Thanks Joe for the Wikipedia link.? A lot of detail and
additional links.? When I get a chance, I plan to copy to my
system.
Harold
On 6/17/24 12:18, Joe Monk wrote:
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
I dont the 44 supported FBA...
A unique feature of the Model 44 is its integrated single disk
storage drive which uses the cartridge and
provides 1,171,200 bytes:?pp.5,?11?
of removable disk storage built right into the CPU. A second
integrated drive is available as an option.:?p.12? The Model
44 Programming System (M44PS) uses this drive as a
systems residence device.:?p.7?
Joe
On Mon, Jun 17, 2024 at
9:56?AM Harold Grovesteen via <h.grovsteen= [email protected]>
wrote:
By which I am assuming the format of the disk is unknown
and possibly the contents.
I have tools in SATK that can readily build a FBA disk
image.? But you do need to know what goes on it and how it
is structured on the disk.? Both of which appear to be
unavailable.
Harold Grovesteen
On 6/17/24 09:19, Richard Cornwell wrote:
Assembling it would not be a
problem, DOS should be able to assemble it. However what
we have is only the changes from PS/44 to make MPS/44.
What is lacking it the tools to format the disk and load
the decks onto the disk. So it is a lot of code to write
to get it installed on a disk. It could either be
installed on a 2311 or special disk for 44. Basically a
couple megabyte FBA disk.
Rich
|
According to the Functional Characteristics the 2315 drive had 200 cylinders + 3 spare. Each cylinder consisted of 16 sectors of 366 bytes each.
It supported '0001011' + 1 byte for seek cylinder.
???????????? 'hsss1010' for read. Read begins at h(Head), sss(Sector) and continues to end of track
???????????? 'hsss1001' for write. It began at given sector until end of track, if there was not enough data the rest of the track was written as 0.
??????????? '00000010' Read IPL, '00000011' NOP, '00000100' Sense.
The 44 supported most of the RR, RX, RS, and SI instructions. According to docs it did not support LM/STM, BXH, BXLE but they are used in MPS/44.
The 44 also allowed for instructions do be placed in bump storage and on illegal opcode it could transfer to bump storage to be executed.
Rich
|
I dont the 44 supported FBA...
Stronger than that - I don't think FBA (in the IBM mainframe context) overlapped the 360/44 or 44PS at all. Whether any IBM
FBA disk device could be attached to any S/360 (or at least was
supported by IBM in such a configuration) is doubtful, but I don't know
for sure that it was impossible.?
? A unique feature of the Model 44 is its integrated single disk storage drive which uses the cartridge and provides 1,171,200
bytes:?pp.5,?11? of removable disk storage built right into the CPU. A second integrated drive is available as an option.:?p.12? The Model 44 Programming System (M44PS) uses this drive as a systems residence device.:?p.7?
And that little built-in drive is not supported by any other OS than 44PS. ?
Joe
Tony H.
|
I dont the 44 supported FBA...
A unique feature of the Model 44 is its integrated single disk storage drive which uses the cartridge and provides 1,171,200
bytes:?pp.5,?11? of removable disk storage built right into the CPU. A second integrated drive is available as an option.:?p.12? The Model 44 Programming System (M44PS) uses this drive as a systems residence device.:?p.7?
Joe
On Mon, Jun 17, 2024 at 9:56?AM Harold Grovesteen via <h.grovsteen= [email protected]> wrote:
By which I am assuming the format of the disk is unknown and
possibly the contents.
I have tools in SATK that can readily build a FBA disk image.?
But you do need to know what goes on it and how it is structured
on the disk.? Both of which appear to be unavailable.
Harold Grovesteen
On 6/17/24 09:19, Richard Cornwell
wrote:
Assembling it would not be a problem, DOS should be able to
assemble it. However what we have is only the changes from PS/44
to make MPS/44. What is lacking it the tools to format the disk
and load the decks onto the disk. So it is a lot of code to write
to get it installed on a disk. It could either be installed on a
2311 or special disk for 44. Basically a couple megabyte FBA disk.
