Re: Meridian Flip - Stopped Working
On Thu, Feb 23, 2023 at 12:13 PM, Brian Valente wrote:
FYI this is confirmed as expected behavior. Gemini 2 has no "Initial Alignment" anymore, <99 always returns 1 + x. The coordinates are taken from startup.
Correct. In G2, bit 2? Modelling in use is used to indicate whether an alignment was done. Bit 1 is always set to 1.
|
Re: Meridian Flip - Stopped Working
|
Re: Meridian Flip - Stopped Working
On Wed, Feb 22, 2023 at 10:09 AM, Graeme Coates wrote:
so that's does appear to be a Gemini 2 bug (the reported value from <99: is incorrect when the mount has not had an Initial Alignment) :)
FYI this is confirmed as expected behavior. Gemini 2 has no "Initial Alignment" anymore, <99 always returns 1 + x. The coordinates are taken from startup. ? -- Brian
|
Re: Meridian Flip - Stopped Working
Frank I'm going to set you up with a support ticket so we can talk directly
There's a lot of cooks in the kitchen right now, and I realize it can be confusing for all
Brian thanks - I'm starting to loose track here.
Do you want me to repeat the test ?? Please repeat where you want the limits set. I will then image the scope at the point of trying the meridian flip.
-- Brian?
Brian Valente astro portfolio? portfolio astrobin?
--
Brian
|
Re: Meridian Flip - Stopped Working
 ----------------------- Jim W Phoenix, AZ USA
|
Re: Meridian Flip - Stopped Working
On
-----------------------
Jim W
Phoenix, AZ USA
|
Re: Meridian Flip - Stopped Working
In the auto meridian flip settings, is the "use telescope side of pier" on or off?
|
Re: Meridian Flip - Stopped Working
I haven¡¯t looked though each of the previous posts so I am likely missing necessary information.?
I am running 5.21 and I think ASCOM Gemini Driver 1.1.17.0 with NINA 2.1 HF1 RC0x and haven't had issues doing Meridian Flips with my G11G.? My setup process is as follows.? I was running ASCOM Gemini Driver 1.0.84 but upgraded recently.
- Set CWD.? Use bubble levels on RA and DEC
- Power on ¨C Quick start (Don't understand the difference between Quick and Cold Start now)
- Polar align the mount with PoleMaster and SharpCap Pro
- Park the mount CWD
- Cycle power ¨C Quick Start
- Model the mount - 3 or more in west then east
- Setup NINA's target
I connect to the Gemini-2 through point-to-point Ethernet.? After modeling the mount I don¡¯t use the HC.? Everything is through NINA.? When I kick off an imaging session the mount is CWD and I tell NINA to sync from NINA to Gemini-2.? Never the other way around.? I have had issues syncing the other way.
I use Edward's setting for NINA and the mount Limits settings.
I am not sure if the above adds any value.
----------------------- Jim W Phoenix, AZ USA
|
Re: Meridian Flip - Stopped Working
On Wed, Feb 22, 2023 at 02:13 PM, Frank Wielgus wrote:
Regarding the tests to solve the issue, they are done indoors, otherwise it might be months.
From a cold start CWD:
- the mount is pointing at the NCP
- if I do a "go to bright star", it goes there with no issue ( I know from having used it outside, the star is within the field of view )
- this tells me the NCP is an alignment point
I just tested adding another star and did an alignment. No difference in outcome - when just over the meridian, the meridian flip function does nothing. The other functions do work. Even nudging the mount further to when it starts beeping, the meridian flip function does nothing.
I tried to do exactly what you describe here, Frank. I had Level 6 beta already flashed, so I tried a cold start, slew to past the meridian, and then do :Mf#... and it flipped with no problems, even without a single sync or align. Repeated a couple of times, works! I then flashed firmware 5.21 and now, with cold start, align/sync, etc., I can't make it flip using the :Mf# command. The result is exactly like what you're getting, :Mf# returns 0, meaning success, but no flip. Anywhere before or past the meridian, all the way to the safety limit, still no flip. Unless I'm missing something, it appears the :Mf# command is broken in that version... Regards, ? ?-Paul
|
Re: Meridian Flip - Stopped Working
Brian thanks - I'm starting to loose track here.
