Radu, I'm a little late jumping in, but here goes. I have a couple of issues that impact my bench work. First is that I have vision problems and need magnification to do even basic work. Second is that a year or so ago I developed some neck/shoulder problems that made hunching over to solder painful after a short time at the bench.
For years I'd been using a cheap Chinese stereo microscope and was very happy with that, until the shoulder thing made using it difficult. I decided to switch to a digital microscope with a 24 inch monitor mounted off the back of the bench. I got one of the better-rated Chinese ones from Amazon for, IIRC, around $400 for the basic kit. I'm still getting used to it, but here are a few thoughts:
1. Not having stereo vision makes soldering very different, but you do get used to it, and pretty quickly. It's not the problem I thought it would be, but it still requires adaptation.
2. Most of the moderately priced digital units don't have a "true" zoom in that the focus (or inverse, working distance) shifts as the magnification changes. This is a real pain when you want to zoom in to inspect something. Were I to do it again, I'd spend a couple hundred more if necessary to get a true zoom with stable focus.
3. With the lack of 3-D, lighting becomes very important. The ring light around the lens is good most of the time, but having a light that you can shine from an angle sometimes makes a tremendous difference. I haven't tried it yet, but Dave at eevblog did a video showing how much difference using polarized light can make, too.
4. Be aware that there are a multitude of different mounting tube and fitting sizes used on microscopes, both analog and digital. I wasted a bunch of time and money on pieces that didn't fit together. (I was trying to come up with a wall-mount so that vibrations on the bench wouldn't shake the image. I'm still not there yet.)
Hope this helps.
John
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On 3/17/25 14:59, Radu Bogdan Dicher via groups.io wrote:
Thank you all, great input.
From these choices, it sounds like a stereo microscope on a boom would be ideal. I do tend to work on all sorts of positions and oftentimes spill outside of the desk/bench. Also, some of the boards I need to examine are too large to fit under a microscope with a stand.? I'm not sure exactly how well this relative freedom to move the microscope around works. But the idea to have that available is very exciting - I'm really tired of using my multiple hand magnifiers with their own lights and often another flashlight on the other hand. My eyes get terribly strained with that setup.
Probably a stupid question, but I know nothing on the "stereo microscope" topic - are these working well for people wearing glasses?
Thank you.
Radu.
On Mon, Mar 17, 2025, 10:29 AM John Griessen via groups.io < groups.io> <john@... <mailto:[email protected]>> wrote:
On 3/17/25 07:59, Dave McGuire via groups.io <> wrote:
> On 3/17/25 00:02, Radu Bogdan Dicher via groups.io <
groups.io> wrote:
>> Having done enough (red) eye cracking smd soldering jobs or
inspections in case of suspected failure (cold joints, etc.), I've
>> decided to invest a bit on a better optical setup.
>> There's plenty of cameras on the marketplaces and retailers out
there, but what are some better choices? Good experiences with
>> some specific models?
>> Also, what to watch for? Specs, minimal magnification that
crosses over a good threshold?
>> I have a couple of large screens at my bench - I'm thinking this
will be best done by shooting this over to one of those. USB,
>> HDMI?...
>> Lighting/LEDs making a significant difference?
>> Thank you for your input.
>
>? ? The Mantis by Vision Engineering.
>
>? ? On the prototyping bench I moved from a Nikon SMZ-1 with an
after-market LED ring light to a 1st-generation Mantis about ten
> years ago, and upgraded to a Mantis Elite last year.
>
>? ? The Nikon is a binocular inspection microscope with great
optics (typical of Nikon) and excellent overall performance.? I had
> an opportunity to try out a Mantis when visiting a customer's
lab.? I was astonished by its capabilities and purchased one
> immediately.
>
>? ? My upgrade to the Mantis Elite last year was a similarly
impressive thing.
>
>? ? Two important considerations are binocular optical paths and
lighting.
>
>? ? Binocular optics are, IMO, absolutely required for SMT work.
>
>? ? Lighting is next.? People often skimp on this and use a random
desk lamp or whatever happens to be lying around, but a proper
> lighting system makes all the difference.? There are cheap
aftermarket LED right lights that are surprisingly effective; this
> suggests that the lighting really isn't that difficult a problem
to solve.? The key is 360-degree, oblique, even lighting to
> eliminate shadows.? (lighting is built-in on the Mantis microscopes)
>
>? ???????????? -Dave
Hi Radu,
I've got Greenough scopes (binocular) by Olympus and Vision
Engineering (precursor to Mantis), and fiber light rings and sources
to sell.
The Vision Engineering ones are kind of large, but trying an
Olympus? Greenough would be painless -- you could return it if not
liking it.
When I assemble SMT boards I use a Greenough on a boom that lets me
move with fine dials in X and Y (and of course Z for focus).
I've also tried the Vision Engineering and it would probably be a
speedup tool, but Ive not afforded enough bench top space to use
one effectively yet.
Also have Nikon SMZ-7 and a? Vision Engineering Greenough for sale.
Booms to hold them are super heavy, so looking locally makes the
most sense.
I agree with Dave, that if you want to do prototypes your speed and
quality will
improve drastically with stereo vision -- it puts your "there" in
the micro world...? Also you will notice more since flat view
onscreen doesn't translate to 3D in your mind well.
The large screens might be OK for some things, but not for active
seeing when looking for tiny cracks, missing solder, adequate
solder paste, etc.
Now to get busy cleaning and photographing the ones I mentioned...
--
John Griessen
Albuquerque NM
