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The last bits arrived last week and I'm working on my initial implementation of the TinySA, building the filters "ugly" style. I'm also considering making small PCBs for the filters, both low pass and the IF bandpass filter.
I'm using the EPCOS B3555 434MHz SAW filter from the eBay seller in Poland. It is in a QCC8C package and I've hit a snag. I can't find an existing footprint for that package. Does anyone know of/have a footprint for it for any hobbyist available CAD package? My preference is kicad but others (e.g. Eagle) would be fine.?
If no one has this I guess I'll need to consider learning how create kicad footprints ... or maybe just live with ugly construction :-)
Dave L.
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Hi Dave. I can send you the footprint. What EDA software are you using? 73, Ion VA3NOI
On Mon, Feb 10, 2020, 12:21 Dave VE3LHO < dave@...> wrote: The last bits arrived last week and I'm working on my initial implementation of the TinySA, building the filters "ugly" style. I'm also considering making small PCBs for the filters, both low pass and the IF bandpass filter.
I'm using the EPCOS B3555 434MHz SAW filter from the eBay seller in Poland. It is in a QCC8C package and I've hit a snag. I can't find an existing footprint for that package. Does anyone know of/have a footprint for it for any hobbyist available CAD package? My preference is kicad but others (e.g. Eagle) would be fine.?
If no one has this I guess I'll need to consider learning how create kicad footprints ... or maybe just live with ugly construction :-)
Dave L.
--
Ion
VA3NOI
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kicad but as I said if you have it in a format compatible with any of the software available to hobbyists that would be great.I'm only intending to use this for a small board (i.e. just the BP filter for the TinySA) right now.
Thanks!
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Oops,? I have the 6 pin footprint. You can get it built for you if you go to . They offer this service. That is how I've got mine (the 6 pin). You have to provide them a spec sheet with the drawn footprint, with all dimensions. Do you have the spec sheet for the part you bought? I can look the package up for you and make the request myself as I am collecting the parts for the same project. 73, Ion
On Mon, Feb 10, 2020, 12:35 Dave VE3LHO < dave@...> wrote: kicad but as I said if you have it in a format compatible with any of the software available to hobbyists that would be great.I'm only intending to use this for a small board (i.e. just the BP filter for the TinySA) right now.
Thanks!
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Ion
VA3NOI
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Just made the request for the part and it was accepted. It takes about 24 hours to get it done. Ion VA3NOI
On Mon, Feb 10, 2020, 12:21 Dave VE3LHO < dave@...> wrote: The last bits arrived last week and I'm working on my initial implementation of the TinySA, building the filters "ugly" style. I'm also considering making small PCBs for the filters, both low pass and the IF bandpass filter.
I'm using the EPCOS B3555 434MHz SAW filter from the eBay seller in Poland. It is in a QCC8C package and I've hit a snag. I can't find an existing footprint for that package. Does anyone know of/have a footprint for it for any hobbyist available CAD package? My preference is kicad but others (e.g. Eagle) would be fine.?
If no one has this I guess I'll need to consider learning how create kicad footprints ... or maybe just live with ugly construction :-)
Dave L.
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Ion
VA3NOI
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Interesting service. I'll have to keep it in mind.
I guess, since you've made the request, you already have the data sheet with package profile but just in case its available here:
?
Thanks for doing this. I appreciate it.
Dave L.
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On Mon, Feb 10, 2020 at 10:08 AM, Ion Petroianu, VA3NOI wrote:
Just made the request for the part and it was accepted. It takes about 24 hours to get it done.
Ion
VA3NOI
On Mon, Feb 10, 2020, 12:21 Dave VE3LHO < dave@...> wrote: The last bits arrived last week and I'm working on my initial implementation of the TinySA, building the filters "ugly" style. I'm also considering making small PCBs for the filters, both low pass and the IF bandpass filter.
I'm using the EPCOS B3555 434MHz SAW filter from the eBay seller in Poland. It is in a QCC8C package and I've hit a snag. I can't find an existing footprint for that package. Does anyone know of/have a footprint for it for any hobbyist available CAD package? My preference is kicad but others (e.g. Eagle) would be fine.?
If no one has this I guess I'll need to consider learning how create kicad footprints ... or maybe just live with ugly construction :-)
Dave L.
--
Ion
VA3NOI
|
On Mon, Feb 10, 2020 at 09:21 AM, Dave VE3LHO wrote:
I'm using the EPCOS B3555 434MHz SAW filter from the eBay seller in Poland. It is in a QCC8C package and I've hit a snag. I can't find an existing footprint for that package. Does anyone know of/have a footprint for it for any hobbyist available CAD package?
I made an order yesterday for:?
Since they already had pre-made PCB's and the size is so small.... just in case I ordered one:?