Do you want me to repeat the test ?? Please repeat where you want the limits set. I will then image the scope at the point of trying the meridian flip.
|
Re: Meridian Flip - Stopped Working
The NCP is *not* an alignment point in the sense that Gemini understands (and neither should the initial alignment be anywhere near the poles if it can be helped or it's asking for trouble!). On first movement after restart, it just moves the distance it calculates from the encoder ticks/gearing ratios/date/time and assumes *everything* else is perfect.
[In fact, it is highly likely that you cannot point directly at the pole as it requires nigh on zero orthogonality error between the Dec and RA axis (but this is somewhat beside the point).]
The test you did that had the extended logging had no alignment point recorded and there's nothing to indicate at any point that you have had a successful alignment since the 17th Feb, which was then followed by the flip command being issued at the right point. Even having CWD correctly set for a fake alignment when testing is taken out of the equation, so there should just be these two items required together.
Graeme?
Regarding the tests to solve the issue, they are done indoors, otherwise it might be months.
From a cold start CWD:
- the mount is pointing at the NCP
- if I do a "go to bright star", it goes there with no issue ( I know from having used it outside, the star is within the field of view )
- this tells me the NCP is an alignment point
I just tested adding another star and did an alignment. No difference in outcome - when just over the meridian, the meridian flip function does nothing. The other functions do work. Even nudging the mount further to when it starts beeping, the meridian flip function does nothing.
|
Re: Meridian Flip - Stopped Working
Thanks Frank?
yes inside testing is fine for now
Looking at the zip file you uploaded (thanks again that is perfect) does not appear you reset the limits as I described previously? Also i did not see a pic of your telescope immediately prior to attempting the flip
I'm setting up to do this exact test
Regarding the tests to solve the issue, they are done indoors, otherwise it might be months.
From a cold start CWD:
- the mount is pointing at the NCP
- if I do a "go to bright star", it goes there with no issue ( I know from having used it outside, the star is within the field of view )
- this tells me the NCP is an alignment point
I just tested adding another star and did an alignment. No difference in outcome - when just over the meridian, the meridian flip function does nothing. The other functions do work. Even nudging the mount further to when it starts beeping, the meridian flip function does nothing.
-- Brian?
Brian Valente astro portfolio? portfolio astrobin?
--
Brian
|
Re: Meridian Flip - Stopped Working
Regarding the tests to solve the issue, they are done indoors, otherwise it might be months.
From a cold start CWD:
- the mount is pointing at the NCP
- if I do a "go to bright star", it goes there with no issue ( I know from having used it outside, the star is within the field of view )
- this tells me the NCP is an alignment point
I just tested adding another star and did an alignment. No difference in outcome - when just over the meridian, the meridian flip function does nothing. The other functions do work. Even nudging the mount further to when it starts beeping, the meridian flip function does nothing.
|
Re: Meridian Flip - Stopped Working
Set up and HC version images.? By following Losmandy setting limits video my limits are 94 otherwise contact with tripod legs.
|
Re: Meridian Flip - Stopped Working
Ok - so that's does appear to be a Gemini 2 bug (the reported value from <99: is incorrect when the mount has not had an Initial Alignment) :) That's not the issue behind no flipping though: @Frank Wielgus - I still believe your issue is that you aren't doing an initial alignment after starting the mount. If you are trying to do it manually, it doesn't look like you have done it (or performed it fully/correctly) in the last test where we have the debug logs. If you are expecting Nina to do the plate-solve and sync the mount, it doesn't appear to be doing so either (at least, according to the logs, not since Oct 2022...) so you might need to review the settings there. I'm sorry but I use SGP so I can't advise on where it may be that needs reviewing.?