Rich
|
The model 44 was a specialized box. The largest amount of memory was 256K. It didnt have some instructions.
Joe
On Mon, Jun 17, 2024 at 7:00?AM John Rankin via <John.Rankin= [email protected]> wrote: Has anyone found a copy of the installation tapes for this specialized operating system. ? PS/44 was designed for the s/360 Model 44, and only allowed Fortran to run. ? John Rankin
|
By which I am assuming the format of the disk is unknown and
possibly the contents.
I have tools in SATK that can readily build a FBA disk image.?
But you do need to know what goes on it and how it is structured
on the disk.? Both of which appear to be unavailable.
Harold Grovesteen
On 6/17/24 09:19, Richard Cornwell
wrote:
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
Assembling it would not be a problem, DOS should be able to
assemble it. However what we have is only the changes from PS/44
to make MPS/44. What is lacking it the tools to format the disk
and load the decks onto the disk. So it is a lot of code to write
to get it installed on a disk. It could either be installed on a
2311 or special disk for 44. Basically a couple megabyte FBA disk.
Rich
|
Assembling it would not be a problem, DOS should be able to assemble it. However what we have is only the changes from PS/44 to make MPS/44. What is lacking it the tools to format the disk and load the decks onto the disk. So it is a lot of code to write to get it installed on a disk. It could either be installed on a 2311 or special disk for 44. Basically a couple megabyte FBA disk.
Rich
|
Is the format of the disk known?? Is the content on the disk also
known?? I have a lot of tools for building emulated disks.? So
might help.??
I am assuming running the code would use an emulator of some
kind.? The SATK assembler, ASMA, has support to assemble code for
PS/44 with all of its "weirdness".? The resulting code has not
ever been tested.? In fact I never thought it might be possible.?
But with an emulator, it could be and of some use depending upon
why the original programs are being sought.
Harold Grovesteen
On 6/17/24 07:46, Richard Cornwell
wrote:
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
There is source for MPS/44 which is a variant of PS/44. However it
is incomplete. It is missing the utilities to create the disk and
load it. If you do find it let me know.
Rich
|
There is source for MPS/44 which is a variant of PS/44. However it is incomplete. It is missing the utilities to create the disk and load it. If you do find it let me know.
Rich
|
Has anyone found a copy of the installation tapes for this specialized operating system. ? PS/44 was designed for the s/360 Model 44, and only allowed Fortran to run. ? John Rankin
|
Re: VTP Assistance Needed
Forgot to cite my source-
a post by Rene Ferland
|
Re: VTP Assistance Needed
It gives DOS/VS a 3270 interactive interface, providing services regarding system information, libraries, VSAM, POWER, and utilities.?
hmm … interesting- will have to try it soon?
thanks!
|
Re: VTP Assistance Needed
Do a search here on VTP on DOS/VS
5-pack
On 16/06/2024 18:13, Jim Snellen via groups.io wrote:
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
Hi Jim!
I’m not real sure. I read the posts on groups.io and it seems
be some kind of utility. Do a search on VTP and you’ll see what
I mean. I want to get it running so I can see for myself!
Best regards,
Jim Snellen?
?
On Jun 16, 2024, at 11:26?AM, Jim
Salvino via groups.io
<jsalvino@...> wrote:
?Jim,
I've never heard of VTP.
What does it do?
JimS
|
Re: VTP Assistance Needed
Hi Jim! I’m not real sure. I read the posts on groups.io and it seems be some kind of utility. Do a search on VTP and you’ll see what I mean. I want to get it running so I can see for myself! Best regards, Jim Snellen?
?
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
On Jun 16, 2024, at 11:26?AM, Jim Salvino via groups.io <jsalvino@...> wrote:
?Jim,
I've never heard of VTP.
What does it do?
