Keyboard Shortcuts
Likes
- H390-MVS
- Messages
Search
Re: How to wait indefinitely for a read on CTC device?
Hi Bob,
Thank you for your extensive reply. On 11.25.2022 12:42, Bob Polmanter wrote: I originally posted the MVS-based CTC program on the H390-MVS groupOff-list, Rene Ferland sent me a file he found from one of the old Yahoo files sections, CTCAMAIN.VS1.txt. I'm not sure if this was your code, but from what I can see from a brief scroll through it, it does match much of what you describe from your notes. First of all, you don't want to issue a READ command and have itYes, I think waiting for the attention interruption is the correct approach. Alas, I couldn't find a way for programs running under MVS to easily wait for an attention on a device... Ok with all of that laid out, here is the ugly part.? MVS? (and VS1...and it sounds like I couldn't find a way because MVS doesn't make it easy! ? So what to do?? Turns out, you must establish the attention routineThis definitely gets into areas I haven't touched before... lots of quality time reading through more PDFs on Bitsavers looks to be in my future. I think you've given me the information I need to navigate through learning all the right pieces to accomplish what I want. I hope this helps you get started.? If there is way to access the oldThe code you provided from your notes looks similar to code in the file Rene found (attached to this message), so I think it should give me a good example. Thank you again for your extensive reply. I'll have to leave my delay/sense-polling in place for now while I learn enough to make sense of some of these details, but this does appear to be the answer. Thanks, Matthew |
Re: How to wait indefinitely for a read on CTC device?
On 11.25.2022 08:09, Martin Taylor via groups.io wrote:
Many years ago I contacted Shelby Beach who uses CTC in their DDT debugAh, interesting. C3 is a no-op, but it has a side-effect of disabling compatibility mode on the adapter, putting it into extended mode. Extended mode, among other things, looks like it enables some additional status bits and generates -- and requires handling of -- an attention interrupt when a command is first received from the other side. The attention interrupt is interesting in that it sounds like that aligns with Bob's message about waiting on the interrupt... Thanks, Matthew |
Re: How to wait indefinitely for a read on CTC device?
When doing communications, I used to use a Twait or Waitt macro. I don't remember which. Either way it waited on multiple ecb's. That way of I wanted to end the program I just post the correct ecb and it did clean up and went to EOJ.
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
-----Original Message-----
From: [email protected] <[email protected]> On Behalf Of Matthew Wilson Sent: Friday, November 25, 2022 4:13 AM To: [email protected] Subject: [H390-MVS] How to wait indefinitely for a read on CTC device? Hello, I am on MVS 3.8, writing assembler code that reads from a CTC adapter. I will be running a "server" started task that should wait indefinitely for a command from the "client" program on the other end of the CTC link. I'm having trouble finding the right way to wait indefinitely for the other side to send data. I'm using the EXCP macro to execute my channel program (just a simple read command) on the CTC device. I do the EXCP, then I use the WAIT macro on the associated ECB. When the sender doesn't send anything, the WAIT ends after 1 minute and the completion code in the high order byte of the ECB is 0x41. If I run EXCP and WAIT again, the WAIT *immediately* returns and the high order byte of the ECB is 0x48. See the attached CTCREAD.0.txt for a job that demonstrates this. That's not the behavior I want. Ideally I could WAIT, hit the 1 minute timeout waiting for data, then just issue the READ again and WAIT another minute. (Or just not timeout at all, in a perfect world.) I can loop until I get a non-timeout completion. (Although...I suspect this isn't quite right; I get an "IEA000I 502,IOE,02,9000,..." message on the console for the timeout, which I wouldn't want accumulating every minute over time.) Alternatively, if I close the CTC DCB and open it again before the next EXCP/WAIT, there's another one minute pause before timing out again. This is closer to the desired behavior... but I feel like CLOSEing and OPENing the CTC device each time through the "wait indefinitely for the other side to send data" loop is wrong. (And I also suspect that the read side sending the "read" command state to the other side of the link every time when it's not actually issuing corresponding writes each time will lead to problems.) See the attached CTCREAD.1.txt for a job that demonstrates this close/open approach. This suggests to me that there's some state