Re: Meridian Flip - Stopped Working
From Pointing.DAT:
! *** Losmandy Gemini2 Version 5.21 Build Mar 12 2017 08:22:00 started up ***
I think the file date is a red herring here.?
Graeme
On Wed, 22 Feb 2023 at 15:20, Brian Valente < brian@...> wrote: Frank what is the firmware version you are currently running? ? You can check via hand controller ? Menu->HC->Info ? ? ? Thanks ? Brian ? Brian Valente Losmandy Astronomical ? Losmandy.com Tutorials and vids at ? From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Paul Kanevsky
Sent: Tuesday, February 21, 2023 6:00 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [Gemini-II_io] Meridian Flip - Stopped Working ? On Tue, Feb 21, 2023 at 08:51 PM, Frank Wielgus wrote: Interesting results.
Once the troubleshooter started recording, I went to a bright star via the HC and synched.? During this time, error messages were flashing rather quickly with time out, com errors etc. After syncing I slewed just passed the meridian and tried to flip - which it did not.? The error messages never stopped. I then stopped everything. I did not get these messages before.? File is attached.
Thanks, Frank. You really should've formatted that SD card :) You appear to have another file that needs to be deleted. Notice the date on that file... 11-05-18? 07:32AM? ? ? ?<DIR>? ? ? ? ? System Volume Information 08-20-16? 12:00PM? ? ? ?<DIR>? ? ? ? ? LOGS 02-17-23? 03:38PM? ? ? ?<DIR>? ? ? ? ? CONFIG 02-19-23? 05:14PM? ? ? ?<DIR>? ? ? ? ? COMBINED 11-29-18? 12:53PM? ? ? ?<DIR>? ? ? ? ? AltAz 11-29-18? 12:54PM? ? ? ?<DIR>? ? ? ? ? Catalogs 11-29-18? 12:53PM? ? ? ?<DIR>? ? ? ? ? DE 11-29-18? 12:53PM? ? ? ?<DIR>? ? ? ? ? EN 11-29-18? 12:53PM? ? ? ?<DIR>? ? ? ? ? ES 11-29-18? 12:53PM? ? ? ?<DIR>? ? ? ? ? FR 11-29-18? 12:54PM? ? ? ?<DIR>? ? ? ? ? HC 11-29-18? 12:53PM? ? ? ?<DIR>? ? ? ? ? MHC 11-29-18? 12:53PM? ? ? ?<DIR>? ? ? ? ? Video 01-01-10? 12:00PM? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?363180 Cur_Gem2.bin
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Re: Meridian Flip - Stopped Working
Frank what is the firmware version you are currently running? ? You can check via hand controller ? Menu->HC->Info ? ? ? Thanks ? Brian ? Brian Valente Losmandy Astronomical ? Losmandy.com Tutorials and vids at ?
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From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Paul Kanevsky
Sent: Tuesday, February 21, 2023 6:00 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [Gemini-II_io] Meridian Flip - Stopped Working ? On Tue, Feb 21, 2023 at 08:51 PM, Frank Wielgus wrote: Interesting results.
Once the troubleshooter started recording, I went to a bright star via the HC and synched.? During this time, error messages were flashing rather quickly with time out, com errors etc. After syncing I slewed just passed the meridian and tried to flip - which it did not.? The error messages never stopped. I then stopped everything. I did not get these messages before.? File is attached.