You *are* asking for the flip to take place in the right window as Paul K points out from the log (under the assumption that CWD is indeed correct), but the?mount will flatly refuse to flip (in the way logged) if it doesn't have an Initial Alignment in place.
(As an aside, as a GM8 owner myself, I'm a bit surprised you can't get larger limits than 94 degrees both side - my GM8 with WO FLT110 will go well beyond those points - though I concede it will?make a difference in terms of tripod position,?the NP127is isn't massively bigger than the WO scope. But, though it would make life easier, I don't think that's the issue you're experiencing).??
Flippin' flips! :-D
Graeme
On Wed, 22 Feb 2023 at 17:58, Paul Kanevsky < yh@...> wrote: Hi Graeme, You might be right. I just tried it from command terminal in the ASCOM driver, and this is what I get after a cold start:  On Wed, Feb 22, 2023 at 12:48 PM, Graeme Coates wrote:
On Wed, 22 Feb 2023 at 16:23, Paul Kanevsky < yh@...> wrote:
?
The log seems to show that Gemini thinks it's aligned. Status 1 was returned by <99: command.?
But certainly at least one sync/align is needed before doing any sort of testing from a Cold start.
20:31:28.533 Transmitting commands? ? ?TID:7 [2]: <99:F#
20:31:28.548 Ethernet received:? ? ? ? TID:7 [0]: <99, 1
?
I think this is a Gemini bug.??
?
I just cold started (power cycle and choice?at restart) our G2 which running a slightly later Gemini version (with runaway slew, and RA=0 sync bug fixes) and it also returned "1" to that command before I'd even commanded a slew. So my firm belief here is that no Initial Alignment has taken place, and therefore the Gemini 2 in question is not flipping for that reason.?
?
Here's the python commands I use to do the direct interface via the ASCOM driver (I ran a few to check they were sensible - I would fully expect <205: and <206: (RA/DEC Index Errors) to return zero from a cold start).??
?
?
?
?
?
Graeme
?
|
Re: Meridian Flip - Stopped Working
Hi Graeme, You might be right. I just tried it from command terminal in the ASCOM driver, and this is what I get after a cold start: 
On Wed, Feb 22, 2023 at 12:48 PM, Graeme Coates wrote:
On Wed, 22 Feb 2023 at 16:23, Paul Kanevsky < yh@...> wrote:
?
The log seems to show that Gemini thinks it's aligned. Status 1 was returned by <99: command.?
But certainly at least one sync/align is needed before doing any sort of testing from a Cold start.
20:31:28.533 Transmitting commands? ? ?TID:7 [2]: <99:F#
20:31:28.548 Ethernet received:? ? ? ? TID:7 [0]: <99, 1
?
I think this is a Gemini bug.??
?
I just cold started (power cycle and choice?at restart) our G2 which running a slightly later Gemini version (with runaway slew, and RA=0 sync bug fixes) and it also returned "1" to that command before I'd even commanded a slew. So my firm belief here is that no Initial Alignment has taken place, and therefore the Gemini 2 in question is not flipping for that reason.?
?
Here's the python commands I use to do the direct interface via the ASCOM driver (I ran a few to check they were sensible - I would fully expect <205: and <206: (RA/DEC Index Errors) to return zero from a cold start).??
?
?
?
?
?
Graeme
?
|
Re: Meridian Flip - Stopped Working
On Wed, 22 Feb 2023 at 16:23, Paul Kanevsky < yh@...> wrote: ? The log seems to show that Gemini thinks it's aligned. Status 1 was returned by <99: command.?
But certainly at least one sync/align is needed before doing any sort of testing from a Cold start.
20:31:28.533 Transmitting commands? ? ?TID:7 [2]: <99:F#
20:31:28.548 Ethernet received:? ? ? ? TID:7 [0]: <99, 1
I think this is a Gemini bug.??
I just cold started (power cycle and choice?at restart) our G2 which running a slightly later Gemini version (with runaway slew, and RA=0 sync bug fixes) and it also returned "1" to that command before I'd even commanded a slew. So my firm belief here is that no Initial Alignment has taken place, and therefore the Gemini 2 in question is not flipping for that reason.?