I should be able to clear to get the EXCP to really wait another minute before timing out, without actually having to close and re-open the CTC DCB. The best approach I've been able to come up with so far is to not do a READ in my "wait" loop, but to do a SENSE CCW on the CTC adapter. On the sending side, I issue a CONTROL command through the CTC adapter before doing the WRITE. On my receiving side, I put the EXCP that runs the SENSE CCW in a loop with a 250ms pause (using STIMER macro). So if the SENSE doesn't see the CONTROL command from the other side, I sleep for 250ms and check again. Once the SENSE gets the CONTROL command from the other side, I can run the READ CCW and get data back. This, so far, is the closest I've come to an ideal solution because it doesn't cause any IO exceptions, either in my program or on the MVS console. However, I don't quite like it because I want to be able to use the WAIT macro on an ECB list that include the CTC "read" wait along with some other events. And with the 250ms spin loop, if the other side of the link writes data 50ms into the loop iteration, it's unfortunate to delay activity the remaining 200ms, and seeing the CPU time of the job slowly increase over time while doing nothing due to the loop is...not aesthetically pleasing. SO... MY QUESTION... what is the correct way in MVS 3.8 to wait on reading data from a CTC adapter that may come right away or may not come for hours? Especially in the context of wanting that to be one of several ECBs I'm waiting on with the WAIT ECBLIST=... form of the WAIT macro? Thank you, Matthew |
Re: How to wait indefinitely for a read on CTC device?
¿ªÔÆÌåÓýBob, I have copies of the files from most of the MVS groups but I won¡¯t be able to access them for a week. Dave ? From: [email protected] <[email protected]> On Behalf Of Bob Polmanter
Sent: 25 November 2022 20:42 To: [email protected] Subject: Re: [H390-MVS] How to wait indefinitely for a read on CTC device? ? Hi Matthew, |
Re: How to wait indefinitely for a read on CTC device?
Hi Matthew,
I've done a lot of CCW programming of CTC devices over the years but unfortunately for this case the vast majority of it was in a VM environment.? In a virtual machine, I could write my own interrupt handlers and issue the CCWs using SIO and have 100% control over the device.? However, I did do some work with CTC adapters under MVS and VS1, using EXCP and WAIT but it wasn't anything meaningful; its sole purpose was to prove that I could get it to work.? And I did. I originally posted the MVS-based CTC program on the H390-MVS group when it was still under the control of Yahoo Groups.? It was in the file section and it had a name like CTCASAMP.TXT or CTCAMVS.TXT or something like that.? For some reason, that post did not get migrated over here to groups.io in this forum or in the other MVS Turnkey forum.? Further, I cannot seem to find it here on my TK4 system.? I honestly don't know what happened to it.? Actually, I think I did this when I was still using TK3 long ago and so it might be there, if I still have that stuff.? It has been a long while. However, I did find some 'CTC Notes' in my files, and I do recall some things that I discovered while trying to get those adapters to work on MVS, and combined with what I know of how CTCAs work in general, I think I can get you pointed in the right direction. First of all, you don't want to issue a READ command and have it pending. Instead, you just want to have the device's DCB opened and everything initialized and ready to go, then just WAIT.? The ECB isn't tied to the device or the DCB; this is just one of your own ECBs. ? When the other side writes to the CTC, an attention interruption will be raised on the opposite side.? This attention will drive an interrupt handler and then it can post the WAIT. After the WAIT is posted, your code can now issue the READ. It should be completed very quickly and you'll get a CSW with CE+DE if you chain the READ CCW with a NO-OP? X'03' CCW.? After that operation is completed you are free to go back and wait again, or attempt to write something to send back.? The other side would also be waiting for the next action and if you did write something back then the other side would also receive an attention and do a post and then issue READ.? I hope that makes sense.? But the main point is, you don't issue a read until you get an attention. After receiving an attention, you could (optionally) issue a "Sense Command Byte" CCW (X'14'), to see what command the other side used to initiate the attention.? It could have issued a write.? Or it could have issued a Control CCW.? You can use the results of sense command byte (SCB) to determine how you want to handle the attention.? But something tickles my memory that in MVS the SCB value is placed