JimS
|
Re: VTP Assistance Needed
Jim,
I've never heard of VTP.
What does it do?
JimS
|
Re: VTP Assistance Needed
Hello Jim,
No problem.? I may have been a little harsh with my criticism.? I was also trying to get SPF working around the same time as VTP and there were some issues with that as well so I may be getting the findings from both mixed up.
I had also been running the modified version of the DOS/VS 5 Pack system v1r0m1 at times, so that may have had some bearing.
I should say that I was running DOS/VS native as opposed to under VM/370.
It will be interesting to see how you get on with it and if I find the time, I may re-visit it with a fresh perspective.
All the best,? Alex.
|
Re: VTP Assistance Needed
Hello Alex,? Thanks loads for your help. I shall perform the same steps as you and hopefully get VTP to work.? I'm a little disappointed in your assessment of the slow behavior and errors you encountered. Reading the VTP posts, it seemed to be a good utility.? I’ll update this post with my results and thanks again for responding.?
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
On Jun 14, 2024, at 6:24?PM, alexsim via groups.io <alexsim@...> wrote:
?Hi Jim
It's been over 2 years since I looked at this but here is what I can remember.
As you noted, I didn't get an answer to my question but given that VTP seemed to be trying to access that file, I assumed that I would need to get it created.? After some research, I discovered that the label information for the IJAFILE did exist in the system even though the file itself wasn't there.? The extent information did point to a free area of the correct size on the PWRR34 volume so I just had to work out how to get it created.? I found that I needed to re-generate POWER with the ACCOUNT option set to YES.? This should turn on accounting and create the file automatically.
I decided to generate a new version of POWER and named it POWERA so as not to mess with the existing set up, mainly because I was new to DOS/VS and wasn't very sure about what I was doing.? I then created a new start up deck for POWERA based on what was in the existing POWER.VS.SYSIN.TRACKS file and loaded it through the card reader 00C to start up POWERA.
I also encountered another problem with VTP which I eventually tracked down to be an issue with some of the user records which are added to the U000.SECURITY.FILE file by the OSS99 program during the install process.? I found that the records at the start i.e.
A000000HERC01 ?CUL8TR ?00100002
A000000HERC02 ?CUL8TR ?00200002
A000000HERC03 ?PASS4U ?00101100
A000000HERC04 ?PASS4U ?00201100
A000000HERC05 ?PASS4U ?00300002
A000000HERC06 ?PASS4U ?00301100
A000000HERC07 ?PASS4U ?00102002
A000000HERC08 ?PASS4U ?00202100
A000000HERC09 ?PASS4U ?00103079*
needed to have a leading zero added to the numbers that follow the Userid and Password and I also removed the extra blanks i.e.
A000000HERC01 CUL8TR 000100002
A000000HERC02 CUL8TR 000200002
A000000HERC03 PASS4U 000101100
A000000HERC04 PASS4U 000201100
A000000HERC05 PASS4U 000300002
A000000HERC06 PASS4U 000301100
A000000HERC07 PASS4U 000102002
A000000HERC08 PASS4U 000202100
A000000HERC09 PASS4U 000103079*
I have to say that when I did eventually get VTP to run and got logged on, I found it quite slow and also the some functions didn't work or caused it to hang or abend.? So I didn't take it any further.
I hope that I've remembered this correctly and that it provides you with some assistance going forward.
Good luck,? Alex.
|
Re: VTP Assistance Needed
Hi Jim
It's been over 2 years since I looked at this but here is what I can remember.
As you noted, I didn't get an answer to my question but given that VTP seemed to be trying to access that file, I assumed that I would need to get it created.? After some research, I discovered that the label information for the IJAFILE did exist in the system even though the file itself wasn't there.? The extent information did point to a free area of the correct size on the PWRR34 volume so I just had to work out how to get it created.? I found that I needed to re-generate POWER with the ACCOUNT option set to YES.? This should turn on accounting and create the file automatically.