I asked about the performance of the Johanson Tech. 39nH inductors (?with this package per the B39431-B3740 datasheet and David (from rfextra) replied that he will be performing some testing with the SAW filter, PCB and inductor per the matching network spec and will post in the listing and reply.? I'm thinking if you ask, he might share, since he may have the layout readily available assuming the package footprint is the same.?
I think this is the last piece of hardware to make a like-for-like type design for comparison of performance of my work.? Being that this SAW listing has ten per order... I have a few to practice making my own PCB's with.? I still haven't practices soldering the 0603 size yet and was thinking about buying an inductor kit also to have a range of inductors.? Thinking will order the kit from mdflyelectronics to have with the resistor and capacitor 0603 kit for future experimenting with.?
I do have a roll of 0ohm resistors to practice with too before hand and see there are board practice kits for about a dollar also thinking won't hurt the budget... then again probably just as easy to desolder and resolder some salvage boards to practice on:?
?
?
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On Mon, Feb 10, 2020 at 12:04 PM, jafinch78 . wrote:
On Mon, Feb 10, 2020 at 09:21 AM, Dave VE3LHO wrote:
I'm using the EPCOS B3555 434MHz SAW filter from the eBay seller in Poland. It is in a QCC8C package and I've hit a snag. I can't find an existing footprint for that package. Does anyone know of/have a footprint for it for any hobbyist available CAD package?
.. stuff deleted ...
I'm thinking if you ask, he might share, since he may have the layout readily available assuming the package footprint is the same.?
A pretty good suggestion but unfortunately that SAW filter is in a different package (DCC6 versus QCC8).
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On Mon, Feb 10, 2020 at 01:11 PM, Dave VE3LHO wrote:
A pretty good suggestion but unfortunately that SAW filter is in a different package (DCC6 versus QCC8).
Yeah, I didn't search through all his PCB's for the different components he offers... though know he has quite a few.? Not sure if any are? QCC8 package... though figured might be worth asking him.?
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Maybe not as nice but building the filter dead bug style does deliver good performance. The out of band rejection is at least 70dB, Combined with the SI4432 out of band rejection you get about 100dB which is sufficient. -- HBTE Files section:? /g/HBTE/filesErik, PD0EK
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I have received a message from Mouser telling me that my request for QCC8C footprint has been discarded due to insufficient information in the data sheet. We are left with the only option of creating it ourselves. I will try to do it in Eagle and see what comes out. Ion VA3NOI
On Mon, Feb 10, 2020, 12:21 Dave VE3LHO < dave@...> wrote: The last bits arrived last week and I'm working on my initial implementation of the TinySA, building the filters "ugly" style. I'm also considering making small PCBs for the filters, both low pass and the IF bandpass filter.
I'm using the EPCOS B3555 434MHz SAW filter from the eBay seller in Poland. It is in a QCC8C package and I've hit a snag. I can't find an existing footprint for that package. Does anyone know of/have a footprint for it for any hobbyist available CAD package? My preference is kicad but others (e.g. Eagle) would be fine.?
If no one has this I guess I'll need to consider learning how create kicad footprints ... or maybe just live with ugly construction :-)
Dave L.
--
Ion
VA3NOI
|
I have a footprint I made myself (KiCAD), but at work at the moment so no access to the PC.? I will put on the files section this evening if I remember.
73
Dave M0WID
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I have made many a custom footprint in ExpressPCB, how hard could it
be?
You just make a pad, copy it a few times and then group it as a
component.
I do have Kicad, I do know it is almost impossible to get started
on...
But I see it has a component wizard.
73,
Gary
WB6OGD
On 2/11/2020 4:36 AM, Ion Petroianu,
VA3NOI wrote:
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
I have received a message from Mouser telling me
that my request for QCC8C footprint has been discarded due to
insufficient information in the data sheet.
We are left with the only option of creating it
ourselves.
I will try to do it in Eagle and see what comes
out.
Ion
VA3NOI
On Mon, Feb 10, 2020, 12:21
Dave VE3LHO < dave@...> wrote:
The last
bits arrived last week and I'm working on my initial
implementation of the TinySA, building the filters "ugly"
style. I'm also considering making small PCBs for the filters,
both low pass and the IF bandpass filter.
I'm using the EPCOS B3555 434MHz SAW filter from the eBay
seller in Poland. It is in a QCC8C package and I've hit a
snag. I can't find an existing footprint for that package.
Does anyone know of/have a footprint for it for any hobbyist
available CAD package? My preference is kicad but others (e.g.
Eagle) would be fine.?
If no one has this I guess I'll need to consider learning how
create kicad footprints ... or maybe just live with ugly
construction :-)
Dave L.
--
Ion
VA3NOI
|
Erik,
Your ugly style SAW filter board is actually quite pretty!
And if you are getting 70dB of stopband suppression, plenty effective.
