Re: mounting a SCRTCH volume

#1760

Which is why we need to be very careful regarding that example of Z/OS on Mr. Peabody's systems and be even more so regarding its use. (I donot need to explain that connection now do I?)

No, I'm not in DeNile.?

Re: mounting a SCRTCH volume

#1759

Hello!
I remember, just not the content of the conversation, one with an
IBMer when they certified Linux as one of their guests, a discussion.
We met over lunch that day, and spent the time talking. Finally the
subject of Hercules came up, he commented that the company was
considering legal action against the emulator. ( believe it was
finally quashed when they found out it was a perfect teaching vehicle.
I raised the subject of VM/370 release 6. I'd asked about having the
company release all of the product, not just the bits we had already.
He said no. I asked why. He raised several reasons, none of which made
sense to me then or now.

I suspect that if someone had the entire collection of the product
here, and MVS/370, which eventually became the release most of you
run, and made it available directly. Nothing would happen immediately.
It would only happen if someone from IBM did see it announced here.

Which is why we need to be very careful regarding that example of Z/OS
on  Mr. Peabody's systems and be even more so regarding its use. (I do
not need to explain that connection now do I?)
-----
Gregg C Levine gregg.drwho8@...
"This signature fought the Time Wars, time and again."

On Tue, Nov 24, 2020 at 12:00 AM Jeffrey Melton via groups.io
<melman74@...> wrote:

[Edited Message Follows]
[Reason: EDIT: MVS/XA was released in 1983, not 1981.]

I don't claim to be a legal expert, but I am a subscriber to Moshix's YouTube channel, where only a year or two ago Moshix and a number of other hobbyists were formally engaged with IBM, attempting to persuade them to release to our community the distribution and source for MVS/XA, a vintage 1983 release.

IBM turned them down flat.

So I myself would definitely assume nothing regarding IBM's allowing a vintage 2011 release of Z/OS somehow finding its way to a well-known public domain site.

Put another way, if it WERE legal, we would certainly be hearing about it, most of all from IBM themselves, as it would be to IBM's great PR advantage to publicize such a massive release of proprietary intellectual property to the public domain.  Does such a press release exist?  Not that I've been able to Google...

As I don't want the legal department of Big Blue knocking on my door anytime soon, I'll be sticking to MVS 3.8j and the other known public domain OSs until I hear differently from IBM.And this space belongs to Lando Calrissian because he bought it.

Re: mounting a SCRTCH volume

#1758

开云体育

Yeah, I agree with ALL of your points, but alas I had to ask.? Like I said I figured I knew the answer.? And, no I would not like to see an army of IBM lawyers going after anyone.

?

One would think for the PR value they would, however I am not them.

?

But it would be nice to have, if I was dreaming.

?

Dave,

N8ZFM

?

From: <[email protected]> on behalf of "Jeffrey Melton via groups.io" <melman74@...>
Reply-To: "[email protected]" <[email protected]>
Date: Monday, November 23, 2020 at 11:41 PM
To: "[email protected]" <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: [H390-MVS] mounting a SCRTCH volume

?

I don't claim to be a legal expert, but I am a subscriber to Moshix's YouTube channel, where only a year or two ago Moshix and a number of other hobbyists were formally engaged with IBM, attempting to persuade them to release to our community the distribution and source for MVS/XA, a vintage 1981 release.

IBM turned them down flat.

So I myself would definitely assume nothing regarding IBM's allowing a vintage 2011 release of Z/OS somehow finding its way to a well-known public domain site.?

Put another way, if it WERE legal, we would certainly be hearing about it, most of all from IBM themselves, as it would be to IBM's great PR advantage to publicize such a massive release of proprietary intellectual property to the public domain.? Does such a press release exist?? Not that I've been able to Google...

As I don't want the legal department of Big Blue knocking on my door anytime soon, I'll be sticking to MVS 3.8j and the other known public domain OSs until I hear differently from IBM.

--
This message was scanned by ESVA and is believed to be clean.

Re: mounting a SCRTCH volume

#1757
Edited

I don't claim to be a legal expert, but I am a subscriber to Moshix's YouTube channel, where only a year or two ago Moshix and a number of other hobbyists were formally engaged with IBM, attempting to persuade them to release to our community the distribution and source for MVS/XA, a vintage 1983 release.

IBM turned them down flat.

So I myself would definitely assume nothing regarding IBM's allowing a vintage 2011 release of Z/OS somehow finding its way to a well-known public domain site.?