Thanks, Frank. You really should've formatted that SD card :) You appear to have another file that needs to be deleted. Notice the date on that file... 11-05-18? 07:32AM? ? ? ?<DIR>? ? ? ? ? System Volume Information 08-20-16? 12:00PM? ? ? ?<DIR>? ? ? ? ? LOGS 02-17-23? 03:38PM? ? ? ?<DIR>? ? ? ? ? CONFIG 02-19-23? 05:14PM? ? ? ?<DIR>? ? ? ? ? COMBINED 11-29-18? 12:53PM? ? ? ?<DIR>? ? ? ? ? AltAz 11-29-18? 12:54PM? ? ? ?<DIR>? ? ? ? ? Catalogs 11-29-18? 12:53PM? ? ? ?<DIR>? ? ? ? ? DE 11-29-18? 12:53PM? ? ? ?<DIR>? ? ? ? ? EN 11-29-18? 12:53PM? ? ? ?<DIR>? ? ? ? ? ES 11-29-18? 12:53PM? ? ? ?<DIR>? ? ? ? ? FR 11-29-18? 12:54PM? ? ? ?<DIR>? ? ? ? ? HC 11-29-18? 12:53PM? ? ? ?<DIR>? ? ? ? ? MHC 11-29-18? 12:53PM? ? ? ?<DIR>? ? ? ? ? Video 01-01-10? 12:00PM? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?363180 Cur_Gem2.bin
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Re: Meridian Flip - Stopped Working
From the log zip file provided, Pointing.DAT appears to show no Initial Alignment since startup -?
If there is no initial?alignment, Gemini will not flip. (I have a sample python script which I wrote to test flips, and I can comment out the initial?sync to prove this.). If you think you are doing a sync, or a platesolve with sync, this might suggest it's not doing what you think it is? You have successful platesolve/syncs in late Sept and early Oct, but none since. The last entry in the file is: ! *** Losmandy Gemini2 Version 5.21 Build Mar 12 2017 08:22:00 started up ***
:NODA
:EQUAT
+40 36 07 2023 02 22 10.0 1000.0 0.0
<EOF>
The last alignment looks like it was nearly a week ago and I presume you have done a cold start since (this is a manual alignment on a catalogue object (Alpheratz) since it will say "PC Object" if doing a platesolve+sync via software. Initial Alignments to PC Objects are perfectly valid, and the normal way of doing it as an imager - you even have these in the file):?
! *** Losmandy Gemini2 Version 5.21 Build Mar 12 2017 08:22:00 started up *** :NODA
:EQUAT
+40 36 07 2023 02 16 10.0 1000.0 0.0
! UTC Date: 16/02/2023 UTC Time: 22:10:44 Initial Alignment, Object: Alpheratz α AND, West Side
00 09 35.11 +29 13 08.47 00 09 35.09 +29 13 08.62 02 28.68
! ? 0.00 ? 0.00 ? 0.00
Graeme
On Wed, 22 Feb 2023 at 13:06, Paul Kanevsky < yh@...> wrote: On Tue, Feb 21, 2023 at 08:51 PM, Frank Wielgus wrote:
Interesting results.
Once the troubleshooter started recording, I went to a bright star via the HC and synched.? During this time, error messages were flashing rather quickly with time out, com errors etc. After syncing I slewed just passed the meridian and tried to flip - which it did not.? The error messages never stopped. I then stopped everything. I did not get these messages before.? File is attached.
Thanks, Frank.? The logs show all the settings and configuration, and I'm still unable to see anything that would cause the no flip behavior. Maybe Ren¨¦?can take a look.
The comm errors you saw were related to the troubleshooter and Gemini.NET driver trying to poll the mount simultaneously while running in the 'record activity' mode. I've made a fix for this for a future version of the driver, but it shouldn't affect anything other than the occasional popup messages.
I do see your tests to flip the mount, and as before, Gemini reports success but doesn't flip, HA=0.1826:
Tracking=True
Nudge from Safety=True
Eastern Safety Limit=094d00
Western Safety Limit=094d00
Goto Limit=002d30
AtHome=False
AtPark=False
Status Byte=5
At Safety Limit=False
Side of Pier=W
####### HA=0.189758 before flip request, mount is tracking #########08:40:17.184: ENQ 0 Macro=557783;389867;6.265307;+31.833485;+0.189758;195.535668;+80.937333;T;T;N;W;6.455065;0;0;276.106358;5;00090B10;-1;0;5;0;
####### Sent flip request, received 0 => OK #########
08:40:17.184: TRANSMITED=:Mf#
08:40:17.184: RECEIVED=:Mf#=0
####### Mount continues to track towards the safety limit, no flip has occurred #########
08:40:17.685: ENQ 0 Macro=557769;389867;6.265302;+31.833485;+0.189902;195.547123;+80.936885;T;T;N;W;6.455205;0;0;275.582792;5;00090B10;-1;0;6;0;
08:40:18.187: ENQ 0 Macro=557756;389867;6.265306;+31.833485;+0.190038;195.557759;+80.936475;T;T;N;W;6.455344;0;0;275.096623;5;00090B10;-1;0;5;0;
08:40:18.688: ENQ 0 Macro=557742;389867;6.265300;+31.833485;+0.190185;195.569213;+80.936029;T;T;N;W;6.455485;0;0;274.573057;5;00090B10;-1;0;13;0;
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Re: Meridian Flip - Stopped Working
First is selected via the HC then synced.