I decided to generate a new version of POWER and named it POWERA so as not to mess with the existing set up, mainly because I was new to DOS/VS and wasn't very sure about what I was doing.? I then created a new start up deck for POWERA based on what was in the existing POWER.VS.SYSIN.TRACKS file and loaded it through the card reader 00C to start up POWERA.
I also encountered another problem with VTP which I eventually tracked down to be an issue with some of the user records which are added to the U000.SECURITY.FILE file by the OSS99 program during the install process.? I found that the records at the start i.e.
A000000HERC01 ?CUL8TR ?00100002
A000000HERC02 ?CUL8TR ?00200002
A000000HERC03 ?PASS4U ?00101100
A000000HERC04 ?PASS4U ?00201100
A000000HERC05 ?PASS4U ?00300002
A000000HERC06 ?PASS4U ?00301100
A000000HERC07 ?PASS4U ?00102002
A000000HERC08 ?PASS4U ?00202100
A000000HERC09 ?PASS4U ?00103079*
needed to have a leading zero added to the numbers that follow the Userid and Password and I also removed the extra blanks i.e.
A000000HERC01 CUL8TR 000100002
A000000HERC02 CUL8TR 000200002
A000000HERC03 PASS4U 000101100
A000000HERC04 PASS4U 000201100
A000000HERC05 PASS4U 000300002
A000000HERC06 PASS4U 000301100
A000000HERC07 PASS4U 000102002
A000000HERC08 PASS4U 000202100
A000000HERC09 PASS4U 000103079*
I have to say that when I did eventually get VTP to run and got logged on, I found it quite slow and also the some functions didn't work or caused it to hang or abend.? So I didn't take it any further.
I hope that I've remembered this correctly and that it provides you with some assistance going forward.
Good luck,? Alex.
|
Hello friends,
I am reposting this request as I noticed Alex replied to a "file upload" notice in 2022 and received no response.? I also posted there and probably shouldn't have.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Hi Alex & Group,
I also had to create an additional VSAM dataspace.
I am running DOS/VS as a VM/370 CE guest using Hyperion and HercGUI.? Since I was having problems, I decided to breakup up the INSTALL.JCL into (4) separate jobs.? I had issues running the install jobs but reading the VTP posts, I was able to get past those.? Now when I release the RVTP job and then DIAL, I'm getting (almost) the same results as you.
01 F3 // JOB VTP ? ? ? ? RUN VTP 3.8 ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ??
02 ? ?DATE 06/12/24,CLOCK 16/43/22 ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ??
03 F3 4228I FILE FILE00 ? ? OPEN ?ERROR X'80'(128) ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ??
04 F3 4228I FILE FILE01 ? ? OPEN ?ERROR X'80'(128) ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ??
05 F3 4228I FILE FILE02 ? ? OPEN ?ERROR X'80'(128) ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ??
06 F3 4228I FILE FILE03 ? ? OPEN ?ERROR X'80'(128) ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ??
07 F3 4228I FILE FILE04 ? ? OPEN ?ERROR X'80'(128) ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ??
08 F3 4228I FILE FILE05 ? ? OPEN ?ERROR X'80'(128) ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ??
09 F3 4228I FILE FILE06 ? ? OPEN ?ERROR X'80'(128) ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ??
10 F3 4228I FILE FILE07 ? ? OPEN ?ERROR X'80'(128) ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ??
11 F3 4228I FILE FILE09 ? ? OPEN ?ERROR X'80'(128) ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ??
12 F3 4228I FILE FILE11 ? ? OPEN ?ERROR X'80'(128) ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ??
13 F3 4228I FILE FILE13 ? ? OPEN ?ERROR X'80'(128) ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ??
14 F3 4228I FILE FILE14 ? ? OPEN ?ERROR X'80'(128) ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ??
15 F3 4601I NO FORMAT 1 LABEL FOUND ? ? IJAFILE ?SYS000=361 ?PWRR34
16 F3 0S02I JOB VTP ? ? ?CANCELED DUE TO PROGRAM REQUEST ? ? ? ? ??
17 F3 EOJ VTP ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?
18 ? ?DATE 06/12/24,CLOCK 16/43/23,DURATION 00/00/01 ? ? ? ? ? ? ??