into the UCB and you can examine that after the attention, thereby avoiding the extra hassle of issuing another EXCP to do the Sense Command Byte operation.? See below in the notes about UCB+23. Ok with all of that laid out, here is the ugly part.? MVS? (and VS1 before it), do not present the attention to the application program.? Even though you have a DCB opened to the DDNAME with UNIT=xxx for the CTCA device, MVS won't give you the attention.? So what to do?? Turns out, you must establish the attention routine yourself.? I don't know if there is some official "MVS-way" of doing this, such as with IO appendages or some system macro that I don't know about (but I doubt it), so what I did was set up the attention routine myself. The attention routine should be treated like an asynchronous exit.? It needs to be in page-fixed storage.? The exit gets control directly from the system i/o interrupt handler and it is treated as a subroutine of the interrupt handler.? You set up a base register quickly, examine the CSW in the IOB if you need to, and POST your ECB.? Then exit using BR 14. What I can't remember is if I did a regular POST or if I did a 'branch entry to POST'.? I think it was branch entry though, because I doubt the system interruption handler would tolerate an SVC execution due to a regular POST. To page-fix the storage for the exit, you could GETMAIN some storage in subpool 245 and move your exit code into that storage area.? What I did (because this wasnt anything serious) was just use ADDRSPC=REAL on the EXEC PGM=? JCL statement along with a small REGION size like 64K or whatever to make the program? run in fixed real storage that way. Now there is one other problem to solve and this is where my notes come in.? The system doesn't know about your exit routine or how to locate it.? You have to tell it, manually.? Basically, you stuff the address of of a one word parameter list that contains the address of the entry point of your exit directly into the CTC's UCB.? To do all of this (to set the parm list exit address in the UCB and to use SP 245 storage) you need to be APF-authorized and both of these functions need storage key 0 access.? Here is what my notes say about getting the exit address set into the UCB: ???????? OPEN? (CTCA) * ???????? MODESET KEY=ZERO,MODE=SUP ???????? LA??? R5,CTCAATTN????????? POINT TO ATTN EXIT PARM LIST ???????? L???? R6,CTCA+44????????????? GET DEB ADDRESS FROM DCB ???????? L???? R6,32(,R6)????????????? GET UCB ADDR FOR CTCA FROM DEB ???????? LA??? R6,0(,R6)?????????????? CLEAR THE HIGH ORDER BYTE R6 ???????? ST??? R5,24(,R6)????????????? PUT PARM LIST ADDR IN UCB CTCA???? DCB?? DDNAME=CTCA500,MACRF=(E),DSORG=PS CTCAATTN DC? A(ATTNRTN)???? PARMLIST POINTS TO ATTN EXIT . . ATTNRTN? DS? 0H ????????????????? BALR? R3,0 ????????????????? USING *,R3 * UCB addr is in R7, can examine CSW or sense data in UCB * UCB sense command code is at UCB+23 * UCB CSW status is at UCB+28 ?????????????????? BR?? R14 I hope this helps you get started.? If there is way to access the old Yahoo group files that might be an option.? Feel free to ask questions if needed.? Good luck. Regards, Bob |
Re: How to wait indefinitely for a read on CTC device?
[...]
This reference may be useful for the C3 code etcWow. I didn't know a CTC device hexadecimal CCW opcode could be registered as a trademark! Really, IBM?! :) -- "Fish" (David B. Trout) Software Development Laboratories mail: fish@... |
Re: How to wait indefinitely for a read on CTC device?
Tom Bottomley
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
From: [email protected] <[email protected]> on behalf of Martin Taylor via groups.io <mtayloribm360@...>
Sent: 25 November 2022 16:09 To: [email protected] <[email protected]> Subject: Re: [H390-MVS] How to wait indefinitely for a read on CTC device? ?
Hello Matthew,
Many years ago I contacted Shelby Beach who uses CTC in their DDT debug tool. In the reader part of the tool a CCW is issued using a C3 command code with a data length of 1. No sure what this does but it may be a solution to your problem, or just a red herring :-) ?FYI Have you a copy of the CTC manual?IBM System/370 Special Feature Description: Channel-to-Channel Adapter?which can be found on bitsavers.
Hope this is of some use !
Regards, Martin. -- Regards, Tom [UK] |
Re: How to wait indefinitely for a read on CTC device?
Martin Taylor
Hello Matthew,
Many years ago I contacted Shelby Beach who uses CTC in their DDT debug tool. In the reader part of the tool a CCW is issued using a C3 command code with a data length of 1. No sure what this does but it may be a solution to your problem, or just a red herring :-) ?FYI Have you a copy of the CTC manual?IBM System/370 Special Feature Description: Channel-to-Channel Adapter?which can be found on bitsavers.