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Re: Meridian Flip - Stopped Working
On Tue, Feb 21, 2023 at 08:51 PM, Frank Wielgus wrote:
Interesting results.
Once the troubleshooter started recording, I went to a bright star via the HC and synched.? During this time, error messages were flashing rather quickly with time out, com errors etc. After syncing I slewed just passed the meridian and tried to flip - which it did not.? The error messages never stopped. I then stopped everything. I did not get these messages before.? File is attached.
Thanks, Frank.? The logs show all the settings and configuration, and I'm still unable to see anything that would cause the no flip behavior. Maybe Ren¨¦?can take a look. The comm errors you saw were related to the troubleshooter and Gemini.NET driver trying to poll the mount simultaneously while running in the 'record activity' mode. I've made a fix for this for a future version of the driver, but it shouldn't affect anything other than the occasional popup messages. I do see your tests to flip the mount, and as before, Gemini reports success but doesn't flip, HA=0.1826:
Tracking=True
Nudge from Safety=True
Eastern Safety Limit=094d00
Western Safety Limit=094d00
Goto Limit=002d30
AtHome=False
AtPark=False
Status Byte=5
At Safety Limit=False
Side of Pier=W
####### HA=0.189758 before flip request, mount is tracking #########08:40:17.184: ENQ 0 Macro=557783;389867;6.265307;+31.833485;+0.189758;195.535668;+80.937333;T;T;N;W;6.455065;0;0;276.106358;5;00090B10;-1;0;5;0;
####### Sent flip request, received 0 => OK #########
08:40:17.184: TRANSMITED=:Mf#
08:40:17.184: RECEIVED=:Mf#=0
####### Mount continues to track towards the safety limit, no flip has occurred #########
08:40:17.685: ENQ 0 Macro=557769;389867;6.265302;+31.833485;+0.189902;195.547123;+80.936885;T;T;N;W;6.455205;0;0;275.582792;5;00090B10;-1;0;6;0;
08:40:18.187: ENQ 0 Macro=557756;389867;6.265306;+31.833485;+0.190038;195.557759;+80.936475;T;T;N;W;6.455344;0;0;275.096623;5;00090B10;-1;0;5;0;
08:40:18.688: ENQ 0 Macro=557742;389867;6.265300;+31.833485;+0.190185;195.569213;+80.936029;T;T;N;W;6.455485;0;0;274.573057;5;00090B10;-1;0;13;0;
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Re: Meridian Flip - Stopped Working
Frank,
How do you slew to the first star after a cold start?
Do you manually slew to it or do you select an object from the hand controller and issue a goto command?
If you manually slew and then synchronise it will not do anything as it needs to know what it is you are pointing at.
If you command a goto to an object in the Eastern sky and then command a goto to an object in the Western sky - both well away from the meridian - the mount should perform a flip to do this.
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My tests are done inside. I hope this is what you mean. Using only the HC from a cold star at CWD, I slewed to a bright star and synced. Then I took the attached.
After this, I connected on the PC and checked the planetarium - and they agree with where the scope is pointing.
Then via the HC went to just over the meridian ( tried various spots ) and tried to meridian flip at them - all failed.
<GeminiStateSync.jpg><TelePointModSync.jpg>
--
Paul
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Re: Meridian Flip - Stopped Working
Interesting results.
