Dave,
You may already know the history of the NMD, but for those that don't, the NMD connector (Network Measurements Division) was HP's solution to stabilize test port cables on various test sets. With good test port cables, NMD test port connectors, and the anti-rotation clamps (08515-60003 if memory serves me) you can get pretty consistent results. I agree with you that NMD will properly mate with standard connectors but I've seen the results of standard connectors screwed into test ports and without extreme care (which I take for granted everyone exercises with precision connectors, right :0)) the results are usually pretty poor repeatability over a series of measurements and possibly a telltale dip in response at higher frequencies. I didn't intend my answer to mean it couldn't be done, just that there are risks and the NMD was designed to help minimize them. For that you usually pay a premium.
Steve
WB0DBS
?
On 10/16/2015 03:51 PM, Steve Steve-Krull@... [hp_agilent_equipment]
wrote:
> The NMD is a special test port connector, not a standard connector. Have
> a look at the Maury website for pictures. You might be able to fit a
> standard connector to a test port but I wouldn't guarantee the accuracy
> or reliability of the results. I agree 500 USD per NMD connector is a
> big chunk of money; and cable sets are really pricy. You might be able
> to find a pair of connectors at a more reasonable price but you'll find
> that precision connectors demand a higher price. Even if you stop at
> 26.5G you're still faced with getting from the NMD test ports to 3.5mm
> or SMA. I recently passed on a 70820A on eBay for exactly that reason.
> Beware the cheap inter-series adapters if you're after any sort of
> repeatability and reliability.
The NMD connectors are "supersets" of standard connectors, like 3.5mm,
2.4mm, etc. They are designed to be entirely compatible with them, and
are very frequently used in that environment.
-Dave
--
Dave McGuire, AK4HZ
New Kensington, PA
|
I had forgotten, yes, they are 2.4mm. The rest of my post still stands. You cannot interconnect SMA with them, you need an adapter. I went through this when I had to replace the (missing) 2.4mm NDM's on my 70820.
?
On 10/16/15 08:44 PM, Bob Bownes bownes@... [hp_agilent_equipment] wrote:
> They are 2.92mm. The easiest thing to get is 2.92mm to SMA adapters, but
> they are quite pricey at about $100 each.
>
> You can order 2.92mm to *.* test port cables, but, again, expect to pay
> quite a bit. Sometimes you see them on ebay for about $250-$300 each for
> 2.92mm to N or SMA.
I don't know what connectors these, as I don't have one, but I was lead to
believe by someone else they are 2.4 mm. If 2.4 mm as the author states, then
they will not mate to SMA. But if 2.92 mm they will mate to SMA. But of course
they wont have the performance. Also 2.92 mm is very fragile - much more so than
2.4 or 3.5 mm.
One of my VNAs has 3.5 mm NMD connectors on it. I managed to pick up a pair of
adapters to N for about $150, and much the same for adapters to 3.5 mm. I do
also have the proper test port cables, but they are serious money.
Sure you see NMD adapters on eBay for stupid money, but it is not hard to buy
them at a lot less. Many of the people asking $500 will probably take $100-$200
for them if you ask.
Dave
>
>
>
> On Fri, Oct 16, 2015 at 3:14 PM, steve@...
> [hp_agilent_equipment] <hp_agilent_equipment@...> wrote:
>
>>
>> I just got hold of a 70820A microwave transition analyzer, and need either
>> cables or adaptors for the two RF ports. As I understand it, these are
>> APC-2.4 connectors, also known as NMD 2.4mm? Is that correct, two names for
>> the same connector, or is there some difference?
>>
>>
>> I just tried to find some adaptors, a quick look on ePay, one adaptor is
>> coming up at around $500 US, so I'd be spending more on the adaptors than I
>> paid for the whole unit. Anyone know of a more affordable source? I really
>> only want to go up to 26.5GHz, and don't really care about the perfomance
>> any higher.
>>
>>
>>
--
Dr. David Kirkby Ph.D CEng MIET
Kirkby Microwave Ltd
Registered office: Stokes Hall Lodge, Burnham Rd, Althorne, Essex, CM3 6DT, UK.