Could work better than many attempts at an etched board.
An etched board that only has a groundplane on the back
would need lots of feedthroughs to connect ground points.
Feedthroughs have inductance, and that groundplane is 1.5mm further away.
(In this case, an etched board could have an almost solid ground plane on the front.)
I have had that center SMA pin try to rotate when connecting a cable,
so I try to leave a land of copper at an SMA to solder the pin to.
Otherwise those caps can break.
An alternative might be some 1 meg resistors in a 1206 package
from center pin to the ground pins,?adding strength there.
Sufficient grounding as you have done is important.
Not obvious, but you have left copper under each SAW filter
connecting ?the two halves of the ground plane, that's important.
I'd probably leave the entire ground plane intact except for
a small island on each end for the SMA pin.
I would have thought it might need a shield through the middle?
to isolate one SAW filter from the other, but 70dB is good enough.
Jerry, KE7ER
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On Tue, Feb 11, 2020 at 01:09 AM, <erik@...> wrote:
Maybe not as nice but building the filter dead bug style does deliver good performance.
The out of band rejection is at least 70dB, Combined with the SI4432 out of band rejection you get about 100dB which is sufficient.
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I use Teflon tape to isolate parts of the PCB such as under the sma center line. The PCB is solid copper -- HBTE Files section:? /g/HBTE/filesErik, PD0EK
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Correction:? Those are inductors, not caps.
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Show quoted text
On Tue, Feb 11, 2020 at 08:10 AM, Jerry Gaffke wrote:
I have had that center SMA pin try to rotate when connecting a cable,
so I try to leave a land of copper at an SMA to solder the pin to.
Otherwise those caps can break.
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Ah, that makes sense.
And I vaguely recall now that you may have stated?
you were using tape in a previous post.
I thought I was seeing the fiber in the exposed fiberglass.
Jerry
On Tue, Feb 11, 2020 at 08:15 AM, <erik@...> wrote:
I use Teflon tape to isolate parts of the PCB such as under the sma center line. The PCB is solid copper
--
HBTE Files section:?/g/HBTE/files
Erik, PD0EK
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Footprint QCC8C is the same as Murata footprint SM5050-8, for which I have found libraries (symbol and footprint) and uploaded them in the files section, in the folder VA3NOI.
Part number is a resonator (RO3101C)
73,?
Ion
VA3NOI
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It is actually pretty nice isn't it? Gives me inspiration to make something as nice :-)
Ugly style is going to be my first attempt but I have 50 of the filters and a bunch of the inductors and caps (at pennies a piece I couldn't just order the 3~4 I really needed)? so I'm going to experiment. We'll see if the etched pcb works better (or worse) than my ugly version. Everything you say is true but none the less pcb are generally "better".
I am a little concerned about the SMA connector center pin rotating. In my case it would be both a cap and an inductor that could be destroyed and I am considering some kind of small small land at each connector so I can solder them.
Dave
VE3LHO
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Show quoted text
On Tue, Feb 11, 2020 at 08:10 AM, Jerry Gaffke wrote:
Erik,
Your ugly style SAW filter board is actually quite pretty!
And if you are getting 70dB of stopband suppression, plenty effective.
Could work better than many attempts at an etched board.
An etched board that only has a groundplane on the back
would need lots of feedthroughs to connect ground points.
Feedthroughs have inductance, and that groundplane is 1.5mm further away.
(In this case, an etched board could have an almost solid ground plane on the front.)
I have had that center SMA pin try to rotate when connecting a cable,
so I try to leave a land of copper at an SMA to solder the pin to.
Otherwise those caps can break.
An alternative might be some 1 meg resistors in a 1206 package
from center pin to the ground pins,?adding strength there.
Sufficient grounding as you have done is important.
Not obvious, but you have left copper under each SAW filter
connecting ?the two halves of the ground plane, that's important.
I'd probably leave the entire ground plane intact except for
a small island on each end for the SMA pin.
I would have thought it might need a shield through the middle?
to isolate one SAW filter from the other, but 70dB is good enough.
Jerry, KE7ER
On Tue, Feb 11, 2020 at 01:09 AM, <erik@...> wrote:
Maybe not as nice but building the filter dead bug style does deliver good performance.
The out of band rejection is at least 70dB, Combined with the SI4432 out of band rejection you get about 100dB which is sufficient.
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Thanks. Looks good overall.
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
On Tue, Feb 11, 2020 at 12:59 PM, Ion Petroianu, VA3NOI wrote:
Footprint QCC8C is the same as Murata footprint SM5050-8, for which I have found libraries (symbol and footprint) and uploaded them in the files section, in the folder VA3NOI.
Part number is a resonator (RO3101C)
73,?
Ion
VA3NOI
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Ion Petroianu
jafinch78 .