19 F1 1Q34I ? F3 WAITING FOR WORK
I downloaded the "corrected VTP 3.8" from the Files section and reinstalled using the updated INSTALL.JCL file.? VTP starts up in the F3 partition but when I issue the "DIAL DOSVS 080" command from 3270 session, I get the above error.? Where did I go wrong and what do I do to fix this?
BTW, I did an LVTOC on 361 and the IJAFILE is NOT there, so same question:
When I try to run VTP itself, I receive an error relating to IJAFILE, which I think is the Power Account file.
On my version of George Shedlock's 5 pack system, this file doesn't appear to be there.
Does this need to exist for VTP to work ?
|
Hi Alex & Group,
I also had to create an additional VSAM dataspace.
I am running DOS/VS as a VM/370 CE guest using Hyperion and HercGUI.? Since I was having problems, I decided to breakup up the INSTALL.JCL into (4) separate jobs.? I had issues running the install jobs but reading the VTP posts, I was able to get past those.? Now I want to release the RVTP job but I'm getting (almost) the same results as you.
01 F3 // JOB VTP ? ? ? ? RUN VTP 3.8 ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ??
02 ? ?DATE 06/12/24,CLOCK 16/43/22 ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ??
03 F3 4228I FILE FILE00 ? ? OPEN ?ERROR X'80'(128) ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ??
04 F3 4228I FILE FILE01 ? ? OPEN ?ERROR X'80'(128) ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ??
05 F3 4228I FILE FILE02 ? ? OPEN ?ERROR X'80'(128) ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ??
06 F3 4228I FILE FILE03 ? ? OPEN ?ERROR X'80'(128) ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ??
07 F3 4228I FILE FILE04 ? ? OPEN ?ERROR X'80'(128) ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ??
08 F3 4228I FILE FILE05 ? ? OPEN ?ERROR X'80'(128) ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ??
09 F3 4228I FILE FILE06 ? ? OPEN ?ERROR X'80'(128) ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ??
10 F3 4228I FILE FILE07 ? ? OPEN ?ERROR X'80'(128) ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ??
11 F3 4228I FILE FILE09 ? ? OPEN ?ERROR X'80'(128) ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ??
12 F3 4228I FILE FILE11 ? ? OPEN ?ERROR X'80'(128) ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ??
13 F3 4228I FILE FILE13 ? ? OPEN ?ERROR X'80'(128) ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ??
14 F3 4228I FILE FILE14 ? ? OPEN ?ERROR X'80'(128) ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ??
15 F3 4601I NO FORMAT 1 LABEL FOUND ? ? IJAFILE ?SYS000=361 ?PWRR34
16 F3 0S02I JOB VTP ? ? ?CANCELED DUE TO PROGRAM REQUEST ? ? ? ? ??
17 F3 EOJ VTP ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?
18 ? ?DATE 06/12/24,CLOCK 16/43/23,DURATION 00/00/01 ? ? ? ? ? ? ??
19 F1 1Q34I ? F3 WAITING FOR WORK
I downloaded the "corrected VTP 3.8" from the Files section and reinstalled using the updated INSTALL.JCL file.? VTP starts up in the F3 partition but when I issue the "DIAL DOSVS 080" command from 3270 session, I get the above error.? Where did I go wrong and what do I do to fix this?
BTW, I did an LVTOC on 361 and the IJAFILE is NOT there, so same question:
When I try to run VTP itself, I receive an error relating to IJAFILE, which I think is the Power Account file.
On my version of George Shedlock's 5 pack system, this file doesn't appear to be there.
Does this need to exist for VTP to work ?
|
Jim Snellen