Once the troubleshooter started recording, I went to a bright star via the HC and synched.? During this time, error messages were flashing rather quickly with time out, com errors etc. After syncing I slewed just passed the meridian and tried to flip - which it did not.? The error messages never stopped. I then stopped everything. I did not get these messages before.? File is attached.
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Re: RA lag both motors stopped
In the first instance I suspect that you may have had an unusually cold period causing over-tight worm to ring mesh which caused stalls.
However a faulty encoder could certainly cause similar problems,
The only way to determine this is to have both the Gemini and both motors on the desk in front of you.
If you can arrange that, there are tests you can undertake:
1) after startup is the RA motor turning slowly and does it resist gentle attempts to turn it by hand against that motion or trying to make it move faster? If yes, the RA motor is good.
2) Does the DEC motor resist attempts to move it as above.
3) To double check the DEC motor you can swap the motors.
If the above isn't what you encounter then tell us what does happen?
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-----Original Message----- From: [email protected] < [email protected]> On Behalf Of erwan quigna Sent: 21 February 2023 21:21 To: [email protected]Subject: [Gemini-II_io] RA lag both motors stopped Hi, Since a week I have a big problem on the g11 gemini2 of mu observatory. This is the third time I found the mount complexity stopped. Seems both motors stopped working during the night. After that almost impossible to move any axes, even after power cycle. I have the message RA/dec lag message. I passed the whole Sunday in the observatory trying to find find the failing component Swapping cable with old ones : work better. (Move a little between fails) Swapping motor no change Removing motor no change Unplug ra motor : dec works normally Unplug dec motor no change At the end I was able to retrieve a fully functional mount after swapping the optical encoder of the ra motor with the one of an old legacy svm motor ¡ but only for 2 days. This night complete failure again. Even worst. No move at all. Try ten of power cycle. Even reformat of scared I had to phone someone to move the telescope to be able to close the observatory. I believe the problem is on the gemini computer itself. Given the symptom do you believe a repair is possible ? Does it seems like a known failure `? Thanks Erwan
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Re: Meridian Flip - Stopped Working
On Tue, Feb 21, 2023 at 04:58 PM, Brian Valente wrote:
https://gemini-2.com/ASCOM.html
I'm currently using 1.0.84. I will download and install 1.1.17 beta.
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Re: Meridian Flip - Stopped Working
Hi Frank ? Please make sure you are using the latest beta of Gemini Telescope.net https://gemini-2.com/ASCOM.html ? (this is for the trouble shooter feature below) ? ? Please do only the things I mentioned, do not use the planetarium program, don¡¯t sync before, do not do anything other than the steps I outlined. Use only the Gemini Telescope.net for the meridian flip. The goal is to reduce the # of variables here, so sorry to be a stickler about this. ? If you can take a picture of your scope/mount prior to attempting meridian flip, please post ? Flip using Gemini Telescope.net only ? What happens? What messages are on the hand controller/Gemini Telescope.net? ? If that doesn¡¯t work please use the troubleshooting report feature and post both of those here ? 
? ? ? Thanks ? Brian ? Brian Valente Losmandy Astronomical ? Losmandy.com Tutorials and vids at ?
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From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Frank Wielgus
Sent: Tuesday, February 21, 2023 4:51 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [Gemini-II_io] Meridian Flip - Stopped Working ? My tests are done inside. I hope this is what you mean. Using only the HC from a cold star at CWD, I slewed to a bright star and synced. Then I took the attached.
After this, I connected on the PC and checked the planetarium - and they agree with where the scope is pointing.
Then via the HC went to just over the meridian ( tried various spots ) and tried to meridian flip at them - all failed.
|
Re: Meridian Flip - Stopped Working
My tests are done inside. I hope this is what you mean. Using only the HC from a cold star at CWD, I slewed to a bright star and synced. Then I took the attached.
After this, I connected on the PC and checked the planetarium - and they agree with where the scope is pointing.
Then via the HC went to just over the meridian ( tried various spots ) and tried to meridian flip at them - all failed.