Registered in England and Wales, company number 08914892.
Tel: 07910 441670 / +44 7910 441670 (0900 to 2100 GMT only please)
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
|
The 70820A uses male 2.4 mm connectors.? I don't think I've seen any with 2.92. ? For interfacing with 3.5mm or (good-quality) SMA M-M cables, I use A350F240F adapters from "rfextra" on eBay.? These were sold for a while at http://cgi.ebay.com/160715492551 for "only" $100 each, but it looks like they're out of stock at the moment. ? -- john, KE5FX ? ?
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
From: hp_agilent_equipment@... [mailto:hp_agilent_equipment@...]
Sent: Friday, October 16, 2015 12:45 PM
To: hp_agilent_equipment@...
Subject: Re: [hp_agilent_equipment] HP 70820A connectors? ? They are 2.92mm. The easiest thing to get is 2.92mm to SMA adapters, but they are quite pricey at about $100 each. You can order 2.92mm to *.* test port cables, but, again, expect to pay quite a bit. Sometimes you see them on ebay for about $250-$300 each for 2.92mm to N or SMA.
|
Dr. David Kirkby - Kirkby Microwave Ltd
On 10/16/15 08:44 PM, Bob Bownes bownes@... [hp_agilent_equipment] wrote: They are 2.92mm. The easiest thing to get is 2.92mm to SMA adapters, but
they are quite pricey at about $100 each.
You can order 2.92mm to *.* test port cables, but, again, expect to pay
quite a bit. Sometimes you see them on ebay for about $250-$300 each for
2.92mm to N or SMA. I don't know what connectors these, as I don't have one, but I was lead to believe by someone else they are 2.4 mm. If 2.4 mm as the author states, then they will not mate to SMA. But if 2.92 mm they will mate to SMA. But of course they wont have the performance. Also 2.92 mm is very fragile - much more so than 2.4 or 3.5 mm. One of my VNAs has 3.5 mm NMD connectors on it. I managed to pick up a pair of adapters to N for about $150, and much the same for adapters to 3.5 mm. I do also have the proper test port cables, but they are serious money. Sure you see NMD adapters on eBay for stupid money, but it is not hard to buy them at a lot less. Many of the people asking $500 will probably take $100-$200 for them if you ask. Dave
On Fri, Oct 16, 2015 at 3:14 PM, steve@...
[hp_agilent_equipment] <hp_agilent_equipment@...> wrote:
I just got hold of a 70820A microwave transition analyzer, and need either
cables or adaptors for the two RF ports. As I understand it, these are
APC-2.4 connectors, also known as NMD 2.4mm? Is that correct, two names for
the same connector, or is there some difference?
I just tried to find some adaptors, a quick look on ePay, one adaptor is
coming up at around $500 US, so I'd be spending more on the adaptors than I
paid for the whole unit. Anyone know of a more affordable source? I really
only want to go up to 26.5GHz, and don't really care about the perfomance
any higher.
-- Dr. David Kirkby Ph.D CEng MIET Kirkby Microwave Ltd Registered office: Stokes Hall Lodge, Burnham Rd, Althorne, Essex, CM3 6DT, UK. Registered in England and Wales, company number 08914892. Tel: 07910 441670 / +44 7910 441670 (0900 to 2100 GMT only please)
|
On 10/16/2015 03:51 PM, Steve Steve-Krull@... [hp_agilent_equipment] wrote: The NMD is a special test port connector, not a standard connector. Have
a look at the Maury website for pictures. You might be able to fit a
standard connector to a test port but I wouldn't guarantee the accuracy
or reliability of the results. I agree 500 USD per NMD connector is a
big chunk of money; and cable sets are really pricy. You might be able
to find a pair of connectors at a more reasonable price but you'll find
that precision connectors demand a higher price. Even if you stop at
26.5G you're still faced with getting from the NMD test ports to 3.5mm
or SMA. I recently passed on a 70820A on eBay for exactly that reason.