Hope this is of some use ! Regards, Martin. |
Re: How to wait indefinitely for a read on CTC device?
Hi Matthew,
Being the author of the Hercules CTCE device supporting real CTCA's (even Ficon CTCA's), I must however admit that I've never written any programs performing communications using CTCA's, and I do not know how to do that. Not under MVS - z/OS or VM - z/VM. All I ever tested were these operating systems using CTCE CTCA's, including VTAM (MPC and non-MPC), RSCS CTCA links, NJE links, z/VM SSI ISFC links, MVS GRS connections, and even z/OS XCF links (like for Base Sysplex). The CTCA channel programs I've thus come across, seem mighty complex to me, but they all appeared to be working fine. There is even automatic recovery after some TCP/IP hiccups, most of the times. Sorry that I am unable to help you further, but I hope you find support from others who know how to do the things you want to achieve. Cheers, Peter |
How to wait indefinitely for a read on CTC device?
Hello,
I am on MVS 3.8, writing assembler code that reads from a CTC adapter. I will be running a "server" started task that should wait indefinitely for a command from the "client" program on the other end of the CTC link. I'm having trouble finding the right way to wait indefinitely for the other side to send data. I'm using the EXCP macro to execute my channel program (just a simple read command) on the CTC device. I do the EXCP, then I use the WAIT macro on the associated ECB. When the sender doesn't send anything, the WAIT ends after 1 minute and the completion code in the high order byte of the ECB is 0x41. If I run EXCP and WAIT again, the WAIT *immediately* returns and the high order byte of the ECB is 0x48. See the attached CTCREAD.0.txt for a job that demonstrates this. That's not the behavior I want. Ideally I could WAIT, hit the 1 minute timeout waiting for data, then just issue the READ again and WAIT another minute. (Or just not timeout at all, in a perfect world.) I can loop until I get a non-timeout completion. (Although...I suspect this isn't quite right; I get an "IEA000I 502,IOE,02,9000,..." message on the console for the timeout, which I wouldn't want accumulating every minute over time.) Alternatively, if I close the CTC DCB and open it again before the next EXCP/WAIT, there's another one minute pause before timing out again. This is closer to the desired behavior... but I feel like CLOSEing and OPENing the CTC device each time through the "wait indefinitely for the other side to send data" loop is wrong. (And I also suspect that the read side sending the "read" command state to the other side of the link every time when it's not actually issuing corresponding writes each time will lead to problems.) See the attached CTCREAD.1.txt for a job that demonstrates this close/open approach. This suggests to me that there's some state I should be able to clear to get the EXCP to really wait another minute before timing out, without actually having to close and re-open the CTC DCB. The best approach I've been able to come up with so far is to not do a READ in my "wait" loop, but to do a SENSE CCW on the CTC adapter. On the sending side, I issue a CONTROL command through the CTC adapter before doing the WRITE. On my receiving side, I put the EXCP that runs the SENSE CCW in a loop with a 250ms pause (using STIMER macro). So if the SENSE doesn't see the CONTROL command from the other side, I sleep for 250ms and check again. Once the SENSE gets the CONTROL command from the other side, I can run the READ CCW and get data back. This, so far, is the closest I've come to an ideal solution because it doesn't cause any IO exceptions, either in my program or on the MVS console. However, I don't quite like it because I want to be able to use the WAIT macro on an ECB list that include the CTC "read" wait along with some other events. And with the 250ms spin loop, if the other side of the link writes data 50ms into the loop iteration, it's unfortunate to delay activity the remaining 200ms, and seeing the CPU time of the job slowly increase over time while doing nothing due to the loop is...not aesthetically pleasing. SO... MY QUESTION... what is the correct way in MVS 3.8 to wait on reading data from a CTC adapter that may come right away or may not come for hours? Especially in the context of wanting that to be one of several ECBs I'm waiting on with the WAIT ECBLIST=... form of the WAIT macro? Thank you, Matthew |
Re: MVS 3.8J Software Contribution Announcement
I will look in thus....