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Re: Meridian Flip - Stopped Working
Sorry I should have been more clear
The gemini settings are shown in the web page/ hand controller
I'm talking about the computer's own timezone settings, which your application uses (example of Windows 11 below).
I think more important are the meridian flip settings of your application i mentioned last time. It's not just the mount settings that determine success, it's the coordination between the app and the mount
On Tue, Feb 21, 2023 at 02:34 PM, Brian Valente wrote:
computer<->Gemini
Thanks Brian but not sure what you mean by computer<->Gemini.? So I took some screen shots from the web interface and Ascom Profiler.? If these are inadequate let me know.
-- Brian?
Brian Valente astro portfolio? portfolio astrobin?
--
Brian
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Re: Meridian Flip - Stopped Working
Can you confirm that you have done at least one sync after cold start before trying a flip using the handset? (Confirm this by looking on the Gemini web page that has the model parameters - if you do a proper sync and don't fudge it, the RA and HA index values should be non-zero (assuming you don't have absolutely perfect alignment!!). At the very least, the number of model points will be >0.
On Tue, Feb 21, 2023 at 02:34 PM, Brian Valente wrote:
computer<->Gemini
Thanks Brian but not sure what you mean by computer<->Gemini.? So I took some screen shots from the web interface and Ascom Profiler.? If these are inadequate let me know.
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Re: Meridian Flip - Stopped Working
On Tue, Feb 21, 2023 at 02:34 PM, Brian Valente wrote:
computer<->Gemini
Thanks Brian but not sure what you mean by computer<->Gemini.? So I took some screen shots from the web interface and Ascom Profiler.? If these are inadequate let me know.
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Re: Meridian Flip - Stopped Working
Frank these are just the mount settings, which need to be coordinated with the software meridian flip settings. Can you post those ? computer<->Gemini settings for date/time/timezone need to be the same as well. I¡¯ve seen incorrect timezone cause issues b/c it was an hour off between the two ? ? ? ? ? Thanks ? Brian ? Brian Valente Losmandy Astronomical ? Losmandy.com Tutorials and vids at ?
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From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Frank Wielgus
Sent: Tuesday, February 21, 2023 1:24 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [Gemini-II_io] Meridian Flip - Stopped Working ? Paul - I agree with you but I am at a loss.? I am hoping the smarter brains with this group can help me.
Attached is a screen shot of the relevant info.? Maybe someone can see an issue. Time and location seem correct.? The limits are what had worked initially ( I cannot go past 94 ). I previously had not used the HC meridian flip function to know if it ever worked - as an imager I rely on the capture software to manage.
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Re: RA lag both motors stopped
Yes I have the old one
I am i france and very proficient in electronics.
Good point I will try a rework of all soldering
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Le 21 f¨¦vr. 2023 ¨¤ 22:36, rkaufmann87@... a ¨¦crit :
Is your Gemini 2 one of the old ¡°long boys¡± or the current, square Gemini 2. The older ¡°long boys¡± occasionally suffer from a broken solder joint that can cause an RA failure message. It¡¯s a simple fix but does require some soldering. Try Brian¡¯s suggestions first and if still no joy contact Tonya at Losmandy (better to call in the afternoon) and she can walk through some additional steps. I had a similar issue a few months ago and ended up sending my Gemini 2 box in for repair as I¡¯m not comfortable soldering electronics. Total cost including shipping was about $100.
Best,
Roger K.
On Feb 21, 2023, at 1:21 PM, erwan quigna <equigna@...> wrote:
Hi,
Since a week I have a big problem on the g11 gemini2 of mu observatory.
This is the third time I found the mount complexity stopped.
Seems both motors stopped working during the night.
After that almost impossible to move any axes, even after power cycle.
I have the message RA/dec lag message.
I passed the whole Sunday in the observatory trying to find find the failing component
Swapping cable with old ones : work better. (Move a little between fails)
Swapping motor no change
Removing motor no change
Unplug ra motor : dec works normally
Unplug dec motor no change
At the end I was able to retrieve a fully functional mount after swapping the optical encoder of the ra motor with the one of an old legacy svm motor
¡ but only for 2 days.