Beware the cheap inter-series adapters if you're after any sort of
repeatability and reliability. The NMD connectors are "supersets" of standard connectors, like 3.5mm, 2.4mm, etc. They are designed to be entirely compatible with them, and are very frequently used in that environment. -Dave -- Dave McGuire, AK4HZ New Kensington, PA
|
Steve,
The NMD is a special test port connector, not a standard connector. Have a look at the Maury website for pictures. You might be able to fit a standard connector to a test port but I wouldn't guarantee the accuracy or reliability of the results. I agree 500 USD per NMD connector is a big chunk of money; and cable sets are really pricy. You might be able to find a pair of connectors at a more reasonable price but you'll find that precision connectors demand a higher price. Even if you stop at 26.5G you're still faced with getting from the NMD test ports to 3.5mm or SMA. I recently passed on a 70820A on eBay for exactly that reason. Beware the cheap inter-series adapters if you're after any sort of repeatability and reliability. Steve K.
On Oct 16, 2015, at 2:14 PM, " steve@... [hp_agilent_equipment]" < hp_agilent_equipment@...> wrote:
?
I just got hold of a 70820A microwave transition analyzer, and need either cables or adaptors for the two RF ports. As I understand it, these are APC-2.4 connectors, also known as NMD 2.4mm? Is that correct, two names for the same connector, or is there some difference?
I just tried to find some adaptors, a quick look on ePay, one adaptor is coming up at around $500 US, so I'd be spending more on the adaptors than I paid for the whole unit. Anyone know of a more affordable source? I really only want to go up to 26.5GHz, and don't really care about the perfomance any higher.
|
They are 2.92mm. The easiest thing to get is 2.92mm to SMA adapters, but they are quite pricey at about $100 each.
You can order 2.92mm to *.* test port cables, but, again, expect to pay quite a bit. Sometimes you see them on ebay for about $250-$300 each for 2.92mm to N or SMA.
On Fri, Oct 16, 2015 at 3:14 PM, steve@... [hp_agilent_equipment] <hp_agilent_equipment@...> wrote:
?
I just got hold of a 70820A microwave transition analyzer, and need either cables or adaptors for the two RF ports. As I understand it, these are APC-2.4 connectors, also known as NMD 2.4mm? Is that correct, two names for the same connector, or is there some difference?
I just tried to find some adaptors, a quick look on ePay, one adaptor is coming up at around $500 US, so I'd be spending more on the adaptors than I paid for the whole unit. Anyone know of a more affordable source? I really only want to go up to 26.5GHz, and don't really care about the perfomance any higher.
|
I just got hold of a 70820A microwave transition analyzer, and need either cables or adaptors for the two RF ports. As I understand it, these are APC-2.4 connectors, also known as NMD 2.4mm? Is that correct, two names for the same connector, or is there some difference?
I just tried to find some adaptors, a quick look on ePay, one adaptor is coming up at around $500 US, so I'd be spending more on the adaptors than I paid for the whole unit. Anyone know of a more affordable source? I really only want to go up to 26.5GHz, and don't really care about the perfomance any higher.
|
Re: HP 83592B hangs 8350B sweeper
Peter,
I have an 83594A and an 83595A wth boards that have mismatched part numbers so it may not have been anything nefarious but if so its contagious! There are a couple of boards that don't match any of the manuals I've been able to find, and there are switches that open parts of loops, and pots for adjustments, and none are mentioned in any manual. The "joys" of working on older gear! Steve WB0DBS
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
On Oct 16, 2015, at 10:47 AM, 'Peter' bunge@... [hp_agilent_equipment] < hp_agilent_equipment@...> wrote:
?
Has anyone noticed that boards in HP 8350 plug-ins have part numbers different from the plug-in model? My 83592 has two boards, A6 and A7, that have part numbers starting with 83595-x. The others start 83592-x. ? I know that replacing the A6 board (83595-60106) with a good one (83592-60106) gets the plug-in working, even with the 83595-x A7 board. ? On the bad A6 board I have found that a pot (R63, SRD bias) was missing and the Band 0 jumper was in the B1 position. The board also has two extra pots which are not shown on the schematic or component location. There are seven single turn pots on the top left, viewed from component side. They are shown in the 83595 manual. Did someone try to get it running with the board from a 83595 (0.01 to 26.5 GHz) plug-in? I need to look carefully at every component. The 60106 in the number is the same (83592-60106) and the boards look identical but I¡¯m sure there are component differences as I have found. I do not believe that this is the original board for the plug-in. ? I have seen instruments put together with odd parts before. I have an HP8656A chassis that is part 8656A and part 8657A inside. I gave up troubleshooting when I discovered this. This is a very dishonest practice to do this and sell the items as-is, for parts, etc. ? ?