Here's the python commands I use to do the direct interface via the ASCOM driver (I ran a few to check they were sensible - I would fully expect <205: and <206: (RA/DEC Index Errors) to return zero from a cold start).??
?
Graeme
?
|
Re: Meridian Flip - Stopped Working
On Wed, Feb 22, 2023 at 10:02 AM, Graeme Coates wrote:
From the log zip file provided, Pointing.DAT appears to show no Initial Alignment since startup -? If there is no initial?alignment, Gemini will not flip.
The log seems to show that Gemini thinks it's aligned. Status 1 was returned by <99: command.? But certainly at least one sync/align is needed before doing any sort of testing from a Cold start.
20:31:28.533 Transmitting commands? ? ?TID:7 [2]: <99:F#
20:31:28.548 Ethernet received:? ? ? ? TID:7 [0]: <99, 1
|
Re: Meridian Flip - Stopped Working
On Wed, Feb 22, 2023 at 10:37 AM, Graeme Coates wrote:
From Pointing.DAT:
?
! *** Losmandy Gemini2 Version 5.21 Build Mar 12 2017 08:22:00 started up ***
?
I think the file date is a red herring here.?
?
Graeme
The file date is weird, but the file itself appears to match the reported firmware version, 5.21
|
Re: Meridian Flip - Stopped Working
From Pointing.DAT:
! *** Losmandy Gemini2 Version 5.21 Build Mar 12 2017 08:22:00 started up ***
I think the file date is a red herring here.?
Graeme
On Wed, 22 Feb 2023 at 15:20, Brian Valente < brian@...> wrote: Frank what is the firmware version you are currently running? ? You can check via hand controller ? Menu->HC->Info ? ? ? Thanks ? Brian ? Brian Valente Losmandy Astronomical ? Losmandy.com Tutorials and vids at ? From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Paul Kanevsky
Sent: Tuesday, February 21, 2023 6:00 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [Gemini-II_io] Meridian Flip - Stopped Working ? On Tue, Feb 21, 2023 at 08:51 PM, Frank Wielgus wrote: Interesting results.
Once the troubleshooter started recording, I went to a bright star via the HC and synched.? During this time, error messages were flashing rather quickly with time out, com errors etc. After syncing I slewed just passed the meridian and tried to flip - which it did not.? The error messages never stopped. I then stopped everything. I did not get these messages before.? File is attached.
Thanks, Frank. You really should've formatted that SD card :) You appear to have another file that needs to be deleted. Notice the date on that file... 11-05-18? 07:32AM? ? ? ?<DIR>? ? ? ? ? System Volume Information 08-20-16? 12:00PM? ? ? ?<DIR>? ? ? ? ? LOGS 02-17-23? 03:38PM? ? ? ?<DIR>? ? ? ? ? CONFIG 02-19-23? 05:14PM? ? ? ?<DIR>? ? ? ? ? COMBINED 11-29-18? 12:53PM? ? ? ?<DIR>? ? ? ? ? AltAz 11-29-18? 12:54PM? ? ? ?<DIR>? ? ? ? ? Catalogs 11-29-18? 12:53PM? ? ? ?<DIR>? ? ? ? ? DE 11-29-18? 12:53PM? ? ? ?<DIR>? ? ? ? ? EN 11-29-18? 12:53PM? ? ? ?<DIR>? ? ? ? ? ES 11-29-18? 12:53PM? ? ? ?<DIR>? ? ? ? ? FR 11-29-18? 12:54PM? ? ? ?<DIR>? ? ? ? ? HC 11-29-18? 12:53PM? ? ? ?<DIR>? ? ? ? ? MHC 11-29-18? 12:53PM? ? ? ?<DIR>? ? ? ? ? Video 01-01-10? 12:00PM? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?363180 Cur_Gem2.bin
|
Paul Kanevsky
