <julian@...>
Description:
Manual Changes Nov. 1966 for instruments Ser. No. Prefixes 644-
|
Re: Please don¡¯t upload ArtekManuals.
Speaking of manual downloads, I was excited to see the new header inviting me to 'check out the wiki'
This looks very promising, I can anticipate a few downloads; it would also be good to contribute, but when I contemplate scanning any HP manuals I have to concede that it is usually too great a task, even scanning direct to a PDF.
?
Aside from that, the first few manuals I looked for offer a .BIN file download. I can find nothing that will open a BIN file, except a text editor, which is not going to help. Googling for 'how to open...' I see that it is an obsolete format for burning CD ROMs or something.
?
Have I missed something?
?
?- Julian
|
Re: HP 8568B bandpass filter alignment.
I recall that I ended up making the connections using thin wire coiled into a spring and this could then be slid over the connection pins to make a connection that had some springy grip. However, this was only just adequate. I think it would be much better to use thin socket pins of the correct diameter. So be prepared to have to order or find some suitable connectors to fit to the pins on the board.
|
Re: HP 8568B bandpass filter alignment.
If this is about adjusting the LC and crystal filters at the 21.4MHz IF I don't think this is covered by the service manual. I adjusted my 8568B a few years ago and I had to make a set of special jumper links to bypass the RBW filter sections during the adjustment process.
?
Try looking in the performance and adjustment document 08568-90118 for info on how to make the jumper links and also how to adjust the filters. It is quite time consuming to do and the jumper links need to be able to interface correctly with the pins on the board.
?
The official bypass jumpers should slide and fit into place quite snugly if the correct connectors are used. However,?I made my own and it took me a while to find a way to reliably fit them so they gave a reliable 'push in' connection. I've still got them somewhere, but I'm not sure where!
?
It is definitely worth doing this if the filters have drifted out of adjustment.?
|
Re: Please don¡¯t upload ArtekManuals.
Agreed. Their manuals are real PDF which can be searched which is a must. Perfect!
?
|
Frank Mashockie
Michael A. Terrell
Julian_Hardstone