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
LarryB On November 23, 2022 10:55:39 AM CST, Rob Prins <prin0096@...> wrote: Hi Larry, -- Sent from my Android device with K-9 Mail. Please excuse my brevity. |
Re: MVS 3.8J Software Contribution Announcement
Thanks, Rob!
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
Let me know of any issues. Thanks, again! LarryB On November 23, 2022 9:10:29 AM CST, Rob Prins <prin0096@...> wrote: Hi Larry, -- Sent from my Android device with K-9 Mail. Please excuse my brevity. |
Re: MVS 3.8J Software Contribution Announcement
Rob?
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
Thank you for providing up to date dasd for TK4. It saves me lots of time. Laddie? I built a MVS 3.8J back in 1982 ran it under VM on a?4341 Wish?I kept a backup of the system once I had?discovered Hercules On Wednesday, November 23, 2022, 9:10 AM, Rob Prins <prin0096@...> wrote:
|
Re: MVS 3.8J Software Contribution Announcement
Hi Larry,
In CLGLST (the list and log utility of ISPF) I found a minor bug. After quit of ISPF, you can print the log and list dataset and a job will be submiited. The userid.CARDS.Dxxx.Txxx dataset is not deleted. Can you change the disposition of this dataset? Thanks in advance, Cheers, Rob |
Re: MVS 3.8J Software Contribution Announcement
Hi Rob,
Thanks for providing your TK4ROB DASD distributions. May I suggest for the next release that you include the needed .conf file as a part of the DASD .zip file, such that merely by unzipping and overlaying the base TK4- Version 8, all needed files will be in place as needed. I will go out on a limb and guess that I was not the only one who missed the additional .conf file needed to make your add on DASD boot up properly, this time around. Thank you! ScottC |
Another IBM 3270 emulator
Hello,
I found this mentioned today on IBM-MAIN listserv: It is a 3270 emulator written in python. It supports various screen sizes and it does automation. I have not tried the automation piece but I can connect with a mod-5 27x132 screen size I successfully used this install sequence on my raspberry pi and tk4- pip3 install ebcdic tnz python -m tnz.zti then in the session set session_ssl 0 set session_ps_size 27x132 goto? your_ip_address:3270 More information can be found @? I would be interested if anyone else has tried it using the automation feature. regards, -don |
Re: Error received with ICKDSF
Fish, you found it!? The folder properties are RO so when the file was created, it inherited read-only status.? In fact, Hercules reported it:and I missed it. 21:42:31.914 00007548 HHC00476I 0:0344 CKD64 file D:/VM370CE/DISK/MVS38/KICKS0.344: opened r/o I'm using shadowing and completely missed this.? Now, to start over... Thanks to both you and Jay. On Tue, Nov 15, 2022 at 10:49 PM Fish Fish <david.b.trout@...> wrote: Jim Snellen wrote: --
Best Regards, Jim |
Re: Error received with ICKDSF
Jim Snellen wrote:
[...] ... SENSE = 10020000 082B4010 00000000...Sense byte 0 = X'10' = Equipment Check. Sense byte 1 = X'02' = Write Inhibited. Are you sure your Hercules dasd image isn't marked read-only? (If not in Windows, then perhaps in your Herc config file?) -- "Fish" (David B. Trout) Software Development Laboratories mail: fish@... |
Re: Error received with ICKDSF
I did that.? The third bullet shows where I take it away from Hercules.
I tried with the volume mounted to MVS but ICKDSF didn't like it.? It gave me the message: ICK31049I UNITADDRESS SPECIFIED FOR VOLUME MOUNTED ON-LINE. So, I issued a VARY 344 OFFLINE d u,dasd,,340,8? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?
22.20.54? ? ? ? ? ?IEE450I 22.20.54 UNIT STATUS 522? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?
?UNIT TYPE STATUS? VOLSER VOLSTATE? ?UNIT TYPE STATUS? VOLSER VOLSTATE??
?340? 3350 O? ? ? ?CBT000 PRIV/RSDNT 341? 3350 O? ? ? ?CBT001 PRIV/RSDNT
?342? 3350 O? ? ? ?CBT002 PRIV/RSDNT 343? 3350 O? ? ? ?CBTCAT PRIV/RSDNT
?344? 3350 OFFLINE? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?345? 3350 OFFLINE? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ??
?346? 3350 OFFLINE? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?347? 3350 OFFLINE? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?? |