Put another way, if it WERE legal, we would certainly be hearing about it, most of all from IBM themselves, as it would be to IBM's great PR advantage to publicize such a massive release of proprietary intellectual property to the public domain.? Does such a press release exist?? Not that I've been able to Google...

As I don't want the legal department of Big Blue knocking on my door anytime soon, I'll be sticking to MVS 3.8j and the other known public domain OSs until I hear differently from IBM.

Re: Windows build with VS2019 [Was: Newbie question about REVIEW/RPF etc]

#1756

Thanks, Bill and Fish!?

I'll try following your steps in my VM and see if I can get it to work.? Myself I don't like using the MS development tools for several reasons - besides your moving target issue, I feel like they are way more bloated than they need to be, even when installing just the tools one needs to complete a given build.? That, and they are difficult to cleanly remove from a Windows installation - I've resorted on more than one occasion to just resetting my windows environment to effectively uninstall Visual Studio 201?. (I think it was 2013 but don't remember for sure...)

That's also why from here on out I'll only install and use Visual Studio on a VM - it's just too much of a hassle to use on a real computer that cannot be dedicated to just one project...

Fish, I know you had your reasons for moving from Cygwin/GCC to VS.? But myself, I'd prefer to use Cygwin/mingw to build on windows because it's so much leaner and easier to clean off/reconfigure when needed...? I've used both Cygwin and MinGW to build GnuCOBOL, for example, and they worked great.? One can quite easily setup and isolate multiple Cygwin/MinGW environments on the same machine too - I wouldn't even want to try doing that with VS.

Re: mounting a SCRTCH volume

#1755

开云体育

So, silly question on my part and I think I know the answer – yeah its there freely available on archive.org, with of course zPDT. The documentation clearly states that you must have a USB key for zPDT and you can only get it from IBM.?

?

But of course we all here know of another way it could be IPL’ed and it does look like the full ADCD disk set.

?

The fact it is freely downloadable on a well-known public domain site, is not permission from IBM to download a copy?? As in like it’s a mistake that its there and will be removed as soon as they get a notice from IBM, probably.

?

Or does its presence there, now mind you this is a 2011 version so 9 years old, which to most software would be in a museum, (would anyone even want to run a 9 year old version of Windows?)

?

Is IBM allowing it to be there?? Would be nice of them, and of course IBM is never been accused of being nice when it comes to giving anything away (no offense, it is capitalism).

?

Not proposing any kind of piracy at all, is anyone aware of a change in the rules from IBM?

?

Of couse I am not advocating telling IBM its there and then asking for permission as who knows they may try to inflict a penalty for the fact its there and I am not ratting on anyone.

?

Thanks,

Dave N8ZFM

?

Hi Rahim,

These are forums for the freely available Hercules emulator, not IBM's own mainframe emulation product zPDT.? Even if you legally have the right to obtain Z/OS 1.11 ADCD, you can't (legally) run it on the Hercules emulator, you must run it on zPDT.

?

Re: [Marketing Mail] Re: [H390-MVS] Newbie question about REVIEW/RPF etc

#1754

Thanks Bill,

I think right now I have enough (terminal) emulators.? I have Vista v1 and v2 from Tom Brennan, the freeware wc3270 and wx3270 built on Linux's w3270, and a running 90 day trial of IBM Personal Communications.? One thing I will say for the free/reasonable priced emulators (Vista and the w3270 descendants), I think they are better than or just as good as IBM's - they more than meet my needs as a Hercules hobbyist.? I personally wish Tom Brennan was continuing development on Vista, because that would otherwise be my go-to terminal emulator.

Am I personally interested in the "Master the Mainframe" program?? Not right now.? I'd rather tinker around in my own Herc/MVS3.8 environment, either with TK4- or in my own sysgenned MVS 3.8.? Were I to be seriously considering getting back into mainframe programming as a career, I'd pursue MtM more earnestly at that point.? Right now, I've got plenty to keep me entertained for awhile what with relearning JCL, playing as system programmer, using KICKS, playing with all of the MVS 3.8j compilers, retrograding various COBOL programs I've written over the years to work with our 1972 COBOL compiler, learning/using VSAM instead of a database, getting into PL/I, learning mainframe assembly language, and using REXX and TSO CLISTs.

As far as the original reason for my post, I will be installing the latest version of RPF on a TK4- environment shortly and will let you all know what I find out as far as the screen behavior.? As Rob has said above, the latest version should work with my ideal custom terminal size (150x43), so we'll see...