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Re: HP-8566B, HP-8566A used without display
John,
The display section is more that the CRT circuits; it's also the IF section. Along with the HPIB you'd need to capture the IF signals and do the processing in software. As you said, probably hellish to do, but an interesting project to think about!
I remember some of the ATE from decades ago in the USAF and yes, often the display was done away with. When it came to the metrology lab we had display sections available so we could do the calibration at first, and later I think the labs got ATE capability. I'm not sure how the developers did their magic but I suspect it was a similar method.? Steve WB0DBS
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
On Oct 16, 2015, at 9:09 AM, John Griessen john@... [hp_agilent_equipment] < hp_agilent_equipment@...> wrote:
?
On 10/15/2015 04:48 PM, sgm460122@... [hp_agilent_equipment] wrote:
> You might look into a TFT display replacement.
OK. I don't have an 8566B or a display for it. The question was, Does anyone use
the GPIB port to get SA sweeps and is it practical, or is there much other settings info
that would be missing and make it hellish to do?
I just read that some ATE users didn't buy the display. Did those ATE programmers
always have one with the display to develop on?
John
|
Re: HP 83592B hangs 8350B sweeper
Has anyone noticed that boards in HP 8350 plug-ins have part numbers different from the plug-in model? My 83592 has two boards, A6 and A7, that have part numbers starting with 83595-x. The others start 83592-x. ? I know that replacing the A6 board (83595-60106) with a good one (83592-60106) gets the plug-in working, even with the 83595-x A7 board. ? On the bad A6 board I have found that a pot (R63, SRD bias) was missing and the Band 0 jumper was in the B1 position. The board also has two extra pots which are not shown on the schematic or component location. There are seven single turn pots on the top left, viewed from component side. They are shown in the 83595 manual. Did someone try to get it running with the board from a 83595 (0.01 to 26.5 GHz) plug-in? I need to look carefully at every component. The 60106 in the number is the same (83592-60106) and the boards look identical but I¡¯m sure there are component differences as I have found. I do not believe that this is the original board for the plug-in. ? I have seen instruments put together with odd parts before. I have an HP8656A chassis that is part 8656A and part 8657A inside. I gave up troubleshooting when I discovered this. This is a very dishonest practice to do this and sell the items as-is, for parts, etc. ? ?
|
After the fly-back transformer blew I decided to try an LCD mod for this analyzer.? The A90 Display Board along with all the high-voltage circuits are no longer needed and removed.? It's been several weeks but I have a working version.? There's still an issue but I'm not sure if it can be resolved easily.? HP decided to use vertical line scans (the fast sync) instead of the normal horizontal scans for a normal monitor.? I can only surmise that HP wanted to keep from skewing the data by posting all the "Y" values for a given "X" as the "X" value increments with the graph origin located at the bottom left of the screen.? This is real time plotting so maybe there might be some noticeable distortion to the displayed data had they used a normal CRT scan.?? So now the slow scan becomes the horizontal scan on a typical monitor!? The result is that the display is rotated 90 degrees CW on a standard LCD monitor. I worked out a circuit to emulate an old-school XT color graphics adapter. The added benefit is that the two raster streams (full & half bright) can now be assigned any of the RGB color combinations.? The sync timings with the A60 Digital Display Driver oscillator (22.589 MHz) is too slow to fit an entire line scan on a modern LCD monitor.? I started modifying the display board with several oscillators to see what would happen.? The A60 board also has a selector for the slow sync of 60 Hz (power line frequency) or Free Sync which is tied to the on board oscillator which provides additional modes to test. I tried several oscillators and anything above 24 MHz causes too much jitter with the display and the monitor has a hard time synching with the signal.? I wanted to try a frequency in the 23 MHz range but didn't have a standard oscillator style like the original so I built an oscillator