This night complete failure again.
Even worst. No move at all. Try ten of power cycle. Even reformat of scared
I had to phone someone to move the telescope to be able to close the observatory.
I believe the problem is on the gemini computer itself.
Given the symptom do you believe a repair is possible ?
Does it seems like a known failure `?
Thanks
Erwan
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Re: RA lag both motors stopped
The problem even exist with motors removed from the mount
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Re: RA lag both motors stopped
Is your Gemini 2 one of the old ¡°long boys¡± or the current, square Gemini 2. The older ¡°long boys¡± occasionally suffer from a broken solder joint that can cause an RA failure message. It¡¯s a simple fix but does require some soldering. Try Brian¡¯s suggestions first and if still no joy contact Tonya at Losmandy (better to call in the afternoon) and she can walk through some additional steps. I had a similar issue a few months ago and ended up sending my Gemini 2 box in for repair as I¡¯m not comfortable soldering electronics. Total cost including shipping was about $100.
Best,
Roger K.
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
On Feb 21, 2023, at 1:21 PM, erwan quigna <equigna@...> wrote:
Hi,
Since a week I have a big problem on the g11 gemini2 of mu observatory.
This is the third time I found the mount complexity stopped.
Seems both motors stopped working during the night.
After that almost impossible to move any axes, even after power cycle.
I have the message RA/dec lag message.
I passed the whole Sunday in the observatory trying to find find the failing component
Swapping cable with old ones : work better. (Move a little between fails)
Swapping motor no change
Removing motor no change
Unplug ra motor : dec works normally
Unplug dec motor no change
At the end I was able to retrieve a fully functional mount after swapping the optical encoder of the ra motor with the one of an old legacy svm motor
¡ but only for 2 days.
This night complete failure again.
Even worst. No move at all. Try ten of power cycle. Even reformat of scared
I had to phone someone to move the telescope to be able to close the observatory.
I believe the problem is on the gemini computer itself.
Given the symptom do you believe a repair is possible ?
Does it seems like a known failure `?
Thanks
Erwan
|
Re: RA lag both motors stopped
Hi Erwan
Were there motor stall messages when this happened? have you tried adjusting the worm mesh??
things that most often cause/ lag/stall 1. insufficient power 2. worm mesh too tight 3. telescope not properly balanced
On Tue, Feb 21, 2023 at 1:21 PM erwan quigna < equigna@...> wrote: Hi,
Since a week I have a big problem on the g11 gemini2 of mu observatory.
This is the third time I found the mount complexity stopped.
Seems both motors stopped working during the night.
After that almost impossible to move any axes, even after power cycle.
I have the message RA/dec lag message.
I passed the whole Sunday in the observatory trying to find find the failing component
Swapping cable with old ones : work better. (Move a little between fails)
Swapping motor no change
Removing motor no change
Unplug ra motor : dec works normally
Unplug dec motor no change
At the end I was able to retrieve a fully functional mount after swapping the optical encoder of the ra motor with the one of an old legacy svm motor
¡ but only for 2 days.
This night complete failure again.
Even worst. No move at all. Try ten of power cycle. Even reformat of scared
I had to phone someone to move the telescope to be able to close the observatory.
I believe the problem is on the gemini computer itself.
Given the symptom do you believe a repair is possible ?
Does it seems like a known failure `?
Thanks
Erwan
-- Brian?
Brian Valente astro portfolio? portfolio astrobin?
--
Brian
|
Re: Meridian Flip - Stopped Working
Paul - I agree with you but I am at a loss.? I am hoping the smarter brains with this group can help me.
Attached is a screen shot of the relevant info.? Maybe someone can see an issue. Time and location seem correct.? The limits are what had worked initially ( I cannot go past 94 ). I previously had not used the HC meridian flip function to know if it ever worked - as an imager I rely on the capture software to manage.
|
Paul Kanevsky
David C. Partridge