Re: mounting a SCRTCH volume

#1753

Hi Rahim,

These are forums for the freely available Hercules emulator, not IBM's own mainframe emulation product zPDT.? Even if you legally have the right to obtain Z/OS 1.11 ADCD, you can't (legally) run it on the Hercules emulator, you must run it on zPDT.

On Hercules we run public domain IBM operating systems such as MVS 3.8j.? To run any version of MVS or Z beyond that on Hercules would be contrary to IBM's copyrights.

If you need help with zPDT and a z/OS question, you will probably have better luck seeking help from your official IBM channels. As an approved ISV with a zPDT license and access to the z/os ADCD library,? you or your sponsor have likely paid a lot of $$$ for you to have those official support channels available to you; you should use them rather than seeking out help on a hobbyist community with a completely different emulation product than that which you are working with.?

Re: mounting a SCRTCH volume

#1752

Hello!
And if that's the case gang we need to be very careful. While we are
not attempting to catch a rabbit, instead we are watching the
activities of someone with an OS which is still copyrighted by IBM,
and, ah, technically should not be stored over there. (Right next to
Sherman and Mr. Peabody if anyone is interested.)
-----
Gregg C Levine gregg.drwho8@...
"This signature fought the Time Wars, time and again."

On Mon, Nov 23, 2020 at 7:57 PM Kevin Monceaux <Kevin@...> wrote:

On Tue, Nov 24, 2020 at 12:28:39AM +0000, Jeremy Nicoll wrote:

On Mon, 23 Nov 2020, at 20:52, Rahim Azizarab via groups.io wrote:
Z111 from archiveThat said, what exactly IS "z111"?   The name means nothing to me nor google.Having recently noticed it was there myself, I suspect Z111 from archive
translates to the Z/OS 1.11 ADCD that is available on Archive.org.

--

Kevin



Bruceville, TX

What's the definition of a legacy system? One that works!
Errare humanum est, ignoscere caninum.
And so far this space is still being watched by the Rebel Alliance.
For the Wookiees.

Re: mounting a SCRTCH volume

#1751

On Tue, Nov 24, 2020 at 12:28:39AM +0000, Jeremy Nicoll wrote:

On Mon, 23 Nov 2020, at 20:52, Rahim Azizarab via groups.io wrote:
Z111 from archiveThat said, what exactly IS "z111"?   The name means nothing to me nor google.Having recently noticed it was there myself, I suspect Z111 from archive
translates to the Z/OS 1.11 ADCD that is available on Archive.org.

-- 

Kevin

Bruceville, TX

What's the definition of a legacy system? One that works!
Errare humanum est, ignoscere caninum.

Re: mounting a SCRTCH volume

#1750

Jeremy,

(whispering) I think this is Z/OS V1R11.

Chris
-- 
 <cjar1950@...>



----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
On Tue, 24 Nov 2020 00:28:39 +0000
"Jeremy Nicoll" <yahgrp87@...> wrote:
On Mon, 23 Nov 2020, at 20:52, Rahim Azizarab via groups.io wrote:
Z111 from archiveSorry, I wasn't clear.  I didn't mean now as a one-of answer to my question; I meant 
I thought you should say this every time you ask a question, so that people whose
experience is limited to MVS 3.8 know you're not using the same thing.

That said, what exactly IS "z111"?   The name means nothing to me nor google.

-- 
Jeremy Nicoll - my opinions are my own.

Re: mounting a SCRTCH volume

#1749

On Mon, 23 Nov 2020, at 20:52, Rahim Azizarab via groups.io wrote:
Z111 from archiveSorry, I wasn't clear.  I didn't mean now as a one-of answer to my question; I meant 
I thought you should say this every time you ask a question, so that people whose
experience is limited to MVS 3.8 know you're not using the same thing.

That said, what exactly IS "z111"?   The name means nothing to me nor google.

-- 
Jeremy Nicoll - my opinions are my own.

Re: [Marketing Mail] Re: [H390-MVS] Newbie question about REVIEW/RPF etc

Bill Lewis

#1748

I learned about it myself on the Moshix Mainframe Discord channel.

(maybe this link works)

Bill

Show quoted text

On Mon, Nov 23, 2020 at 06:08 PM, Doug Wegscheid wrote:

Dorsnt that training have a price tag?