with some inverter gates (74LS04) and a 23.247 MHz crystal.? It's mounted on top of the board with a selector block to choose between the old and the new oscillator. This works fairly well but I would like to get a regular oscillator so I can close up the case. I've added some pictures in my "3561A Repair" photo folder.? I've included the final display results showing success at getting a complete raster display on the LCD monitor so at least it's usable again! Since I'm running at a faster frequency the skewing problem might not be an issue so the main question is - would it be possible to modify the way the pixels are mapped to memory so that it emulates a standard display?? I've got my 1650A Logic Analyzer working but don't have a clue where to start looking at bits and bytes.? There is some description in the manual for the A60 board and it appears that all the addressing is done on the A60 board:? "The byte address consists of two parts: a row address and a column address.? The column address is taken from the upper seven bits of the position address register, the row address is taken from the next seven bits.? The bottom three bits of the position address register are decoded to form the bit address bus (RAM selector)."? I'm thinking that the CPU is assigning the coordinates and the A60 board is converting it to a position address.? If that's the case then there is probably a ROM that needs to be modified (well above my capabilities).? If anyone has a clew HOW or IF re-addressing the pixels is possible please let me know. Gary
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Re: HP-8566B, HP-8566A used without display
On 10/16/2015 10:09 AM, John Griessen john@... [hp_agilent_equipment] wrote: You might look into a TFT display replacement. OK. I don't have an 8566B or a display for it. The question was, Does anyone use
the GPIB port to get SA sweeps and is it practical, or is there much other settings info
that would be missing and make it hellish to do?
I've done it with a 70K-series SA, it's easy to do. I believe the command set is similar to that of the 8566. The 70900 LO/controller has an "8566 compatibility mode" for ATE use. -Dave -- Dave McGuire, AK4HZ New Kensington, PA
|
Re: HP-8566B, HP-8566A used without display
On 10/15/2015 04:48 PM, sgm460122@... [hp_agilent_equipment] wrote: You might look into a TFT display replacement. OK. I don't have an 8566B or a display for it. The question was, Does anyone use the GPIB port to get SA sweeps and is it practical, or is there much other settings info that would be missing and make it hellish to do? I just read that some ATE users didn't buy the display. Did those ATE programmers always have one with the display to develop on? John
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Re: cleaning contaminated boards
If it is a NiCad chances are you have highly alkali potassium salts that will happily eat their way through copper.? In situations like this the approach I take is:
1/ Remove the leaking battery.
2/ Remove as much blue crud as possible with a scalpel and metal scribe/pick, being careful not to damage components and traces, and in some cases where it has eaten its way under solder mask you have to carefully scrape that away to reveal more blue crud.
3/ Neutralise the remaining potassium salts with white wine vinegar.? Dab it on with a stuff brush and scrub firmly but carefully.? Leave it for a while.
4/ Wash the entire board with distilled water, again careful but firm scrubbing.? Repeat a couple of times.
5/ Put board in a warm dry place to thoroughly dry out.? If you can also use a dry air blower aerosol to make sure you blow out any water in tricky places such as under DIPs.
Before doing any of this make sure you do your research on the particular battery chemistry you're up against.
Good luck!
Neil
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Re: Searching for a Pwr/Supp Circuit HP-8591A P/N 0950-1977
Hi Clint, I am sending my hand made diagram ... Best regards / Roumen LZ3RV, Sofia, Bulgaria On Fri, Oct 16, 2015 at 10:21 AM, 'hardy' hardyhansen@... [hp_agilent_equipment] <hp_agilent_equipment@...> wrote:
Hi
I think it son didiers site
Hardy
Fra: hp_agilent_equipment@... [mailto:
hp_agilent_equipment@...]
Sendt: 16. oktober 2015 08:04
Til: hp_agilent_equipment@...
Emne: [hp_agilent_equipment] Re: Searching for a Pwr/Supp Circuit HP-8591A
P/N 0950-1977
Hi Clint,
I have a pdf file and notes from Roumen / LZ3RV.
Did you find it?