On Mon, Nov 23, 2020 at 6:00 PM, Bill Lewis

<wrljet@...> wrote:

If you enroll in IBM's "Master the Mainframe" online training they will give you a free license for TN3270.
(or at least they did when I signed up back in May)

If you have a .EDU email address, you can register someplace else on IBM's website and
get a free licensed copy of PCOMM v14.0 for Windows.?
(where that was exactly I can't remember at the moment)

Bill

Re: [Marketing Mail] Re: [H390-MVS] Newbie question about REVIEW/RPF etc

Bill Lewis

#1747

On Mon, Nov 23, 2020 at 06:08 PM, Doug Wegscheid wrote:

Dorsnt that training have a price tag?

No.

On Mon, Nov 23, 2020 at 6:00 PM, Bill Lewis

<wrljet@...> wrote:

If you enroll in IBM's "Master the Mainframe" online training they will give you a free license for TN3270.
(or at least they did when I signed up back in May)

If you have a .EDU email address, you can register someplace else on IBM's website and
get a free licensed copy of PCOMM v14.0 for Windows.?
(where that was exactly I can't remember at the moment)

Bill

Re: [Marketing Mail] Re: [H390-MVS] Newbie question about REVIEW/RPF etc

#1746

Dorsnt that training have a price tag?

Show quoted text

On Mon, Nov 23, 2020 at 6:00 PM, Bill Lewis
<wrljet@...> wrote:

If you enroll in IBM's "Master the Mainframe" online training they will give you a free license for TN3270.
(or at least they did when I signed up back in May)

If you have a .EDU email address, you can register someplace else on IBM's website and
get a free licensed copy of PCOMM v14.0 for Windows.?
(where that was exactly I can't remember at the moment)

Bill

Re: [Marketing Mail] Re: [H390-MVS] Newbie question about REVIEW/RPF etc

Bill Lewis

#1745

If you enroll in IBM's "Master the Mainframe" online training they will give you a free license for TN3270.
(or at least they did when I signed up back in May)

If you have a .EDU email address, you can register someplace else on IBM's website and
get a free licensed copy of PCOMM v14.0 for Windows.?
(where that was exactly I can't remember at the moment)

Bill

Re: mounting a SCRTCH volume

#1744

Z111 from archive

regards;

Rahim 
?? 

??

On Monday, November 23, 2020, 2:20:37 PM CST, Jeremy Nicoll <yahgrp87@...> wrote:

On Mon, 23 Nov 2020, at 17:52, Rahim Azizarab via groups.io wrote:
> Good thinking,? I looked in VATLIST00 and it is all wrong.

>? VATDEF IPLUSE(PRIVATE),SYSUSE(PRIVATE)

When did that get added to what's valid in VATLSTxx?

Rahim, it might be useful if you mentioned which version of MVS or z/OS
you're trying to use.

There's no point in people here directing you to MVS 3.8 help pages if
you'd be better off reading the current z/OS manuals.

--
Jeremy Nicoll - my opinions are my own.

Re: mounting a SCRTCH volume

#1743

On Mon, 23 Nov 2020, at 17:52, Rahim Azizarab via groups.io wrote:
Good thinking,  I looked in VATLIST00 and it is all wrong.  VATDEF IPLUSE(PRIVATE),SYSUSE(PRIVATE) When did that get added to what's valid in VATLSTxx?

Rahim, it might be useful if you mentioned which version of MVS or z/OS
you're trying to use.

There's no point in people here directing you to MVS 3.8 help pages if 
you'd be better off reading the current z/OS manuals.

-- 
Jeremy Nicoll - my opinions are my own.

Re: mounting a SCRTCH volume

#1742

I added more than one line as it was totally wrong.? Bingo, I am in.? It helps to discuss problems for sometimes one does not see the obvious.? I am willing to share the image if anyone wants.

Thanks;

regards;

Rahim 
? 

??

On Monday, November 23, 2020, 1:50:21 PM CST, René Ferland <ferland.rene@...> wrote:

>> I looked in VATLIST00 and it is all wrong.

?

I am not so sure, but I am no expert. My suggestion was just to add the line:

?

SY2PKB,0,0,3390 ? ?,Y

with SY2PKB initialized with that volser.

Cheers,

Rene FERLAND, Montreal

?

Re: mounting a SCRTCH volume

#1741

>> I looked in VATLIST00 and it is all wrong.

?

I am not so sure, but I am no expert. My suggestion was just to add the line:

?

SY2PKB,0,0,3390 ? ?,Y

with SY2PKB initialized with that volser.

Cheers,

Rene FERLAND, Montreal

?