QSP to vk4jkl AT wia.org.au
73 John @ irlp 6163
Ingen virus fundet i denne meddelelse.
Kontrolleret af AVG - www.avg.com
Version: 2015.0.6140 / Virusdatabase: 4447/10825 - Udgivelsesdato:
15-10-2015
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
|
Re: Searching for a Pwr/Supp Circuit HP-8591A P/N 0950-1977
Hi
I think it son didiers site
Hardy
Fra: hp_agilent_equipment@... [mailto:hp_agilent_equipment@...]
Sendt: 16. oktober 2015 08:04
Til: hp_agilent_equipment@...
Emne: [hp_agilent_equipment] Re: Searching for a Pwr/Supp Circuit HP-8591A P/N 0950-1977
Hi Clint,
I have a pdf file and notes from Roumen / LZ3RV.
Did you find it?
QSP to vk4jkl AT wia.org.au
73 John @ irlp 6163
Ingen virus fundet i denne meddelelse.
Kontrolleret af AVG - www.avg.com
Version: 2015.0.6140 / Virusdatabase: 4447/10825 - Udgivelsesdato: 15-10-2015
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
|
Re: Searching for a Pwr/Supp Circuit HP-8591A P/N 0950-1977
Hi Clint,
I have a pdf file and notes from Roumen / LZ3RV.
Did you find it?
QSP to vk4jkl AT wia.org.au
73 John @ irlp 6163
|
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
-----Original Message----- From: "wallydoc@... [hp_agilent_equipment]" <hp_agilent_equipment@...>
Sent: Oct 15, 2015 9:53 AM
To: hp_agilent_equipment@...
Subject: [hp_agilent_equipment] HP3325 transistor
I broke and rebuilt a HP 3325A function generator. It appears that everything works up to the power amp.
Power amp has had most transistors replaced and does give out an appropriate signal as far as amplitude.
The wave forms are OK at the test point prior to the final. The output sine waveform from final is distorted and of course square is distorted at higher freq.
I was planning to replace the power amp input dual transistor 1845-0357 (SD2608).I think it's selenium 360mW NPN. I cannot find SD2608 or a cross to it. There is an original 1854-0357 on E Pay. It isn't Selenium, it is a SELected part. Does anyone know what this crosses to? It was replaced with HP 1854-1010, which is a MD918A. This is listed as being replaceable with an NTE81. There are a couple MD918A on Ebay, starting at $4.99 Here is a list of stocking distributors. Keysight states that a limited supply of the 1854-1010 are available for $ 20.17, each. I think that is a pair of 2N918A transistors, on the same die, to reduce drift. That is replaced by the NTE108-1, and Newark has those for 94 cents each. I would use a pair of them to replace a suspect transistor for testing, before spending $21 to $30 for a new part. Do you think this could be the problem?
Any other suggestions as to aligning the final amp? Any particulars as to the replacement of transistors?
Wally KC9INK Michael A. Terrell
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Re: HP-8566B, HP-8566A used without display
?
I must agree with Rich. These are very nice displays and make the 8566/68
SA into a modern instrument. Simmconn has done a very nice job with this
kit.
?
?
Regards,
Tom
?
?
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Thursday, October 15, 2015 5:48
PM
Subject: Re: [hp_agilent_equipment]
HP-8566B, HP-8566A used without display
?
DUH....
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NewScope-8 is
a Color LCD kit for HP 8566A, 8566B, 8568A, 8568B and 8567A Spectrum
Analyzers |
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Preview
by Yahoo |
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You might look into a
TFT display replacement. I have one in my HP-8567A and I am well pleased with
it.
You can look it
here and download the Instruction Manual. You an browse his website and see
what other upgrade kits that he has available.
RICH
From: "John Griessen
john@... [hp_agilent_equipment]"
To:
hp_agilent_equipment@...
Sent: Thursday, October 15, 2015 2:06
PM
Subject:
[hp_agilent_equipment] HP-8566B, HP-8566A used without display
?
Does anyone have
experience programming them with GPIB to make plots?
I'm
wondering if that is a viable option since the displays are so old and
fading...
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bownes
Dave McGuire
Michael A. Terrell